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G26packer
05-21-2009, 19:39
Today I was over at my very good friends house, whom I spend time with very frequently. Out of the blue she said that she needed to get something off her chest.. of course I was open to whatever she had to say, we talk about everything. But what she said shocked me, and I wasn't prepared to act. She said "do you "pack" all the time. I said "no not all the time" (which I know I should ladies). Then she said "well could you not do it around me?"
I was so shocked I sat there speechless and asked her why. Her response was that it made her feel "uncomfortable". I tried to not show how upset I was and laughed and said "what do you think that I am going to shoot you or something?" she didn't offer any response to that.
I left shortly after that.
First of all, I have carried around her for over a month now, completely concealed, and I have always maintained complete control over my firearm. The only reason why she knows is because I was showing her husband and father and law my pistol. (one is a retired police officer, the other a local officer.)Both of which are completely supportive of me carrying.
This is a personal choice of mine, in which I have every right under the law to do. I always carry responsibly and concealed (even though open carry in my state is completely legal.
I do not feel that I should have to give up my right to protect myself and my family while I am around her to make her feel comfortable, also seeing that the place that we take our kids to the park has no cell service and out in the middle of no where. (what a nice place to get in trouble).
I am not sure how to handle this, and I feel so strongly about it that I am prepared just not to be around her. I am so upset about the whole situation, hoping that some of you ladies can shed some light on the issue. Completely open to any and all suggestions! Thanks!

G26packer
05-22-2009, 11:37
Some help would be great!

dsw3131
05-22-2009, 11:42
I'm not a lady, but I'll offer my opinion. Firstly, if she's a very good friend, I would try to sit down with her and explain very plainly about why I carry, why it's perfectly safe, and ask her why she's afraid of my gun. Most people have very emotional reactions to guns, and don't think through their reasoning logically. It doesn't always help to try to explain it logically to them, because some can't get away from that "creepy" feeling that guns give them. If she's still unmoved, I would tell her that I understand her fears, and will respect her wishes when I'm in her house. I'd leave the gun in the car whenever I visit her house (which would be rarely after that). However, I'd also calmly and politely explain that carrying a firearm for self-defense is something I believe very strongly in. I've trained with my handgun, I know how to use it and carry it safely, and I will not give up my ability to defend myself and my kids to quell someone else's irrational fear. She can know with confidence that I will not be armed if I enter her house, but if she decides to avoid me any other time, knowing that I'm armed, that is her perogative.

After that, I'd leave the ball in her court. Still be polite and invite her out or offer to meet her for play time at the park. If she consistently rejects you, then I've guess you've lost a good friend. I know that would be hard to swallow, but I'm not giving up my right to self-defense just to keep an unreasonable friend happy.

You might nicely offer (more than once) to take her shooting. Knowledge can many times belay irrational fears, and if she learns how to handle and safely shoot a handgun, maybe she won't be so afraid of them. I'm not suggesting you try to recruit her into the concealed carry community (unless she begins acting interested). Just that you show her that firearms are a tool, and you don't have to live in fear of them.

Just my two cents.

G26packer
05-22-2009, 13:39
I guess I need to go back to when I was first introduced to guns. I was born and lived in Canada for 18 years and we all know what their view on firearms is.
I already made it a point not to carry in her house and left it in my car, just because of the way that I play with her kids sometimes, I would hate to be flipping one of them around and them to knock themselves on it or feel something in my shirt and grab it. But you are absolutely right, I cannot afford to give up my right to protect myself and my family, just because she has an irrational fear.
I think that she may honestly feel that because I am a woman I would not be able to control it as well as a man.
My husband has open-carried in their home several times without any comments, and knows that he carries concealed everywhere he goes, and if she had even mentioned it to her husband that it bothered her, he would have said something to him about it.
Whatever the reason, like you said I will respect her and not carry in her home. I will explain to her the reasons why I carry and offer to take her shooting.
I think it really comes down to a belief system, I respect her beliefs and her opinion, why shouldn't she respect mine?

holyjohnson
05-22-2009, 14:16
tell her "sorry,no"
shes got no cause to not trust you carrying.and no right to expect you to be unarmed anytime.
if she has no valid reason she has no reason to expect it.
if you don`t do it in her house which is respectful and reasonable (to her anyway)
there should`nt be any problem.if the friendship suffers maybe she`s got to learn to be a bit more open minded and not think her lack of understanding is anyone else`s fault.or her inability to defend herself and family is anyone else`s responsibility.
start meeting on neutral ground more and see if she brings it up again.
avoid anyplace like her house,or bars or anywhere you can`t carry.maybe offer to take her to a shooting range.don`t try to force her to live the gun life.
but maybe explain why its important and try to introduce her to self defense.
if she just flat wont get it,try and stay friends or put your foot down.
be prepared to cut your losses,some people just WONT get it.
good luck.(by the way,i`m not a lady either so everything i just said is probably wrong) :rofl:

G26packer
05-22-2009, 14:26
tell her "sorry,no"
shes got no cause to not trust you carrying.and no right to expect you to be unarmed anytime.
if she has no valid reason she has no reason to expect it.
if you don`t do it in her house which is respectful and reasonable (to her anyway)
there should`nt be any problem.if the friendship suffers maybe she`s got to learn to be a bit more open minded and not think her lack of understanding is anyone else`s fault.or her inability to defend herself and family is anyone else`s responsibility.
start meeting on neutral ground more and see if she brings it up again.
avoid anyplace like her house,or bars or anywhere you can`t carry.maybe offer to take her to a shooting range.don`t try to force her to live the gun life.
but maybe explain why its important and try to introduce her to self defense.
if she just flat wont get it,try and stay friends or put your foot down.
be prepared to cut your losses,some people just WONT get it.
good luck.(by the way,i`m not a lady either so everything i just said is probably wrong) :rofl:
:rofl::rofl::rofl:No it's not wrong...I feel so strongly about it, that it is like her basically asking me to not practice my religion around her......which the answer would obviously be NO!

deMontacute
05-22-2009, 16:00
I'm not a chick... errrr I mean Woman... But my advice would be "concealed means concealed"... ;)

FrogWithAGlock
05-22-2009, 17:37
Concealed is concealed. If she asks again, tell her it's like her asking about your underwear - personal, and has nothing to do with her, and you'd prefer she not mention it again.

Cat91
05-22-2009, 20:10
I have a close friend from England, where guns are illegal.

She knows I'm in the law enforcement biz.

We got talking about guns (this is some years ago and I was carrying a S&W 469 at the time, wish I could find another one) and she wanted to know if I was carrying then. I was, and zipped open my Coronado purse. She freaked, couldn't believe I carried it of-duty. Heck, I pack 24/7, these days my G27 is always on me or in arm's reach. Rose's simply terrified of the whole concept of firearms. Guns = evil. That's how they're indoctrinated over across the pond. No reason for it, simply full-on irrational fear. You can't fight that. She's one of these gals who has told me she'd rather get dead by the bad man than fight back. Me, I'm a West Virginia gal. I'm not going to go gently into that dark night; I plan to take the bad man with me or at least give it the old college try.

Miao, Cat

ubimow
05-23-2009, 02:07
Wow I can't believe she would say that she would rather get killed than defend herself???? I can't even begin to comprehend how someone could not having any survival instinct whatsoever!! Sorry, but that is just retarded. :upeyes:

lawman800
05-23-2009, 04:07
Sorry, no deal.

I have (had) fervently anti-gun friends. We get into huge arguments about guns. I also have a few anti-gun family members. They don't like it, they don't have to be around me. I am not compromising my safety or the safety of those around me to make someone "comfortable".

I figure getting mugged and stabbed or shot while my wife is getting molested might be a little more uncomfortable than not having that buddy around who is going to do what? Say mean things to the gangbangers for being bad people?

I have no problem with people being sheeple and living by the good grace of others, that's their life choice, don't expect me to do the same.

To be fair to her and you, if you wish to solve it or compromise... tell her you won't carry your gun around her if she promises to throw herself in front of muggers while you get away or at the minimum, won't hold a grudge against you while you throw her to them as you run off. You'll come back for her, promise. She'll be your shield if she won't let you have a sword.

tshadow6
05-23-2009, 19:14
I'm a guy, just so you know. Now, I leave my weapon locked in my car whenever I'm at a family member's house. Other than that, I carry concealed. If someone has a problem with that, it's their problem not mine. I would respect your friend's wishes when in her home, otherwise, continue to carry concealed. Maybe getting beaten or worse is more comfortable for her?

lawman800
05-23-2009, 19:35
I'm a guy, just so you know. Now, I leave my weapon locked in my car whenever I'm at a family member's house. Other than that, I carry concealed. If someone has a problem with that, it's their problem not mine. I would respect your friend's wishes when in her home, otherwise, continue to carry concealed. Maybe getting beaten or worse is more comfortable for her?

I don't leave my gun in the car when I visit family. If they don't like it, it's on them. I can leave without a problem. My family does not compromise my safety. If they can't understand it and they get uncomfortable with me carrying a weapon, then they don't trust me either.

ubimow
05-23-2009, 20:11
concealed is concealed. If she asks again, tell her it's like her asking about your underwear - personal, and has nothing to do with her, and you'd prefer she not mention it again.

LOL, perfect!!!

G26packer
05-24-2009, 12:04
SO my husband just mentioned in passing to her husband what she had said to me, and of course she had never mentioned anything to him about it. He said "ignore her, she's just anti gun. So, I think that I am going to back off the friendship with her for a while and just do what I do, it's not my problem to worry about her irrational fears, I know that I am legal...

lawman800
05-24-2009, 17:39
SO my husband just mentioned in passing to her husband what she had said to me, and of course she had never mentioned anything to him about it. He said "ignore her, she's just anti gun. So, I think that I am going to back off the friendship with her for a while and just do what I do, it's not my problem to worry about her irrational fears, I know that I am legal...

Become really good friends with her husband, hang out with him, call him and text him in the middle of the night, giggle about guns, give each other that knowing look that only pro-gunners give, that'll drive her nuts!

Cuzzin
05-24-2009, 17:49
... So, I think that I am going to back off the friendship with her for a while and just do what I do, it's not my problem to worry about her irrational fears, I know that I am legal...

Er ya go!!!

Mrs.Cicero
05-25-2009, 09:37
From my feminine (ha) perspective...

I don't have friends that have a problem with my carrying... for the obvious reason that if they have a problem with my exercising my God-given right to be prepared to defend myself, then they obviously think that their emotions are of greater value than my rights as a human being. I don't need friends like that. Anyone who asks me not to carry around them, or in their home, is not a friend. He/She is a selfish libridiot.

Unfortunately, one doesn't get to choose one's family that way, but one can control even that situation a bit - i don't go to the homes of family members who have issues with firearms. They may still be invited to mine, but in my house, it's my rules - either Mr.C or I or both are armed, and if guests don't like it they are FREE to leave.

If you still desire a friendship with this dingbat, then you may choose to do the same thing - tell her you won't carry in her home, as that is HER castle... a human right which she is unlikely to recognize, but may provide you a springboard for further discussion of the stupidity of acting on emotional reactions rather than morals, ethics, and intellect... Then just don't go to her house anymore. You may still invite her to your own... and you may choose whether or not to bring up the corollary idea that YOUR home is YOUR castle, in which to carry or not as you see fit.

Final comment... would she tell you not to carry fire insurance on your house because she hates AIG/insurance companies? Would she tell you not to carry life insurance because she knows someone who knows someone whose claim was turned down because of the suicide clause on the policy? That's what folks who tell their "friends" not to carry are doing...

Mrs.C :upeyes:

G26packer
05-26-2009, 20:38
Thanks for all your replies everyone. She did call by the way, she spent about a half an hour explaining herself, and alot of "what if this? what if that?" nonsense. Turns out her rediculous excuse was... drumroll please.... she knew someone that knew someone else, that apparently had an "accident" with a firearm, in which they couldn't have possibly been negligent and it was all the guns fault.. yes ladies and gentlemen.. you heard it here first...
Now excuse me while I go without driving my car because I knew someone that hit a parked car once that "came out of nowhere"...:whistling:

G26packer
05-26-2009, 20:42
Just wanted to add that I found it amusing that so many men replied to a thread entitled "when to put your foot down" in Women's Issues.. :tongueout:

kentuckysptpr
05-26-2009, 21:25
Well, I am a female. I think your friend may be intimidated by your gun. It takes a very confident woman to carry a gun and she probably feels like you have something in common with the men in her life. I would carry it anyhow.

mitchshrader
05-26-2009, 21:31
don't talk to crazy people.

Mrs.Cicero
05-27-2009, 07:04
don't talk to crazy people.
:rofl:
Mitch, you crack me up.

Mrs.C

LadyG23
05-27-2009, 07:31
I had a female friend who had similar anti-gun views and her hubby is ex-military. She had a no-gun rule in her house. I respected that. Outside of her house, I carried around her. She started up a couple message boards and "allowed" me a "firearm room" where I would answer questions - mostly about women and guns. Almost five years later she has decided that guns aren't a bad thing and is talking about going to a range to try out shooting and her hubby is now allowed to have one in the house. :supergrin:

I viewed it the same way as I would if she asked me not to smoke in her house or if I would mind keeping my very large dogs penned up when she brought her daughters (who are terrified of dogs) over to play. By being respectful to her wishes, brought her around to see that not everyone who carries is a "gun nut" who would fly off the handle about their "right to carry" and that yes, guns are perfectly safe in the right hands.

I guess you would need to judge if the friendship is worth it to you. In my case, it was.

lawman800
05-27-2009, 10:13
It's a little different than smoking in her house... guns don't emit fumes and stink up the whole house and get into people's lungs, unless you intentionally fire the lead into the lungs, that is.

It's more akin to asking someone to leave their Bible (religion kills) outside or toolbox (hammers kill) outside or a ladder (falling kills) outside or any other innocuous object that has been given some type of characteristic that is not really inherent in it.

ancient_serpent
05-27-2009, 13:57
G26 I think you've done very well in that situation, especially if you want to keep the friendship. Personally, I carry everywhere its legal. I don't go places I can't carry often at all. While i've not had the same type of situation occur, my GFs daughters roommate was a little bit anti. Took some time, and a whole lot of talking but she wants to hit the range sometime in the near future. Some people we can educate, some are so caught up in hoplophobia they'll not change. Best of luck to you.

Diesel_Bomber
05-31-2009, 15:37
She didn't know you were carrying before..............don't see why she'd have to know now.

lawman800
05-31-2009, 15:42
She doesn't, simple as that.

Mrs. Tink
06-01-2009, 08:12
It's hard for us to understand people like that, because they are coming from a "fear and emotion" viewpoint whereas we are coming from a "defensive and rational" viewpoint. They view the gun as a menacing instrument symbolic of nothing but danger. We view it as a tool for self-defense against the ever-higher risk out in the world. It is hard to change that paradigm.

Usually, only education and facts will ply the emotional anti-gunner, and that over a long period of time. Even traumatic events that clearly demonstrate the need for self-defense can push an anti-gunner either way.

Just continue to be rational with her, and of course do whatever is best for you. It is unfortunately up to her if whatever choices you choose to make are not good enough for her.

G26packer
06-01-2009, 15:33
Thanks everyone, it is nice (but rather unfortunate) to see that others have been in this same situation, you guys managed to keep me from saying what I really did want to say, which wouldn't have been understood anyways.... a couple of times I just felt like saying "you have a better idea?" and just being done with it.... but I don't go where I can't carry either... and it turns out.. you aren't ever missing out on much. A lot of people don't understand what we do.... When you are carrying.. you know it's there even though you don't always think about it, like one of your appendages... but you definately know when it's not... and I don't care for that feeling at all...

katrina sarcasm
06-07-2009, 22:38
I've been asked that by 3 of my girlfriends that knew when I took the CCW course, and the first time I was caught off guard and know that I offended at least one of them... they got over it. But since then, I *cough* fib a little bit. "You don't carry all the time, do you?" Answer: "A lot of times it's in my car" and they don't ask anymore questions. If they know me well enough, they'll call me on it - I have yet to be called on that one. My fiance just broke it off and I was about to stay at a girlfriend's house - and within 45 minutes of my arrival with all my stuff packed in my car, she texted me and said she didn't feel comfortable with a gun in the house... so I found a new place to stay. Maybe I need to be friends with less liberals?

lawman800
06-07-2009, 22:40
You have the wrong friends for sure.

charleym3
06-09-2009, 17:21
My wife and I have opposite views of this issue. She isn't anti-gun she's anti-carry. It's philosophical rather than emotional. She believes that the presence of a firearm will escalate a problem.
She owns her own business and works until late at night, but still won't carry a gun. When she leaves work at night, she has her cell phone out with "911" punched in and her thumb on the "dial" button. She thinks that's good enough. I know that it won't be if she ever needs it, but I hope that she never does.
I carry every day. She pretends that I don't. It's an uneasy peace. Some day something will happen that will cause one of us to change our position. I can only pray that it doesn't cost the life of someone that I care about.

Bilbo Bagins
06-10-2009, 12:36
A) You suffered a FAIL in the concealed carry department. You were made by your friend. You need a better setup or a smaller, more concealable gun.

B) Your response SUCKED. What do you think I'm going to shoot you is an irresponsible, and lame answer to her question. I would give the "I carry to protect my family" line is much better and throw out stories of local crime events to prove your point.

C) Her house, her rules, I would not carry in her house again until she changes her mind. Otherwise if your around her and not in her home, or outside, all bets are off. You can handle that any way you want. You could completely cut her off and no longer be her friend. My advice is to tell her that you will never carry "In Her Home" again if she wishes however you will carry when not in her home, and again explain "Why" you carry , and don't be a tool about it. Explain the safety of your family and friends are more important, your not going to change that. She will have to excuse herself when she is out and in your presence, she is the one with the problem.

mythaeus
06-10-2009, 13:02
I'm not a woman, but I carry a G26 daily so I thought I'd chime in :supergrin:

I actually commend your friend for speaking up. To that, I interpreted that you you are at least good friends because she is honest with you about her feelings. However, it looks like you are not close friends; or, at least not close enough for her to fully trust you with all your decisions about yourself. You may not have demonstrated to her that you can in fact handle guns safely, regardless of whether or not she is receptive to the idea nor had you an opportunity to do so. Moreover, I think you may not have done a good enough job of presenting your case on your need to carry, at least in her house and around her children.

Well, so far, I am blaming you for this whole thing haven't I? The fact that she called you to talk about it makes it seems that she cares about your friendship and is willing to listen. A good friendship is bound to hit some rough patches and I am glad you didn't throw your hands up, "do you have a better idea?", and be done with it. My gut sense is that it will work out if you continue your dialogue instead of giving up or ignoring the issue and hope it will go away, or worst, marring the friendship to an effective end. I don't think it's a good route.

May I suggest having her come over to your house more often and carry when she and her kids are in your home? Bring up the topic and show her your method of carry, after unloading the gun out of her sight of course, and show how it is impossible for the gun to go off in a secure IWB with the trigger covered and underneath your clothes. Point to the fact that the trigger safety will prevent the gun from firing if dropped. While the Glock has no external safety, its trigger is relatively heavier and tell her that in order for you to effectively defend yourself under stressful situation where you may forget that the is a safety, you prefer no manual safeties...as do the majority of police forces in the country. The purpose is to show that if nothing happens in YOUR house, nothing is bound to happen in HER house either.

Another thing to consider is to invite her to come out to the range and shoot with you. Go over the basic safety rules and shooting techniques to her. I take it though that her husband may have tried it before; however, I think they may not have approached her on a "friends" level. If she is really a friend and cares about your friendship, she is likely to give it a try.

I guess, my point here is really work at it on the friendship/relationship terms through discussion, not my rights vs. your rights and my opinion vs. your opinion, and give up on the first few tries...unless your don't think the friendship is worth the effort in the first place.

Regards,
Al

PS: Just to qualify myself a little...
All of my friends are liberal Democrats (mostly apathetic towards gun rights, not against gun rights). The majority of them have young kids (5 or under). They themselves had never handled guns before until they met me. In the short period of gun ownership (under 1.5 years), I've managed to take most of them out to the range. Convinced them that my wife and I are responsible gun owners. Now, we carry in ALL of our friends' houses 100% of the time, including leaving our firearms next to the bed when we stay overnight. I am not talking about 1 or 2 couples either...8 couples and lots of kids. We were close friends well before the past 1.5 years though.

G26packer
06-10-2009, 13:03
Thanks Al, the way you broke it down, made everything seem like a full picture....
Bilbo:

First of all, I have carried around her for over a month now, completely concealed, and I have always maintained complete control over my firearm. The only reason why she knows is because I was showing her husband and father and law my pistol. (one is a retired police officer, the other a local officer.)Both of which are completely supportive of me carrying.

You obviously didn't read the posting about how she found out.... she had also told me later that she had absolutely no idea that I was carrying other than she was told by someone that knew.
Although you bring some good information to the table in your posting, it is completely overshadowed by the fact that you were completely rude and really didn't offer any positive input at all.
Everyone else offered suggestions in a respectful manner.... I don't see why you couldn't have done the same thing.

lawman800
06-10-2009, 21:14
Thanks Al, the way you broke it down, made everything seem like a full picture....
Bilbo:

You obviously didn't read the posting about how she found out.... she had also told me later that she had absolutely no idea that I was carrying other than she was told by someone that knew.
Although you bring some good information to the table in your posting, it is completely overshadowed by the fact that you were completely rude and really didn't offer any positive input at all.
Everyone else offered suggestions in a respectful manner.... I don't see why you couldn't have done the same thing.

It's part of his charm...

PATRICE
09-25-2009, 18:44
.....

lawman800
09-25-2009, 20:01
The law has nothing to do with it. Her friend being a nutjob does.

Yellowfin
09-25-2009, 20:47
She's one of these gals who has told me she'd rather get dead by the bad man than fight back. So basically she's suicidal but lacks the guts to take responsibility for doing it herself.

Mrs.Cicero
09-26-2009, 07:01
So basically she's suicidal but lacks the guts to take responsibility for doing it herself.

and the problem with that suicidal attitude is she won't understand why anyone else should value their own life more than she "values" hers. I hate that.

Mrs.C

another okie
09-26-2009, 11:23
Your mistake was telling anyone that you were carrying a gun. Now that you've learned that lesson, don't tell anyone else.

Glock26girl
09-28-2009, 23:55
Your mistake was telling anyone that you were carrying a gun. Now that you've learned that lesson, don't tell anyone else.

+1, I did the same thing and will never make the same mistake again. It is "my" business, no one else's.

PATRICE
09-29-2009, 04:36
<smile>.....
</smile>