2nd time out with the g-20 a little better. [Archive] - Glock Talk

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527varmint
05-16-2010, 17:52
Today I took the g-20 to the indoor range. They had some reloads 180 gr FMJ 20.99 for 50. I fired 100 reloads and then 25 rounds of the DT 200gr wfngc.

I was doing really bad the first 25. After that I started shooting about 4" groups at 25 feet. Its obviously me. I could put a few close together but I had nothing consistent. On the last 50 rounds I was shooting 3-4 inch groups pretty consistent. What helped was follow thru. I tried to keep my eye on the target during and after the shot. A firmer grip also helped so the gun was recoiling back into my hand and not flipping up.

Then I switched to the double tap. Their accuracy was about the same. They seemed to shoot low and left after a shot or two but I decided that just before the gun fired I was tilting it down in anticipation of recoil. Follow thru made even more difference with the hot loads and I had to focus on it real hard. By the last five rounds I shot em off fast as I could re-aquire the target and hit all 5 within a 4 inch group. Holding on tight and having the gun recoil back made an even bigger difference with the double tap but also increased felt recoil alot.

If your holding on tight enough to hit the targets then it is just enough recoil to cause a slight tingling from the grips texture hitting the hand.Not unpleasant at all but i'm sure glad I didn't buy a 44mag for my first hand gun! I would definently flinch and not hit anything with the 44mag.

One thing I don't like is how my sweaty hand feels on the grip and the texture on the back of the grip.

The meprolight sights are ok but I feel like I could benefit from a larger dots.

For what its worth I have very little pistol experience. I have shot my friends 9mm xd i think it was the fullsize one. It had 3 dot sights and I did much better. I was hitting 3-4" groups at 50 feet.

I'm going to get the LW 40 conversion barrel this week. 10mm ammo is expensive and I think the lower recoil will help me. I wish the advantage arms kits where in stock. I obviously need to fire many thousands of rounds its going to cost a fortune till I reload.

_The_Shadow
05-16-2010, 22:25
One Word...Handloading! Seriously if your a gun enthussast, you should roll your own especially for 10mm. The disipline of handloading can help with better shooting...not saving money, but being able to shoot more more often!

The 40S&W conversion will also help with cost as well, by using the same sight picture and feel appeal from the same gun! I use the 40 conversions in my G-29 (Storm Lake) and (Bar-Sto) in my S&W1006.

Good luck and best regards!

VN350X10
05-16-2010, 22:40
If you bought the G20 as your first handgun......shame on the salesman !
As a N.R.A. pistol & rifle instructor, AND working in a gunshop, I stress to new shooters to buy a QUALITY .22 rimfire handgun as their 1st pistol.
several reasons;
1) Ammo cost.....nothing cheaper to learn with
2) Less recoil, goes w/#3
3) Less noise. This leads to less distraction & less chance of flinching.
4) All of the basics of sight picture, trigger squeze & follow-thru are the same.
5) You'll never outgrow the pistol. EVERYBODY that I know that shoots any kind of competition has at least 1 high quality .22 pistol. There are times you get tired of chasing brass !
My first centerfire pistol was a Ruger Super Blackhawk, yeah, a .44 Mag. BUT I had been shooting a .22 revolver for more than 13 years befor getting the .44. All the same, just bigger "BANG" & easier to see holes in the targets.

Get the Advantage Arms kit ASAP, or better yet, buy a Ruger MKIII Tgt. or a S&W 22A.
These are the 2 pistols I recomend most & buy one based on how well it fits your hand.
There are other pistols that are good, but over the years these 2 seem to be the best value for the $$$ spent.
My oldest Ruger is a MK I Tgt. with over HALF A MILLION rounds thru it !
I figure I'm going to need grandchildren to wear it out !

shoot safe,

uncle albert

527varmint
05-17-2010, 23:05
If you bought the G20 as your first handgun......shame on the salesman !
As a N.R.A. pistol & rifle instructor, AND working in a gunshop, I stress to new shooters to buy a QUALITY .22 rimfire handgun as their 1st pistol.
several reasons;
1) Ammo cost.....nothing cheaper to learn with
2) Less recoil, goes w/#3
3) Less noise. This leads to less distraction & less chance of flinching.
4) All of the basics of sight picture, trigger squeze & follow-thru are the same.
5) You'll never outgrow the pistol. EVERYBODY that I know that shoots any kind of competition has at least 1 high quality .22 pistol. There are times you get tired of chasing brass !
My first centerfire pistol was a Ruger Super Blackhawk, yeah, a .44 Mag. BUT I had been shooting a .22 revolver for more than 13 years befor getting the .44. All the same, just bigger "BANG" & easier to see holes in the targets.

Get the Advantage Arms kit ASAP, or better yet, buy a Ruger MKIII Tgt. or a S&W 22A.
These are the 2 pistols I recomend most & buy one based on how well it fits your hand.
There are other pistols that are good, but over the years these 2 seem to be the best value for the $$$ spent.
My oldest Ruger is a MK I Tgt. with over HALF A MILLION rounds thru it !
I figure I'm going to need grandchildren to wear it out !

shoot safe,

uncle albert

I got a g-20 for my first gun for two reason. One is I need a lightweight gun for woods carry NOW. My beagle got mauled by a cougar this year while rabbit hunting. I have had encounters with bears, cougars, and coyote more then once. The g-20 can shoot 40 s&w and 22lr. I just ordered the 40 barrel. I would get the AA kit now but no one has them in stock and I'm not waiting 6 months.

I plan to eventualy get a browning buckmark or ruger pistol.

I was thinking just for some more fun at the range I could break out my old colt frontier pistol. It was grandads I never shoot it but it would be cool to pop off some 22lr for practice while at the range.

I will certainly reload I just need to get a house so I have a spot to work. I don't really think i'll save much money but I'm a junkie for accuracy with rifles and hand rolled is the only way to get 10mm hot loads.

VN350X10
05-18-2010, 15:43
I can understand the "why" but it's still gonna be a steep learning curve. As much as I love the 10MM (got 7 or 8 of them) unless someone is a serious handgun shooter, I recomend another calilber, usually a .45 ACP if they really want a big bore pistol.

uncle albert

527varmint
05-18-2010, 19:01
I can understand the "why" but it's still gonna be a steep learning curve. As much as I love the 10MM (got 7 or 8 of them) unless someone is a serious handgun shooter, I recomend another calilber, usually a .45 ACP if they really want a big bore pistol.

uncle albert

45 acp is just going to anger a large predator! I'm really not into handguns i'm addicted to shotguns and rifles. If the gun cannot stop a mtn lion or black bear with 1 or 2 shots its of no use to me. The 45 acp doesn't have enough penetration power not even close. All reports I found of 45 acp and bear it took 6 or more shots at close range. In a bear or cougar attack the majority of victims never have time to fire more then 1 or 2 shots , if at all.


I see no reason i can't master the gentle recoil of the g-20. Its got to be the lightest recoiling gun that can kill a bear and is light enough to pack all day. The only other choices are .41 mag revolvers and larger. If it weighs as much as the glock any of those are going to kick much harder. The other glocks are too small for my hands infact the g-20 grip could be even slightly bigger for me. Should be just right with my hunting gloves on though. The shot is probably going to be from 1 inch to 25 feet max distance. I think I'll hit it!

VN350X10
05-18-2010, 19:14
Won't go into the number of 1 shot kills recorded on wild hogs w/a .45.....and they're a lot tougher than a cougar, as far as requiring penetration.
As far as the 10MM, what is the % of chance that you'll encounter a bear ?
The old Norma 200 gr might be the ticket, as they didn't expand, they penetrated. Even a 200 gr XTP will expand a bit, might want to look into fmj for reloading.
Any 10MM load will penetrate enough on a cat; Ted Nugent has taken wart hog in Africa with the Cor-Bon load with 135 gr. Nuge is a BIG fan of the 10MM & he carries a G20.

uncle albert

527varmint
05-19-2010, 00:04
I think my chance of bear encounter is good because I call predators in bear country ontop of all the fishing and camping. I encounter bears atleast once a year before i started calling predators and walking through berry patches with my dog where bears love to loaf around and eat.

MinervaDoe
05-19-2010, 18:52
I plan to eventualy get a browning buckmark or ruger pistol.

I was thinking just for some more fun at the range I could break out my old colt frontier pistol. It was grandads I never shoot it but it would be cool to pop off some 22lr for practice while at the range.
There you go. Take the .22 to the range along with the 10mm. When you fire the .22, you will see if you are flinching from the 10mm.
Intersperse them and use the .22 to cure the flinch from the bigger gun. This is pretty much standard operating procedure any time a gun has potential to make you flinch.

I will certainly reload I just need to get a house so I have a spot to work. I don't really think i'll save much money but I'm a junkie for accuracy with rifles and hand rolled is the only way to get 10mm hot loads.
With my 10mm, I started at the other end of the spectrum. I am only shooting 180 grain and 165 grain bullets at about 1020 fps. The gun is amazingly controllable with those loads. It is also unbelievably accurate.

Shooting the bigger pistols is kind of a paradox because you have to be "tough" enough to be relaxed when the gun kicks. At the same time, you can't be so relaxed that you "limp wrist" it.

As for all of the other symptoms that you described, this type of chart can be a very good guide. I've been using it for thirty years and it is very revealing every time I go back to it.
http://www.ashcavai.com/mnsl/target_analysis_guide01.03a.pdf

527varmint
05-19-2010, 20:36
That is a cool chart!

MinervaDoe
05-19-2010, 21:10
Yeah, sometimes the problems I have change from week to week. It's nice to look at the chart and pick out one problem to work on.

If you start to reload, I think you'll find some of the slower loads are very accurate. I've been loading up a light bullet and a slower load in my 10mm. Meanwhile, in my 9mm, I've been loading my rounds up hot. So, my 9mm is actually kicking more than my 10mm right now.

It's do-able to start out with a 10mm. But it's a good thing you have a .22. You're just going to have to get scientific about this.

527varmint
05-20-2010, 07:48
I found a .22lr conversion in stock! Its on the way! I'll get a set of meprolights on it too!

I do plan to reload and have some gentle practice loads and some hot loads too. I believe the loads I purchased at the range are just a tiny bit more power then 40 s&w. The double tap was a way bigger boom then the reloads from the range.

MinervaDoe
05-20-2010, 09:19
I found a .22lr conversion in stock!
Uh oh. Now I've got to play catch up.
Some people find it a huge help to have the same form factor in their .22 pistol as their duty pistol.

Where did you find the advantage arms .22 conversion kit?

527varmint
05-21-2010, 07:59
Gunbroker

There are a few of them on there. Some are over priced. I paid 265 plus 20 bucks shipping for the kit with all the cleaning stuff and that seems fair to me. Some are asking 300 without shipping. I'm pretty dang excited about it! Now with the 40 barrel and the conversion i'm all set. I have to send in the .22 kit for the meprolight sights its like 70 more dollars and 2 weeks of shipping it back and fourth so I still have probably 3 weeks to a month of waiting before I'm ready to shoot it. One this I like is don't have to stockpile a ton of ammo. I will just buy like 250 rounds of double tap for the woods. I can get .22lr and 40 sw for a decent price anywhere I go. won't be long now till I can't mail order ammo in CA so it will not be possible to get hot 10mm loads.

MinervaDoe
05-21-2010, 08:46
won't be long now till I can't mail order ammo in CA so it will not be possible to get hot 10mm loads.
More inncetive to reload. I believe that you will still be able to get components by mail order.

Still, if I ever get an opportunity to screw the Governator over, there will be NO hesitation.