FTF using RWS Ammo. [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Glockfan1977
07-27-2010, 18:54
Hey everyone. A couple of months ago I was shooting my G19 using RWS 124 grain FMJs. Well about midway into the box I had 2 FTFs not in sequential order. I had one in one mag, the next in another mag. I reloaded the dimpled rounds back into the mag and they both fired. This was the first time I shot this ammo.
Does anyone have any input as to why my G19 had 2 FTFs. Keep in mind this is a second gen G19, has had approximately 10,000 - 20,000 rounds through it never a problem up until now.
I look forward to hear what you guys have to say.

DannyR
07-27-2010, 19:28
I suspect you experienced an ammo problem and not a pistol problem.

unit1069
07-27-2010, 20:50
I've never shot any (thought the price of a box was way too much) but I think it's Swiss-made ammo.

I've never had any problems with European ammo but I understand some manufacturers there use primers that need a good whack to fire the round. I've shot Sellier & Bellot without any incidents but I've read more than a couple of posts by folks who describe the same problem you had when shooting S&B.

newmexican
07-27-2010, 21:24
That RWS stuff is strange. I saw it at my local bg 5 for about 23.00 a box...So I passed on it. Later that same day, I saw it at Wal-Mart for 12.00 a box so I picked up 7 or 8 boxes of the stuff.

IT worked great for me out in the desert, shooting up old TVs etc, etc out of my g17 rtf2, no a single ftl or ftf.

It got wierd for me when I went to my local indoor range, I was shooting the RWS stuff off and it was sparking everywhere, the employee came out and told me I was tall and I was actually hitting the ground which was causing the sparking.....I figured that was BS.

anyways, the planwas to put about 6-700 rounds through the gun before using it as my everyday gun, so I switched from the RWS to S&b, blazers, WWBs, Lawman, and a box of Magtech. (BTW, not a single ftf or ftl).

NONE of the other ammo caused the sparking that the RWS did. I even ran some HPs through the gun to see if it prefered one over the other and no sparking.

so: to break the gun in I put the following through it.

-lawman
-s&b
-magtech
-RWS
-blazer
-WWB

and for HP

-ranger +p+
-golden sabers
-a few buffalo bore +p
-critical defense.

I guess my point is that the RWS was odd and sparked off the cement at the indoor range while nothing else did.

Glocks&Ducs
07-27-2010, 21:32
...

I guess my point is that the RWS was odd and sparked off the cement at the indoor range while nothing else did.

I don't see why that is a big deal. The employee is correct in his explanation. Most people actually hit the ground depending on the distance they are shooting at. The only reason you could see sparks is probably because RWS uses a different metal jacket than the other brands.

3rdgen40
07-27-2010, 22:10
I suspect you experienced an ammo problem and not a pistol problem.
Really ? Even though he was using RWS 124gr., not the standard WWB 115gr. ? Isn't RWS 124gr loaded to SAMMI specs' ?

GAFinch
07-27-2010, 22:14
I've been shooting RWS lately since Walmart discounted the price. Not a single problem in my CZ. Shoots just as well as WWB.

Glocks&Ducs
07-27-2010, 22:16
Really ? Even though he was using RWS 124gr., not the standard WWB 115gr. ? Isn't RWS 124gr loaded to SAMMI specs' ?

That doesn't mean that the ammo didn't have hard primers, or that the primers were all seated properly.

mboylan
07-28-2010, 00:59
The ammo may have harder primers and you may have a weakened striker spring. The primer may have gotten contaminated.

glock031
07-28-2010, 02:16
I've shot about 1500 rounds of RWS lately. All good. WWB doesn't even compare to the quality of RWS ammo IMO.

CBennett
07-28-2010, 06:29
Shoots great in my Ruger SR9c got about 200 rounds of that through it without a hitch..I would say that its quite a stout round and has a lot more recoil than say Remington UMC or Federal...it gotta be near NATO or P+ rounds power wise...felt a lot like shooting a P+ self defense round.

samuse
07-28-2010, 09:16
If you can't estimate your round count closer than the nearest 10,000, I'd respring the gun every now and then.

Funny how everyone blames ammo for their malfunctions. :upeyes: Every other thread says WWB is too weak, dirty, out of spec, etc.

Now this wierd Swiss match ammo stuff is "just as good as WWB":rofl:

american lockpicker
07-28-2010, 10:04
RWS has worked flawlessly in my Glock 17.

G19Pistolero
07-28-2010, 10:34
I have about 500 rds of RWS on my Glock 19 and about the same on my Beretta M9 with no issues...

-J.-

fuzzy03cls
07-28-2010, 11:16
I tried 9mm when it 1st hit the shelves at walmart. Many rounds on my g17 never a jam until this ammo. Lasted 2 mags. About half of each mag had FTF's. I left the rest of the ammo at the range. I won't use it.

samuse
07-28-2010, 12:58
I have some RWS 9mm on my shelf right now. I've never tried it in a Glock, only my Hi-Power.

Nuthin' puts an ass whoopin' on a hard primer like a 32lb mainspring:rofl:

Q400
07-28-2010, 13:15
RWS ammo is steel jacketed,which when it hits the concrete floor, it will cause sparks.Assuming the floor is concrete.

cmcinc
07-28-2010, 13:28
I have shot a few hundred rounds of it the last few months and had no problems with it.

KG21
07-28-2010, 14:06
This ammo is now outlawed at my indoor range. It was sparking all over the place as well. The RO put a magnet on the rounds, they all stuck. This ammo is most likely steel core. FWIW Just my .02.

Q400
07-28-2010, 14:50
Steel jacket. I pulled one apart and it looks like the core is lead, soft material scratches with a pick.

Don Glock
07-28-2010, 15:21
it's either hard primers, or a weak striker spring. never tried RWS myself though.

Don Glock
07-28-2010, 15:22
RWS ammo is steel jacketed,which when it hits the concrete floor, it will cause sparks.Assuming the floor is concrete.

all ammo causes sparks when it hits the concrete floor at the range. i know because i often take dates there, only use federal champion/WWB, and they always shoot the floor and ceiling :rofl:

Q400
07-28-2010, 18:17
Here is an interesting read on sparking bullets. Go down to Generic Bad Movie Physics,it will answer some questions as to why jacketed and plated lead bullets may cause sparks on concrete

http://www.intuitor.com/moviephysics/mpmain.html

Merkavaboy
07-28-2010, 19:07
This ammo is now outlawed at my indoor range. It was sparking all over the place as well. The RO put a magnet on the rounds, they all stuck. This ammo is most likely steel core. FWIW Just my .02.

If it was steel cored then it would be considered AP, thus, it would have never been imported into the U.S. for retail sales. The new RWS and Geco 9mm uses a lead core gilding metal mild steel jacketed bullets.

The older Sellier & Bellot 9mm with the silver jacketed bullets are cupro-nickel steel jacketed.

Don Glock
07-28-2010, 19:37
If it was steel cored then it would be considered AP, thus, it would have never been imported into the U.S. for retail sales. The new RWS and Geco 9mm uses a lead core gilding metal mild steel jacketed bullets.

The older Sellier & Bellot 9mm with the silver jacketed bullets are cupro-nickel steel jacketed.


what about wolf? there's steel in the core & jacket, i believe.

Merkavaboy
07-28-2010, 22:53
what about wolf? there's steel in the core & jacket, i believe.

99% of the WOLF 9mm imported from Russia (made by Tula Cartridge Works and Ulyanovsk) also use a gilding metal steel jacketed bullet. Though, I do have one sample round with the Polyformance coating on the steel case that does have a standard copper non-steel jacketed bullet.

Russian 9mm loads, by all manufacturers, are well known for using mild steel for the bullet jackets.

Glockfan1977
07-30-2010, 19:03
I found some Federal 115 grain FMJ RN at Wal-Mart for around $9.50 a box. I couldn't pass them up and bought 300 rounds. I think I am going to use these from now on.

glock031
07-30-2010, 21:03
I found some Federal 115 grain FMJ RN at Wal-Mart for around $9.50 a box. I couldn't pass them up and bought 300 rounds. I think I am going to use these from now on.
If you have any FTFire at all with this ammo then i would check the striker and check/clean the striker channel and maybe look into buying a new striker spring iF need be......

abq87120
07-31-2010, 20:58
My shooting instructor says several of the foreign manufacturers are being sued for kabooms - poor quality control. I'm sticking with domestic ammo. Not that much difference in price.

jwhited
02-04-2011, 19:09
Hey there, fellas. Sorry to revive an old thread, but I had to chime in on this one. A few months ago, I ran a couple of boxes of RWS through my G17, and experienced SEVEN FTFs! Since then, I've traded the G17 for a G23, but needless to say, I haven't bothered with RWS since! WWB is now my plinking ammo of choice.

ElrodCod
02-05-2011, 06:56
I don't see why that is a big deal. The employee is correct in his explanation. Most people actually hit the ground depending on the distance they are shooting at. The only reason you could see sparks is probably because RWS uses a different metal jacket than the other brands.

It's a steel jacket. I checked with a magnet.

Chogun
05-23-2011, 20:25
I have a g27 and I use RWS. I have one ftf every box of 50. Only ammo that dos this. Hickcok45 had ftf in his Colt vs Smith & Wesson video using RWS.

4 glocks
05-24-2011, 12:42
There are a few vid about RWS ammo it has some matalic properties to it. TNoutdoors9 did one a few years ago. I have not shot it much but do have 600-700 rounds I have picked up over time. If several people are having FTF with this ammo only it must be hard primed. as I shoot mine and have any FTF it will be range use only but it's range use only anyway.

HotRoderX
05-24-2011, 12:51
I used RWS when it was avalible at walmart loved the stuff never had a issue with it either. I now use Geco which I been told is the same people who made RWS. Dont know if thats true but the stuff works just as good as RWS.

Chogun
05-24-2011, 21:22
I only use RWS at the range $11 for 9mm and $14.50 in 40s&w.

samuse
05-24-2011, 22:16
I think you can buy a stiffer striker spring for a Glock to make it hit the primer harder.

May be worthwhile if you want to shoot a bunch of this stuff.

I've been thinking about that stiffer spring for my carry guns.

mastrbloata
05-25-2011, 05:00
Well, I don't have a second gen 19 but I have a 3rd gen 19 and I had a FTF a couple of weeks back out of a box of that stuff I'd gotten what, a year and a half ago when it was all there was at Wal Mart? I'm willing to bet it's the ammo because I've also had that happen once or twice with my 17 using it as well back when I first got some in 2009. I've never had any FTF's with either the gen 2 -17 or the gen 3 -19 except using that ammo.

DEADEYEGUY
05-25-2011, 10:19
A long time ago I was talking to someone at SIG about hammer srings. I asked them why they used such heavy hammer springs. He told me that some of the European ammo had very hard primers. They wanted to make sure the guns with set the ammo off regardless of the primers being hard. Probably what you are experiencing. Mines chocked twice on Wally World WWB. I think it was just underpowered rounds.

Chogun
05-25-2011, 21:58
I think you can buy a stiffer striker spring for a Glock to make it hit the primer harder.

May be worthwhile if you want to shoot a bunch of this stuff.

I've been thinking about that stiffer spring for my carry guns.
Good I'm going to do that!

vafish
05-26-2011, 03:26
When was the last time you detail stripped and cleaned the gun real well?

10-20k rounds could be weak striker spring or funk in the firing pin channel.

Chogun
06-14-2011, 21:12
Ok got the new 6.0 lbs firing striker spring. I compperd the fired casings and ther is a diference in the primer. It is getting hit harder and Still hade one FTF in the box of 50!

american lockpicker
06-14-2011, 21:14
RWS 9mm is Swiss made it doesn't have problems. It must be your gun.

DEADEYEGUY
06-14-2011, 23:28
The bullet is steel cored with a copper jacket. It's usually good ammo. In theory they say the barrel never comes into contact with the steel. Just the copper. Steel is supposed to be mild. I've shot over a thousand round of it through my 9mm's. Got a couple of rounds that required two hits to ignite them so you do get an occasional hard primer. As a whole I had no problems with it. With the steel core I wonder if it can pierce body armor? Allot of the old Chinese 7.62x39mm had steel cores and would go through vests, walls, cars, people whatever. Although I know we are talking apples and oranges rifle ammo vs. pistol ammo

Merkavaboy
06-15-2011, 06:35
The bullet is steel cored with a copper jacket. It's usually good ammo. In theory they say the barrel never comes into contact with the steel. Just the copper. Steel is supposed to be mild. I've shot over a thousand round of it through my 9mm's. Got a couple of rounds that required two hits to ignite them so you do get an occasional hard primer. As a whole I had no problems with it. With the steel core I wonder if it can pierce body armor? Allot of the old Chinese 7.62x39mm had steel cores and would go through vests, walls, cars, people whatever. Although I know we are talking apples and oranges rifle ammo vs. pistol ammo

RUAG Ammotec makes the current RWS, Geco and DAG 9x19mm ammo, and these rounds DO NOT have steel cores, nor are they considered Armor Piercing. These rounds use a mild steel bullet jacket over a standard lead core.

banger
06-15-2011, 08:29
My shooting instructor says several of the foreign manufacturers are being sued for kabooms - poor quality control. I'm sticking with domestic ammo. Not that much difference in price.


Do you think you can get him to narrow that down a little...

Ammo is made virtually everywhere from Albania to Zimbabwe.

In many cases in multiple factories in the same country.

Particularly in 9mm.

Chogun
06-15-2011, 15:42
RWS 9mm is Swiss made it doesn't have problems. It must be your gun.
I have a glock 27. I get one FTF every box of 50 using 40S&W. I installed 6lbs firing spring and still get FTF. Used 9mm RWS and it works with no FTF. Used 357sig reloads and no FTF. It's not my gun.

chasbo00
06-15-2011, 19:49
RUAG Ammotec makes the current RWS, Geco and DAG 9x19mm ammo, and these rounds DO NOT have steel cores, nor are they considered Armor Piercing. These rounds use a mild steel bullet jacket over a standard lead core.

You got it right! The mild steel bullet jacket is copper plated and the cartridge looks like it has a standard FMJ bullet. Because the bullet is magnetic, some think this means it has a steel core - not so.