Questions about proper staking [Archive] - Glock Talk

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SilverBullet_83
01-08-2010, 12:47
got in my stag upper a few days ago and got around to pulling it apart today. I know the castle nut on the buffer tube has not been done at all, but how does this look?
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y154/01civi/DSC01099.jpg

faawrenchbndr
01-08-2010, 13:07
I'd be fine with that staking job.

RMTactical
01-08-2010, 15:40
I think Stag staking has gotten better recently, but I still like it done a little more than that.

That is better than nothing though.

AK_Stick
01-08-2010, 15:55
I'll probably get flamed for this but.


Some of my unit's older Colt's look about like that, maybe just slightly more.

I wouldn't worry about it in the slightest. I might do a better job of it, if you were going to do the other one. That said, my castle nut isn't staked either, just torqued.

faawrenchbndr
01-08-2010, 17:20
I'm not sure about now,...but for a while ArmaLite was only using LockTight
and torquing them. A friend in Georgia has a rifle that is done like that, it has 7k rounds fired without an issue.

crazymoose
01-08-2010, 17:39
That staking is fine. You can see that the inside of the hole has been deformed to provide friction against the screw, which is the whole point. I like the staking my PMOAKS does better, but yours is fine.

As far as staking the castle nut, get a spring-loaded center punch from a hardware store. They are usually about $8. Grind the tip down (I used a Dremel) so that it's rounded, and go to town staking the end plate into the castle nut indentations. Slow and steady is the key. With my center punch, I usually need 20-30 impacts to achieve one stake.

TheChosenOne
01-08-2010, 18:05
I'm not sure about now,...but for a while ArmaLite was only using LockTight
and torquing them. A friend in Georgia has a rifle that is done like that, it has 7k rounds fired without an issue.

Loctite does nothing because when it heats up it loses it's effect.

faawrenchbndr
01-08-2010, 18:23
Loctite does nothing because when it heats up it loses it's effect.

Yes,.....I know that. Tell ArmaLite......:dunno:

thunderbat
01-08-2010, 18:28
Leave well enough alone, check it when you clean. That should hold up for quite some time. Last thing you want is to deform the rails that run alongside the key...

SilverBullet_83
01-08-2010, 18:38
thanks guys

Ruggles
01-08-2010, 18:48
Looks fine to me as well.

lawman800
01-09-2010, 00:51
Looks good enough to me.

Alaskapopo
01-09-2010, 02:31
got in my stag upper a few days ago and got around to pulling it apart today. I know the castle nut on the buffer tube has not been done at all, but how does this look?
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y154/01civi/DSC01099.jpg

Not good enough. I had to stake the bolt carriers on both of my previous Stag builds. the bolt itself should be pushed in a bit from the metal on the carrier.
Pat

jobob
01-09-2010, 03:09
Loctite does nothing because when it heats up it loses it's effect.

That depends on what Loctite we're talking about. Some grades are damn near permanent and made to be heat resistant.

Alaskapopo
01-09-2010, 03:11
That depends on what Loctite we're talking about. Some grades are damn near permanent and made to be heat resistant.

The tougest I am aware of is Red and it will come loose with heat. A friend of mines Armalite started malfunctioning at match. Checked his rifle out and found the gas key loose. I tightened it down and used red locktight to finish the match. Later I staked it with my MOAKS tool. But Armalite had not staked his carrier key at all.
Pat

jobob
01-09-2010, 03:35
The tougest I am aware of is Red and it will come loose with heat. A friend of mines Armalite started malfunctioning at match. Checked his rifle out and found the gas key loose. I tightened it down and used red locktight to finish the match. Later I staked it with my MOAKS tool. But Armalite had not staked his carrier key at all.
Pat

Don't they make a sleeve retainer for cylinder sleeves? If it will work in that application, I'd think it would work as a thread locker and wouldn't be affected by heat.

Might be wrong on that though, as I don't do engine rebuilds.

I have a compensator screwed onto a 1911 barrel that's held on with nothing but Loctite red, since 1988, through around 20k rounds, and it hasn't budged. It probably isn't subjected to the heat an AR carrier key gets, though.

Alaskapopo
01-09-2010, 13:42
Don't they make a sleeve retainer for cylinder sleeves? If it will work in that application, I'd think it would work as a thread locker and wouldn't be affected by heat.

Might be wrong on that though, as I don't do engine rebuilds.

I have a compensator screwed onto a 1911 barrel that's held on with nothing but Loctite red, since 1988, through around 20k rounds, and it hasn't budged. It probably isn't subjected to the heat an AR carrier key gets, though.

Not sure what a cleeve retainer is?
Pat

crazymoose
01-09-2010, 15:14
Don't they make a sleeve retainer for cylinder sleeves? If it will work in that application, I'd think it would work as a thread locker and wouldn't be affected by heat.

Might be wrong on that though, as I don't do engine rebuilds.

I have a compensator screwed onto a 1911 barrel that's held on with nothing but Loctite red, since 1988, through around 20k rounds, and it hasn't budged. It probably isn't subjected to the heat an AR carrier key gets, though.

The thread locker to use for these sorts of applications is Rocksett. It's a ceramic-based locker that's good to 2000F+. It's what AAC suggests for their flash hiders, comps, and QD mounts. You have to de-grease thoroughly before using it, but it is very good stuff.

jobob
01-09-2010, 16:14
Not sure what a cleeve retainer is?
Pat

I have no idea what cleeve retainer is, either!

jobob
01-09-2010, 16:19
The thread locker to use for these sorts of applications is Rocksett. It's a ceramic-based locker that's good to 2000F+. It's what AAC suggests for their flash hiders, comps, and QD mounts. You have to de-grease thoroughly before using it, but it is very good stuff.

Never heard of it before, but found it here: http://store.flexbar.com/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD_MT&Store_Code=FLX&Product_Code=15015&Category_Code=Adhesive-Cement

Looks like great stuff!

jobob
01-09-2010, 16:24
I have no idea what cleeve retainer is, either!

A sleeve retainer would be used in an auto shop. When an engine is worn out, they re-bore the cylinders and intall a sleeve to bring it back into spec. I've heard of some gunsmiths boring out and sleeving a barrel.

Alaskapopo
01-09-2010, 17:54
I have no idea what cleeve retainer is, either!

Damn my fingers could not keep up with my brain. Sorry about the typo.
Pat

jobob
01-09-2010, 20:52
Damn my fingers could not keep up with my brain. Sorry about the typo.
Pat

Been there, done that! No problem, but it does present a good opportunity for just a little jab! :cool:

Flinter
01-10-2010, 14:00
My Colt M4 (military issue) has less staking than that. In fact it was done with a punch in 3 places on each bolt head. I think the staking issue is way over played. The maximum the staking protusion may extend in an upward direction is .025" (.064 cm) per TM 9-1005-319-23&P. The bolts are torqued to 50-58 in/lbs. The stakes are simply there to aid in keeping the bolts from backing out in use.

faawrenchbndr
01-10-2010, 16:06
Good Man! Gotta love it when someone actually researches the TM! :thumbsup:

Flinter
01-10-2010, 19:04
The TMs help alot. I've seen some very knowledgeable types show the "proper" staking on one, and the bolt heads are deformed to the point they will have to be ground off to be replaced if the need arose. That is not how it should be done. The bolts are inteded to be removed with allen sockets so the poor 45B in the field can replace it if need be, and the military TMS were written with a lot of hard usage as experience.

Kentak
01-11-2010, 13:06
I'm not sure about now,...but for a while ArmaLite was only using LockTight
and torquing them. A friend in Georgia has a rifle that is done like that, it has 7k rounds fired without an issue.

Carrier key, or castle nut?

pat701
01-11-2010, 14:02
I have a Rock River N/M AR-15 and the staking is about the same as the pictured BCG, on my Rock River BCG.

faawrenchbndr
01-11-2010, 14:07
Carrier key, or castle nut?

Carrier key,....Tony was told they use RockSet