How do you remove a live primer? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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GlockHead77
04-11-2010, 19:13
Hello Everyone,

Here's a question for you seasoned reloaders out there. How do you go about removing a live primer from an empty case? What method do you use to ignite the primer before punching it out? I recently started reloading and have had this happen a handful of times. What happens is that the primer won't seat completely (for whatever reason) leaving the primer high and most likely unchamberable, not to mention dangerous to continue the reloading process with.

Here are the details:

Ammo is 9mm Luger.
Primers are Federal Small Pistol.
Brass has been mixed but the two in the picture are Winchester.
The press is a Hornady LNL AP.

Thanks for the help.

dsmw5142
04-11-2010, 19:26
I have had a problem at times seating primers in Winchester brass myself. I always decap a live primer same way as a spent one. Just go slow and easy with the decapping pin. I have a lee turret, so I remove the tube at the bottom and hold my hand underneath to catch it. Most of the time I just re-use it without issue, unless it has been crushed sideways or something. I always wear safety glasses when reloading and hope you do too.

DEADLYACCURATE
04-11-2010, 19:30
I always decap a live primer same way as a spent one. Just go slow and easy with the decapping pin.

This.

Bren
04-11-2010, 19:31
Unless you use the nuclear primers, I wouldn't worry too much about it. I have just punched them back out in the sizer/deprimer, but more often I just throw the brass/primer in the trash.

Olivers_AR
04-11-2010, 19:34
You might want to caulk it up to experience and put them in the dud box or local ammo disposal method. For a few rounds its not worth it.

Suggest that some of your rounds maybe military crimped, which needs to be swagged in a different fashion. Check the rim of the primer hole and see if there are any extra metal shavings.

sdelam
04-11-2010, 19:58
I sometimes have priming issues with my LNL too. I find that its usally caused by me ridding the handle a bit to much on the return stroke witch prevents the shell plate from fully indexing. This causes the edge of the primer to catch on the edge of the primer pocket and causes just enough damage to the primer to not allow it to seat right.

I find if i "let it fly" a bit towards the end of the return stroke than i have fewer problems. Some brass and primer combos tend to be more forgiving than others. I have a issues with mil 223 and CCI primers even after i swage the pocket. On the other hand I picked up some PMC primers and they seem to fall in r-p brass. Good luck.

Oh and just punch them out like normal, theyre designed to go off by a hard stike to the other side.

MrVvrroomm
04-11-2010, 20:02
I'd just toss those two in the trash.

fredj338
04-11-2010, 23:36
Go slow & easy, no big deal.

Orlando Eric
04-11-2010, 23:41
I have read to deactivate a primer squirt some wd40 on it and wait. Personally I just decap them as usal.

Cobra64
04-12-2010, 02:40
Hello Everyone,

Here's a question for you seasoned reloaders out there. How do you go about removing a live primer from an empty case? What method do you use to ignite the primer before punching it out? I recently started reloading and have had this happen a handful of times. What happens is that the primer won't seat completely (for whatever reason) leaving the primer high and most likely unchamberable, not to mention dangerous to continue the reloading process with.

Here are the details:

Ammo is 9mm Luger.
Primers are Federal Small Pistol.
Brass has been mixed but the two in the picture are Winchester.
The press is a Hornady LNL AP.

Thanks for the help.

Winchester and S&B cases are the worst. :steamed: I separate those from all the rest of mixed headstamps and deal with them after I've popped a valium.

You can seat them with the LnL, just lean on the handle harder and smack 'em home.

Murphy's Law
04-12-2010, 09:08
Not worth screwing around for a few primers.....after all, you get 1K in a brick so loosing a few shouldn't make a big difference. Trash them (brass with primer) and continue loading the rest.

AltiDude
04-12-2010, 09:11
9mm brass is cheap. Chuck any questionable loads in the trash.

Bren
04-12-2010, 09:13
Winchester and S&B cases are the worst.

I agree about S&B - they go in the trash, but Winchester are my preferred cases and load really easy for me.

Colorado4Wheel
04-12-2010, 10:41
I would deprime them if possible. Only so I could find out what actually happened.

cyberiad
04-12-2010, 16:52
I find some cases stamped "WIN" can be difficult to prime in my 550. On the other hand most of them are very easy to work with.

jdavionic
04-12-2010, 17:03
I always decap a live primer same way as a spent one. Just go slow and easy with the decapping pin. I always wear safety glasses when reloading and hope you do too.

Same here. Never had one go bang.

GlockHead77
04-12-2010, 18:10
So I successfuly deprimed the two shells shown in the pictures like they were regular spent rounds and the only thing I had to do different was to loosen the shell plate on the LNL AP so that the high primer would fit under the plate. Otherwise the high primer kept me from being able to slide the case onto the shell plate all the way. I worked the lever slowly, bracing myself for a primer detonation, but neither one went off. I just heard the familiar plink of the primer poping out and falling down the tube.

Thanks again for the help. I think I made this harder than it needed to be.

dudel
04-12-2010, 18:58
All depends on if you want to reuse the primer or not. If it's all mashed up because you tried to seat in a crimped primer pocket then you won't want to reuse it. You can either deactivate it with a squirt of wd40, Kroil, etc, then push it out with the a decapper (you can use the sizing die in a pinch, I prefer a Universal Decapper (Lee makes one, as do others) because it does not contain the pressure should the primer go offf. Just go slow and easy, and keep your face away from the top of the press. The times I've had to do this I skipped the squirt of oil step (just depends how risk averse you are at the time).

If you plan to reuse the primer, then use the decapping die and go slow and easy. Avoid sharp movements. Light and steady presure until the primer eases out.

Get back and find out what the problem is. Save some spend primers and fiddle with the LNL until you can get them seated reliably. (See Jack, there is a use for spent primers!)

Good decision not to shoot the high primer rounds. Too easy to get a slam fire in that condition.

Bamamedic
04-12-2010, 19:52
Just deprime it as usual. If your concerned about it, you can place the cartidge in a vise and use a automatic center punch to set off the primer. Not a charged case of course.

frankmako
04-12-2010, 19:57
Unless you use the nuclear primers, I wouldn't worry too much about it. I have just punched them back out in the sizer/deprimer, but more often I just throw the brass/primer in the trash.

same here.

Taroman
04-12-2010, 20:10
I've even decapped upside down ones in the press without mishap.

FWIW, I just returned a bag of new Winchester 44 Special brass in which the cases were shorter than SAAMI spec and the case mouths were cut at a slight angle. I primed them before discovering the problem and some of the pockets were VERY tight, took both hands on the AutoPrime.

chris in va
04-12-2010, 20:48
Trash 'em. Can't reuse those primers anyway.

dudel
04-13-2010, 02:09
I've even decapped upside down ones in the press without mishap.

FWIW, I just returned a bag of new Winchester 44 Special brass in which the cases were shorter than SAAMI spec and the case mouths were cut at a slight angle. I primed them before discovering the problem and some of the pockets were VERY tight, took both hands on the AutoPrime.

That should have told you something right there.

jwsr
04-13-2010, 12:15
In my reloading for my .44 magnum since the early '90's I think I've had two live primers to remove. My reload bench is in my garage, fairly well insulated. I put shell in my redhawk and fire it; simple and not that loud, and then safe to de-prime.

VN350X10
04-13-2010, 20:25
by going slow & EZ, no problems.
A primer needs an impact to set it off.
As an experiment, put a primer in a vise, so that the jaws will flatten it in the same direction as the firing pin would hit it.
Going slowly, you can completely FLATTEN the primer & it won't detonate.
Once it's totally flat, use a small hammer & lightly tap one jaw of the vise.
The fully flattened primer will now detonate (safety glasses are suggested for this part of the demo).

Like I said, slowly crushing a primer won't set it off, it takes an impact.

I've been loading since 1973 & have not set off a primer in a loading press.
If something is taking more than the normal amount of pressure, STOP !! and see what the problem is.
Much safer that way.

uncle albert

FlyfishermanMike
04-14-2010, 16:38
Turn them into glue-stick ammo and fire away!

unclebob
04-14-2010, 17:51
by going slow & EZ, no problems.
A primer needs an impact to set it off.
As an experiment, put a primer in a vise, so that the jaws will flatten it in the same direction as the firing pin would hit it.
Going slowly, you can completely FLATTEN the primer & it won't detonate.
Once it's totally flat, use a small hammer & lightly tap one jaw of the vise.
The fully flattened primer will now detonate (safety glasses are suggested for this part of the demo).

Like I said, slowly crushing a primer won't set it off, it takes an impact.

I've been loading since 1973 & have not set off a primer in a loading press.
If something is taking more than the normal amount of pressure, STOP !! and see what the problem is.
Much safer that way.

uncle albert
I know an individual that has a large pistol primer permanently imbedded in his hand. He tried to push a live primer out with a punch in his had no sharp blows just steady pressure and it went off. Yes many of thousand of live primers have been deprimed. But can go off and they at times do.

VN350X10
04-14-2010, 17:55
I'll stick by my contention that SOMEHOW he hit it with some sort of impact.
Might not have been much, say bumping the punch with his other palm.
But rest assured, there WAS an impact.

uncle albert

unclebob
04-14-2010, 19:31
You can believe what ever you want to believe. That is your prerogative. He said he did not hit it. That he was pushing it out. And I even asked him if we sure that he did not hit it.

SFCSMITH(RET)
04-14-2010, 21:42
I know an individual that has a large pistol primer permanently imbedded in his hand. He tried to push a live primer out with a punch in his had no sharp blows just steady pressure and it went off. Yes many of thousand of live primers have been deprimed. But can go off and they at times do.

I have never, in 30 years of reloading, maybe 125k rounds, punched out a primer, live or dead, with a punch in my hand. Never even thought to try it. Never.

Just punch it out with the depriming die and move on. Done it quite a few times. if'n it's going to pop, it's just going to do it on the way to the spent primer can anyways.

unclebob
04-15-2010, 06:46
I have never, in 30 years of reloading, maybe 125k rounds, punched out a primer, live or dead, with a punch in my hand. Never even thought to try it. Never.

Just punch it out with the depriming die and move on. Done it quite a few times. if'n it's going to pop, it's just going to do it on the way to the spent primer can anyways.

Read # 2 post.
The person who did it is a commercial reloader, Deputy Sheriff, Sheriff Department Firearm Instructor,
Some times you just get complacent.

Nickotym
04-15-2010, 08:21
I usually put the primed case in a gun and shoot the primer. Then remove as usual. No worries about the primer going off while removing it.

G29Reload
04-15-2010, 08:24
I always decap a live primer same way as a spent one. Just go slow and easy with the decapping pin.

+1

If you're careful you can re-use it. If not, well theyre not THAT expensive. 5c down the drain.

SFCSMITH(RET)
04-15-2010, 08:30
Read # 2 post.
The person who did it is a commercial reloader, Deputy Sheriff, Sheriff Department Firearm Instructor,
Some times you just get complacent.

You said "punch in the hand", not "decapping die, and attempt to catch spent primer".


Don't know him, don't care if you say those are some kind of "qualifications" that make his method valid in some way. I could honestly throw out some job titles and "qualifications" that most would think out rank that by a long shot, but the only one I feel is relative to what was ASKED was that I had been doing it for a long time, and how I do it.

And since you didn't say WHOM the person was, and didn't discuss the primer in the hand until many posts later, hard for anyone to tell it's/not the same person.

And, in my world, you don't "just get complacent" with stuff that can kill you. And if you do, they got a website for that, called Darwin Awards. I worked in a field where people doing everything right, still got dead. Made it a point to not do crap that could harm me if avoidable. Just like a ND, his primer in hand event, didn't "just happen", however it went, he was at fault. period.

Gunnut 45/454
04-15-2010, 09:05
Just decap and reuse! I so glad to see there are many of you that can afford to through perfect good brass and primers away! Christ!:faint:

unclebob
04-15-2010, 15:51
You said "punch in the hand", not "decapping die, and attempt to catch spent primer".


Don't know him, don't care if you say those are some kind of "qualifications" that make his method valid in some way. I could honestly throw out some job titles and "qualifications" that most would think out rank that by a long shot, but the only one I feel is relative to what was ASKED was that I had been doing it for a long time, and how I do it.

And since you didn't say WHOM the person was, and didn't discuss the primer in the hand until many posts later, hard for anyone to tell it's/not the same person.

And, in my world, you don't "just get complacent" with stuff that can kill you. And if you do, they got a website for that, called Darwin Awards. I worked in a field where people doing everything right, still got dead. Made it a point to not do crap that could harm me if avoidable. Just like a ND, his primer in hand event, didn't "just happen", however it went, he was at fault. period.
I think you missed the whole point of what I was trying too say. First I was not trying too justify his qualifications. But too let you know he is a very qualified reloader. He tried to do a sort cut and it went wrong. Also too explain that you do not need too hit the primer from the other side too make it go off.
Yes I know quite well what mistakes people make can kill yourself and other people. I spent 25 and half years in the Air Force as a weapons mechanic and 21 years of that as a gunner on the AC130 gunship. Except for one time. I came closer too being killed by are own people many times, than by the Viet Cong and other conflicts that I fought in.

Glock21sf-miami
04-15-2010, 16:25
I had to ream the primer pockets of all my Winchester and S&B brass. I read somewhere that you should put the primed brass in the gun and just ignite it pulling the trigger. However, I do not want to unnecessarily fill the gun with dirt or having to clean it for a couple of cases so I generally just throw them out.

Remember, you only ream the primer pockets on the first reload and use them without problems for subsequent reloads. I load .45 mainly so I will probably get about 15 firings from each batch of brass.

GioaJack
04-15-2010, 16:31
You never have to worry about 'depriming a live flint'.

Jack

unclebob
04-15-2010, 16:40
You never have to worry about 'depriming a live flint'.

Jack
Welcome back. Hope you did not get sun burn or catch anything.:embarassed:

GioaJack
04-15-2010, 16:53
Welcome back. Hope you did not get sun burn or catch anything.:embarassed:


Hell, I'm still down in Phoenix, won't be home until Saturday night. Kinda nice wearing shorts and ignoring customers just so I can irritate everyone on the forum.

Never let it be said I have no goals in life. :supergrin:

Jack

Milltown
04-16-2010, 14:38
I have had a problem at times seating primers in Winchester brass myself. I always decap a live primer same way as a spent one. Just go slow and easy with the decapping pin. I have a lee turret, so I remove the tube at the bottom and hold my hand underneath to catch it. Most of the time I just re-use it without issue, unless it has been crushed sideways or something. I always wear safety glasses when reloading and hope you do too.

I remember reading Lee's book on reloading and it had a story about a guy depriming a live primer on his lap with hand press and ending up with it embedded into his leg.

Jager1
04-16-2010, 17:35
I always decap a live primer same way as a spent one. Just go slow and easy with the decapping pin.

This.

unclebob
04-16-2010, 17:40
Just deprime it as usual. If your concerned about it, you can place the cartidge in a vise and use a automatic center punch to set off the primer. Not a charged case of course.

Just curious have you actually done this?

dudel
04-17-2010, 05:35
I'll stick by my contention that SOMEHOW he hit it with some sort of impact.
Might not have been much, say bumping the punch with his other palm.
But rest assured, there WAS an impact.

uncle albert

I can see how it could happen with no "impact". All it takes is for the punch to hang up, say on the flash hole, then slip past to the primer.

There are several ways to safely decap a live primer, some safer than others.

Using a vise and a center punch, or holding the primed round in your hand and trying to push it out, don't qualify as safe in my book.

Sometimes you need to think before you ask someone to hold your beer and watch. :supergrin:

bulletguy
04-19-2010, 00:44
For the most part, I would bet those who have been loading for very long have all done this. Yet, it is something that every reloading equipment manufacturer has said not to do. Some relaoding manuals address the subject and they also tell you not to do this. I too have, on several occasions, deprimed cases with live primers in them, but I always take it slow and avoid any chance for a quick or hard contact against tlhe primer face. Never had a fire off,but I have a neighbor who has had two occasions when he tried to remove large magnum rifle primers and both times they went boom. Scared the crap out of him, but he was not hurt. If you are in doubt, give up reusing the primer and just spray a little WD40 or water in the case. Either one will "kill" the combustible agent in the primer and then deprime as usual.

unclebob
04-19-2010, 06:42
If you are in doubt, give up reusing the primer and just spray a little WD40 or water in the case. Either one will "kill" the combustible agent in the primer and then deprime as usual.

A couple of years ago I ran a test on WD40 and primers. It takes 2 two 3 days too deactivate a primer, once it dries out. It is live again.
Another person tried water, but I do not remember if it did anything or not

bulletguy
04-19-2010, 10:35
Well, "Uncle Bob," I sure wouldn't try to dispute you, but I have done this more than a few times over the past 15 years, and in many cases after blowing out the excess WD 40 or water with my air compressor I test fired the round . Never had a primer fire. Our experiences are different for some reason. Go figure! I plan to do it again real soon.

Oh, and a neighbor down the street who reloads and whom I shoot with has done the same thing. I don't know how many times.

unclebob
04-19-2010, 14:37
Well, "Uncle Bob," I sure wouldn't try to dispute you, but I have done this more than a few times over the past 15 years, and in many cases after blowing out the excess WD 40 or water with my air compressor I test fired the round . Never had a primer fire. Our experiences are different for some reason. Go figure! I plan to do it again real soon.

Oh, and a neighbor down the street who reloads and whom I shoot with has done the same thing. I don't know how many times.

What I did was put 10 primers in a dish and covered them with WD40. Waited 30 minutes primed one in a case and fired it. Did the same 1 hour, 6 hours and 12 hours, and all fired. Next day tried one it fired but weaker. Next day did not fire. I was using some Remington small pistol primers that I have had for about 30 years.