RWS 9mm Luger Sport Line 124gr. FMJ - info? [Archive] - Glock Talk

PDA

View Full Version : RWS 9mm Luger Sport Line 124gr. FMJ - info?


yO B
10-31-2009, 02:23
Alright, I have some 9mm Luger 124gr. FMJ ammo, but I can't find any information other than what is on the box. I'm assuming it is range/target ammunition. Does anyone have any experience with this ammuntion?

The box is marked 'RWS 124gr. FMJ Sport Line. RAUG Ammotec AG - Thun -Switzerland. 'The Ammunition Counts'; SYNOXID primer.

I can't find a thing online, but I think it is from BIG 5. I couldn't find anything on the RWS website, and everything I find with keywords relates to air rifles, rifle cartridges, or ancient "Steyer" ammunition. This appears to be fairly new.

The RWS website lists GECO ammo, but the box print has nothing about this. Keyword searches also came up with the "Fiocchi" name, but again, nothing on the box. I want to know what I have, or any other significant information. Is this manufactured/imported by someone else and simply bears the RWS logo?

Thanks in advance.

* From Fiocchi web

http://www.fiocchiusa.com/images/Web_Fiocchi_Tables/Pistol&Rev_Tables.gif

Merkavaboy
10-31-2009, 03:48
Simple answer: Brand-spankin' new production ammo for target shooting with a high price tag on it (almost $30 for a single box from Big 5 Sporting Goods).

As for a more complicated answer, as far as I can piece together is as follows:

Prior to WWII RWS headstamped 9mm ammo was made at the Rheinisch Westfaelische Munitionsfabrik A.G. in Nuremberg, Germany. There appears to have been some 9mm ammo made after the war with the RWS headstamp on the case, but the ammo was made by Dynamit Nobel A/G, Troisdorf, which was actually Gustav Genschow (Geco) during the war years. The Geco 9mm ammo that was readily available about 5 years ago was actually made by Dynamit Nobel.

Now we come to the current 9mm ammo headstamped RWS for the first time in about 50 years (+/-). The box indeed states "Made in Switzerland", so I doubt that the ammo was made in Germany. It wasn't too long ago that many of the European ammo makers were combined under on roof, that of Ruag Ammotec. So I wouldn't be suprised to see in the future ammo stamped "HP" (Hirtenberger Patronfabrik of Austria) being made in Switzerland or Germany and Geco being made in Switzerland (as the new RWS ammo is).

Those of us who collect ammo often have to do a lot of puzzle solving to figure out who really makes what ammo and for whom.

Ak.Hiker
11-01-2009, 00:29
Simple answer: Brand-spankin' new production ammo for target shooting with a high price tag on it (almost $30 for a single box from Big 5 Sporting Goods).

As for a more complicated answer, as far as I can piece together is as follows:

Prior to WWII RWS headstamped 9mm ammo was made at the Rheinisch Westfaelische Munitionsfabrik A.G. in Nuremberg, Germany. There appears to have been some 9mm ammo made after the war with the RWS headstamp on the case, but the ammo was made by Dynamit Nobel A/G, Troisdorf, which was actually Gustav Genschow (Geco) during the war years. The Geco 9mm ammo that was readily available about 5 years ago was actually made by Dynamit Nobel.

Now we come to the current 9mm ammo headstamped RWS for the first time in about 50 years (+/-). The box indeed states "Made in Switzerland", so I doubt that the ammo was made in Germany. It wasn't too long ago that many of the European ammo makers were combined under on roof, that of Ruag Ammotec. So I wouldn't be suprised to see in the future ammo stamped "HP" (Hirtenberger Patronfabrik of Austria) being made in Switzerland or Germany and Geco being made in Switzerland (as the new RWS ammo is).

Those of us who collect ammo often have to do a lot of puzzle solving to figure out who really makes what ammo and for whom.

That is pretty darn complicated and interesting info.

JohnKSa
11-01-2009, 12:45
RWS is currently an importer/distributer, not a manufacturer as far as I can tell. They market a variety of products from a wide range of companies.

yO B
11-01-2009, 13:50
Simple answer: Brand-spankin' new production ammo for target shooting

As for a more complicated answer, as far as I can piece together is as follows:

Rheinisch Westfaelische Munitionsfabrik A.G. in Nuremberg, Germany.
Dynamit Nobel A/G, Troisdorf,
Gustav Genschow (Geco)

the current 9mm ammo headstamped RWS
Ruag Ammotec.

ammo stamped "HP" (Hirtenberger Patronfabrik of Austria) being made in Switzerland or Germany and Geco being made in Switzerland (as the new RWS ammo is).

Those of us who collect ammo often have to do a lot of puzzle solving to figure out who really makes what ammo and for whom.

Thanks for the information. I have come up with most of these names in my search as well, but I can't seem to tie them directly to the box of ammo I have. But it has to be someone, somewhere, and probably one of these names.

RWS is currently an importer/distributer, not a manufacturer as far as I can tell. They market a variety of products from a wide range of companies.

I think that is one thing (if true) that makes this seem more complicated than it is. I have a box of ammo branded RWS (and no name other than RUAG Ammotec) on box, and ammo stamped RWS 9mm, in a bullet weight (124gr) that I can't find info directly from RWS.

Every search leads to a name to a name to a name or company and company. I hate simple answers! :)

Smack
03-03-2010, 15:21
http://www.rws-usa.com/rws_sport_fmj.php

Police Marksman
03-03-2010, 19:01
Wal-Mart has this match ammo for $16.97 a box of 50.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=147765672

glocksterr
03-03-2010, 20:32
Wal-Mart has this match ammo for $16.97 a box of 50.


match ammo that runs 1180?



:dunno:

Police Marksman
03-03-2010, 21:48
It sounds like this is 9mm NATO ammo. It should be excellent for those who like FMJ ammo.

http://gunnuts.net/2009/04/03/9mm-nato-vs-9mm-luger/

glocksterr
03-03-2010, 22:01
its more likely CIP as that is what the S&B runs.

:cool:

G26Okie
03-04-2010, 07:59
Wal-Mart has this match ammo for $16.97 a box of 50.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=147765672

Yeah, saw this last night. Also probably why it was the only 9mm left on the shelf @ that price.

yO B
03-17-2010, 19:34
http://www.rws-usa.com/rws_sport_fmj.php
Thank you. It looks like that site is brand-spankin'-new (hence the copywrite 2010). It wasn't there last year!

Wal-Mart has this match ammo for $16.97 a box of 50.

I also saw this ammo at WM the other week. Maybe it's spreading across the market now, because $16.97 isn't bad compared to what it was a while ago ($24+). The RWS-USA website seems to be new, so maybe we will see more of them.

sciolist
03-17-2010, 20:00
We have it at Wally's here too, but I have no need for 34 cent range ammo. I can get it cheaper than that from at least 5 other local sources.

Bring back the 20 cent WWB!

Actually... talk to me about 15 cent WWB. :-)

mustachio
04-25-2010, 15:54
Wal-Mart has the RWS for $12.97 right now. I just picked up a few boxes for my G26. For that price, I will buy them, not for the $17 as previously noted. They must not be selling them, therefore the drop in price.
Mustachio

rixtrix1
04-26-2010, 00:20
Wal-Mart has the RWS for $12.97 right now. I just picked up a few boxes for my G26. For that price, I will buy them, not for the $17 as previously noted. They must not be selling them, therefore the drop in price.
Mustachio

Same thing I noticed at Wally World today in Chandler AZ, so I picked up some. Boxes marked RUAG Ammotec AG Made in Switzerland. Sure looks a lot nicer than WWB. Hope it shoots better.

Sporting Goods Sales Manager said I probably couldn't use it at an indoor range," cuz it's steel instead of lead"?! I didn't think that comment deserved an answer.

RicG

chad1972
05-01-2010, 19:49
wal mart here has it for $12 box of 50, im going to get some tomorrow.

glocksterr
05-01-2010, 19:52
Sporting Goods Sales Manager said I probably couldn't use it at an indoor range," cuz it's steel instead of lead"?! I didn't think that comment deserved an answer.

RicG

hee,hee!

BillR
05-01-2010, 21:19
Wal-Mart has the RWS for $12.97 right now. I just picked up a few boxes for my G26. For that price, I will buy them, not for the $17 as previously noted. They must not be selling them, therefore the drop in price.
Mustachio
Yep, I grabbed 2 boxes tonight for $12.97 each.

Merkavaboy
05-01-2010, 22:27
Same thing I noticed at Wally World today in Chandler AZ, so I picked up some. Boxes marked RUAG Ammotec AG Made in Switzerland. Sure looks a lot nicer than WWB. Hope it shoots better.

Sporting Goods Sales Manager said I probably couldn't use it at an indoor range," cuz it's steel instead of lead"?! I didn't think that comment deserved an answer.

RicG

RUAG's current ammo made and sold under the brand names of RWS, DAG and Geco use a mild steel jacket bullet with a lead core. Ranges that use steel plates for a backstop usually don't allow steel jacketed bullets to be used on the range.

novaDAK
05-02-2010, 04:36
Wal-Mart has the RWS for $12.97 right now. I just picked up a few boxes for my G26. For that price, I will buy them, not for the $17 as previously noted. They must not be selling them, therefore the drop in price.
Mustachio

Yep, I grabbed 2 boxes tonight for $12.97 each.

well, a price drop would explain why there were 6 boxes sitting on the shelf for a month or two that just sold last week in one day.

G26Okie
05-02-2010, 05:35
Yeah, @ 12.97 I bought a box, but only because it was all they had. If they had federal or wwb I'd be snatching that up.

spweber
05-02-2010, 08:33
My WalMart also had reduced the price down to $12.97, so I brought home a box yesterday.

I used them last week in breaking in my NIB Glock 17, and the gun operated flawlessly with them.....noticed the slight increase in recoil from the UMC 115gr that I was alternating with. My Glock just ate all 350 rounds up like warm butter (250 UMC 115gr. and 100 RWS 124gr.)

I'm new to spending $$ on 9mm ammo, but I thought that the WallyWorld price at the $12 level isn't too bad...... :cool:

Regards,
Stan

cadillacguns
05-02-2010, 09:52
Federal Wally World 9mm is $9.47 a box, WWB 100 pacs slightly more than double that so $12.97 for 50 rds for me is too much unless its the only thing on the shelf.

BillR
05-02-2010, 09:57
Federal Wally World 9mm is $9.47 a box, WWB 100 pacs slightly more than double that so $12.97 for 50 rds for me is too much unless its the only thing on the shelf.


That's all they had...:dunno:

glocksterr
05-02-2010, 12:36
i bought some of this stuff. seems like a good price for NATO+ ammoo.

let's see what i does on the chrony.

:)

Gulfcop
05-13-2010, 22:18
Glad the thread was started ,I have been looking at this ammo. I was wondering about it. The price dropped down to 12.97 at my wally world. Next pay day I will pick some up.

Cineski
05-13-2010, 23:03
This is great ammo, however, buyer beware it is magnetic. Some ranges don't allow any ammo with steel in the bullet as it can spark and start a fire.

JohnTz
05-14-2010, 05:33
This is top notch stuff. Clean and very accurate. Kinda pricey at $13 a box but you get what you pay for. Very consistant high spec manufacturer. I wish I could find it by the case and get the price down to $12 a box and I would switch over to it. I shoot AE 124 that I get for $11.88 a box and I am too cheap to pay the extra $1 a box since I shoot allot of 9mm. It is my workhorse training and competition caliber.

TWS G26
05-20-2010, 19:36
Here you go.....video. Yes, it is most absolutely magnetic. But clean, accurate, and not much recoil. Also running .50 less for 50 rounds compared to WWB 115 gr....for now anyway. Still higher than Federal 115 gr in these parts. If you are looking for some 124 gr plinking ammo, it could be the ticket.


http://www.youtube.com/tnoutdoors9#p/c/BDB9A9740F47C67A/2/3mqEVXosxzQ

Police Marksman
05-21-2010, 13:21
Here you go.....video. Yes, it is most absolutely magnetic. But clean, accurate, and not much recoil. Also running .50 less for 50 rounds compared to WWB 115 gr....for now anyway. Still higher than Federal 115 gr in these parts. If you are looking for some 124 gr plinking ammo, it could be the ticket.


http://www.youtube.com/tnoutdoors9#p/c/BDB9A9740F47C67A/2/3mqEVXosxzQ

Since there is some steel in the jacket, does this mean it would have more penetration through barriers, almost like armor piercing ammo? It would have to penetrate more that standard copper jacketing. Also the loading seems to be at about +P standards with a velocity of about 1160 out of a G19.

TWS G26
05-21-2010, 15:11
Since there is some steel in the jacket, does this mean it would have more penetration through barriers, almost like armor piercing ammo? It would have to penetrate more that standard copper jacketing. Also the loading seems to be at about +P standards with a velocity of about 1160 out of a G19.


Certainly not armor-piercing, nor could I confirm whether or not it supposedly does better on penetrating water jugs, etc. based on what I illustrated. I don't know if that could be quantified with an FMJ at typical handgun velocities. It is one thing to have those magnetic properties in the bullet prior to shooting, but I am still perplexed by the post-shot magnetism. Any metallurgists out there?

Merkavaboy
05-22-2010, 01:59
Certainly not armor-piercing, nor could I confirm whether or not it supposedly does better on penetrating water jugs, etc. based on what I illustrated. I don't know if that could be quantified with an FMJ at typical handgun velocities. It is one thing to have those magnetic properties in the bullet prior to shooting, but I am still perplexed by the post-shot magnetism. Any metallurgists out there?

So far all of RUAG's imported 9mm brand ammo (RWS, DAG and Geco) are loaded with what's called a gilding metal clad steel (GMCS) bullet jacket over a lead core. European made ammo is well known to use GMCS bullets in 9mm. It's less expensive to use GMCS bullets instead of the standard copper alloy gilding metal jacketed bullets. If they had a metal core rather than a lead core, you would have noticed it after shooting your steel targets.

mustachio
05-22-2010, 18:14
this ammo worked fine in my G26 and was quite accurate. However, in my Kel-tec sub 2000, it had feeding problems and ejection problems. When I switched to WWB I had no problems with the sub2k.

86brick
07-11-2010, 10:29
I just bought 4 boxes of this stuff for $55 at $12.97 a box from our local Walmart. Having used this stuff at the range when I first bought my G19 (back then it was $16.97 a box), I really liked it and it also seemed to be very clean ammo. If it stays at this price I will continue to buy it instead of the WWB.

Snowman92D
07-11-2010, 11:42
Tell you one thing, for sure. It is extremely accurate. :thumbsup:

481
07-11-2010, 20:37
Certainly not armor-piercing, nor could I confirm whether or not it supposedly does better on penetrating water jugs, etc. based on what I illustrated. I don't know if that could be quantified with an FMJ at typical handgun velocities. It is one thing to have those magnetic properties in the bullet prior to shooting, but I am still perplexed by the post-shot magnetism. Any metallurgists out there?

I am not a metallurgist and I didn't stay at a Holiday Inn last night either, but there is a big difference between a material being magnetic (or paramagnetic) and being magnetized (this having to do with iron's domain orientation which induces the propagation of a magnetic field) meaning that it would attract to itself other non-magnetized ferrous alloys so long as it is either ferritic or martensitic (body-centered lattice) alloy. Heating repositions the crystal lattice to a face centered lattice crystalline structure (austentitic) that is not magnetic nor capable of being magnetized (this is why red hot iron loses its magnetization) and only does so after reaching a critical point.

I don't believe that mild steel jacketed bullets are magnetized, but they are "magnetic" in the sense that they will be attracted to a magnet since they are composed of an (a ferromagnetic) iron alloy that being mild (low carbon) steel. Even if they were magnetized (capable of attracting other ferrous alloys by virtue of their own magnetic field) before being fired which I find highly unlikely since this property serves no purpose for the ammo's function, it would likely remain so after impact since critical temperature is likely not reached.

Does that help?

Merkavaboy
07-11-2010, 23:29
Since there is some steel in the jacket, does this mean it would have more penetration through barriers, almost like armor piercing ammo? It would have to penetrate more that standard copper jacketing. Also the loading seems to be at about +P standards with a velocity of about 1160 out of a G19.

A Gilding Metal Clad Steel (GMCS) bullet jacket, by it's nature, is going to be harder than a standard gilding metal (GM) bullet jacket. It would make sense that the RUAG GMCS bullet would be less succeptable to deformation than a GM jacketed by, say Winchester or a Speer copper plated TMJ bullet. Therefore I would say that the RUAG bullet would probably have better barrier penetration than a standard GM FMJ bullet in the same caliber, bullet weight and velocity.

A bullet that deforms will create more drag and resist penetrating an object more than a bullet that retains it's original shape and creates less resistance while penetrating an object.