Steel cased .45 acp, safe or harmful to 1911 ? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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mista jc
12-02-2009, 15:40
I just acquired a LNIB SA 1911 Loaded and the only ammo I could find was steel cased, made in Russia.

There's no brand name, it just says pistol sporting cartridges. On the receipt it says, UCW steel cased ammo .45acp, non corrosive, made in Russia

I tried searching but only found information on wolf ammo, some people swear by it because it shoots a bit dirtier but some forbid it.

Can any 1911 experts shed light on the issues or possible damage this ammo can cause to my firearm, if any ? I read about steel cased ammo having a rust prevention coating on it and after a few mags, it will cause binding to the mag walls, receiver and extractor.

Would you shoot it out of your 1911? What parts are compromised by steel cased? What did I get my impatient arse into ?

:crying:

Cobra64
12-02-2009, 16:18
I just acquired a LNIB SA 1911 Loaded and the only ammo I could find was steel cased, made in Russia.

There's no brand name, it just says pistol sporting cartridges. On the receipt it says, UCW steel cased ammo .45acp, non corrosive, made in Russia

I tried searching but only found information on wolf ammo, some people swear by it because it shoots a bit dirtier but some forbid it.

Can any 1911 experts shed light on the issues or possible damage this ammo can cause to my firearm, if any ? I read about steel cased ammo having a rust prevention coating on it and after a few mags, it will cause binding to the mag walls, receiver and extractor.

Would you shoot it out of your 1911? What parts are compromised by steel cased? What did I get my impatient arse into ?

:crying:I have no personal experience shooting Wolf ammo, and based on others' experiences, I don't plan to.

Zombie Steve
12-02-2009, 16:27
I wouldn't expect fantastic results, but I wouldn't worry about running it through my gun if it's a couple boxes. Shoot what you have; look for something better. When you are sitting around asking yourself what to do with all this .45acp brass... send me a PM.

:supergrin:



To answer your question, I would think it could be harder on the extractor and ejector.

Cobra64
12-02-2009, 16:31
I wouldn't expect fantastic results, but I wouldn't worry about running it through my gun if it's a couple boxes. Shoot what you have; look for something better. When you are sitting around asking yourself what to do with all this .45acp brass... send me a PM.

:supergrin:

Steve, I think it's Berdan primed.

bac1023
12-02-2009, 16:39
Frankly, I wouldn't do it.

Zombie Steve
12-02-2009, 16:43
Steve, I think it's Berdan primed.

...I meant once he gets BRASS brass. Can't reload steel anyways.

:whistling:

Cobra64
12-02-2009, 16:47
...I meant once he gets BRASS brass.

:whistling:Gotcha. :)

Rinspeed
12-02-2009, 17:03
I've heard of lots of people that have shot thousands of rounds of Wolf ammo with no adverse effects. That said I won't shoot the crap in any of my guns. :dunno:

n2extrm
12-02-2009, 18:02
I have seen problems with it in AR's. Never shot or saw it shot in a .45. In the AR platform the coatings sometimes cook to the chamber and the case get riped at the web. Probabley would not happen in a 1911. But still reason enough to not try it. Just my thoughts. :dunno:

GVFlyer
12-02-2009, 18:24
Personally, I wouldn't use it in any of my 1911s. Sorry.

bac1023
12-02-2009, 18:27
I've heard of lots of people that have shot thousands of rounds of Wolf ammo with no adverse effects. That said I won't shoot the crap in any of my guns. :dunno:

Exactly

ilgunguygt
12-02-2009, 18:57
The wolf part would bother me, not the steel case. The US govt issued to steel cased ammo when brass shortages were on, and it was shot in 1911s on the battlefield. Wolf just sucks.

1006
12-02-2009, 19:19
My belief is that brass being softer than steel is not going to hurt steel barrels, but steel on steel might. I know the stuff has some coating on it to prevent it from gouging the chamber and ramp, I just don't trust it to be a 100%. If I was fighting a war .....

den888
12-02-2009, 19:24
Safe for the gun, but not-reloadable and also a bit dirty.

zdragon23c
12-02-2009, 20:00
i wouldn't be surprised to see premature extractor wear with steel.

Neener Neener
12-02-2009, 20:49
i wouldn't be surprised to see premature extractor wear with steel.


Not only would I not be surprised, I would expect it.

bac1023
12-02-2009, 20:59
I'm not sure why someone would want to shoot that crap through their 1911. :dunno:

FLIPPER 348
12-02-2009, 21:07
Would you shoot it out of your 1911? What parts are compromised by steel cased?

:crying:


yes and none


I've shot many (many) 1000s of rounds of Wolf through my 1911s witth no adverse effects.

mista jc
12-02-2009, 21:50
Hm, I guess it's 50/50 from experience and knowledge. Thanks, fellow members. Lots of good responses.

I guess I'll ask my reloader/dealer what he thinks about it. Or just sell it to my buddy who has a G30SF haha.

L-2
12-02-2009, 22:12
deleted

Zombie Steve
12-02-2009, 22:53
I'm not sure why someone would want to shoot that crap through their 1911. :dunno:

He's got it... and nothing else.






FWIW, when you see that line along the side of the headstamp of a fired brass case, you gotta figure that SOMEthing else is taking the pressure on a steel cased round (can't just stamp it's way through it). The .45acp, however, is a pretty low pressure round so I think it would take a huge volume of steel cases to really make a difference on the parts in your gun. Besides, if you had to replace the extractor and ejector and you wanted to go top of the line... you're looking at about $60.



Again, not my first choice, but I wouldn't worry about a couple boxes.

MD357
12-02-2009, 23:03
Wolf ammo used to be nearly half the price of regular ammo. I've probably shot 10K of the stuff via 9mm, .40, and .45. Now the price difference is not that great/worth it IMHO. I've shot a ton of the stuff through factory and custom 1911s with no problems. Yeah the really old stuff would be a PITA to clean after a good number of rounds but who cares? Doesn't hurt your 1911.

sns3guppy
12-03-2009, 00:39
In the AR platform the coatings sometimes cook to the chamber and the case get riped at the web.

This used to be the case, years ago, but is myth today and not reality.

The lacquer that used to coat cases and primers is gone, and gumming chambers isn't an issue.

When was the last time this became a problem in the AK-47? (never).

Extractor wear is an issue, but chamber fouling isn't.

okie
12-03-2009, 02:25
I used to have a Springfield Parkerized 1911 and I ran a butt load of Wolf through it with no worries, also did the same with the Kimber Warrior I used to own, with no worries :supergrin:

LLDJR
12-03-2009, 03:24
Same thing here, I could only find Steel Case Blazer recently, some people like Blazer and some don't.

faawrenchbndr
12-03-2009, 04:43
Standard Blazer ammunition's casings are "aircraft grade aluminum" NOT steel.
I've shot these, they are dirty and fairly unaccurate.

I WILL shoot steel case ammo in an SKS or AK,.....but not in any weapon I care about.

MSgt Dotson
12-03-2009, 05:12
...I meant once he gets BRASS brass. Can't reload steel anyways.

:whistling:

I have reloaded perhaps 20 steel .45 ACP cass a few times to test them; others find they are good for 2-3 reloadings before they split. (perfect for lost brass matches IMO, now have about 200 saved!)

bac1023
12-03-2009, 06:27
I have reloaded perhaps 20 steel .45 ACP cass a few times to test them; others find they are good for 2-3 reloadings before they split. (perfect for lost brass matches IMO, now have about 200 saved!)

I didn't realize that would work. In years past when I reloaded, I never tried it. I know its not recommended.

Zombie Steve
12-03-2009, 09:43
I have reloaded perhaps 20 steel .45 ACP cass a few times to test them; others find they are good for 2-3 reloadings before they split. (perfect for lost brass matches IMO, now have about 200 saved!)

Wow. How's that on your dies?

bac1023
12-03-2009, 09:53
Wow. How's that on your dies?


Yeah, I never tried it, but it sounds rough.

ArmoryDoc
12-03-2009, 10:38
It should be fine with the carbide dies. I would case lube the empties anyway.

FLIPPER 348
12-03-2009, 11:58
It should be fine with the carbide dies. I would case lube the empties anyway.

eggzakly, no worries on the dies. I've reloaded a few just for fun and they worked fine. A class 3 guy I shoot with reloads 100s of Wolf in 9mm for his Mac-10. If you don't want to shoot Wolf poly in your 1911s that's just fine. But why bash the stuff and call it junk because you 'think' it may be bad for your pistol?? It's not like you have any proof or anything, just internet-commando rumor.

Bowtie
12-03-2009, 12:16
Same thing here, I could only find Steel Case Blazer recently, some people like Blazer and some don't.

Blazer is Alum. case..

faawrenchbndr
12-03-2009, 12:29
Blazer is Alum. case..

Yep,...... a bit dirty, but ok for plinker stuff. Just do not expect
great accuracy out of it.

MD357
12-03-2009, 12:39
Pssst..... 1911 fans...... ever care to look up what kind of ammo they used in WWII? Hint: Worked out just fine.

faawrenchbndr
12-03-2009, 13:35
Pssst..... 1911 fans...... ever care to look up what kind of ammo they used in WWII? Hint: Worked out just fine.

Pssst,.......not in MY 1911!

In my Glock? Sure, but I will not run it in a weapon I really care about.
Not arguing, just stating fact!

MD357
12-03-2009, 14:09
Pssst,.......not in MY 1911!

In my Glock? Sure, but I will not run it in a weapon I really care about.
Not arguing, just stating fact!

Well I REALLY care about my 1911s too. :rofl: I'm just relaying that the 1911 can take an amount of abuse and internet lore tends to paint an ignorant picture about them.

Doesn't really matter nowdays anyway, any steel cased ammo you find isn't much discounted relative to Blazer, Fed, WWB etc.

mista jc
12-03-2009, 15:01
Well, I just found out the name of the brand browsing gunbroker.

They're called "Tula" from Russia.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=149012168

ArmoryDoc
12-03-2009, 15:18
eggzakly, no worries on the dies. I've reloaded a few just for fun and they worked fine. A class 3 guy I shoot with reloads 100s of Wolf in 9mm for his Mac-10. If you don't want to shoot Wolf poly in your 1911s that's just fine. But why bash the stuff and call it junk because you 'think' it may be bad for your pistol?? It's not like you have any proof or anything, just internet-commando rumor.

I don't have any issue running it in my guns. It's good plinker stuff.

Brucev
12-03-2009, 15:18
I have fired a lot of the Wolf 5.56mm in my COLT HBAR. I have not ever had a single issue with the ammunition. On target results have been equal to those obtained with any other ball loading. The 5.56mm operates at a much higher pressure than that of the .45 ACP. In any weapon of good quality the Wolf .45 ACP should give fine results. It is not match grade ammo, but for most range use it is equal to any other FMJ load available. Sincerely. Brucev.

janice6
12-03-2009, 15:19
My son and I have run thousands of rounds of steel ammo through our Kimber and Colt Gold Cup with no issues at all. We still shoot it.

brisk21
12-03-2009, 22:13
because I can get Federal .45 Auto for $17 a box, I dont bother with wolf. I probably wouldn't worry about shooting it in my 1911. I would definatley get a whole lot of it if I could find it for $10 or less per box.

fredj338
12-03-2009, 22:51
Late WWII 45acp was steel cased, I doubt the Russian stuff is much diff. I have shot a box of Wolf, just to try it. It shoots fine, dirty as hell, but I reload anyway. I would rather shoot brass or alum. cased ammo. Running a steady diet of steel cases just doesn't seem right.

DLL9mm
12-04-2009, 04:50
I am going to buy a couple boxes of Wolf .45 at my local gunstore. They have some .45 in stock. I will run it through my Firestorm 1911. IF I had a $1,000+ 1911, I wouldn't shoot steel ammo, but since my Firestorm was under $500, I think it will be OK.

LLDJR
12-04-2009, 05:59
Blazer is Alum. case..

Thanks!

This is the first time I ever bought Blazer and I thought it was but the Dicks Sporting Goods guy said, NO they are steel" , I put a magnet on the casing at home and it did not stick either.


Brass is all I typically use.

Jim in MI
12-04-2009, 06:47
I have shot I don't know how many thousands of Wolf in my Wilson Combat and Rock River 1911's. I have friends that have several thousand more rounds than I.....after watching these guys shoot Wolf for 2 years with no problems I switched.

No problems in my guns.

If you don't want to shoot it fine, but until you actually see an extractor break (and spare extractors are like a thousand bucks, aren't they) don't keep circulating the hate.

luv2brode
12-04-2009, 12:11
love me some steel cased ammo, my ar has never had anything else, and when i find it in other calibers i dont hesitate 3.99 for 20 223 not bad in my book and 9mm 6.99 ill take all i can get

FLIPPER 348
12-04-2009, 15:13
because I can get Federal .45 Auto for $17 a box, I dont bother with wolf. I probably wouldn't worry about shooting it in my 1911. I would definatley get a whole lot of it if I could find it for $10 or less per box.


I've still got several cases of Wolf from B4 the nutty ammo hoarders got going strong. $63/500 rounds. Now when you can find them the price is over $125/500!! I've shot many many 1000s of wolf poly 45acp through my 1911s with zero ammo related issues.

AuProspector
01-12-2010, 20:34
I bought a 1000 rounds for a class at Front Sight a few months ago (it was all I could fine at the time) and I was concern about using it in my Colt 1911.... It preformed flawlessly.

It was dirty but the Mobile 1 that I used for gun lube took care of the fouling and clean up was easy (but dirty).

In the past year, I've ran about 2000 rounds of Wolf 55 & 62 grainer in .223 through my Rock River with only 1 malfunction.... (the flash hole in the primer wasn't drill all the way through to the powder chamber). Other than that it seems to be good stuff.


BTW, I just read about a guy having a KaBoom from the same lot of Wolf .45 ACP ammo (he posted the lot number) in his Sig P220. This is the same lot number that I've been using w/o any problems. The KaBoom may have came from the bullet being set back to far into the mouth of the case.

My .02

Max1775
01-12-2010, 20:39
Run the steel. If it doesn't pipe, it's good. Pretty much like anything else. Worry about whats going through the barrel before you worry about what went through the chamber...

tango44
01-12-2010, 20:47
Yes this ammo is made by Tula in Russia which is the factory that produces Wolf Ammo TULA CARTRIDGE WORKS TCW, I have used more than 500 rounds on my Colt Commander and Commander LW and never had a problem with it!

JK-linux
01-12-2010, 20:55
Basic tool mark forensics... harder metal marks softer metal. If the metal of your firearm is softer than the steel cased ammunition, you might have a problem. I shot a ton if this back in the later 1990's without even knowing it was steel cased, and it ran just fine for target practice. It's dirty, so don't shoot it if you hate cleaning. I'd be more worried about fouling in a gas operated rifle than a recoil articulated pistol. I personally would rather shoot Blazer to save money (than shoot Wolf to save money) as it's less mess. If your gun can't handle cheap military type ammunition, then it ain't that great of a gun to begin with. I'm sure the 1911 and it's clones around the world have fired far worse ammunition than Wolf.

Ruggles
01-12-2010, 21:50
I agree other than it being dirty is no harm no foul type of thing IMO.