Bud's Used "Police" 870? Is This An 870P? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Restless28
09-05-2010, 09:54
Bud's has used "police" 870's on their site. How do I know if these are the 870P or are they just calling them "police"?

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=411542031

Morris
09-05-2010, 09:56
Most LE 870s were the Police. A few agencies cheaped out and got express models.

Looks like what is now referred to as a P to me with a Speedfeed forend. Good price.

Restless28
09-05-2010, 10:10
Where are the rest of the 870 folks?! :wavey:

I'm ready to buy if this is the P and ya'll all think this is a good price!

Aceman
09-05-2010, 10:15
P or not - hit it! Hit it now! Before you change your mind!!!!!

Likely a P though...

Restless28
09-05-2010, 10:23
For better or worse, I took Aceman's prodding to heart, and just ordered the 20-inch 870 for $299.

I hope that I didn't screw up! :dunno:

JBnTX
09-05-2010, 10:29
.deleted

Aceman
09-05-2010, 10:33
IMO that's not the actual Remington 870P.

Check out the pictures in this thread.
I bought one of these and it's perfect.

http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=219312

No - but it's a typical one out of however many they have...only difference is where the clip marks are from being placed in/out of the car/trunk.

Restless28
09-05-2010, 10:42
The Bud's front page says this about the gun...

NEBRASKA STATE POLICE GUNS

MAGNUM RECEIVERS (http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=411542031)

JBnTX
09-05-2010, 11:44
deketd

aippi
09-05-2010, 11:47
That may not be a good price. $300 for a older used 870 is not that great and as these are duty weapons they have most likely been abused and neglected. many cops today have very little respect for the shotgun and don't give it the care and attention they do thier handguns or AR's . Also, since they don't own the weapon they treat them about as bad as they treat the Department vehicle. Now, if you can hold the weapon, break it down and inspect it then it may be worth it. I did a thread on buying used "Police weapons sight unseen". So, if there is a return clause and you can inspect the weapon and return it is there are major issues, then you are looking at an OK deal but only OK at best.

Where guys are messing up here is thinking that this weapon is any different then any 870 they can buy today. It is not. Yes, it was parkerized but that finish will be very worn and you are looking at refinishing it anyway. Yes there are a couple parts different but they are worn and may need replacing so you have to buy them anyway and some other you would not have to buy if the weapon was new. So buying an Express tactical, refinish with parkerizing or God forbid paint it if that was what you would do to refinish that used one. Change out two small parts and you now have the same weapon but new for the the same money. You just will not have the word "police" on it and if that is important to you then my advise is being wasted.

This is what I do for a living. Departments send their Remington shotguns to me for refinishing and rebuilding. I know about the condition of these type of weapons, the abuse and the neglect. Yes, some come in and are fine and have been cared for but that is the exception not the rule. It have shocking stories about these weapons.

As for buying sight unseen. A client bought and extension and tune up parts from me for a Police trade in he bought from Gun Broker. the issue was the weapon was manufactures in 1994 but the barrel in 1985. So the stand off distance had changed and the tube would not work. How did this happen. Easy, when weapons are going for trade in some Department Armorers scavenger the best parts and keep them. They trade in the mess. Just as some of you take those like new tires off a car before you trade it in. S0, How old are they? If these are older Wingmaster versions and need flex tab upgrades you are looking at $90 right there. What is the condition of the chamber, bore and if those are pre 1990 barrels with the longer stand off you have an issue with the extension. They should not have this issue but were barrels traded out prior to trade in? Don't know, do you? This is why sight unseen Department trade ins are a problem.

The good thing about these is that Bud's is a good seller and good to do business with. So you can roll the dice and hope for the best. If anything really bad happened Bud's will stand behind it. Still, there is risk as they are used and you have to expect some issues as you can be assured a volume seller like them did not have the time to break these weapons down, survey them and funtion test them.

And yes, I know that some of you have gotten great deals on these weapons from the internet when you were not able to see them first. But more of you got great deals because you were able to see the weapon and you have the knowledge to know what to check on the weapon. Please don't confuse the two.

MD357
09-05-2010, 19:25
I've bought a few things from Buds and they've always been top notch, so I have two of these coming. First one will get here Tues, so I'll let you guys know how they look.

Aceman
09-05-2010, 19:42
That may not be a good price. $300 for a older used 870 is not that great and as these are duty weapons they have most likely been abused and neglected....... But more of you got great deals because you were able to see the weapon and you have the knowledge to know what to check on the weapon. Please don't confuse the two.

All great advice - but I think your job and general attention to detail and quality and work on the high end has skewed your perception a bit!

Restless needs to compliment his Glock with a SHTF long gun. He's been ultra-indecisive for over a year.

And it's an 870 from a reputable source. It can't be BAD, it just may not be the GREATEST. But it's absolutely what he needs - before he changes his mind!!!!!

aippi
09-05-2010, 23:16
I understand your point ACE. The fact that Bud's is selling these also up's the deal as they will stand behind them.

The only other thing is, right now the 25077 is a geat deal with a $30 rebate. they run around $330 so he is getting a new 870 with 18.5" barrel, bead sight, Remington LE tube Extension, synthetic rear stocks and Speedfeed LE forend. It is factory new and no risk. He shoots the hell out of it for a year, then upgrades the Extractor and carrier dog spring for about $18. He has a new weapon for the same money. Same weapon but new. Oh, he won't have the word police on it but with those two parts it is the same except for the finish and the trigger plate housing.

I recommend the new one as the OP may not be able to bring this used one up to duty qualtiy and may have pay to have some things done to it. Gun Smith fees and parts could add up. There is a risk. The new 870 HD is under warranty for two years. I see the new one as a better deal for him.

Restless28
09-06-2010, 05:19
J.D. is right. After thinking about this, the 5077 makes more sense. I need to cancel this order. I should have re-read J.D.'s advice. :embarassed:

ET.
09-06-2010, 07:02
J.D. is right. After thinking about this, the 5077 makes more sense. I need to cancel this order. I should have re-read J.D.'s advice. :embarassed:

Great...another year!:faint:

Restless28
09-06-2010, 07:12
Great...another year!:faint:

FYI, I used this year to get out of credit card debt and make a financial plan to be fiscally sound and safe for the future. :wavey:

I like guns, but, I like financial peace and security more. :supergrin:

B.Reid
09-06-2010, 18:14
Looks like a good gun to me.

Willamette
09-07-2010, 16:58
I've got one of these coming too (ordered yesterday before finding this thread).

Some details were not exactly clear on their site given only the stock photo, but they offer to return the gun from my FFL at their cost if I'm not happy (providing you and the FFL haven't processed the BG check/paperwork [10% restock fee though]).

Look forward to hearing what MD357 has to say on the condition of his when it arrives today.

Restless28
09-07-2010, 17:02
I cancelled mine. I believe J.D. is accurate in saying that a 5077 is a better deal at $339.

rem2429
09-07-2010, 18:13
:crying:FYI, I used this year to get out of credit card debt and make a financial plan to be fiscally sound and safe for the future. :wavey:

I like guns, but, I like financial peace and security more. :supergrin:

I agree. Get out of debt before buying guns. In the mean time look around. I found a special purpose police model for $150 at cabelas a couple of years ago. It needed refinishing, but I have a duracoat set up. It's more fun to build it yourself anyway.

ET.
09-07-2010, 19:19
FYI, I used this year to get out of credit card debt and make a financial plan to be fiscally sound and safe for the future. :wavey:

I like guns, but, I like financial peace and security more. :supergrin:


Good for you! I bet that lets you sleep better at night. I was just kidding around with you.

MD357
09-08-2010, 22:00
Got my first one in today, didn't break it down yet but it seemed really clean inside, not going to win any beauty contests for sure. Put 75 rounds through it and it function like any used 870 should.... perfectly. One of these will be a "beater" and the other will get some wood and a refinish.



I cancelled mine. I believe J.D. is accurate in saying that a 5077 is a better deal at $339.

Personally, I don't think so after seeing my first one. :supergrin: I paid $307..... that's MUCH better than I can do around here for an Express.

fran m
09-09-2010, 14:43
Was it an 870P (police engraved on the receiver)?

MD357
09-09-2010, 22:09
Was it an 870P (police engraved on the receiver)?


Yes, they are marked Police Magnum. :cool:

Z71bill
09-10-2010, 08:46
IMHO - if you value the 20 inch barrel and the 7+1 capacity it is a good deal -

If feel the 18.5" barrel & 6+1 capacity is what you need then buy a new gun.

IIRC last gun show in Houston had NIB Express 18.5" 6+1 for $325 + tax.

I like saving money as much as the next guy - but does $50 one way or the other really change your decision?

thumbbreak
09-11-2010, 16:26
PICs of what you received from Bud's please...

aippi
09-11-2010, 18:20
The issue is not the $50 each way changing the decision. I can't understand how anyone can get that out of these post.

The issue is a new weapon against a very used weapon. Even if your is functioning fine now, do you know enought about these to see an issue that can be comming a few hundred rounds from now. Do you know how to repair the issue or what it is going to cost in parts or gun smith fees. And yes the seller is one of the best sellers out there but there but the weapons are being sold as used and there are no warranties that come with this that is going to cover the issues down the road.

For a few more dollars you get a NEW weapon with a two year warranty. If you have some kind of misconception about what is engraved on the receiver then you are not going to understand my points as you are thinking you got something that you did not.

MD357
09-11-2010, 23:25
The issue is a new weapon against a very used weapon. Even if your is functioning fine now, do you know enought about these to see an issue that can be comming a few hundred rounds from now. Do you know how to repair the issue or what it is going to cost in parts or gun smith fees. And yes the seller is one of the best sellers out there but there but the weapons are being sold as used and there are no warranties that come with this that is going to cover the issues down the road.

OH NOES!!!!!

One wonders how I have so many rounds through my Glocks because I have several used and many were LE trade-ins. Heck, I even have a used Les Baer and Colt. Someone COULD have ravaged those too I guess.

For the faint of heart or a newbie, one should buy an NEW Express for sure. :cool: I guess I'll take my chances with a fragile platform such as the 870. I'll just have to pray they aren't ticking time bombs. :supergrin:

aippi
09-12-2010, 02:11
Then these weapons would be ideal for you MD 357 since you would never have to send one to somone like me to repair as you have the knowledge to do it yourself. I would never even buy a Police trade in hand gun. It is being traded in because they have determined it is no longer "duty quality". I don't own weapons that are not duty quality as I use that same standard for my personal use for carry and the occasional times I use a weapon for work these days.

With that said I would gladly purchase a weapon that was returned to the factory for a rebuild or was gone through by an armorer cetified on that model and given the green light. I don't know enough about other weapons to make these determinations and don't even work on my own handguns. And I don't buy used weapons, but if I did I would never buy one sight unseen any more then I would buy a car sight unseen. I know you are not saying that the 870 is a fragile platform and it was just a samart alleck dig at my post. I don't know why you would take a shot at perfect advice. Since these are the same weapons why would someone pay about the same for a sight unseen used one when they can get a new one with a two year warranty for a few more dollars. $50 is the price of a decent meal with a couple drinks after.

So I am to assume that if you were an LEO and needed a weapon to carry on duty you would get on the internet and buy a used police trade in handgun and shotgun to carry. Is this correct? If the answer is no you would not the think about this. I don't consider an LEO needing any better of a weapon for duty then I do for my own self defense. So I don't want weapons that they have deemed no long fit for duty. And if it is a project gun and needs refinishing and you are adding new furniture and maybe a different barrel to then the new 870 is the way to go because you can sell the new furniture and barrel from it for far more then you can sell that beat up used stuff on the police trade in for. This helps defray the cost for the stuff you are putting on it.

MD357
09-12-2010, 08:25
Then these weapons would be ideal for you MD 357 since you would never have to send one to somone like me to repair as you have the knowledge to do it yourself. I would never even buy a Police trade in hand gun. It is being traded in because they have determined it is no longer "duty quality". I don't own weapons that are not duty quality as I use that same standard for my personal use for carry and the occasional times I use a weapon for work these days.

Ok this simply is NOT true.... unless cosmetic wear deems a duty guy unfit. :supergrin:

LE depts change in weapon platforms ALL the time and "duty quality" has nothing to do with it. Many times, they change platforms that is not very old at all. I've seen it here locally I dunno how many times. They go from Glock to Sig, back to Glock etc etc.

In fact, one can reference Buds, Summit, Top gun, J&G sales, AIM surplus as I've seen Police guns come in from them in barely used condition. To put it bluntly, VERY FEW of these guys have even come close to putting enough rounds through these guns to warrant them unqualified for duty. I've seen this with handguns, rifles AND shotguns.

Honestly, we are talking about an 870 which is the Glock of shotguns. Just like you rarely come across a Glock that is shot out, you don't see an 870 that is worn out, much less from a LE dept. I'd be more leary of buying a shotgun off a competition shooter.

Nsydstr*
09-12-2010, 09:35
I cant find the 25077 you are referring to. Is it the 95077:

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/95077

I'm in the same boat trying to decide on a used 20" Nebraska or a new 870.
Decisions Decisions

aippi
09-12-2010, 10:44
Yes, the model number is 25077. If a dealer is calling it 95077 then he is getting it from Sports South as that is their item number. I bought over $50,000 of those last year from Sports South so I know the number well. Same weapon. Some Distributors use 5077. When you get it, look at the label on the box and you will see the numbers 25077.

Z71bill
09-12-2010, 13:14
The issue is not the $50 each way changing the decision. I can't understand how anyone can get that out of these post.

The issue is a new weapon against a very used weapon. Even if your is functioning fine now, do you know enough about these to see an issue that can becoming a few hundred rounds from now. Do you know how to repair the issue or what it is going to cost in parts or gun smith fees. And yes the seller is one of the best sellers out there but there but the weapons are being sold as used and there are no warranties that come with this that is going to cover the issues down the road.

For a few more dollars you get a NEW weapon with a two year warranty. If you have some kind of misconception about what is engraved on the receiver then you are not going to understand my points as you are thinking you got something that you did not.



What I don't understand is why you are always such a pompous windbag. :tongueout:

It sure seemed like some were liking this gun because of its "low" price.

The info on Bud's seems clear enough

"These guns are in very good condition for a used gun, most seem to be fired very little. They do have some wear on them from being carried in a cruiser"

But you say

"That may not be a good price. $300 for a older used 870 is not that great and as these are duty weapons they have most likely been abused and neglected"

How do you know these guns have been abused and neglected?

Why comment on the price not being low enough if you can't understand / don't see how anyone can think the price difference is being considered?



I have purchased a few things from Bud's - always a good experience -

IMHO Bud's would not be selling these / claiming they were in very good condition unless they were nice guns.

You think Bud's is lying? Maybe stretching the truth?

How many rounds can you shoot out of an 870 before it is worn out?

Must be thousands and thousands - then you replace a few small items and shoot it thousands and thousands more.

So my opinion has not changed -

If you really want a 20 inch barrel with 7+1 this seems like a good deal - if not - and the 18.5 / 6+1 is OK then get the new gun.

Just wondering -

What is the best deal going right now for a new 20" barrel with 7+1 capacity? Does Remington even sell them to retail customers?

Maybe comparing a NIB 870 / 20" 7+1 to Bud's used price would be a better comparison.
:wavey:

aippi
09-12-2010, 15:10
I have never commented that there was any problem with the seller and even stated the fact that Buds is selling them is a plus as they stand by every thing they sell. I am sure you read that. so why all the mess in your last post about Bud's? Why would you even put that mess in your last thread when I specificlly praised the seller.

You also state your opinion has not changes. That is the issue, you are giving opinions. Based on what man. I am not giving opinion. I am stating facts based on being a professional in this business, having use this weapon during my career and being a trained armorer certifed on this weapon.

There is only one 870 so these are the same as a new Express except for finish and a couple parts. If the guy wants a 20" then this is an option for him. I seldom get request for 20" weapons and I would venture few guys even seeing these would want 20" but if they do then get one.

Sounds like you have an issue beyond my advice on this subject because my advice comes from doing this professionally, taking in Department weapons for armorers work and rebulding. I can't say with certainty that I know more about Departmental Remingtons Shotugns then you do but can say I know as much. If that matters to anyone reading my advice then they can take it. I have 17 coming in From National Park Service, not trade ins, but current duty weapons. I assure you that you would shocked If you were see these as I am breaking them down. I will no doubt find a few that that will shock even me as they were in service and an Officers life was counting on it. The good thing is that I am very good at this and every weapon will go back to them like new and duty ready.

And none of the ones I get for rebuild are worse then the trade ins. I am sure it will not shock you find out that when wepaons are being traded in that some armorers go through them and take out the best parts for some of the mess they have laying around. I have seen trade ins that were 870P that had old 18" Express barrels on them that did not even have the detent ball. That 870P barrel is on some officers personal weapon somewhere. Also 870P's trade ins with Express trigger plate assemblies and even MIM extractors. Weapons manufactured in the Mid '90s' but had old pre 1990 barrels that make it hard to put an extension on due to the stand off distance. There is a lot more but you get the point.

I don't have a problem with you disagreeing with my advice. It is there to take or leave. You are attempting to disprove it as being sound advice from a professional and that I have an issue with. So state your credentials if you want to have a professional debate about the condition of used law Enforcement Department/Agency onwed Remington Shotguns. Do not include an officers personal owned shotgun. I have found officers take care of them. The ones not owned by the actual officer, well that is a different story. So let us know how you are qualified to counter my advise and we will continue, Please add how long you used Departmental owned wepaons during your career. I used them for 21 years and was the Armorers relief, he took a lot of time off and like to let stuff pile up before he left so I got a lot of time working on these weapons back then. Please add your training to work on Remington Shotguns. I am a Factory Trained Remington Law Enforcement Armorer. Please add how many you have worked on in the past 30 years. For me I can only guess at about 4,000 to 5,000 law Enforement Remington 870's and a few 11-87's. Add other 870 sporting models and the count goes up.

Once you give us your qualifications then we can debate the issue of LE Departmental trade ins and readers will be able to benifit from both of our knowledge about these weapons. I also state on my web site that I love to talk to customers as I learn so much from them and I am sure I can learn some things from you. This will be a good thread.

If this a good price for trades in. Yes, because that is what they bring. Is buying one sight unseen a good idea, well no.

I will end now since I don't want you to accuse me of being a pompus windbag again. I seem to offend you even though I know what I am talking about.

Z71bill
09-12-2010, 21:26
I have never commented that there was any problem with the seller and even stated the fact that Buds is selling them is a plus as they stand by every thing they sell. I am sure you read that. so why all the mess in your last post about Bud's? Why would you even put that mess in your last thread when I specificlly praised the seller.

You also state your opinion has not changes. That is the issue, you are giving opinions. Based on what man. I am not giving opinion. I am stating facts based on being a professional in this business, having use this weapon during my career and being a trained armorer certifed on this weapon.

There is only one 870 so these are the same as a new Express except for finish and a couple parts. If the guy wants a 20" then this is an option for him. I seldom get request for 20" weapons and I would venture few guys even seeing these would want 20" but if they do then get one.

Sounds like you have an issue beyond my advice on this subject because my advice comes from doing this professionally, taking in Department weapons for armorers work and rebulding. I can't say with certainty that I know more about Departmental Remingtons Shotugns then you do but can say I know as much. If that matters to anyone reading my advice then they can take it. I have 17 coming in From National Park Service, not trade ins, but current duty weapons. I assure you that you would shocked If you were see these as I am breaking them down. I will no doubt find a few that that will shock even me as they were in service and an Officers life was counting on it. The good thing is that I am very good at this and every weapon will go back to them like new and duty ready.

And none of the ones I get for rebuild are worse then the trade ins. I am sure it will not shock you find out that when wepaons are being traded in that some armorers go through them and take out the best parts for some of the mess they have laying around. I have seen trade ins that were 870P that had old 18" Express barrels on them that did not even have the detent ball. That 870P barrel is on some officers personal weapon somewhere. Also 870P's trade ins with Express trigger plate assemblies and even MIM extractors. Weapons manufactured in the Mid '90s' but had old pre 1990 barrels that make it hard to put an extension on due to the stand off distance. There is a lot more but you get the point.

I don't have a problem with you disagreeing with my advice. It is there to take or leave. You are attempting to disprove it as being sound advice from a professional and that I have an issue with. So state your credentials if you want to have a professional debate about the condition of used law Enforcement Department/Agency onwed Remington Shotguns. Do not include an officers personal owned shotgun. I have found officers take care of them. The ones not owned by the actual officer, well that is a different story. So let us know how you are qualified to counter my advise and we will continue, Please add how long you used Departmental owned wepaons during your career. I used them for 21 years and was the Armorers relief, he took a lot of time off and like to let stuff pile up before he left so I got a lot of time working on these weapons back then. Please add your training to work on Remington Shotguns. I am a Factory Trained Remington Law Enforcement Armorer. Please add how many you have worked on in the past 30 years. For me I can only guess at about 4,000 to 5,000 law Enforement Remington 870's and a few 11-87's. Add other 870 sporting models and the count goes up.

Once you give us your qualifications then we can debate the issue of LE Departmental trade ins and readers will be able to benifit from both of our knowledge about these weapons. I also state on my web site that I love to talk to customers as I learn so much from them and I am sure I can learn some things from you. This will be a good thread.

If this a good price for trades in. Yes, because that is what they bring. Is buying one sight unseen a good idea, well no.

I will end now since I don't want you to accuse me of being a pompus windbag again. I seem to offend you even though I know what I am talking about.

:yawn: How many times have you posted your "resume" of 870 experience? :upeyes:

A little bit insecure maybe?

So do we agree? :wow:

If someone wants a 20" barrel with 7+1 this would be a good deal

If they are fine with an 18.5" barrel 6+1 then spend the extra $50 and get a new gun.

Don't know why you felt the need to throw out the " I can't understand how anyone can get that out of these post" pompous BS.


And yes you really do come across like a pompous windbag in almost every post - and I know a little something about pompous windbags - mainly because I have a little pompous windbag in me too.:supergrin:

:wavey:


BTW your spelling really sucks -:tongueout:

aippi
09-12-2010, 21:56
You can't even keep your own post straight. You said Windbag. That is someone who talks alot and says nothing. I talk a lot and I say things that are correct on the subject. I repeat my qualificatons because there is so much BS from people that don't know the subject that other readers need to see the qualifications of the person giving the advice. They can go to my web site look at the posted Remington Armorers Certificatons for the 870P, 11-87P, 700 Police and 7615 and know that they are getting the correct information and if this helps them with their answer then the purpose is met. However, others give their opinions to much on here and try to pass them off as facts. Others simply post something they read on another blog which was posted by a guy who read it on another blog and so on and so on and it is a crock. So, after thousands of dollars spent to get the correct information about Remington shotguns I can give it away free to anyone who ask if I want to. Dozens of guys from Glock talk have e-mailed me or called me with Remington questions and I have even spent time on the phone helping them as they corrected and issue with their weapon. Never tried to sell them anything and most often talked them out of buying stupid tacti-fool mess for their weapon. That makes me a pretty good guy there Zbill. And while I am tooting my own horn. Let me add that I have over 150 of my AI&P tactical builds being carried by LEO's in 27 and have rebuilt a few hundred for others for and LE Agencies. What else. Oh yes, I please two very attractive young ladies the other night. Yes, I did. I walked away from their table after saying hello to them and they looked very pleased I was leaving. Oh, I don't mind your responses and the flip comments about me like "Insecure" as you don't know me. So if it is a comment about my abilities then that certainly does not bother me as AI&P Tactical is very sucessfull because I am very good at what I do and even better on the business end of it. So please continue to reply when ever you see one of my post. It puts good stuff out there for the OP and generates ideas sometimes and well, it is fun proving guys like you wrong :-).

Z71bill
09-13-2010, 08:18
You can't even keep your own post straight. You said Windbag. That is someone who talks alot and says nothing. I talk a lot and I say things that are correct on the subject. I repeat my qualificatons because there is so much BS from people that don't know the subject that other readers need to see the qualifications of the person giving the advice. They can go to my web site look at the posted Remington Armorers Certificatons for the 870P, 11-87P, 700 Police and 7615 and know that they are getting the correct information and if this helps them with their answer then the purpose is met. However, others give their opinions to much on here and try to pass them off as facts. Others simply post something they read on another blog which was posted by a guy who read it on another blog and so on and so on and it is a crock. So, after thousands of dollars spent to get the correct information about Remington shotguns I can give it away free to anyone who ask if I want to. Dozens of guys from Glock talk have e-mailed me or called me with Remington questions and I have even spent time on the phone helping them as they corrected and issue with their weapon. Never tried to sell them anything and most often talked them out of buying stupid tacti-fool mess for their weapon. That makes me a pretty good guy there Zbill. And while I am tooting my own horn. Let me add that I have over 150 of my AI&P tactical builds being carried by LEO's in 27 and have rebuilt a few hundred for others for and LE Agencies. What else. Oh yes, I please two very attractive young ladies the other night. Yes, I did. I walked away from their table after saying hello to them and they looked very pleased I was leaving. Oh, I don't mind your responses and the flip comments about me like "Insecure" as you don't know me. So if it is a comment about my abilities then that certainly does not bother me as AI&P Tactical is very sucessfull because I am very good at what I do and even better on the business end of it. So please continue to reply when ever you see one of my post. It puts good stuff out there for the OP and generates ideas sometimes and well, it is fun proving guys like you wrong :-).


So now you want to argue about what a windbag is? :rofl:


The point is (IMHO) the gun at Bud's is not a bad deal - actually a good deal if you want a 20" barrel and 7+1 capacity.

But - you come in to the thread and - while spouting off all your great qualifications and vast experience - proclaim it is most likely an abused and neglected gun.

I guess someone with your vast experience does not even need to bother looking at the details. :upeyes:

Fact is I have experience with Bud's - all good - and think I can trust them MORE THAN I TRUST YOU to evaluate a gun THEY are selling.

So be clear - and answer a simple direct question.

Do you still think the Bud's gun is most likely abused and neglected?

How much should a used 870 (20" 7+1) in the condition Bud's is advertising sell for?


Oh please - great all knowing master of the 870 share your wisdom with me. :upeyes:

MD357
09-13-2010, 09:24
Do you still think the Bud's gun is most likely abused and neglected?

Here's the thing, it doesn't matter what he thinks as it's an opinion. Unless he buys one himself and can cite specific problems. :cool:

Z71bill
09-13-2010, 11:31
What else. Oh yes, I please two very attractive young ladies the other night. Yes, I did. I walked away from their table after saying hello to them and they looked very pleased I was leaving.

Sorry Aippi I missed this part of your post - you are making my gut hurt from laughing so hard.


First of all -

Hi - I am a Remington factory approved certified armor with vast knowledge of the 870, 870P, 11-87P, 700 Police and 7615 platforms -

Must be the worst pick up line I have ever heard :rofl:

And second -

"I walked away from their table after saying hello to them and they looked very pleased I was leaving" :rofl:

I bet they were very pleased you were leaving :yawn:- :rofl::rofl:

aippi
09-13-2010, 12:00
That is the punch line, they were please that I was getting away from them. It is a joke numbnuts. I am getting PM's, IM from other forums and personal e-mails and even a phone call to just ignor you and MD guy from other members as you are both known for this kind of mess if anyone dissagrees with you or with you or has any knowledge on a subject. My knowledge on the subject of this OP is professional. You have little if any on this particular subject so you attack the person who does. Your are both contributing nothing. You are the problem with sites like this. They are designed to share information on a subject. To post a question and get answers. You have no knowledge, have never sat over a work bench working on Departmenal 870's for days and dealing with all the issues that have and are going to have months down the road (after the sale is final). Some one who does post in and since the information is contray to what you posted you simply attack. Anyone thinking anything you post is even advice deserves what they get. Your a waste of time and I will take the advice of those who have been on this site longer and ignor you.

To other guys - Thanks for the warrings about these two guys, however, if I see a post from either one of them that could result in someone damaging their Remington Shotgun or making it unsafe I will not ignor that.

Z71bill
09-13-2010, 12:59
That is the punch line, they were please that I was getting away from them. It is a joke numbnuts. I am getting PM's, IM from other forums and personal e-mails and even a phone call to just ignor you and MD guy from other members as you are both known for this kind of mess if anyone dissagrees with you or with you or has any knowledge on a subject. My knowledge on the subject of this OP is professional. You have little if any on this particular subject so you attack the person who does. Your are both contributing nothing. You are the problem with sites like this. They are designed to share information on a subject. To post a question and get answers. You have no knowledge, have never sat over a work bench working on Departmenal 870's for days and dealing with all the issues that have and are going to have months down the road (after the sale is final). Some one who does post in and since the information is contray to what you posted you simply attack. Anyone thinking anything you post is even advice deserves what they get. Your a waste of time and I will take the advice of those who have been on this site longer and ignor you.

To other guys - Thanks for the warrings about these two guys, however, if I see a post from either one of them that could result in someone damaging their Remington Shotgun or making it unsafe I will not ignor that.

Thanks for the laugh :rofl:- you should consider stand up comedy -

BTW - I don't doubt you know about the 870 -:shocked:

Having knowledge is always a good thing - being able to apply your knowledge is also important - and this is where you really come up short -

Bla bla bla bla I am an expert and know everything only holds up if the opinion you spout actually makes sense - telling folks to not buy a perfectly good gun from Bud's based on your view that all police trades are abused, neglected junk is just plain unprofessional.

When someone questions your judgement maybe try explaining your position instead of falling back on the tired old - I have XX years experience and am a certified expert bla bla bla whining BS :crying:

Maybe you should just

Step up and admit you made a mistake in judgement and thank me for pointing out your error and teaching you a few things. :cool:

BTW - Sorry if I hurt your feelings - and your spelling still sucks. :wavey:

Willamette
09-13-2010, 13:02
With any luck UPS will be delivering my Bud's 870P in a couple of hours. FFL has agreed to let me break it down to inspect it before committing to transfer. If I haven't sent it back I will post some pics later on so you can all scrutinize the gun and determine if it's a good deal or not.

This is my first shotty to own. It matched the base model I was looking for (20", parkerized, 7+1, synthetic, short fore-end, etc.), was priced nicely, my FFL only requires $20 total for the transfer (incl. BG check), the shipping was free, no taxes, and someone else put the first scratches on it. Hell, they even broke it in for me (think of all the money saved on ammo to get it to this point). Thus far it's a good deal for me and it will be interesting to hear what others think after seeing one.

MD357
09-13-2010, 13:58
I am getting PM's, IM from other forums and personal e-mails and even a phone call to just ignor you and MD guy from other members as you are both known for this kind of mess if anyone dissagrees with you or with you or has any knowledge on a subject.

Something is wrong with you. Seriously. If you've gotten a phone call about myself and this thread then you need to focus more on your business and that individual needs to delegate his time better, because that is quite sad. I know Bill Wilson wouldn't have time to worry about what I said on an internet forum about what Budsgunshop is selling. :supergrin:

I stated I bought two of these. You carry on about police trade ins and your experiences blah blah blah, which is fine. However, you think your opinion is FACT. Let me explain that in the world of the internet that the plural of anecdote is NOT fact. I don't care if you've seen this or that with 870s. I have no reference to what you are saying and it's not that I don't believe you. I was stating that these particular shotguns haven't been abused by the examples I have recieved and that it's hard to wear out an 870. Nothing more, nothing less. If your experiences are different, then GREAT, that's the beautiful thing about America. All I ask is that unless you bought one of these, that you realize that you are posting on PURE speculation.

To post a question and get answers. You have no knowledge, have never sat over a work bench working on Departmenal 870's for days and dealing with all the issues that have and are going to have months down the road (after the sale is final). Some one who does post in and since the information is contray to what you posted you simply attack.

Yes, we get it. You have stated several times your experience with the 870 and you are VERY quick to hold it over anyone's head. However, this all has nothing to do with these particular guns.

One thing to consider in the future is many of the professional shooters, instructors and builders I have known and been exposed to, were good teachers. Generally, good teachers aren't extremely insecure and verbally abusive when someone disagrees with them. Food for thought. :cool:

Willamette
09-13-2010, 22:00
Here's an overall view of the one I picked up today:

http://glocktalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=204402&stc=1&d=1284433027

I'm pleased with the condition considering the source. There are actually fewer wear marks than I was expecting and the stock looks new. It appears to have been carried a lot and fired very little. The wear seems consistent throughout, lockup feels as good as the new ones I've used, and there is some minor discoloration (oxidation) from where officers likely grabbed around the barrel and mag between the front grip and receiver to carry it or stow it. The extractor looks as fresh as the spare I have for it, the trigger/housing/safety look clean and only lightly worn from use. The worst marring is at the barrel/magazine band and likely attributed to disassembly/reassembly and the wear seems consistent between the barrel and magazine to lead me to believe this barrel is original to the gun. The bore is smooth and clean and shows only minor wear where the bolt parks next to it when closed.

The only oddity I found (which was immediately noticeable) was the synthetic stock was sitting about 1/8" off of the receiver. The last person to work on the gun attached the wood stock metal backing plate behind the receiver. It's possible the police department or Bud's may have simply placed it there for the next owner so it would not get lost. I'm glad it was there as I have some wood furniture to add later on and would have had to hunt one down.

Edit to add more info which may or may not affect others decisions on buying one of these:
-I called Remington to do a serial number and barrel stamp date check and both were manufactured in 1994
-barrel is Cylinder Bore (no choke)

thumbbreak
09-13-2010, 22:13
Here's an overall view of the one I picked up today:

I'm pleased with the condition considering the source. There are actually fewer wear marks than I was expecting and the stock looks new. It appears to have been carried a lot and fired very little. The wear seems consistent throughout, lockup feels as good as the new ones I've used, and there is some minor discoloration (oxidation) from where officers likely grabbed around the barrel and mag between the front grip and receiver to carry it or stow it. The extractor looks as fresh as the spare I have for it, the trigger/housing/safety look clean and only lightly worn from use. The worst marring is at the barrel/magazine band and likely attributed to disassembly/reassembly and the wear seems consistent between the barrel and magazine to lead me to believe this barrel is original to the gun. The bore is smooth and clean and shows only minor wear where the bolt parks next to it when closed.

The only oddity I found (which was immediately noticeable) was the synthetic stock was sitting about 1/8" off of the receiver. The last person to work on the gun attached the wood stock metal backing plate behind the receiver. It's possible the police department or Bud's may have simply placed it there for the next owner so it would not get lost. I'm glad it was there as I have some wood furniture to add later on and would have had to hunt one down.

Looks like you got your money's worth out of this deal. Thanks for posting pics!

Z71bill
09-14-2010, 08:53
Here's an overall view of the one I picked up today:

http://glocktalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=204402&stc=1&d=1284433027

I'm pleased with the condition considering the source. There are actually fewer wear marks than I was expecting and the stock looks new. It appears to have been carried a lot and fired very little. The wear seems consistent throughout, lockup feels as good as the new ones I've used, and there is some minor discoloration (oxidation) from where officers likely grabbed around the barrel and mag between the front grip and receiver to carry it or stow it. The extractor looks as fresh as the spare I have for it, the trigger/housing/safety look clean and only lightly worn from use. The worst marring is at the barrel/magazine band and likely attributed to disassembly/reassembly and the wear seems consistent between the barrel and magazine to lead me to believe this barrel is original to the gun. The bore is smooth and clean and shows only minor wear where the bolt parks next to it when closed.

The only oddity I found (which was immediately noticeable) was the synthetic stock was sitting about 1/8" off of the receiver. The last person to work on the gun attached the wood stock metal backing plate behind the receiver. It's possible the police department or Bud's may have simply placed it there for the next owner so it would not get lost. I'm glad it was there as I have some wood furniture to add later on and would have had to hunt one down.


What type of recoil pad does it have?

Nice & soft or the hard rubber bruiser?

Is the type of choke specified? Full, modified, IC or is it just a cylinder bore?

Willamette
09-14-2010, 12:05
What type of recoil pad does it have?

Nice & soft or the hard rubber bruiser?

Is the type of choke specified? Full, modified, IC or is it just a cylinder bore?

It's closer to a bruiser type. The stock is hollow so I'm not sure if it will easily accept a cushy bolt-on Limb Saver or the new Remington Super Cell recoil pads. It should work well with the slip-on pads by LimbSaver or Pachmyer (sp?) providing it doesn't bugger up your length of pull.

It's cylinder bore (CYL stamped on left side).

aippi
09-15-2010, 11:25
Yes, you got a good deal and having the FFL check it out was a good move. Add an R3 pad to that and life gets good.