10MM carry ammo recommendation [Archive] - Glock Talk

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mclaren
12-23-2009, 13:33
Will be carrying a G20 after Christmas for self defense. I work alone in a high crime area so I am upgrading to the 10. I am not really interrested in mail order only ammo like BB or DT. I plan to get some for fun but for now need dependable factory ammo. I think the silvertip is slightly outdated, but you tell me.
I need penetration, I work among lots of cover I may need to shoot through.
I can live with a little overpenetration, its a pretty desolate area.
I just need balls-out power any druggie can feel.

Does any factory load come close to DT or BB on power? I will sacrifice a a little energy for total dependability.

What do I need?

xrmattaz
12-23-2009, 14:14
I truly enjoy Mike McNett's Doubletap loads. (his 180 grainers do ~1300 fps from a G20 barrel)

The Winchester Silvertip, 175 gr. at ~1200 fps. is no slouch, either! (right around 600 lbs/ft. energy)

(The Silvertip is my preferred carry, in .44 Special, when I carry a revolver)

deadmonkey90
12-23-2009, 14:17
black talons.

fredj338
12-23-2009, 14:25
The 175gr WSTHP is a good load giving 1250fps from a 5". It expands well at that vel.

mclaren
12-23-2009, 14:50
black talons.
Black talon 10mm is like antique ammo now right?
Can I get SXT or Ranger T?

Jdog
12-23-2009, 15:09
I just need balls-out power any druggie can feel.
...but for now need dependable factory ammo
Does any factory load come close to DT or BB on power?

Don't know why you wouldnt think DT or BB isn't dependable premium factory ammo. Based on the ammo you're describing maybe the 200gr Controlled Expansion JHP if u want good penetration in a hollow point... here's what I recommend:

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_25&products_id=40

bfg1971
12-23-2009, 16:54
I hate to say it but if you want to find enough ammo to be able to fill a couple of mags and have a few practice sessions you might need to look at mail order ammo.

Most of the 10mm shooters on GT have at least tried DT and few have anything bad to say about it. It is what I use in my 20 and 29.

MedicOni
12-23-2009, 17:24
I'd got with DT 180gr JHP. Great stuff there

PghJim
12-23-2009, 18:22
If you do not want mail order, you will not shoot any 10mm. Nobody stocks it and if the do it is generally the 175 gr. Silver Tip, which is a good Round and the one I would carry if DT was not around. For some reasom Corbon loads 10mm like 40 S&W. For outside carry, I use DT 165 gr, Golden Sabers. They are the best performing 40 S&W round and I carry a G29 so would have less velocity.

SDGlock23
12-23-2009, 18:53
For non mail order, you have the Federal Hydra Shok, which is essentially a .40. That's not a bad thing, but it's real light for 10mm.

Also there is the Hornady lineup. They offer 155gr, 180gr, and 200gr. Their 155gr lists somewhere around 1350+ fps. Their 180gr lists at 1180fps and their 200gr lists at 1050 fps.

There is also the Winchester 175gr Silvertip. I've heard mixed opinions on it. Some say it does what the box claims, others say it really does around 1150 fps.

Corbon has a couple. I've chronoed the 165gr JHP and it did around 1150 from the Glock 20... essentially a .40.

If I were you, I think I would choose Hornady. Or mail order ammo from BB. Or buy a pistol with more premium options like a 9mm, 40 or 45, it will cost you less and still be very effective.

t-shooter
12-23-2009, 20:07
I carry 180 gr Speer Gold Dot from Double Tap as an all-around load. For CHL purposes I like the silvertips.

BigHutch
12-24-2009, 09:42
This is what I have loaded. http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_25&products_id=36&osCsid=8rknec3g8fu4llionsqajursc2

deadmonkey90
12-24-2009, 09:51
Black talon 10mm is like antique ammo now right?
Can I get SXT or Ranger T?
yea both are great, ranger t is just the new black talon

MarkCO
12-24-2009, 09:57
Double-Taps first, then Silvertips.

Ak.Hiker
12-25-2009, 01:15
For your needs go with the Winchester 175 grain Silvertip or the Hornady 180 grain XTP. Both of these loads are a step above the 40 S&W in power and the 40 is a pretty well thought of SD load. They would also be a step above the 40 if you needed to put down a wild animal. If you do change your mind on mail order DT makes some very good 10mm loads.

DLL9mm
12-25-2009, 05:35
I like the Golden Sabers from Double Tap. When I carried a 10mm, I used those or SilverTips.

mclaren
12-25-2009, 20:55
Thanks for all of the good advice. I recieved a G20C this morning, the girlfriend treats me right. The only ammo she could find was 155 gr XTP's. I carry hornady ammo more than anything else but these seem a little light loaded. 1268 fps I think. Double Taps are like 1450. Maybe you guys are right, that's why I asked. These should be about 550 ft/lbs which is nothing to sneeze at but I'll take the extra 200 fps.
As far as the gun goes, what a sweet piece. I put trijicons on it 10 minutes after it came out of the box. Now for a holster!
Am I at the end of the road for my recoil spring? If I step up to the big boy loads like the 155/1450 will the stock spring beg for mercy?

MSgt Dotson
12-25-2009, 22:24
Hornady offers the 200 gr XTP @ 1050 fps....

IndyGunFreak
12-26-2009, 02:38
Georgia Arms also makes some popular 10mm JHP's.

Unfortunately, you're going to learn very quickly why a lot of 10mm folks reload. Think very clearly on what you're doing. If you can't get ammo to practice with, a 10mm isn't going to do you any good. Either relax your standards on not going mail order, or you're likely going to have to change calibers. I'd focus on getting a gun and PRACTICE. Placement trumps caliber any day of the week, but that wasn't really the point of this thread.

IGF

Waffentomas
12-28-2009, 19:22
Hornday 155s are good enough for now. They are a reliable feeding, reliable expanding bullet, that penetrates well. Even the 155s penetrate, don't let the light wt. throw you, this bullet is designed to go deep. Silvertips are hit and miss. I've had them move at 1220+ in my Glock 20, and I've had them average around 1150 as well. I"ve also had some pretty wacked standard deviations from them. The 1290 fps listed is from a 6" test barrel, you'll never get that from a 4.6" comped barrel - ever.

You'll need to go to Double Tap to wring out the 10mm as it was meant to be, but for now, you are well armed. FWIW, I always keeps 100 rounds of the Hornday 155s around, just because. I carry the DT 165gr Gold Dot, and use the 230gr Equalizer for the house.

Tom

TurboRocket
12-28-2009, 22:29
I need penetration, I work among lots of cover I may need to shoot through.


Aside the info you are asking for, I'd be slightly concerned about this statement.

Also, I cannot believe your GT alias was available even in Dec 2009.

MTS532
12-28-2009, 22:53
I just need balls-out power any druggie can feel.

Just curious, what do your local police carry for their primary weapon and duty rounds?

double07gt
12-29-2009, 09:43
I just ordered a bunch of 10mm ammo from Double Tap a few minutes ago. I looked online at a few other places, but I liked the personal touch/customer service of a "live" conversation with a real person versus punching numbers into a computer when ordering. As always, the folks at Double Tap are top-notch. You can't go wrong with anything from Double Tap.

mclaren
12-29-2009, 16:10
Aside the info you are asking for, I'd be slightly concerned about this statement.

Also, I cannot believe your GT alias was available even in Dec 2009.
Why does it concern you that I would like to reliably shoot through cover? If someone is shooting at me from behind an automobile or a door or wall why wouldnt I want to penetrate that? I work around lots of these things, they belong to me and I can put holes in them if I choose. If I have identified a threat, and he goes behind one of these and continues to shoot, I am not going to wait for him to hop back out. If the situation dictates, I will shoot through that "cover." This is why I wont carry Extreme Shock or Safety Slugs (among other reasons.) I wont give the BG that advantage.

Please elaborate on your second statement. I dont understand.

mclaren
12-29-2009, 16:18
Just curious, what do your local police carry for their primary weapon and duty rounds?
City carries H&K USP .45 w/ HST's dont know what wieght

Troopers carry G31 with sabers

cmspeedy
12-29-2009, 16:26
He was probably thinking that if you are shooting through barriers are you using the firearm for self defense? - probably not.

I have all of the above rounds and keep 155g Corbon DPX in the G20 most of the time. The GD 180g's from DT or BB are my hunting rounds. (Deer)

You will be amazed at how fast your shots are with the DPX. It may be weaker than most mentioned at around 500 ft/lb, but the reduced recoil and solid copper bullet close the gap somewhat IMO. I love it and am dying to try one out on the pigs on our property.

The DPX should penetrate well although lately I have read reports of some deflections through windshields. Not enough field data yet on barrier penetration on the 10mm DPX. One things for sure - IT EXPANDS AND PENETRATES DEEP!!!

cmspeedy
12-29-2009, 16:31
As for the heavier recoil spring. I have a 20 and 22 lb I use with all DT and BB ammo, but when carrying for self defense I keep the stock spring in as I fear some of the lower power loads, like the DPX, could experience a failure to cycle if I have a heavy spring in.

Erich1B
12-29-2009, 16:49
I carry my G29 with Double Tap's 165gr Golden Sabers

mclaren
12-29-2009, 18:02
He was probably thinking that if you are shooting through barriers are you using the firearm for self defense? - probably not.

I see the misunderstanding. I mentioned before that I work alone in a high crime area. I am self employed so a self defense scenario for me at work would be similar to a home defense for others.
If I was in a public parking lot or a grocery store, fleeing the threat and avoiding collateral damage would be primary. Not that these are ever unimportant, but its different when you are in a "one way in, one way out" scenario and you alone are the target.

I dont want to come off as being a mall ninja:2gun: that needs exploding bullets. I see a need in my everyday life for 10mm power and I want to use the appropriate ammo for my unique setting. I know there are many out there with more experience with it than me. I see those people chiming in.

I believe in tailoring my defensive weapon for the expected environment. If I have to defend myself at work it will be against someone who is seeking violence, not a knife wielding opportunist looking to swipe a carton of smokes.

Maybe I should move

cmspeedy
12-29-2009, 18:36
If you really want proven penetrating power through barriers you need a good, heavy, bonded bullet. Speer Gold Dots in 180g would be my recommendation. I would get them in either Doubletap or Buffalo Bore - with the Buffalo Bore having a little more power.

I still buy the 175g silvertips when I see them. Great round as well, but I don't know how it does against a barrier. Loaded hot as others have mentioned.

I have so much variety in my 10mm ammo. It's one of the things I enjoy about the caliber. 135g - 230g should have everything covered.

glock20c10mm
12-29-2009, 20:24
Now for a holster!
Don't know what you want, but I'll throw this out at you...

You can get Fobus paddle holsters from OpticsPlanet.com for cheap. (Optics Planet is an Authorized Fobus dealer.) You have to spend at least $29.95 to get their flat rate shipping charge of $6.99, and are only charged sales tax if you live in Illinois.

http://www.opticsplanet.net/fobus-standard-belt-right-hand-holsters-glock-20-21-37-gl3bh.html
So this standard Fobus paddle holster for the G20(C) is $20.89.

http://www.opticsplanet.net/fobus-single-mag-pouch-glock-10mm-45acp-para-3901g45.html
And this single mag pouch Fobus holster for the 10mm Glock mags is $17.70.

So;
$20.89
$17.70
+$6.99
= $45.58

And they show up at your front door. Mine worked well for me when out hiking/hunting. Plus I like it that the gun holster is open at the bottom so when I put the Glock 10mm 6" accessory barrel in the gun, it simply extends ~1.5" past the holster and I never even notice it.

For a holster and mag pouch, that is pretty cheap! Besides that, Optics Planet is a piece-of-cake to deal with, and reputable.

TurboRocket
12-29-2009, 21:02
He was probably thinking that if you are shooting through barriers are you using the firearm for self defense? - probably not.



Yep, that's all I meant. As a civilian (and not a lawyer), I don't think my primary concern in ammo selection should be barrier penetration. I'm not saying that is the top of your priority list either - just making a comment since that was in your original post.

My second comment about your GT alias is just that it is a good name, and I was surprised that it was still available after the many of thousands of members who joined before you.

stengun
12-30-2009, 21:00
Howdy,

I copied this from another post by me.............

I carry Win ST in my G20. I have been using Win ST in 10mm since the mid/late 80's. I have used them in combat, and for hunting and they are the best SD/HD/hunting round on the market.

Here's a pic..............
http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd248/stengun/PA140197.jpg

This is a Win 175gr ST. It expanded to 1.02" at the widest point and penetrated over 17".

9mm round next to it only expanded to about .62" and penetrated about 9" in the same test media.

Some of the DT and Buffalo loads or way overpressure and do not live up to the hype or velocity claims.

For me, I will stick will a proven load, the Win 175gr ST.

Paul

cmspeedy
12-31-2009, 06:29
Howdy,

I copied this from another post by me.............

I carry Win ST in my G20. I have been using Win ST in 10mm since the mid/late 80's. I have used them in combat, and for hunting and they are the best SD/HD/hunting round on the market.

Here's a pic..............
http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd248/stengun/PA140197.jpg

This is a Win 175gr ST. It expanded to 1.02" at the widest point and penetrated over 17".

9mm round next to it only expanded to about .62" and penetrated about 9" in the same test media.

Some of the DT and Buffalo loads or way overpressure and do not live up to the hype or velocity claims.

For me, I will stick will a proven load, the Win 175gr ST.

Paul

Thanks for sharing. Good Info. The silvertip is impressive.

Having said that, I don't know if any of the 10mm loads are really "proven". Not enough data IMO.

BillR
12-31-2009, 11:11
Just curious...why no love for the DT 135gr Nosler load? It seems like it'd be perfect for a SD round. (provided no barriers were encountered) It's not at all likely to over-penetrate.
Winter clothing?
Comments?

telecster
12-31-2009, 11:33
Just got my Blackhawk holster. $25 on EBay. Fits like a glove in my G20. I like the added release button.

mclaren
12-31-2009, 11:49
Just curious...why no love for the DT 135gr Nosler load? It seems like it'd be perfect for a SD round. (provided no barriers were encountered) It's not at all likely to over-penetrate.
Winter clothing?
Comments?
I agree, this would be a good public load. If I were going to the mall or out to eat I think this would be a good one for not coming out.
I do wonder how it penetrates though.
Is this a bonded bullet? If not I wonder how one would do this light and fast.

MTS532
12-31-2009, 13:00
9mm round next to it only expanded to about .62" and penetrated about 9" in the same test media.

What was the test media?

Jdog
01-01-2010, 22:25
Just curious...why no love for the DT 135gr Nosler load? It seems like it'd be perfect for a SD round. (provided no barriers were encountered) It's not at all likely to over-penetrate.
Winter clothing?
Comments?

I just shot another box of these today and just reminded me of why I don't use them for carry. It's the poor follow up's caused by recoil
The heavier grain double taps (i.e. 180gr gold dots) are less recoil, smoother to shoot and produce quicker follow ups. But yeah the 135's wouldn't have the over penetration problem. I think the loud sound alone would scare an assailant.

gatorboy
01-02-2010, 00:45
Just curious...why no love for the DT 135gr Nosler load? It seems like it'd be perfect for a SD round. (provided no barriers were encountered) It's not at all likely to over-penetrate.
Winter clothing?
Comments?

The DT 155 GD is a much better choice IMO. 1475 FPS is plenty fast, only 125 fps slower but 20 gr. heavier. It's bonded and will rarely "frag nasty:upeyes:". It might over expand and have it's petals folded behind it when it's dug out by the ME but there will be a point that it's fully expanded and still traveling. I like em' a lot.

BleedNOrange
01-05-2010, 13:13
Just get a g21 and a .400 cor-bon barrel. The .400 is identical or even better than some factory 10mm loads. If you cant find ammo just throw in the tried and true .45, maybe some plus p's if it makes you feel better.

canon3825
01-07-2010, 22:45
Hey Guys. I don't want to upset anyone with my first post but I wanted relay something concerning the "C" models being used for CC. "mclaren" wrote on the previous page " I recieved a G20C this morning, the girlfriend treats me right." Definitely a bonus for him. But there is an issue with carrying a "C" model at night.

I shot with a group in NH that was called Tactical Arts Group. TAG was specifically designed for people that carried. You had to have a CCW or a open carry holster. The range was "hot" and everyone had a loaded firearm on them. In the winter we would shoot indoors. But once the range cleared we would shoot outside until the late fall. There were different stages every week and there was a timer to help with that adrenaline rush of trying to hurry. We mostly shot paper for score, but there was a plate rack for practice when you were not shooting a stage. The range was not lit so everyone needed to use a flashlight.

My second handgun was a Glock 21. In the fall of my first year shooting with TAG, I was lucky enough to buy a G 21C parts kit from a PD. I tried the "C" slide and barrel on my 21 frame. The "C" really helped with muzzle rise. I had gotten a set of night sights for it and had them installed right after I got the pistol. The first monday night I shot with TAG using the "C" barrel and slide was a total waste. I went to the plate rack to warm up. We would start with our arms to our side. The timer would beep and you had to pull your firearm and light, because it was dark, and engage the six plates on the rack as quick as you could. The guy with the best time of the night was sought after by the top shooters, but everyone would try their best.

The timer beeped and I pulled my Surefire from the holder and the 21C from behind my right hip under my jacket. I could make out the new Meprolites quite well and got my support hand with the flashlight under my right hand holding the Glock. I hit the light and lined up on the first plate. The flash was so bright from the compensator ports in the "C" barrel, even with the Surefire, it took me several seconds engage the second plate. I gave up after the third plate because the "C" ports were blinding me so bad. I reholstered, got my range bag, and switched the "C" B/S for the standard B/S. I was using standard ball ammo not hot carry ammo.

If you are going to carry at night, try your carry gun in the dark. It would be a real drag to find out your short barrel or worst yet your compensated pistol, blinds you so bad after the first round that you are so incapacitated that you are a "sitting duck" for several seconds.

Scott

glock20c10mm
01-09-2010, 15:05
Hi Scott, and :welcome:,

I agree. It's part of the reason I got rid of my G20C. Plus, if one if ever forced to hold the gun in close to their body while shooting there's a whole lot of flame and stuff that will blow right up in ones face and whatever else.

A simple remedy is to get an aftermarket non ported barrel at least for night carry. The compensated slide still works fine with them. More often that not, I had Glock's own accessory 6" 10mm barrel in it anyway.

Good Shooting,
Craig

Short Cut
01-09-2010, 15:16
I chose to carry Double Tap 200 grain XTP because it feeds reliably in my pistol, it is accurate to point of aim with my fixed sights, it penetrates really well (which I place high importance in), stays together and expands respectably.

glock20c10mm
01-09-2010, 15:18
I agree, this would be a good public load. If I were going to the mall or out to eat I think this would be a good one for not coming out.
I do wonder how it penetrates though.
Is this a bonded bullet? If not I wonder how one would do this light and fast.

This should help...

All of these tests were done using 10% ballistic gelatin provided by Vyse gelatin using all FBI protocols and 4 layers of denim and two layers of light cotton T-shirt in front of the gelatin.

DoubleTap 9mm+P
115gr. Gold Dot JHP @ 1415fps - 12.00" / .70"
124gr. Gold Dot JHP @ 1310fps - 13.25" / .70"
147gr. Gold Dot JHP @ 1125fps - 14.00" / .66"

DoubleTap .40 S&W Penetration / expansion
135gr. Nosler JHP @ 1375fps - 12.10" / .72"
155gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1275fps - 13.00" / .76"
165gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1200fps - 14.0" / .70"
180gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1100fps - 14.75" / .68"
200gr XTP @ 1050fps - 17.75" / .59"


DoubleTap .357 Sig
115gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1550fps - 12.25" / .71"
125gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1450fps - 14.5" / .66"
147gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1250fps - 14.75" / .73"

DoubleTap .357 Magnum
125gr. Gold Dot JHP @ 1600fps - 12.75" / .69"
158gr. Gold Dot JHP @ 1400fps - 19.0" .56"

DoubleTap 10mm
135gr JHP @ 1600fps - 11.0" / .70" frag nasty
155gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1475fps - 13.5" / .88"
165gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1400fps - 14.25" / 1.02"
165gr Golden Saber JHP @ 1425fps - 14.75" / .82"
180gr Golden Saber JHP @ 1330fps - 16.0" / .85"
180gr XTP @ 1350fps 17.25 / .77
180gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1300fps - 15.25" / .96"
200gr XTP @ 1250fps - 19.5" / .72"
230gr Equalizer @ 1040fps - 11.0" and 17.0" / .62" and .40"

DoubleTap .45ACP
185gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1225fps - 12.75" / .82"
200gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1125fps - 14.25" / .88"
230gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1010fps - 15.25" / .95"

DoubleTap 9X25
115gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1800fps - 10.0" / .64" frag nasty
125gr Gold DOt JHP @ 1725fps - 15.0" / .74"
147gr Gold Dot JHP @ 1550fps - 17.5" / .68"

For those who are asking, here it is!
-Mike

As someone else mentioned too, I personally like the the DT 10mm 155gr Gold Dot load. Very wicked in my experience with lots more integrity than the Nosler bullet.

As for what some mentioned about the 135gr load possibly for highly populated areas or apartment defense, I just don't believe you're any worse off with the 155gr Gold Dot load anyway. And even if it somehow did make it out the back side of the BG, I can't see it actually penetrating another person behind them. Might give them a minor flesh wound, but beyond, I think that's even a stretch.

Good Shooting,
Craig