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dw_player
02-20-2010, 10:00
OK, so I'm thinking about my tax return and may invest in m first 'black' rifle. There are two options I'm now considering:
1. A good quality AR
2. The new Bushmaster ACR
Whatever I get would be my first real tactical rifle (I have a M&P15-22) and I only want to buy it once. Meaning I don't want to outgrow the rifle by buying something very cheap and upgrading it later.
Money IS an object though, don't get me wrong.
I've read a lot about BCM and am leaning towards them as an AR platform provider.
I received an email from OnPoint about the Bushmaster ACR becoming available this spring/summer and am interested based on what I read, but I'm a novice. I realize it's 1.5-2x the cash potentially, but would it be worth the investment?
Do any of you guys have any thoughts/experience with the ACR? Which would be better for range, training (which I intend to get) and maybe some competition (not sure about this one yet...).
Thanks in advance!

WarMachine
02-20-2010, 10:44
I don't have any comment on the ACR specifically, but you can build a damn fine railed BCM with, BUIS, a quality optic, Larue mount, sling, magazines, ammo, etc. for the price of a bare bones ACR.

My middy BCM has been wonderful, so perhaps I'm a little biased, as I thoroughly enjoyed piecing together and shooting my build.

Noveske is even offering free stripped lowers with an upper purchase, I believe.

I just don't think (too early to "know" I suppose) that the ACR will be worth investing in over a well thought out AR build with quality components, or even a SCAR which is already being fielded.

You say that money IS an object for you. In that case, I'd get a squared away AR and save the extra money to be put towards LOTS of trigger time so that the thing doesn't just sit in the safe. I would get an ACR if I had money to burn, but not for my first foray into black rifle territory.

This is all just my opinion of course. I only have hands-on experience with AR's and a buddy of mine's SCAR.

furioso2112
02-20-2010, 10:53
It's going to take a lot of research and good guessing to buy once and not ever want to upgrade. There are a few things that you'll be hard-pressed to figure out before using an AR that would require (relatively) major changes later: barrel twist rate (would require a barrel change - easy enough, as is anything with an AR, but requires tools and some searching for instructions). 1 in 7" is gaining popularity, and shoots heavier bullet weights more accurately (a short description). BCM also offers a 410SS barrel that is 1 in 8", a compromise between 1 in 9" (former most popular, shoots lower bullet weights more accurately) and 1 in 7". The barrels are very accurate, but a bit heavier. The gas system and barrel length are also things you'll need to consider. A bolt, handguard (free-floated or not?), and the hundreds of other accessories can be changed later, essentially as drop-ins, but as you said, you prefer to buy once. You'll do well to talk about an figure out what kind of shooting you're going to do. Plinking, 3-gun, long-range all have a different set of components that optimize the usefulness of your setup and accessories.

Ttere are tons of good threads to look into. It might take a few weeks of dedicated research and thinking to make a good guess, and that's no guarantee that you won;t soon want to change a component or two.

DLEE25
02-20-2010, 12:41
I was really interested in the ACR ever since it first appeared as the Masada. You must consider that since Bushmaster took over the product, they made some changes like the positon of the charging handle. It is an innovative product and has potential, but the AR system is proven. There are more options for a quality AR out there. BCM products are a fine example so I would agree with that.

Unfortunately, even with a high quality AR platform, there will always be upgrades since technology always develops. Sights get better, rails get lighter and stronger etc. But I also know of plenty of guys who are quite happy with their 15 year old stock Colts with iron sights.

I would recommend talking to the Bravo guys and getting an AR with what you want on it rather than investing all your eggs on a new design. Good luck and have fun.

raven11
02-20-2010, 12:50
to buy a ACR you'd have to say

No, i don't want to buy:
1) multiple DI AR
2) piston AR
3) FN FAL
4) HK G3
5) FN FS2000
6) FN Scar
7) FN PS90
8)MSAR AUG
9)XCR

the choice is yours but most of the weapons on the above list you could buy one with money to spare

crazymoose
02-20-2010, 13:01
I was really interested in the ACR ever since it first appeared as the Masada. You must consider that since Bushmaster took over the product, they made some changes like the positon of the charging handle. It is an innovative product and has potential, but the AR system is proven. There are more options for a quality AR out there. BCM products are a fine example so I would agree with that.

Unfortunately, even with a high quality AR platform, there will always be upgrades since technology always develops. Sights get better, rails get lighter and stronger etc. But I also know of plenty of guys who are quite happy with their 15 year old stock Colts with iron sights.

I would recommend talking to the Bravo guys and getting an AR with what you want on it rather than investing all your eggs on a new design. Good luck and have fun.

I agree. Were a more trustworthy company handling it, I might suggest the ACR, but Bushmaster has a long history of taking all sorts of QC shortcuts. A good AR-15 like a Bravo Co. will serve you well. If your heart is set on something other than an AR, perhaps something like the FN SCAR-L would be a more dependable investment.

dw_player
02-20-2010, 13:23
Thanks for the responses so far guys. Exactly the insightful and welcomed biased/informed opinions I was hoping for.
Now let me clarify one point. I may have overstated my goal in buying once. From what I've read so far (I'm an engineer by day so I tend o over analyze and get lots of data) I view the AR as a componetized platfor
There are certainly opotunities and reasons o upgrade or swap out components but I want to ensure I'm building off of a quality base (solid upper and lower).
Rails, optics and barrel are certainly areas I need to become more educated in. I will probably put some time in open sites first (prior to optics) to make sure I am comfortable in many situations.
I really appreciate the twist rate exaplanation. That actually helps a ton.
Keep the data coming.
Thanks again.

Constructor
02-20-2010, 13:38
I would never buy a $2300 piston AR in place of a SCAR or possibly ACR, the SCAR and ACR were designed as piston rifles from the ground up, a piston AR is a bandaid IMO. I have a SCAR but still waiting on the ACR to do a month long inspection and test side by side.
There is nothing wrong with a well built DI AR, especially if you aren't shooting 500 rounds a day.

PlasticGuy
02-20-2010, 14:43
I was very excited about the Masada. When Bushmaster took over and changed it to the ACR, they also:

1) Raised the MSRP to over $3000
2) Changed to a 1:9" twist
3) Made the barrel without chrome lining
4) Increased the weight to 8.25 pounds
5) Changed the trigger group so not all parts are AR15 compatable

I'm no longer interested. I won't pay $3000 for a rifle with a sub-standard barrel and weighing 2+ pounds more than an AR15 carbine with the same length barrel. And it's not even combat tested. At least the overpriced SCAR has been in the hands of warriors. The only battles the ACR has seen are on the Playstation 3.

Constructor
02-20-2010, 15:32
I was very excited about the Masada. When Bushmaster took over and changed it to the ACR, they also:

1) Raised the MSRP to over $3000
2) Changed to a 1:9" twist
3) Made the barrel without chrome lining
4) Increased the weight to 8.25 pounds
5) Changed the trigger group so not all parts are AR15 compatable

I'm no longer interested. I won't pay $3000 for a rifle with a sub-standard barrel and weighing 2+ pounds more than an AR15 carbine with the same length barrel. And it's not even combat tested. At least the overpriced SCAR has been in the hands of warriors. The only battles the ACR has seen are on the Playstation 3.


LOL, and Call of Duty

Quiet
03-20-2010, 08:26
There is a Bushmaster ACR up for auction on gunbroker. (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=161198693)

Starting bid was $8500 and it is currently at $15,000 with the reserve not met. :wow:

blhar15
03-20-2010, 11:38
I think I would buy the FN SCAR right now over the ACR. The SCAR is released in black finish now and is just starting get to more production. The SCAR is pretty much mil-soec just like the military version with a 16" barrel and semi-auto and of course a 1/7 twist chrome-lined barrel. I have held a SCAR and they are very lightweight, nice handling.

WayaX
03-20-2010, 15:33
to buy a ACR you'd have to say

No, i don't want to buy:
1) multiple DI AR
2) piston AR
3) FN FAL
4) HK G3
5) FN FS2000
6) FN Scar
7) FN PS90
8)MSAR AUG
9)XCR

the choice is yours but most of the weapons on the above list you could buy one with money to spare

You also have to say "yes, I want to buy a gun that was great in design, but then butchered by the monkeys at Bushmaster. Also, I want to spend 1.5-2x the price that magpul wanted to originally sell it for. Still yet, I realize that the Bushmaster ACR isn't really a magpul Masada and has had many of the cool features such as the 7.62x39 caliber idea scrapped."

Yeah, the Masada is dead to me. :crying:

TimP
03-20-2010, 17:02
the ACR = just another semi-auto 223.

12131
03-20-2010, 17:05
If you want to pay extortion money and be a beta tester, then get the ACR.:wavey:

faawrenchbndr
03-20-2010, 17:06
the ACR = just another semi-auto 223.

Yep,.......:dunno:

PlasticGuy
03-20-2010, 21:07
the ACR = just another semi-auto 223.
Until proven otherwise, you're absolutely right. The burden is on Bushmaster to prove why an overweight and overpriced rifle with a second rate barrel should be the most expensive production combat rifle in the country. So far they have fallen way short of that goal.

TimP
03-20-2010, 21:10
im not trying to be a dick folks, im really not. But like plastic guy said "prove why an overweight and overpriced rifle with a second rate barrel should be the most expensive production combat rifle in the country"

I have shot a ACR/Masada, and the ergonomics are very good. When the rifles price was 1000-1500 or so, it would have bene easier to swallow. 2500+, no thanks.

Constructor
03-20-2010, 21:36
agreed, you could build a really good running DI AR for $1200 complete with rails and upgrade parts then add accessories. and still have $1000 left for practice ammo.

PlasticGuy
03-20-2010, 21:49
im not trying to be a dick folks, im really not. But like plastic guy said "prove why an overweight and overpriced rifle with a second rate barrel should be the most expensive production combat rifle in the country"...
And for the record, I wasn't trying to be a jerk either. I'm no fan of the AR15, and I would love to see the ACR come out in a competitive price range with exceptional features and really kick butt. Unfortunately, that's not what I'm seeing. Maybe at some point in the future, but not now.

I pawed them over extensively at the SHOT Show. The weight is a real issue, the Bushmaster folks really were being evasive about why they're using that particular barrel, and they told me the MSRP was over $3000 for the model with the collapsable/folding stock and railed forend. Even if they dropped the price by $1000, it would still be too heavy and have a crappy barrel. They've lost their minds, and lost their customer base.

mvician
03-21-2010, 00:35
Get in line folks............there is one on Gunbroker :rofl:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=161198693


oops I see it is posted above

GlockLovin
03-21-2010, 06:01
Lwrc!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

wct097
03-21-2010, 06:08
I prefer the M4 to the SCAR, and the ACR to the SCAR and M4 (and even the AK47). I haven't had much luck with the M16A4 though.... think I'll stick with the ACR once I unlock it again. Prestige mode sucks.

Blitzer
03-21-2010, 06:16
I.M.E./O. I have never read a magazine that ever said anything bad in a gun review. So don't base your decision on what you read.

Find lots of folks who own various brands of AR-15 rifles and ask lots of questions. ;)

I am leaning toward a SIG 556 myself.

nastytrigger
03-21-2010, 14:02
Build your own. I haven't, but I could easily. Building your own AR is very rewarding both in final product and intimate knowledge of the weapon.

kabob983
03-22-2010, 11:46
I was SO on the ACR bandwagon up until a few months ago when the final specs and price were released. Man, the hype died in a flash.

Methinks my next purchase will be a SCAR 17S (whenever it is released)...308 flavor = mmmmmmmmm.

Daekwan
03-22-2010, 20:23
My brother from another mother is stealing my ideas again. I'm more than happy with my .223/5.56 solution I have so the black SCAR in .308 is at the top of my want list. Too bad they are goin for $3k plus. Although I do have a friend who claims he can get them at cost straight from FN.

WRXcelration
03-22-2010, 21:42
Who in their right mind would bid $16,000 on a AR style platform.
Makes you second guess our economy

kabob983
03-24-2010, 10:46
My brother from another mother is stealing my ideas again. I'm more than happy with my .223/5.56 solution I have so the black SCAR in .308 is at the top of my want list. Too bad they are goin for $3k plus. Although I do have a friend who claims he can get them at cost straight from FN.

.308 SCAR isn't out yet, should be in the next few months though. And when they first are released they'll command a ridiculous premium as well (I'm thinking $4500-5000 on GB early on). I too would like a SCAR 17S (SCAR-H as people call it) but it's going to be too pricey.

If you do have a buddy who can get 'em at cost from FN...hook me up! :supergrin:

12131
03-24-2010, 11:29
Who in their right mind would bid $16,000 on a AR style platform.
Makes you second guess our economy
Shill bidding runs rampant.

Daekwan
03-24-2010, 13:26
.308 SCAR isn't out yet, should be in the next few months though. And when they first are released they'll command a ridiculous premium as well (I'm thinking $4500-5000 on GB early on). I too would like a SCAR 17S (SCAR-H as people call it) but it's going to be too pricey.

If you do have a buddy who can get 'em at cost from FN...hook me up! :supergrin:

Yeah I kinda meshed sentences together there. I've been watching the prices of the newly released Black SCARs on Sturm and they started at $3999.. dropped to $2999 and are getting more reasonable every week.

As far at the .308 black one.. $4500-5000 sounds just about right for early adopters. Im in no rush though, I doubt if I'll be buying another rifle this year. Still have a couple of other things to get first.. you know that 686+ and G23.. :)

And Rem870 I havent forgotten you either. So many guns, so little money.. :(

kabob983
03-24-2010, 14:03
Yeah I kinda meshed sentences together there. I've been watching the prices of the newly released Black SCARs on Sturm and they started at $3999.. dropped to $2999 and are getting more reasonable every week.

Am I the only guy who LIKES the look of the tan SCARs? Were I to buy one I'd go with it, I've got enough all-black guns...

deMontacute
03-24-2010, 16:31
Am I the only guy who LIKES the look of the tan SCARs? Were I to buy one I'd go with it, I've got enough all-black guns...
I would. I like the FDE SCAR, but....

...for now I am waiting for rumors of "revisions" to play out. There is alot of chatter that FN will be revising the SCAR design, atleast for SOCOM. It remains to be seen whether these rumors are true, and if they will carry over to the civilian design.

I will say, I'd hate to be one of the early adopters if a new Gen2 SCAR-L is in the works.

But I'm pretty sure the wife would neuter me if I tried to get another right now anyway, so I have time to assess...

glock22357
03-25-2010, 04:08
I've been watching the prices of the newly released Black SCARs on Sturm.......(

What do you mean "on Sturm?"

Is this a website for selling firearms? I googled sturm and nothing came up.

deMontacute
03-25-2010, 06:39
What do you mean "on Sturm?"

Is this a website for selling firearms? I googled sturm and nothing came up.

http://www.sturmgewehr.com/

kabob983
03-25-2010, 08:49
I would. I like the FDE SCAR, but....

...for now I am waiting for rumors of "revisions" to play out. There is alot of chatter that FN will be revising the SCAR design, atleast for SOCOM. It remains to be seen whether these rumors are true, and if they will carry over to the civilian design.

I will say, I'd hate to be one of the early adopters if a new Gen2 SCAR-L is in the works.

But I'm pretty sure the wife would neuter me if I tried to get another right now anyway, so I have time to assess...

There's always going to be rumors abounding, methinks it'll be a while before we see anything about an update.

Darkangel1846
03-25-2010, 14:12
I like that HK 416, or maybe the Sig but the price is a bit high.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ObXZMepn3SI

kabob983
03-26-2010, 06:46
I like that HK 416, or maybe the Sig but the price is a bit high.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ObXZMepn3SI

HK416 is "just another piston AR" to me, albiet a REALLY overpriced one...

Kalashnikova
11-30-2010, 22:35
I have an ACR. I like it and I have no problems with it. The recall replaced the firing pin with a titanium pin and a new spring. I think they recalled all of them just to be safe. Mine never fired full auto. I also do not use crap ammo. Yes it iwas expensive, but so are the FS2000, PS90, FNscar and MSAR STG 556.

JHorner_G17C
11-30-2010, 23:37
IMO... ACR=overpriced hype for mall ninjas to drool over with zero combat experience in the real world. Build yourself a nice middy save the money for ammo!!!!

Jdog
11-30-2010, 23:47
i've been thinking about the ruger. I know it's a little more proprietary in some areas than the standard AR but it's only $1,500. Any thoughts ?
http://www.ruger.com/products/sr556/index.html

PlasticGuy
12-01-2010, 00:15
i've been thinking about the ruger. I know it's a little more proprietary in some areas than the standard AR but it's only $1,500. Any thoughts ?
If I'm going to buy a combat rifle, I want it to be US mil-spec. If it isn't an AR15, the only option that I would consider viable is the SCAR. Anything else is just mall ninja stuff that will likely be out of production within a few years. Harsh maybe, but the truth.

Chuck TX
12-01-2010, 04:41
i've been thinking about the ruger. I know it's a little more proprietary in some areas than the standard AR but it's only $1,500. Any thoughts ?
http://www.ruger.com/products/sr556/index.html

Definitely a no go for me. You can't even service the piston yourself IIRC. There are other options in the same range that are more flexible if you have to have a piston.

TedG
12-01-2010, 09:14
According to Wikipedia......

On October 15, 2010 Bushmaster issued a recall of all ACR rifles instructing users to "Please immediately discontinue the use of your ACR rifle" along with instructions to contact customer support for an RMA. Bushmaster stated that the recall was issued due to "a possible firearms performance issue that may develop with a small number of ACR rifles" and goes on to state that "Bushmaster discovered a design flaw which could result in multiple rounds firing continuously when the trigger is pulled". Bushmaster has stated that it will cover all of the costs associated with the repairs to the recalled rifles.[12]

Quiet
12-04-2010, 09:55
According to Wikipedia......

On October 15, 2010 Bushmaster issued a recall of all ACR rifles instructing users to "Please immediately discontinue the use of your ACR rifle" along with instructions to contact customer support for an RMA. Bushmaster stated that the recall was issued due to "a possible firearms performance issue that may develop with a small number of ACR rifles" and goes on to state that "Bushmaster discovered a design flaw which could result in multiple rounds firing continuously when the trigger is pulled". Bushmaster has stated that it will cover all of the costs associated with the repairs to the recalled rifles.[12]

Previous thread on Bushmaster ACR recall with link to Bushmaster ACR recall letter (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1275063)

Morris
12-04-2010, 12:24
If I'm going to buy a combat rifle, I want it to be US mil-spec. If it isn't an AR15, the only option that I would consider viable is the SCAR. Anything else is just mall ninja stuff that will likely be out of production within a few years. Harsh maybe, but the truth.

The Sig go away?

PlasticGuy
12-04-2010, 15:15
The Sig go away?
Yes. I still believe it is an underrated rifle, but they have moved down a path with it that has no future in LE or Military. It could have been viable in any market they chose to pursue. Unfortunately, they chose to pursue the mid-level civilian market rather than going all the way and making it military grade. I think it's a horrible waste, because I still believe it has one of the best operating systems and barrels on the market.

You sold yours too, didn't you?

Morris
12-04-2010, 18:30
Yep. Had to focus on ARs for work.

Chuck TX
12-05-2010, 14:51
Yes. I still believe it is an underrated rifle, but they have moved down a path with it that has no future in LE or Military. It could have been viable in any market they chose to pursue. Unfortunately, they chose to pursue the mid-level civilian market rather than going all the way and making it military grade. I think it's a horrible waste, because I still believe it has one of the best operating systems and barrels on the market.

You sold yours too, didn't you?

The ones I'd seen chewed brass up, which turned me off as a reloader.

PlasticGuy
12-07-2010, 00:32
The ones I'd seen chewed brass up, which turned me off as a reloader.
Puts one little dent in the side. They reload just fine. You must hate HK's. :supergrin:

mstennes
12-07-2010, 08:13
I was very excited about the Masada. When Bushmaster took over and changed it to the ACR, they also:

1) Raised the MSRP to over $3000
2) Changed to a 1:9" twist
3) Made the barrel without chrome lining
4) Increased the weight to 8.25 pounds
5) Changed the trigger group so not all parts are AR15 compatable

I'm no longer interested. I won't pay $3000 for a rifle with a sub-standard barrel and weighing 2+ pounds more than an AR15 carbine with the same length barrel. And it's not even combat tested. At least the overpriced SCAR has been in the hands of warriors. The only battles the ACR has seen are on the Playstation 3.

Of that 8 pounds at least 7 of it feels like its on the front, it is the worst balanced rifle I have shot. A friend got one, its slow to shoulder, the balance outright sucks. Oh and they were recalled, his was anyway, he told them to keep it.

Andrewsky
12-07-2010, 18:29
If you can't hit the target with an AR, you're not going to hit it with one of these new rifles (SCAR, ACR, whatever).

mstennes
12-07-2010, 20:13
HK416 is "just another piston AR" to me, albiet a REALLY overpriced one...

Thats the truth, and its really working out well for SOCOM users (former) now also.

mixflip
12-07-2010, 21:02
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpqTPK4s-X8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpqTPK4s-X8)This video review pretty much ended my ACR hard on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_-v7Jc60zE This video also was the nail in the coffin for me.

raven11
12-07-2010, 21:27
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpqTPK4s-X8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpqTPK4s-X8)This video review pretty much ended my ACR hard on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_-v7Jc60zE This video also was the nail in the coffin for me.

my $600 AR is built better than that thing

TurtleBoy617
12-22-2010, 13:50
I have a Bushmaster ACR and aside from their recall.. I have been happy with it. I haven't had any problems.

This being said, If I could go back in time and stop myself from buying the ACR, I would. After post-purchase research, my money would have been better spent on the FN SCAR or quality DI AR15 such as a Noveske, etc.

I have put about 500 rounds through mine so far, maybe more. If I wanted to sell it, I couldn't get back what I paid for it. I bought the basic model and purchased the flip stock and tri rail after purchase. I tried selling it, but I couldn't get what I paid for it stripped down, even with all the extra goodies included.

I'm not disappointed yet, haven't had any problems.

Janno05
12-22-2010, 16:16
I would be standing in line if bushmaster hadn't gotten their hands on it. I really enjoy my M4gery, and once I pick up an AK I think I will try out a Robinson Arms XCR. I have never seen one in person, but it looks like one hell of a design that doesn't get much attention. I like the idea of a caliber swap to 5.45/39 for some cheap target practice.

Infallible
12-24-2010, 21:30
I'm in the same boat and after much research and seeing videos online, I have to say the ACR is not the rifle it was hyped up to be. I think I will spend my money of an FN SCAR.

mixflip
12-25-2010, 02:45
I am another fan of the extremely overlooked Robinson XCR.

I like...

Its left side non reciprocating charging handle. (lower than a SCAR's too)
Its quick change barrels for caliber swaps. (actually available while the ACR's arent)
Its ambi fire controls
Its short throw selector switch
Its ambi bolt release. (that the ACR copied lol)
Its folding stock that can be adapted to your favorite M4 style if you like?
Its monolithick upper
Its AK-ish bolt and piston design
Its about the same weight as the ACR yet the XCR has an aluminum upper not plastic

My only gripe is that the rear take down pin is not a captured style like an AR. I could accidentally bump it on my gear and break open the gun right when I really dont want to? Its a button style, not a pin.

I love this pic.... who ever owns it is a lucky man.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i182/mixflip/XCR_SBR_LS_LG.jpg

NeverMore1701
12-25-2010, 07:26
I love just about everything about the XCR concept, I just worry about the longevity of the rifle and company :dunno:

mjkeat
12-25-2010, 08:42
Wasnt there something a while back about the owner of Robinson supporting anti gun politicians?

22highcaps
12-26-2010, 08:22
I was very excited about the Masada. When Bushmaster took over and changed it to the ACR, they also:

1) Raised the MSRP to over $3000
2) Changed to a 1:9" twist
3) Made the barrel without chrome lining
4) Increased the weight to 8.25 pounds
5) Changed the trigger group so not all parts are AR15 compatable

I'm no longer interested. I won't pay $3000 for a rifle with a sub-standard barrel and weighing 2+ pounds more than an AR15 carbine with the same length barrel. And it's not even combat tested. At least the overpriced SCAR has been in the hands of warriors. The only battles the ACR has seen are on the Playstation 3.

As I understand it, they also use a smaller gas port than an equivalent AR barrel so even if you could get your hands on the required mounting hardware you would still have issues trying to adapt a conventional AR barrel.

Given how little of this gun actually interchanges with the Black Rifle, perhaps we should move this to general non-glocking or another forum as to keep this one dedicated to the AR15.

jhoagland
12-26-2010, 08:46
Ummm, as long as the/a rifle was black I though it would be fine for this forum. After all that's what it is named.
Here are mine.
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb275/jkhoagland/guns%20and%20shooting/smokeyandthesaiga003.jpg
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb275/jkhoagland/guns%20and%20shooting/moregunpics005.jpg

22highcaps
12-27-2010, 07:51
Ummm, as long as the/a rifle was black I though it would be fine for this forum. After all that's what it is named.
Here are mine.
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb275/jkhoagland/guns%20and%20shooting/smokeyandthesaiga003.jpg
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb275/jkhoagland/guns%20and%20shooting/moregunpics005.jpg

I believed that once and MrMurphy promptly set me straight that this is an AR board.

Nice collection by the way.

jhoagland
12-27-2010, 18:40
OIC.

Thanks though.:cool:

RMTactical
12-27-2010, 19:33
Get a quality AR15 for sure. Use the rest of the money on ammo and some range time, maybe a class.

mstennes
12-29-2010, 14:29
Get a quality AR15 for sure. Use the rest of the money on ammo and some range time, maybe a class.
And optics!!! Oh and spare mags.

IIRC, isnt FN on making the SCAR17 also able to be a 5.56?