Is It Wrong To Not Have A 7.62 AK? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Restless28
08-10-2010, 18:13
After much debate on a $1000 budget, I'm going with an AK instead of an AR. A local shop has the Arsenals in stock.

Since I was looking at 5.56 AR's, what are the general thoughts on AK's in other than 7.62?

Glockdude1
08-10-2010, 18:20
A AK in 5.45x39 is nice.

Very light recoil, accurate, price of ammo is not bad at all.

:cool:

Juice5610
08-10-2010, 19:05
A AK in 5.45x39 is nice.

Very light recoil, accurate, price of ammo is not bad at all.

:cool:

+1 My next AK will be in 545

CTfam
08-10-2010, 20:07
Well I CAN'T have one in 7.62 and yes I think that's wrong. I am eyeballing a 5.45 hard right now. If I go with a "gopher round" I'd rather have the Russian one. 7N6 is a steal right now!

Navitimer
08-10-2010, 20:34
Don't get me wrong - Arsenals are great AKs; however you can save yourself a LOT of money by buying a stock Russian Saiga for around $350 or so (in any caliber you choose - 7.62x39, 7.63x51 (i.e., .308), 5.56 or 5.45) and do the conversion yourself. It's amazingly easy to do, and you'll end up with a Russian-made AK finished just the way you like it. You can pick the stock, rail, grips, etc., any way you like it. You can have a very nice AK for around $500 to $550, depending on how you want to dress it up. Hope this helps -

Navitimer
08-10-2010, 20:36
I failed to mention there is some great "how-to" guides on the web about converting Saigas. You may want to start with the Saiga 12 forum. There's a lot of great folks on that forum who are very helpful. But trust me when I say it's easier to do than you may expect. Please let us know what you decide, and be sure to post some pics!

CTfam
08-11-2010, 15:45
^+1 to that. Isn't an Arsenal a converted Saiga dressed up all pretty? I've seen some of these well known AK builders selling AKs for $1,200 which is down right offensive. Give me 2 converted Saigas and a case of ammo for that kind of scratch.

Aceman
08-11-2010, 17:19
Don't know if Restless wants to go the conversion route - but I can't argue there.

And yes I DO think it is wrong to not own a 7.62 AK - however, if you are running lean, as in only one rifle, you need to make the call on SHTF ammo for yourself.

And 5.45, while cheap, does have an availability issue. However, an S&W M&P15 in 5.45 isn't too expensive, and you can get a 5.56 when you want/can afford.

chuck pullen
08-11-2010, 17:44
Restless-Are the Arsenals at Larry's ? What's the price ? Thanks

Restless28
08-11-2010, 17:50
Restless-Are the Arsenals at Larry's ? What's the price ? Thanks

Won't know til' tomorrow afternoon. I want to go in with an open mind, and if I can't decide, I won't buy. I'll let you know, ok?

CTfam
08-11-2010, 18:28
I do have a very nice .223 AK for sale here... :cool:

Glocker08
08-11-2010, 19:08
After much debate on a $1000 budget, I'm going with an AK instead of an AR. A local shop has the Arsenals in stock.

Since I was looking at 5.56 AR's, what are the general thoughts on AK's in other than 7.62?

Why don't you want one in 7.62 ?

I would go with 5.45 over 5.56. I have no desire to own a 5.56 AK. My next one will more than likely be in 5.45.

Glocker08
08-11-2010, 19:15
Well I CAN'T have one in 7.62 and yes I think that's wrong. I am eyeballing a 5.45 hard right now. If I go with a "gopher round" I'd rather have the Russian one. 7N6 is a steal right now!

What ?! :upeyes: Why not ? :headscratch:

CnRnut
08-11-2010, 19:44
What ?! :upeyes: Why not ? :headscratch:


CT has a ban on 7.62 AK types.

toshbar
08-11-2010, 22:11
I love my 5.45 saiga. It produces 14" groups at 500 yards.:embarassed:

Novocaine
08-12-2010, 02:16
The only reason I don't have 5.45 AK is because when CA ban was enacted 5.45 was just starting to trickle into the US. No spare mags or even ammo was available. SAR was pretty much the only game in town.

TheGrimReaper
08-12-2010, 08:46
Chuck Pullen- Yes, Larry's carries Arsenal Ak's. I saw a couple of SLR-107CR's in there the other day.

Restless28
08-12-2010, 08:51
Chuck Pullen- Yes, Larry's carries Arsenal Ak's. I saw a couple of SLR-107CR's in there the other day.

You don't recall pricing, do you??? :wavey:

CBennett
08-12-2010, 15:30
After much debate on a $1000 budget, I'm going with an AK instead of an AR. A local shop has the Arsenals in stock.

Since I was looking at 5.56 AR's, what are the general thoughts on AK's in other than 7.62?

I had that decision and actually decided on the 5.45 AK74 INSTEAD of the AK47..I just like the added accuracy and light shooting(less recoil...not so important to me honestly but my kid also likes to shoot and is recoil shy) so I could have gotten the 47 or the 74 both were only $20-30 difference in price...but I went with the 74...unless the ammo absolutely dries up or it actually gets MORE expensive than 7.62X39 I wont probably ever have a 47

CTfam
08-12-2010, 16:30
I love my 5.45 saiga. It produces 14" groups at 500 yards.:embarassed:

I saw those pics... Very impressive. I wonder if that bullet would just bounce off a person at that range. :dunno:

I'm currently reading up on 5.45x39mm.

What have you guys shot with it??? I mean hard objects, phone books, animals, etc. Any ballistic tesing links around? THANKS!

PlasticGuy
08-12-2010, 20:26
My preference is for 7.62x39 caliber AK's. They are reliable and durable, and magazines are cheap and high quality. I like the extra power and longer barrel life. All of my personal AK's are 7.62 caliber, though my wife's preference is for her 5.56 caliber Arsenal.

The 5.45 has the advantage of lighter and cheaper ammo, lighter recoil, and magazines that are a bit harder to find and more expensive, but still not bad. Being able to have 5000+ rounds in sealed cans shipped to your door for less than $1000 is a huge tactical advantage.

The 5.56 is an excellent choice for the AK platform, with light recoil and ammo that can be found in any sporting goods store in the nation. The magazines are the sole weak point. The black waffle pattern Bulgarian "Circle 10" mags are excellent and not overly expensive. Everything else is either hard to find, or lower quality. My solution for my wife's AK was to buy a big box full of Circle 10 mags for her Arsenal 106. Magazines being hard to find is only a problem if you don't already have enough. :supergrin:

toshbar
08-12-2010, 20:53
I saw those pics... Very impressive. I wonder if that bullet would just bounce off a person at that range. :dunno:

I'm currently reading up on 5.45x39mm.

What have you guys shot with it??? I mean hard objects, phone books, animals, etc. Any ballistic tesing links around? THANKS!
I've shot mine through about 20" of paper at point blank straight down. It tumbled twice and then came out sideways out of the side of the stack and went into the ground never to be recovered. .223 disintegrated and stopped about 12 inches in. 7.62x39 did half a tumble and stopped right at the bottom of the stack. recovered bullet was in the shape of a banana. I'd like to nail a racoon or opossum with my 5.45 at about 300 yards just to see what happens. not likely as they only come out at night. maybe a watermelon or 5 gallon bucket of water.:dunno:

Duct Tape
08-12-2010, 22:22
Yes, it is very wrong to not have an AKM-clone in 7.62. However, 5.54 is a lot of fun and a little bit cheaper if ya don't mind cleaning with water first then regular cleaning afterward. Yet, I gots me a ton of Yugo .30 cal (7.62) that is corrosive too.

I actually like the 5.45 (AK74) better for fun shooting--albeit not by much.

this guy likes 5.45 so much that... http://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=56057&start=0

He shot a deer with surplus.

Duct Tape
08-12-2010, 22:28
allegedly...

gp35fn
08-12-2010, 22:42
Or you could get a 5.56x45mm AK-I've several SAR3/Wasr3 in the 5.56x45mm-as light and handy as the SAR2, little more recoil, slightly better accuracy, and common (though not cheap) ammo, Best of both worlds.
SAR3.
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h252/gp35fn/P4160004.jpg

Aceman
08-13-2010, 06:33
I saw those pics... Very impressive. I wonder if that bullet would just bounce off a person at that range. :dunno:



Unless a pigeon farted while passing by - in which case it would miss altogether.

Always a mall Ninja givaway for AR fanbois - they talk about the "500" yard shot, but have obviously never actually tried to make one in a 20mph wind.

LEAD
08-13-2010, 06:57
5.45x39 is more AK oriented than 5.56 and most my friends prefer shooting it over 7.62x39. I think everyones first or only AK should be in 7.62x39.

TheGrimReaper
08-13-2010, 07:57
The 5.45x39 is a very interesting round. I see one in my future.

panzer1
08-13-2010, 08:59
I do have a very nice .223 AK for sale here... :cool:Any AK in 223 is NOT an real AK.IMO Sorry just don't see the point in it.

Glocker08
08-13-2010, 12:00
Any AK in 223 is NOT an real AK.IMO Sorry just don't see the point in it.

:agree:

Glockdude1
08-13-2010, 12:18
Any AK in 223 is NOT an real AK.IMO Sorry just don't see the point in it.

How about a AK in 5.45x39?
(.221 caliber :supergrin:)

:tongueout:

Glocker08
08-13-2010, 14:07
Any AK in 223 is NOT an real AK.IMO Sorry just don't see the point in it.

How about a AK in 5.45x39?
(.221 caliber :supergrin:)

:tongueout:

I think he means Soviet rifle/Soviet round kinda thing. (I think so anyway) It's just like I wouldn't want a 7.62x39 in an AR platform or a Mini-30. I just wouldn't. :dunno:

Restless28
08-14-2010, 11:15
Sell me on Arsenals in calibers other than 7.62. I'm curious as to real-world experiences. I liked a SLR-106 with rail that I handled at Larry's.

Adionik
08-14-2010, 12:17
I have both 5.45 and 7.62 AK's...I love 'em both. But everyone should have a 7.62

zeme05
08-14-2010, 12:20
I own 8 AKs all in 7.62 X 39 and honestly didn't know there were caliber restrictions on AKs in diffeent states. Here in Texas if you cross the state line without a gun they issue you one. Children are given pistols to play with in their cribs for toys (unloaded of course) and kids learn to shoot before they learn to walk. Sorry!

squiddie545
08-19-2010, 07:09
not being able to own 7.62s in CT really bites. although, even the johnny taliban is endorsing the 5.45:

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/09/03/taliban-upgrading-to-the-ak-74/

Broncbuster
08-19-2010, 08:00
For a $1000 budget I would get 2 Saiga's and convert. Definately go with the 7.62. If the SHTF every gangbanger out there will have a 7.62 AK where you can pick up some spare parts.

toshbar
08-19-2010, 20:34
For a $1000 budget I would get 2 Saiga's and convert. Definately go with the 7.62. If the SHTF every gangbanger out there will have a 7.62 AK where you can pick up some spare parts.
This is exactly the reason to go 5.45. No gangbanger will be able to hit me out to 600+ yards with a 7.62 AK. Not even close.

my762buzz
08-20-2010, 04:55
This is exactly the reason to go 5.45. No gangbanger will be able to hit me out to 600+ yards with a 7.62 AK. Not even close.


Gangbangers couldn't hit you at 25 yards with a Noveske AR15 because their sideways aiming is not very productive. Most shooters couldn't hit you at 600 yards with a super accurate bolt action rifle. 7.62x39 125 grain goes subsonic right before 600 yards on a warm day and even sooner on a colder day.
Trans-sonic passage pretty much ruins any caliber's flight stability.

As far as long range terminal effect, 5.45x39 after 300 yards slows down to pistol speeds under 1900 fps and does not liquify tissue whether tumbling or not. 5.56 m193 has its distance/speed fragmenting loss under 2800-2500 fps after a couple of hundred yards.
At 300 + yards for these midrange assault caliber choices, the edge goes to greater mass and a better expanding bullet design. However, a .308/.30.06 or larger caliber match type bullet would the better semiauto military service caliber at this range.

CTfam
08-20-2010, 16:31
In what SHTF situation can you imagine a civilian taking a 600 yard shot with a rifle? I'm not knocking anyone here. Just trying to come up with possible scenarios where I would need anything past 200. Can't think of anything. Even if it's an all out war/revolution you wouldn't be engaging armed forces head on at range. Maybe? :dunno: I imagine more of a close range hit and run strategy. 7.62x39 would shine here. Especially in urban warfare.

.308 rocks. When I win the lotto I'll def pick one up.

spyder1969
08-20-2010, 17:47
:agree:


I will third :agree:that!!

my762buzz
08-20-2010, 18:26
In what SHTF situation can you imagine a civilian taking a 600 yard shot with a rifle? I'm not knocking anyone here. Just trying to come up with possible scenarios where I would need anything past 200.

In a court room: Your honor, that greasy gang banger was waving that machete at me and I saw him through my 10x binoculars 600 yards away.
I knew I couldn't let him get any closer so I sent a bullet 1/3 mile away into his head so he would get the message. Clearly it stopped the immediate danger he was posing.

Novocaine
08-21-2010, 03:07
Don't lose the focus just because a guy brought a knife to a gunfight- remember 600 yards rule.

Adionik
08-21-2010, 12:58
I prefer to take 1000 yard shots with my AR.....blind folded :tongueout:



:rofl:

FA5Si
08-22-2010, 16:43
I have both 5.45 and 7.62 AK's...I love 'em both. But everyone should have a 7.62

I do - an SKS. My AK is 5.45.

FA5Si
08-22-2010, 16:45
In what SHTF situation can you imagine a civilian taking a 600 yard shot with a rifle? I'm not knocking anyone here. Just trying to come up with possible scenarios where I would need anything past 200. Can't think of anything. Even if it's an all out war/revolution you wouldn't be engaging armed forces head on at range. Maybe? :dunno: I imagine more of a close range hit and run strategy. 7.62x39 would shine here. Especially in urban warfare.

.308 rocks. When I win the lotto I'll def pick one up.

Any situation that needed that kind of reach would be best done with a scoped bolt gun, not an EBR.

toshbar
08-22-2010, 23:23
Any situation that needed that kind of reach would be best done with a scoped bolt gun, not an EBR.
So now you're talking about the almighty MOSIN NAGANT:bowdown:.

It doesn't need a scope :supergrin:

Adionik
08-23-2010, 00:33
I do - an SKS. My AK is 5.45.

I fired an SKS for the first time the other night, and I was pleasantly surprised. Doesn't feel ANYTHING like the AK does with the same round. I may pick one up...but I have quite a few things ahead of it.