Semi auto VS pump shot gun - which can you shoot faster? [Archive] - Glock Talk

PDA

View Full Version : Semi auto VS pump shot gun - which can you shoot faster?


Z71bill
03-18-2010, 14:26
MAYBE A DUMB QUESTION! :embarassed:

Is there any time difference between follow up shots for a semi auto VS pump shot gun?

I am sure if you just blast away at the air a semi auto would be faster - but if you pump the gun between the first shot and taking aim for the second shot - no real time lost - or not much difference?

When I was in high school I could shoot my pump faster than my dad could fire his semi auto - Duck hunting over decoys - he always said I shot too fast - but it was almost always 3 shots 3 dead ducks :supergrin: - and once in a while I would load an additional round and get off one more shoot.

Anyone ever done any training or exercises comparing a semi auto and a pump?

Mabo
03-18-2010, 14:37
Semi-Auto:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pqtg81aRILM

Pump:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVoehY1ssyM

Same guy, just using different guns...

I think most people will be more accurate and have faster follow up shots with a semi-auto but I could be wrong.

David Armstrong
03-18-2010, 16:37
The folks at a very high level of training can often match or beat some of the autos out there for speed, but they are few and far between. Most of us simply cannot operate a slide as fast as the auto can cycle. For example, with my Beretta 1201 I can get 5 shots of 00Buck off in one second. I'm sure I could do the same with my 870 trigger-wise, but I cannot pump the slide that fast.

DustyJacket
03-18-2010, 18:25
Tim Bradley (check other videos, he shoots pistols, too)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8aKv3ztNzhY

stopatrain
03-18-2010, 18:25
Semi auto is best!

desertfox
03-20-2010, 00:57
semi auto.....it will have less felt recoil do to the operating system to let you back on sight faster. most shooters, unless you practice a LOT, do not start to work the action until they have start to recover from the recoil......this is why the semi auto shootguns in most peoples hands will be faster.

but with practice.............

mixflip
03-20-2010, 01:27
Did anyone notice that the pump action video shows the shooter not even aiming down the sights? He hit all 6 from the hip with a pump shotgun....Dang that boy can shoot!

shootingbuff
03-20-2010, 11:10
As you stated with a transition little if no time is lost. With and especially without a transition 2 things are important. First is recoil management. Second as DF stated when you start the pump stroke.

Let's take recoil management first. Bottom line is if you cannot control the SG it doesn't matter which action. Secondly if you waste time - you are wasting time.

With good recoil management a pump in a good shooters hands will beat a normal person with a SA.

A person can gain or lose time in transitions as well. Additionally basic gun handling skills plays a big part if one does not know how to load, select load their SA or any firearm.

A match or a real life oh poop situation more than not will NOT be just on the rpm rate of the SG. It is going to be more on the shooter as we keep coming back to. In other words if the shooter can the pump can or SA or double etc.

If one wants to disagree take a look at the better cowboy shooters and then ask your self if you can keep up with hits on target.

Now the question if a SA has advantages yes as it does shortcomings. I shoot both. Selecting which firearm is a personal choice based on many factors. As you well know fit is a big part of SGing. To many it is the feel and what they want in a firearm. So if you are happy with a pump use it and if you want to compete do so. If you feel you are disadvantaged shoot He-Man class(usually pump 12 bore and 8 rounds).

Take care and best in the responses.

sb

Glocker08
03-20-2010, 11:53
[quote=Mabo;14964907]Semi-Auto:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pqtg81aRILM

:wow: DAMN ! 12 shots in 1.44 seconds.That guy has got a quick trigger finger. It's almost like full auto.

aippi
03-20-2010, 12:12
I fire an 870 with the Mesa tactical stock w/Endine buffer faster then my 11-87 police.

NWanner
03-20-2010, 16:14
I can almost beat my buddy shooting 12 rounds out of my Saiga-12 with 7 rounds out of my Mossberg 835. We're talking about less than half a second. I also consider the Saiga one of the fastest shooting semi-autos. These are target loads so there's almost no felt recoil.

DonCT
03-21-2010, 05:28
To paraphrase Mas Ayoob's police shotgun book: YOU may shoot a pump faster than I shoot a semi. But you will not be able to shoot a pump faster than YOU can shoot a semi.

Z71bill
03-21-2010, 10:13
The obvious points then -

More people use a pump over a semi auto for HD because of lower cost & higher reliability. :shocked:


I bought my wife a semi auto 20 gauge - Escort from Academy $300 out the door - picture next to my 870 with 18.5 inch barrel for comparison.

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r128/z71bill/gun%20pics/P1000180.jpg

Purchased so my wife could shoot clays - but like all of the guns in my house - can be used in HD/SHTF situation.

I will most likely grab the 870 - let the wife have the 20 gauge -

But after shooting a few hundred rounds through the 20 gauge semi auto I really like it.

Maybe a Mossberg 930 is in my future.

shootingbuff
03-21-2010, 10:17
To paraphrase Mas Ayoob's police shotgun book: YOU may shoot a pump faster than I shoot a semi. But you will not be able to shoot a pump faster than YOU can shoot a semi.

Ah that is what I meant ;-)
I just go off yapping because most folks think a SG is easy to shoot well and a SA is the only SG to have. I do the same with those that think pump is the only way to go to though:supergrin:

shootingbuff
03-21-2010, 10:20
To paraphrase Mas Ayoob's police shotgun book: YOU may shoot a pump faster than I shoot a semi. But you will not be able to shoot a pump faster than YOU can shoot a semi.

I agree if the shooter has the manual of arms down equally and is equally proficient in the manual of arms.

I have seen some good pump guys go to a semi and are lost for a while or even the other way around. Nothing to do with their shooting but it plays into the overall outcome of running the gun. There are some that just don't wont to learn the other action as well.

Glocker08
03-21-2010, 10:36
I can almost beat my buddy shooting 12 rounds out of my Saiga-12 with 7 rounds out of my Mossberg 835. We're talking about less than half a second. I also consider the Saiga one of the fastest shooting semi-autos. These are target loads so there's almost no felt recoil.

Target loads out of an S-12 ? I've heard/read that they don't like lighter loads,even on the #2 setting. I guess you can't believe everything you hear/read,especially on the interwebs. Does it digest them ok ?

Sandman_NC
03-21-2010, 12:40
If you break in the S-12 with the higher velocity rounds, it will feed the value pack ammo just fine.... at least it does for me.:cool:

GreyEclipse
03-21-2010, 13:02
SA, of course. But pumps are more reliable they have the awesome factor.
Less expensive as well.

NWanner
03-21-2010, 13:17
Target loads out of an S-12 ? I've heard/read that they don't like lighter loads,even on the #2 setting. I guess you can't believe everything you hear/read,especially on the interwebs. Does it digest them ok ?

If you break in the S-12 with the higher velocity rounds, it will feed the value pack ammo just fine.... at least it does for me.:cool:

I never followed any break in and I'm pretty sure the first rounds used in it were target shells. My Saiga eats anything and everything on setting '1'. I must have just got the opposite of a "vodka special".

Z71bill
03-21-2010, 14:23
The storm is over - your home is still standing - power has been out for 2 days -

A small generator has provided you & your sexy smoking hot wife with a few simple pleasures - lights / cold drink / a small fan to keep you cool at night

But the distinctive sound from the engine has attracted 3 thugs - its dark outside but the moon gives off enough light so you can see they are packing pistols -

(I should write a novel) :upeyes:

Anyway

They start to kick & push the back door of your home -

Do you want a pump or a semi auto?:tongueout:

GreyEclipse
03-21-2010, 15:18
The storm is over - your home is still standing - power has been out for 2 days -

A small generator has provided you & your sexy smoking hot wife with a few simple pleasures - lights / cold drink / a small fan to keep you cool at night

But the distinctive sound from the engine has attracted 3 thugs - its dark outside but the moon gives off enough light so you can see they are packing pistols -

(I should write a novel) :upeyes:

Anyway

They start to kick & push the back door of your home -

Do you want a pump or a semi auto?:tongueout:

I want a gun, any working gun will do.
The racking of a pump would definitely scare them away but...
So would a 215 grain JHP flying through the door at slightly over 1000fps.:whistling:

David Armstrong
03-21-2010, 17:23
They start to kick & push the back door of your home -
Do you want a pump or a semi auto?
Either one will work just fine. Heck, I'd bet a nice single shot would solve the problem fairly well.:couch:

volsbear
03-21-2010, 20:41
Winchester SX3...

12 rounds, 1.442 seconds. I know that I can't pump that fast LOL...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCB7uEQ9W9A

A local gunshop took an SX3 and tacti-cooled it out.

Aceman
03-22-2010, 19:40
Semi - period.

Given the SAME amount of practice - the semi will always be faster. However, recoil recovery is the key thing. With LESS practice, I'll just be way further off target the faster I try to shoot the semi.

The pump has a built in recovery period. But in the end the semi will win every time.