Dan Wesson CBOB 1911 Problems... HELP!! [Archive] - Glock Talk

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TurtleBoy617
01-23-2010, 15:35
Hey All,

Back in October 2009, I purchased a new, .45ACP CZ-USA/Dan Wesson Commander Bobtail 1911. The one I bought did not shoot straight, jammed, and had problems with the slide now locking back. After sending it in three times within the three months I have "owned" the firearm, they decided that it had gremlins, and that no matter what their gunsmith did, it would not function properly, so they decided to replace it. Out of the kindness of their hearts, they say they have done some custom tuning to the replacement, so that I did not have these problems again, to use their time and money shipping it and fixing the gun.

After waiting a month and a half, I received the replacement firearm, and fired 100 rounds of S&B .45 through it without a single hitch. I was completely excited that they finally fixed it right and that I had a good pistol that I could depend on. (I used S&B because that is what they use at the factory).

Well, S&B isn't plentiful around my area, and I do not believe that after paying $1100 dollars for a gun that is supposed to be an excellent product, has great parts in it and equally great reviews, that it should be able to take much of the factory ammunition that goes through it besides S&B, especially since in a perfect world I would like to use it as my Carry Gun.

Today, I went to the range, and put 100 rounds of WWB through it, and 50 rounds of WinClean through it. It was properly cleaned and oiled with FP-10 (What the gunsmith at CZ/dan wesson recommended to use), and used the checkmate magazines that they sold me and also recommended that I use. They seem to be great magazines. While tuning my pistol they tried to use Chip McCormick Powermags and Wilsons, but they did not lock the slide back.

Anyways, the gun consistently malfunctioned with both types of ammo on round 7 of 8 in three different magazines, where the last round was stuck between loading into the chamber and leaving the mag. Sometimes the slide would be half back, sometimes just a half a centimeter out of battery. Had to rack the slide multiple times in order to get the round out.

The slide also failed to lock back on the last round being fired for the few times that it didn't completely "Jam" while loading the last round. Thus resulting in me being confused that i had an extra round in there, but nope. CLICK.

I have to admit, I confess myself disapointed that this firearm seems only to work with one type of ammo. How am I supposed to trust this thing to reliably shoot my Golden Sabres or Winchester Ranger Bonded hollowpoints if it cannot reliably fire ball ammo other than S&B?

Am I being unreasonable to expect this to fire other kinds of ammo?

I have a Springfield TRP Professional Custom 1911 .45 (yea im spoiled), and it feeds white box, S&B, fiocci, blazer brass, hollow points, and anything else that I choose to put through it, with any magazines, without a single hitch.

I am considering selling this to somebody with more patience and use the money to put towards a custom nighthawk variation of the bobtail.

Any thoughts? Am I being unreasonable?

Thanks.

faawrenchbndr
01-23-2010, 16:12
Has anyone other than you shot this with the same results?

TurtleBoy617
01-23-2010, 16:14
This exact pistol? The gunsmith at CZ-USA did shoot it, he shot S&B through it, and a 2 or 3 of a few different types of hollow points. Other than that, just me. It worked great with S&B, not a flaw. I wasn't expecting WWB to be perfect, and I was surprised by the WinClean not being perfect too.. Still think it should be able to function great with many different manufactured ammos. I would have understood one or two malfunctions, but I stopped counting after 8.

faawrenchbndr
01-23-2010, 16:16
OP stated it was a Dan Wesson CBOB:dunno:

TurtleBoy617
01-23-2010, 16:18
OP stated it was a Dan Wesson CBOB:dunno:

Yup.. Did I miss something?:faint:

doolyd
01-23-2010, 16:31
Well there ya go, should have got a Taurus PT1911, eats anything. :rofl:

Sorry had to do it.

To answer your question, yes it should shoot more than one type of ammo. I use cheap Monarch ammo in mine and it feeds find. I am very surprised to hear their gunsmith couldn't get it to run and if I heard you right, provided a second gun which was tuned (I wonder if by the same smith) and now it doesn't run.

Yes sell it to someone else and get the Nighthawk.

TurtleBoy617
01-23-2010, 17:12
Well there ya go, should have got a Taurus PT1911, eats anything. :rofl:

Sorry had to do it.

To answer your question, yes it should shoot more than one type of ammo. I use cheap Monarch ammo in mine and it feeds find. I am very surprised to hear their gunsmith couldn't get it to run and if I heard you right, provided a second gun which was tuned (I wonder if by the same smith) and now it doesn't run.

Yes sell it to someone else and get the Nighthawk.

Yea that is what I am leaning toward. The same gunsmith did it, and it DOES run flawless with S&B but I can't stand having a gun that only works with one brand of ammunition.

My father who thinks he knows a lot about 1911 thinks i am making a big deal of nothing, and should just settle to use it with S&B... which would be good if S&B was plentiful and cheap, and I did not want to use it for defense..

young wiliam
01-23-2010, 17:14
Would it be prudent to give a little more break in time? Try shooting some more S&B to let everything settle in, and then try some other makes of ammo. JMHO

TurtleBoy617
01-23-2010, 17:59
Would it be prudent to give a little more break in time? Try shooting some more S&B to let everything settle in, and then try some other makes of ammo. JMHO

I have thought about doing so, however I feel like if I increase the round count on this firearm, and it still doesn't work, and I have to send it in (for the 6th time) to get fixed, it will further reduce the gun's value...

faawrenchbndr
01-23-2010, 18:25
Yup.. Did I miss something?:faint:

Nope,.....my mistake.

I saw THIS and brain processed WHAT. :faint:

GVFlyer
01-23-2010, 18:40
Would it be prudent to give a little more break in time? Try shooting some more S&B to let everything settle in, and then try some other makes of ammo. JMHO

That's what I would do were it my pistol.

rvrctyrngr
01-23-2010, 21:28
I have thought about doing so, however I feel like if I increase the round count on this firearm, and it still doesn't work, and I have to send it in (for the 6th time) to get fixed, it will further reduce the gun's value...

I don't think it will reduce the guns value. Wessons are fairly tight and need some time to break in.

My SA was kinda finicky for the first 300 rounds or so, but it's been 100% with everything I've fed it since then. The only 1911 I've owned that was 100% out of the box has been my Smith PD.

I'd give it to 500 rounds or so. If it won't feed other stuff then, I'd say you have an issue or two.

nastytrigger
01-23-2010, 23:49
Keep shooting it for now, like specified. Make it a science experiment! I can understand your frustration. If it doesn't seem to improve, sell it or contact company again... On a happier note, stick with Springfield. I have.

RMTactical
01-23-2010, 23:59
Don't know what to say. I have shot a couple hundred rounds through mine now, and used a variety of different ammo including, Federal FMJ, Remington FMJ, Speer GD's, Federal HST, and Federal Tactical Bonded. It only had an issue with one round and that was the result of a bad magazine (metalform).

However, I have cycled the action probably a thousand times or two just by hand. Maybe that has helped?

paul45
01-24-2010, 08:12
Have you posted this over at 1911Forum/Dan Wesson?
That's where the DW fans and Keith from the DW shop hang out.

MNGunner
01-24-2010, 09:49
Try using 47d's. They are amongst the better mags that I have had experience with. As for not locking the slide back as has been claimed by the CZ smith, all I can say is perhaps they had a shoddy mag, the slide not locking back is generally a mag issue and seriously the 47d's are IMHO the best out there. It has been my experience that the majority of issues with 1911's are mag related and therefore I found what works for me and I stick with them.

RMTactical
01-24-2010, 15:30
Have you posted this over at 1911Forum/Dan Wesson?
That's where the DW fans and Keith from the DW shop hang out.

Worth a try for sure. They know their stuff over there.

TurtleBoy617
01-24-2010, 15:39
I am going to rack that slide back and forth a few hundred times and take it to the range this week and see how it does. I will post on that forum, and see how it is. If racking the slide a bunch does not help, I will continue to shoot it until I have shot around 500 rounds through there, and if there is still a problem, I will decide what to do from there..

1006
01-24-2010, 19:28
Not seeing the gun, I can only make an educated guess. It sounds like the extractor is too tight. The S&B ammo is -- as far as I know -- the only ammo with a relief angle on its base. It chambers easier. The chamber may also be a little tight, causing it to malfunction as soon as it gets a little dirty. If you like the gun, I would take it to a well know smith in your area and get it fixed. If this fellow doesn't have time, he might know someone who will. http://www.m-guns.com/

He is on a forum: http://www.louderthanwords.us/

TurtleBoy617
01-25-2010, 15:41
Update:

Cycled the slide 600 times last night, whiped it down and relubed/oil it up.

Took it to the range today and put 100 more rounds of Winchester white box. I shot it very well. However I had 9 of the same last-round-entering malfunctions that I had before. I had 0 slidelock problems though.

I am going to give to until I have thrown 500 through the pipe, and at that point I will make a decision on what I am going to do. That nighthawk custom is looking more desirable everytime I shoot this gun.

dosei
01-25-2010, 16:38
My .02...

Remove the wood grips and...
Wet the rails with ATF (Synthetic Automatic Transmission Fluid) and continue to cycle the action (or strip it down so your just burnishing the slide to the frame). Keep the rails wet and cycle it over a drip pan (cause it should drip and be a little messy). Remove the slide often to re-wet the rails on the slide & frame (which also cleans off any particles). Constantly cleaning/lubing the rails with ATF and cycling it will burnish the action butter smooth so you get that "riding on ball bearings" feel.

Also, it might be worth your while to get a reduced power recoil spring for it. I've heard that 4" barreled 1911 can be a bit finicky about loads and will start to choke on lower powered loads quicker than their 5" big brothers. And it certainly seems to me that the issue is reliability with weaker loads. So unless your planning on mouse fart loads for SD...I don't see a reliability concern.

That said...PM me if you decide to sell...:supergrin:

maxniman
01-25-2010, 18:43
I am going to rack that slide back and forth a few hundred times and take it to the range this week and see how it does. I will post on that forum, and see how it is. If racking the slide a bunch does not help, I will continue to shoot it until I have shot around 500 rounds through there, and if there is still a problem, I will decide what to do from there..


I have about 500 rounds through my CBOB (Dec 09 purchase) and it takes all types ammo. I also use the DW mags as well as a Wilson Combat 47D and CMC 10 round Power+ with no problems. I would try a few more rounds before selling, mine initally had a few hang ups using WWB ammo - I have never used S&B. I would also post this on the Dan Wesson forum

TurtleBoy617
01-25-2010, 18:53
Roger that. I will post this on their boards, and see what they say. I am surprised I am having all of these issues, I bought the gun in October 09, and the folks at Dan Wesson have had it longer that I have! I am going to give it to 500 rounds, then I might just try to get my money back from it and see about getting a Nighthawk Bobtail since I am so darn picky. We'll see though. It shoots very accurate. Below is a target @ 15 yards with a non-expert shooter.

http://hphotos-snc3.fbcdn.net/hs222.snc3/20932_264863348301_501198301_3340044_4949438_n.jpg

HAIL CAESAR
01-25-2010, 19:11
A couple things are likely the cause.
One the mags springs are weak, order some Tripp replacement springs. Or toss out the 20 pound recoil spring and use a correct 18 pounder.
Secondly, Winclean ammo is pure ***t'ola. Not that S&B is any better.
Third thing I would do is next time you shoot it is let all that residue and soot stay just were it is and rack the slide a couple hundred times dirty. You are using all the soot and residue as a lapping compound. Or just use some toothpaste..I've used it for years.:embarassed:

If you can post some pics of the exact kind if issue you are having so I can (hopefully) correctly diagnose the problem. As best I can over the darn computer. Actually I want to make sure it isn't stem binding.

dosei
01-25-2010, 19:50
http://www.1911auto.org/forum/showthread.php?4060-Cbob-feed-problems

From post #10
Those commanders will teach you about timing in a hurry....no matter which manufacturer you choose. I learned these lessons on a Baer Stinger. (and not all that long ago)

I bought a "calibration pack" from Wolff and swapped springs around until I found the right combination, and learned a lot in the process. After the gun was broken in (about 600 rounds) it runs great with a 20# spring for my carry/hunting loads...I like em a bit warm. It will also run with an 18#, but it WILL NOT run with a 21# variable like Baer puts in them from the shop.

TurtleBoy617
01-26-2010, 22:17
"The chamber is meant to have a slight taper to it. All ammo through our guns should have a good taper crimp or it will not feed or chamber properly.

Keith Lawton"

This is what their gunsmith (the guy who tuned this gun) sent me in response to my concerns.

I ordered an 18lb spring (i guess it is a variable... oh well!) made by Ed Brown. It will be here Thursday, I will take it out Friday and test the two springs. I just bought a bunch of Walmart-Federal Premium rounds, we'll see how it does.

I am leaning more and more towards either selling and getting the nighthawk, or just saving up for a nighthawk. I just dont want to buy a nighthawk and have these same problems with being picky with ammo.

HAIL CAESAR
01-27-2010, 02:00
If your looking for a golden pistol you better go to the 1911 forums and check out the Nighthawk forums, NH has had a hard time making pistols run themselves. They are really sticking it to customers with shipping/ ammo, and repair fees if THEY don't find anything wrong with the gun.

Cobra64
01-27-2010, 11:15
I am leaning more and more towards either selling and getting the nighthawk, or just saving up for a nighthawk. I just dont want to buy a nighthawk and have these same problems with being picky with ammo.

You may want to read this: "Grayguns Dan Wesson CBOB" before selling your CBOB.

http://sigforum.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/430601935/m/831109613

hdbob
01-28-2010, 01:20
Mine shoots factory ammo well, but havent shot much of it... Just reloads.. I have a bunch of 185 gr Im trying and not working good with it... I bought the Same Ed brown variable 18# spring, couldnt tell a difference with the 185 gr

You know you see this with the other brands as well, My friend has a COlt special combat and it is pretty finichy with ammo as well..

I read once in this magazine the guy said that a good friend who wrote for a well known 1911 gun mag told him not to tell anyone, But he loved his 1911's but his conceal carry was a glock.

Put some more rounds thru it, see what happens..


"The chamber is meant to have a slight taper to it. All ammo through our guns should have a good taper crimp or it will not feed or chamber properly.

Keith Lawton"

This is what their gunsmith (the guy who tuned this gun) sent me in response to my concerns.

I ordered an 18lb spring (i guess it is a variable... oh well!) made by Ed Brown. It will be here Thursday, I will take it out Friday and test the two springs. I just bought a bunch of Walmart-Federal Premium rounds, we'll see how it does.

I am leaning more and more towards either selling and getting the nighthawk, or just saving up for a nighthawk. I just dont want to buy a nighthawk and have these same problems with being picky with ammo.

TurtleBoy617
01-29-2010, 19:26
I replaced the 20 pound spring with an Ed Brown 18 pound spring. Took 4 Dan Wesson-Checkmate Magazines, 150 rounds of Federal practice ammo (wallyworld), 50 rounds of WWB, and 20 rounds of PDX1, Alongwith 5 rounds of Hornady TAP, and 8 rounds of old Winchester SXT.

I quickly found that one of my mags did not like to slam the first round into the chamber, and experienced the feed problem I had before with the last round going in the chamber.

I then used the other 3 mags I brough, and it fired flawlessly.

I did have one issue, one of the followers in one of the mags popped out of the top once after the last round fired, and caused it malfunction.. it was wierd but only happened once.

I am going to look at trying some Wilson mags, because if they work, their followers seem to be more secure

But it seems to be breaking in nicely, sometime during this week, most likely Friday, I am going to take it back to the range, and put another 1-200 rounds through it.

It functioned much better than it did previously. I actually kept forgetting that it could fire 8 rounds, I kept expecting there to be a click or a malfunction, so I am pleasently surprised. Especially with the performance with the PDX1, WWB (which had previously locked up the last round), and Hornady TAP.

Now that at the moment it seems to be functioning correctly, I can now focus more on shooting it better. I shoot it well out to ten yards, but I want to get awesome with it

dosei
01-29-2010, 20:13
Nice you know your getting that commander's timing dialed in.

















Actually...I'm pissed as all heck...I wanted to get a "dysfunctional" DW CBOB from someone new to commander length 1911's that just gave up and never really tried to get it dialed in. GRRRRRRRRRRRR





























JK...happy shooting!

TurtleBoy617
01-29-2010, 20:28
I am glad somebody recommended that spring to me. Besides a couple malfunctions from magazines (including a mag follower BEING the malfunction.... whatever...), it fired great. Going to take it out again next time I can get some cheap (in cost) ammo or something.

here is a video of me shooting her (sorry it sucks, but I am so excited to have it work i had to lol)

Me shooting the dan wesson... A miracle.. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2FPB8ECxto)

HAIL CAESAR
01-29-2010, 23:15
I can't imagine how the Checkmate follower jumped unless it wasn't a bull nose.

And seeing the video and me being a instructor at work and not being able to keep my mouth shut...:embarassed:

But try and move your left hand up higher up on your firing hand. Try placing it high enough that your pointer finger is up against your trigger guard. Squeeze your right hand with your left and you should see A LOT less muzzle jump and have more control.

TurtleBoy617
01-30-2010, 10:52
I can't imagine how the Checkmate follower jumped unless it wasn't a bull nose.

And seeing the video and me being a instructor at work and now being able to keep my mouth shut...:embarassed:

But try and move your left hand up higher up on your firing hand. Try placing it high enough that your pointer finger is up against your trigger guard. Squeeze your right hand with your left and you should see A LOT less muzzle jump and have more control.

HAHA. That must have been painful for you to watch. I will practice that (dry) and next time I go to the range will try it out. I knew that I wasn't holding it correct. I shoot it well out to about 10 yards, and I KNOW she is accurate further than that.

Here is a pic of my mag malfunction:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2796/4316633706_1f2d54ea38_b.jpg There is no round in that, that is the follower it got caught on.

Here is a pic of the mag immediately after coming out of the gun.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4025/4316634878_22223c8e6a_b.jpg

maxniman
01-30-2010, 18:19
I am glad somebody recommended that spring to me. Besides a couple malfunctions from magazines (including a mag follower BEING the malfunction.... whatever...), it fired great. Going to take it out again next time I can get some cheap (in cost) ammo or something.

here is a video of me shooting her (sorry it sucks, but I am so excited to have it work i had to lol)

Me shooting the dan wesson... A miracle.. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2FPB8ECxto)


nice vid, nice shots of the brass bouncing off the booth wall:supergrin:

L-2
01-30-2010, 18:55
deleted

HAIL CAESAR
01-30-2010, 21:49
HAHA. That must have been painful for you to watch. I will practice that (dry) and next time I go to the range will try it out. I knew that I wasn't holding it correct. I shoot it well out to about 10 yards, and I KNOW she is accurate further than that.

Here is a pic of my mag malfunction:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2796/4316633706_1f2d54ea38_b.jpg There is no round in that, that is the follower it got caught on.

Here is a pic of the mag immediately after coming out of the gun.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4025/4316634878_22223c8e6a_b.jpg

No it wasn't painful at all, most shooters shoot like that. I was just trying to give you a tip to get you into fast, furious, and accurate shooting.

About the mags, get a Tripp kit for it and that will never happen again. It is rare but does happen.

hdbob
01-31-2010, 07:35
You know I may have 250 rounds thru mine now.. My reloads werent working in it, but would in my S/A and Colt.... shot a box of factory thru it and worked... Yesterday took it out again... last time was 185 gr reloads this time with new variable spring and 230 gr reloads still no go... Shot some factory rounds and was having problems..... took it to a friends, he trimmed the barrel (throat)some and really polished it up, I havent shot it but I had 6 rounds that would not chamber and cycle thru the gun, Now they will at least chamber.... I think im good too go..Gun Is TIGHT..

keninnavarre
01-31-2010, 09:48
I am glad somebody recommended that spring to me. Besides a couple malfunctions from magazines (including a mag follower BEING the malfunction.... whatever...), it fired great. Going to take it out again next time I can get some cheap (in cost) ammo or something.

here is a video of me shooting her (sorry it sucks, but I am so excited to have it work i had to lol)

Me shooting the dan wesson... A miracle.. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2FPB8ECxto)

Seems like you had to go thru a hell of a lot of trouble to get that DW anywhere near reliable. I dont have that kind of patience, and I dont think you should have to replace springs and mags on ANY new gun to get it to operate. Am I missing something? Or do I expect too much?

Glad to see youre getting the bugs worked out, though. Maybe you should send this thread to a company rep, and see about at least getting replacement mags for your trouble.

hi-power man
02-01-2010, 20:40
I suggest you go to the 1911 forum and read the section devoted to magazines. Here's a link.


http://forum.m1911.org/forumdisplay.php?f=53