non expanding hollow point vs fmj [Archive] - Glock Talk

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M1A Shooter
09-11-2010, 22:45
i am loading for my pistols and am mostly target shooting but i still load to near max velocities to maintain my proficiency with SD ammo. i also would like to get something that could be used in the event of shtf or whatever in the future.

i know the military uses fmj ammo due to their rules of war but is ther an advantage to a non expanding holloow point, like the berry's plated for example? if there isnt a real advantage to them then i will keep loading RN or FP bullets but i am just curious.

AZBru88
09-12-2010, 08:19
M1A Shooter after reading your post I got to thinking about the old days, before our high tech SD ammo. I remember guys putting splits in the front of lead ammo with a knife blade. I've seen guys cast lead bullets with paper in the nose or foil (years ago to make the split). I saw a guy do some 38's one time with a single split, which he inserted metal fish wire into with crimp on weights on both ends of a 8" wire, then wrapped it around a pencil and loaded it into the casing behind the bullet. I've even seen guys make their own hollow points with lead bullets, a drill bit and a drill press. Heck there is still a guy (at least a few years ago) selling a fixture to drill your own hollow points. They even have hollow point casting fixtures now for casting your own lead hollow points. I would not recommend any of the above when we have the good hollow points available in bulk.
The thing to remember if the shtf the first thing you will probably go to is a AR or AK high cap assault type weapon. A pistol will be a secondary or third choice weapon. Behind your rifle and shotgun.
If you reload pick up some good bulk hollow points, if not stock up a box or two at a time or 500 rounds at a time as you can afford it. Truly your talking a few pennies more for good quality JHP vs plated or non expanding I'd rather have 500 rounds of good SD ammo stored up then 700-800 of not so good.(Those are just example numbers its what ever your comfortable with, I have friends that keep 30K of ammo, others that keep a few hundred rounds)
Best of luck, I got rid of my casting stuff years ago. Check with the guys here that cast if you want inexpensive shooting thats the way to go...if you can find free or cheap lead.)

Berto
09-12-2010, 09:06
As far as terminal ballistics go, a non expanding HP is likelier to penetrate straight (nose forward) through with it's flat nosed profile, whereas a RN/ Ball will likely tumble at some point and penetrate base first.
From a simple reliability standpoint, I'd be inclined to stick with FMJ (or Ball) over a non functional JHP like the berry's or montana gold.

MrVvrroomm
09-12-2010, 09:36
I use a lot of Montana Gold JHP in 9mm, .40, and 10mm. It's literally a few dollars more when buying by the case. I load most of my JHP the same OAL in respective calibers.

fredj338
09-12-2010, 22:10
Bullets likt ethe Berry's or MG may or may not expand. SOmetimes they will frag, sometimes expand nicely, at least in wetpack. So it's hit or miss. For SHTF ammo, anything that goes bang will work IMO. I would even consider reloading my own ammo using a decent cheap JHP design, like the Rem. 124grJHP in 9mm, or Win 230grJPH in 45acp. Why lay in 100s of $$ in SHTF ammo for soemthing that is likely not to happen. For most scenarios, a box of 50 factory JHP is all you are gonna need or want to carry if you have to bug out on foot. Food & water are priority, a long gun is nicer than a handgun, but has it's own logistics problems for buggin out.:dunno:

M1A Shooter
09-12-2010, 22:21
i do realise the shtf thing is very rare. i was more thinking of cheap plinking ammo that i would be fine with if thats all i had from any point forward without the cost of stocking premium hollow points like rangers or gdhp.

cowboy1964
09-12-2010, 22:45
If you have to bug out are you gonna haul all your reloading gear and supplies with you? Plus ammo could be a bartering item, as valuable as gold or silver (maybe more so) so you better have extra. I'm talking extreme, wide-spread, SHTF scenarios here, not localized ones, where everything has just broken down. Of course even Walmart plinking ammo would be worth a lot in those scenarios.

fredj338
09-13-2010, 11:27
If you have to bug out are you gonna haul all your reloading gear and supplies with you? Plus ammo could be a bartering item, as valuable as gold or silver (maybe more so) so you better have extra. I'm talking extreme, wide-spread, SHTF scenarios here, not localized ones, where everything has just broken down. Of course even Walmart plinking ammo would be worth a lot in those scenarios.
I used to think that but look at a serious SHTF scenario like this. I have prepared, I have syupplies, guns & ammo. Along comes some guys w/ no ammo & I am going to give them the means to take the rest of my stuff? Not likely. No, SHTF. my ammo stays w/ me, I'ld barter or trade something else.
So how much is enough? How many people & guns are you going to have in your little survival group? If it's you & your lady, you aren't carrying much more than a couple 100rds each.:dunno: There will be no bugging out in a vehicle unless you have some serious advanced warning, like days. Then fule becomes a bigger issue. Really, ammo is the last thing I worry about in a SHTF scenario.

Darkangel1846
09-19-2010, 11:12
M1A Shooter after reading your post I got to thinking about the old days, before our high tech SD ammo. I remember guys putting splits in the front of lead ammo with a knife blade. I've seen guys cast lead bullets with paper in the nose or foil (years ago to make the split). I saw a guy do some 38's one time with a single split, which he inserted metal fish wire into with crimp on weights on both ends of a 8" wire, then wrapped it around a pencil and loaded it into the casing behind the bullet. I've even seen guys make their own hollow points with lead bullets, a drill bit and a drill press. Heck there is still a guy (at least a few years ago) selling a fixture to drill your own hollow points. They even have hollow point casting fixtures now for casting your own lead hollow points. I would not recommend any of the above when we have the good hollow points available in bulk.
The thing to remember if the shtf the first thing you will probably go to is a AR or AK high cap assault type weapon. A pistol will be a secondary or third choice weapon. Behind your rifle and shotgun.
If you reload pick up some good bulk hollow points, if not stock up a box or two at a time or 500 rounds at a time as you can afford it. Truly your talking a few pennies more for good quality JHP vs plated or non expanding I'd rather have 500 rounds of good SD ammo stored up then 700-800 of not so good.(Those are just example numbers its what ever your comfortable with, I have friends that keep 30K of ammo, others that keep a few hundred rounds)
Best of luck, I got rid of my casting stuff years ago. Check with the guys here that cast if you want inexpensive shooting thats the way to go...if you can find free or cheap lead.)

Do you remember when guys were making HPs and adding Mercury to the HPsand covering them with wax. Supposed to cause explosive injuries. Called them Mercury tipped ammo. Movies did a lot to make this nonsense work.:rofl:

AZBru88
09-19-2010, 11:40
Do you remember when guys were making HPs and adding Mercury to the HPsand covering them with wax. Supposed to cause explosive injuries. Called them Mercury tipped ammo. Movies did a lot to make this nonsense work.:rofl:
I remember guys inverting primers into HP's...I remember guys drilling SWC and putting steel sheet metal screws into them. Scary what people will try!
I always thought the Mercury was some deep dark CIA trick if you nicked them they died from Mercury poisoning!:rofl:Ya I think I watched to many movies as a kid!