Well I finished my Carbine. Pics [Archive] - Glock Talk

PDA

View Full Version : Well I finished my Carbine. Pics


ghostman1960
01-18-2010, 16:52
I started out with this lower.

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/1263504317.jpg

Then I did a little horse trading for this new upper and wound up with this!

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/1263845115.jpg

I am happy. :supergrin:

RMTactical
01-18-2010, 16:53
Great job. Congrats!

ghostman1960
01-18-2010, 16:56
great job. Congrats!

thank you sir!

RMTactical
01-18-2010, 16:57
What brand upper is it?

faawrenchbndr
01-18-2010, 16:57
Congrats,....fluted barrel, looks good!

ghostman1960
01-18-2010, 17:00
Congrats,....fluted barrel, looks good!

I wasn't really looking for a fluted barrel but I got a great deal on the upper so thats what I wound up with. I am not sure of what advantages it has though.

ghostman1960
01-18-2010, 17:00
What brand upper is it?

DSA Mid Length.

HogGlocker
01-18-2010, 18:09
And that is simply one very nice looking rifle....FYI, I have S&W MP15 rifles and they have been just as reliable as my Colt and RRA....good stuff.

I hear a lot of good about DSA as well lately.

furioso2112
01-18-2010, 18:13
The flutes are intended to help the barrel cool faster and reduce weight. It looks great, too.

lawman800
01-19-2010, 02:35
Fluted barrels increase surface area, reduce weight, increase cooling, increases stiffness, decreases vibrational distortion. You can't lose.

ghostman1960
01-20-2010, 19:18
Fluted barrels increase surface area, reduce weight, increase cooling, increases stiffness, decreases vibrational distortion. You can't lose.
For once I'm not losing! lol

lawman800
01-20-2010, 21:04
You'd lose money since the only thing about fluted barrels is the higher cost of manufacturing.

Navitimer
01-20-2010, 21:38
Very nice! I'm really digging that barrel! Only thing I'd add would be a Daniel Defense quad rail, but I'm partial to those. Regardless, you have a very sweet AR!

DLEE25
01-21-2010, 03:26
Very nice! I've been looking at DSA, their upper prices aren't too bad and they aren't too far from where I live. You gotta post a range report when you break her in.

ghostman1960
01-21-2010, 08:50
You'd lose money since the only thing about fluted barrels is the higher cost of manufacturing.

I less into the upper than I do the lower and I only have $287.00 into the lower. So this is my budget rifle.

ghostman1960
01-24-2010, 13:08
http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/2010_0123firstphotos0034.jpg

lawman800
01-24-2010, 13:55
Nice budget rifle, I wish I had one.

Glock9mmccw
01-24-2010, 14:11
Very nice!!
I have a stripped lower I need to finish.
I should look into that horse trading.

dc2integra
01-24-2010, 20:46
nice ar!

duncan
01-24-2010, 21:57
Gotta have a rifle you can just grab and go with. Just good ole irons! Nice.

wofat226
01-24-2010, 22:11
sweettttttttttttttt

ghostman1960
03-28-2010, 11:54
Final incarnation.

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/004.jpg

lawman800
03-28-2010, 12:00
I'm guessing you are not going to need the BUIS after all.

ghostman1960
03-28-2010, 12:16
I'm guessing you are not going to need the BUIS after all.

I have one folded down under the sight. You never know I guess.

Randolph da man
03-28-2010, 12:21
I have one folded down under the sight. You never know I guess.

how quickly can you access the BUIS ?
what optics is that ?

ghostman1960
03-28-2010, 12:36
how quickly can you access the BUIS ?
what optics is that ?

The BUIS can be accessed as fast as I can turn the thumb screws on the optic and remove it. The Optic is a Bushnell Trophy with red and green dots. It is built like a tank and performs as well as a much more expensive unit.

lawman800
03-28-2010, 13:00
I have one folded down under the sight. You never know I guess.

That's what I'm saying... I saw the BUIS tucked under the sight which is not mounted on a QD base....

ghostman1960
03-29-2010, 06:39
That's what I'm saying... I saw the BUIS tucked under the sight which is not mounted on a QD base....

Ah ok. Why don't you post pics of yours and show me how an expert does it since the thumb screws on my mount are not "QD" enough.

lawman800
03-29-2010, 06:54
Ah ok. Why don't you post pics of yours and show me how an expert does it since the thumb screws on my mount are not "QD" enough.

Hey Francis, lighten up.

I just haven't seen it like that where you would put a ACOG type sight right over a flip-up rear sight which makes it useless, when you can just not even hvae the rear sight or move the red dot forward a bit to clear the flip up rear sight. If the mount was QD or swing out, then you can also access the rear BUIS if needed in a pinch. Was wondering what was your logic in it, that's all.

Who knows, different people do different things and because I couldn't figure out why you would do it that way, I just asked you. If you have no reason or just did it because you can, that's fine too. Nobody said you have to make sense with your toy. It is your toy, after all.

ACOG type sights are pretty fail-proof but they still can fail, or something can hit it and break the glass or whatever. That's the whole purpose of the BUIS, no? How are you going to get to use the BUIS when you have it tucked under the Bushnell? Unscrew it by hand and then tuck it in your pocket? If it's not a concern for you, that's fine too. Nobody said you have to give a rip about it.

faawrenchbndr
03-29-2010, 07:03
This all seems to be a bit too serious,......:dunno:

Please JUST state your opinion, or give suggestions.
If the set-up pictured works with the OP, GREAT.
Later he may just take your idea, and try THAT set-up.

The only "workable" ACOG type set up, that has worked for me,
is with either a small red-dot mounted above or mounted on offset mounts as a BUIS for an ACOG

lawman800
03-29-2010, 07:14
I am trying to learn as well, that's all. I asked Pat about his offset 45 degree mount which also seemed odd to me but he explained why and showed a few pics of how he deploys it so it made sense and I learned something.

That's all I was wondering, if there is a logic about how the Bushnell was mounted right on top of the BUIS, which made it seem to me like it was pretty much useless unless you take the sight off to get to it.

ghostman1960
03-29-2010, 16:46
Is this better?

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/001-1.jpg
http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/002-2.jpg

lawman800
03-29-2010, 21:33
Haha... you didn't have to do that. I really wasn't getting on you as much as I was really trying to figure out how that works for you.

I am trying out different things on my AR's too so learning about what others are doing is a big part of what I am going to do.

TexasVine
03-29-2010, 22:28
Nice job.

ghostman1960
03-30-2010, 05:01
Nice job.

Thank you.

Novocaine
03-30-2010, 13:23
Congrats. Good looking rig. The only thing it needs is a sling.

Fluted barrels increase surface area, reduce weight, increase cooling, increases stiffness, decreases vibrational distortion. You can't lose.

It does none of these things except for reducing weight. It decreases the rigidity. Fluted barrel does cool faster but it heats up faster too and runs hotter. Fluting also introduces stresses that make the barrel flex erratically as the temperature goes up.

Weight reduction benefit is a high price to pay for an overall performance loss. See how many fluted barrels are used by military snipers, people who actually have to lug their rifles around.

You will not find fluted barrels where precision counts even if the sustained fire is not an issue. Be that with police snipers or long range competitors.

For an AR plinker that will spend most of its life on a 100-yard range, who cares? It looks good and perhaps improves the balance for those close range pot shots. But this “increases the stiffness” and “improves the cooling” business is 180 from the truth.

ctaggart
03-30-2010, 14:41
Ya know, I wouldn't get to bent out of shape with anybody's comments on the build. Opinions are like buttholes. Everybody has one and they stink. I figure that if you wanted, you could take the BUIS off completely and use the crude "iron sights" installed on the top of the Bushnell Trophy if it did fail. Here's a pic for those that aren't familiar.

BTW, I really like that upper.

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm95/Ctaggart/bushnelltrophy-1.jpg

ctaggart
03-30-2010, 14:50
Congrats. Good looking rig. The only thing it needs is a sling.



It does none of these things except for reducing weight. It decreases the rigidity. Fluted barrel does cool faster but it heats up faster too and runs hotter. Fluting also introduces stresses that make the barrel flex erratically as the temperature goes up.

Weight reduction benefit is a high price to pay for an overall performance loss. See how many fluted barrels are used by military snipers, people who actually have to lug their rifles around.

You will not find fluted barrels where precision counts even if the sustained fire is not an issue. Be that with police snipers or long range competitors.

For an AR plinker that will spend most of its life on a 100-yard range, who cares? It looks good and perhaps improves the balance for those close range pot shots. But this “increases the stiffness” and “improves the cooling” business is 180 from the truth.

Yeah, you're probably right, these guys don't know what they're doing.
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm95/Ctaggart/pgwdti.jpg
http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm95/Ctaggart/7wsm.jpg

Novocaine
03-30-2010, 16:50
Yeah, you're probably right, these guys don't know what they're doing.

They probably do. Their customers probably don’t.

Some cars go fast some look like they do. They are catered to different crowds.

Why don't you post a pic of such a rifle in hands of a military sniper? Certainly military snipers can use a magic rifle that shaves the weight off while increasing the stiffness.

French military doesn't count, I wouldn't be surprised if French use it seeing how it doubles as a corkscrew :)

lawman800
03-31-2010, 00:22
The lightweight allows the French to drop it faster upon surrender. Also, it is easier to carry around before surrendering. After all, if you are not going to ever use it, why carry a big heavy weapon? I would carry the lightest thing possible if I knew I wont fight anyway so I would suffer less when I drop it.

ctaggart
03-31-2010, 03:39
In all honesty I do agree with you that the flutes don't really offer enough for them to be employed or included in a military rifle or Police rifle which is why they're probably not but I don't believe they have such a detrimental effect on a rifle that they would negatively affect it's intended use.

I do think the PGWDTI Timberwolf would make an excellent rifle for any military/police sniper despite the helical flutes.

Randolph da man
03-31-2010, 04:38
Ya know, I wouldn't get to bent out of shape with anybody's comments on the build. Opinions are like buttholes. Everybody has one and they stink.


especially yours :rofl:

:wavey:

Novocaine
03-31-2010, 13:55
In all honesty I do agree with you that the flutes don't really offer enough for them to be employed or included in a military rifle or Police rifle which is why they're probably not but I don't believe they have such a detrimental effect on a rifle that they would negatively affect it's intended use.

Well, fluting is not a harmless gimmick that doesn’t carry any liability. It degrades rifle’s performance. By performance I mean accuracy and accuracy under the sustained fire. Some vendors who stake their reputation on accuracy above all simply refuse to play this game and some are answering customer’s demands no matter how misguided these demands are. And some dishonest vendors will even go as far as to actively propagate the myth of “increased rigidity” and “improved cooling” even though Mechanical Engineering freshman will be able to dispel this myth in five minutes.

The reason I keep bringing up military snipers is because, unlike LE snipers, they care about the weight of the equipment. Government invests mucho $ (some say .5 mil) to train, equip, place and support a sniper for what may be a single-shot mission. So if this shot is not made it better not be due to the quality of the equipment. Hence the equipment cost, no matter how premium, in overall scheme of things is but a cheap insurance. If there would be a way, as simple as fluting, to shave some weight off without “negatively affecting intended use” it would be done in a heartbeat.

I do think the PGWDTI Timberwolf would make an excellent rifle for any military/police sniper despite the helical flutes.

“Despite” is the key word. You can attach an anchor to Porsche and say it’s still faster than Yugo. Just don’t go racing other Porches.

Fluting has its place. Some hardware is simply too heavy without it to be practical, so you sacrifice performance for mobility. Again, here we’re talking about a civilian AR carbine. The improved balance may be a preferred trait over the precision in a rifle that in a worst case scenario will be called upon to deliver a quick COM hit or two at 15 feet. Empty soda cans at 100 yards will not know the difference either. I was just trying to address the general misconception that seems to be very common.

ghostman1960
03-31-2010, 16:32
A regular plain barrel is a lot stiffer than a fluted barrel of the same outside diameter; however, a fluted barrel is a lot stiffer than a regular barrel of the same weight. Fluting will definitely dissipate heat quickly. And it is not because the surface area is increased; it is because the heat is allowed to reach the outside temperature at a faster rate by removing materials. If your bull barrel becomes unbearably hot on the surface, it is safe to assume that the bore temperature is at a point where it can literally dissolve soft materials. This will damage your bore in the long run.

ghostman1960
03-31-2010, 16:36
This is a military sniper rifle with a fluted barrel.

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/remington_modular_sniper_rifle_msr_.jpg

ghostman1960
03-31-2010, 16:43
Another military sniper with a fluted barrel.

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/SteyrHs50Spiegel.jpg

glock30user
03-31-2010, 16:45
Looks good. Congrats!

ghostman1960
03-31-2010, 16:50
Front end of a Accuracy International Military sniper rifle. I guess they don't get it about flutes either huh?

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/mirage_band.jpg

ghostman1960
03-31-2010, 16:51
Well, fluting is not a harmless gimmick that doesn’t carry any liability. It degrades rifle’s performance. By performance I mean accuracy and accuracy under the sustained fire. Some vendors who stake their reputation on accuracy above all simply refuse to play this game and some are answering customer’s demands no matter how misguided these demands are. And some dishonest vendors will even go as far as to actively propagate the myth of “increased rigidity” and “improved cooling” even though Mechanical Engineering freshman will be able to dispel this myth in five minutes.

The reason I keep bringing up military snipers is because, unlike LE snipers, they care about the weight of the equipment. Government invests mucho $ (some say .5 mil) to train, equip, place and support a sniper for what may be a single-shot mission. So if this shot is not made it better not be due to the quality of the equipment. Hence the equipment cost, no matter how premium, in overall scheme of things is but a cheap insurance. If there would be a way, as simple as fluting, to shave some weight off without “negatively affecting intended use” it would be done in a heartbeat.



“Despite” is the key word. You can attach an anchor to Porsche and say it’s still faster than Yugo. Just don’t go racing other Porches.

Fluting has its place. Some hardware is simply too heavy without it to be practical, so you sacrifice performance for mobility. Again, here we’re talking about a civilian AR carbine. The improved balance may be a preferred trait over the precision in a rifle that in a worst case scenario will be called upon to deliver a quick COM hit or two at 15 feet. Empty soda cans at 100 yards will not know the difference either. I was just trying to address the general misconception that seems to be very common.

You are decidedly full of bunk.

Novocaine
03-31-2010, 22:39
You are decidedly full of bunk.


:) Thanks. Coming from an expert on fluting who two days ago wasnot sure of what advantages it hasit means a lot.


I'm happy to finally meet someone who can reverse laws of theoretical mechanics and, along the way, tell those stubborn misguided souls at US Army, Navy and Marine Corps how it's done.

Of course I could remember that I did say something to effect that fluting, undesirable as it is, sometimes has its place. Like when you don't wanna call a tow truck every time you need to move your equipment. I could remind myself that perhaps it doesn't take a genius to put things like “.50 Cal” or "long range" and "heavy" together. But that wouldn't be nearly as exciting as a glimpse of hope of being there when the new era in mechanical engineering is ushered in.

But hey, some consider M82 and SVD to be true sniper rifles so what do I know :dunno:

GreyEclipse
03-31-2010, 23:06
Nice setup, I like it.

Alaskapopo
03-31-2010, 23:19
Fluted barrels increase surface area, reduce weight, increase cooling, increases stiffness, decreases vibrational distortion. You can't lose.

They actually do not increase stiffness. Basically they do increase cooling and reduce weight.
Pat

bushmasterar15
03-31-2010, 23:58
Very nice. I'm trying to finish a few myself for my kids.

agtman
04-01-2010, 04:46
I started out with this lower.

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/1263504317.jpg

Then I did a little horse trading for this new upper and wound up with this!

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/1263845115.jpg

I am happy. :supergrin:

Yep, very nice! :cool:

ghostman1960
04-09-2010, 15:30
Still evolving I guess.

http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt45/ghostman1960/arcomplete4.jpg