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norton
10-15-2010, 18:18
Most of my die sets are either RCBS or Dillon.
today, I stopped at my dealers and picked up Lee dies for 9x19. I will be using my R/C for this cartridge. Don;t want to mess with changing primers tubes, etc to run them on my 550. I'll be loading 9mm in small quantities.
Anyway, the decapping die is carbide. My dealer suggested on the first case to lube the case-I picked up a bottle of Dillon lube. He thinks this will improve die use from there out.
I never lube my carbide dies.
What do GTR gurus think?

Boxerglocker
10-15-2010, 18:23
I use Horandy One shot to lube all my 9mm and .45 brass (2K a month).

No you don't NEED to if you use carbide dies, but it makes a huge difference in operation of the press specially a progressive and I would venture to say your SS too. Some guys I know use the Dillon lube, I prefer the HOS as it dires almost instantly. I rarely even tumble it off, as it if anything helps enhance feeding into the firearm.

GioaJack
10-15-2010, 18:25
Hell, from the thread title I thought this was going to be an obituary.

BTW... lubing your cases won't hurt a thing, will make sizing a tad easier but you're talking about sizing 9mm cases, not artillery shells.


Jack

WiskyT
10-15-2010, 18:27
Lee dies are great. No beed to lube. If you want, take a portion of your cases and give them a very light spritz with Pledge. Use the regualr Pledge, no the one that calims "no wax buildup". Mix the Pledged cases with the unPledged cases and size away. It lowers the effort to resize. The 9mm requires a little bit more effort to resize than straight walled cases. None of this is necessary, unless you have a week bench or problems with your hands etc. The Pledge doesn't need to be cleaned off and it won't effect your powder etc.

Colorado4Wheel
10-15-2010, 18:29
Lube them. It's not needed but it's a lot smoother.

Bob2223
10-15-2010, 19:33
Lube them. It's not needed but it's a lot smoother.

I agree.

Bob

dudel
10-16-2010, 01:48
No need to lube if you clean the dies AND the brass. If you lube the case, you'll have to clean it off as lubed cases put more pressure on the breechface.

Yes, it's a bit smoother; but not worth the extra work of cleaning the cases IMO. Just need to man up and build those biceps.

crazymoose
10-16-2010, 02:00
Hell, from the thread title I thought this was going to be an obituary.

Ditto.

"He just wasn't the same after Appommatox."

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Boxerglocker
10-16-2010, 02:35
No need to lube if you clean the dies AND the brass. If you lube the case, you'll have to clean it off as lubed cases put more pressure on the breechface.

Yes, it's a bit smoother; but not worth the extra work of cleaning the cases IMO. Just need to man up and build those biceps.

Dudel, no disrespect but how do you explain that?

Brian Enos is a HUGE advocate of lubing pistol cases and specifically recommends HOS, stating "If you try if try it you'll never load pistol again without doing so" He even endorses the fact that there is no real need to remove the lube as it in essence actually enhances feeding in the firearm. I've actually spoken to him personally about it during a phone conversation. How is it a man, world renowed do as a competitive shooter and as a reloading special material expert regarding pistol reloading would not state what you claim? BE has to has more rounds loaded than any dozen in this forum combined.

ColdShot
10-16-2010, 03:48
No need to lube if you clean the dies AND the brass. If you lube the case, you'll have to clean it off as lubed cases put more pressure on the breechface.

Yes, it's a bit smoother; but not worth the extra work of cleaning the cases IMO. Just need to man up and build those biceps.

I have never lubed a pistol case yet :tongueout:

To each his own - I like my steaks rare and my wife likes em dead
and I am not allowed to argue the fact that I think she killed the meat
and every real steak connoisseur knows the deal but this is a free country..Kill it,its your choice

dbarry
10-16-2010, 04:27
I've loaded a couple thousand 9mm on lee dies and never lubed a case. It does feel like I'm resizing an artillery shell every once in awhile. :O)

ki4dmh
10-16-2010, 04:47
Even though you don't have to lube your cases for carbide I still do. It just makes it that much smoother for you.
Happy loading
Scott

wanderinwalker
10-16-2010, 06:34
Every once in a while I will run a few lubed 9mm cases through the LEE sizing die. It does help reduce the force and smooth out the workflow. And by the time I get a bucket full of loaded ammo off the press, I've lost track of the lubed cases, so I just go shoot 'em. Lately I haven't pushed any slicked-up cases through, maybe I will run a few on the next reloading cycle.

The 9mm has a slight taper to the case and even with the carbide dies they do require a little more effort than a straight-wall cartridge like a .45 or .38. Or maybe that's as much effort as a bigger case to size a smaller one? :dunno:

dudel
10-16-2010, 06:54
Dudel, no disrespect but how do you explain that?

Brian Enos is a HUGE advocate of lubing pistol cases and specifically recommends HOS, stating "If you try if try it you'll never load pistol again without doing so" He even endorses the fact that there is no real need to remove the lube as it in essence actually enhances feeding in the firearm. I've actually spoken to him personally about it during a phone conversation. How is it a man, world renowed do as a competitive shooter and as a reloading special material expert regarding pistol reloading would not state what you claim? BE has to has more rounds loaded than any dozen in this forum combined.

Well, he also gets his guns for free:supergrin:

THe same lube that makes the brass slide through the die, also makes it slippery in the chamber. When then the round goes off, the brass expands and grips the chamber walls, until such time that pressre decreases, the slide move back and extracts to brass. With lubed brass, the brass does not grip the chamber walls, and the case slams back to the breechface. Not good for the brass, the breechface or the firing pin. One other reason people don't recommend an oily chamber.

If lubed cases were so good; ask yourself why no commercial ammo comes with lubed cases? If it were such a great idea, why isn't it available commercially.

Not to dis Brian; but shooting a gazillion rounds of one caliber (or two) in one particular event, doesn't necessarily make you an expert on firearms or ballistics. General concensus from many other loads/writers (who have loaded more rounds than Brian), recommend removing the lube.

However, it's still, for now, a free country and if you want to lube cases,
have at it. I was merely point out the downside to the OP.

From Sierra: http://www.sierrabullets.com/index.cfm?section=techservice&page=faq (search for lube)

<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 *********darkgreen align=center><TBODY><TR style="COLOR: #ffffff" *********#2c8a3c><TD>Question</TD><TD>Answer</TD></TR><TR *********#ffffff><TD vAlign=top>I don't want to waste my time wiping all the sizing lube off my cases after the resizing operation, but I've been told not to tumble loaded ammunition. Won't some lubrication help the cartridge chamber more easily? What happens if it is not removed before shooting?</TD><TD vAlign=top>Upon ignition, the case expands in all directions, with the case walls tightly gripping the chamber. Almost instantly, the case relaxes its grip on the chamber walls as the pressure starts to drop, allowing the case to be extracted. If the cartridge were lubricated, the case wouldn't be able to grip the chamber walls, allowing it to slam back sharply against the bolt face. In extreme examples, this force, called "bolt thrust," can even damage a firearm. For what it's worth, the British used to use lubricated cartridges to proof test a firearm, rather than the so called "blue pill" loads used here in the US. Wipe those cases, and make sure your chamber stays clean and dry!</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

OkieGunNut
10-16-2010, 07:05
I found the reference to Brian Enos rather amusing. BoxerGlocker must not shoot USPSA. The first time you drop a mag of "lubed rounds" into the dirt you won't do that again. Of course if you are one of the "prima donnas" who doesn't tape or record scores or RO then you will have time to take your mags apart and clean the dirt out of them and off your "lubed" rounds.
I don't even lube my mags (Glock) after cleaning them.

dudel
10-16-2010, 07:11
I found the reference to Brian Enos rather amusing. BoxerGlocker must not shoot USPSA. The first time you drop a mag of "lubed rounds" into the dirt you won't do that again. Of course if you are one of the "prima donnas" who doesn't tape or record scores or RO then you will have time to take your mags apart and clean the dirt out of them and off your "lubed" rounds.
I don't even lube my mags (Glock) after cleaning them.


:rofl::rofl::rofl:Brian must be looking for an unfair advantage having all the competion with lubed, gritty brass.:supergrin:

njl
10-16-2010, 07:51
Even in 9mm with a carbide sizer, lubed brass resizes so much easier, once you try it, you'll never go back.

Zombie Steve
10-16-2010, 08:13
I've tried One Shot on pistol brass - it does feel pretty good going through the die. Alas, I went back to not screwing around with it if I don't have to... I must be a masochist (or the CRB gene is really kicking in).

Boxerglocker
10-16-2010, 09:23
I found the reference to Brian Enos rather amusing. BoxerGlocker must not shoot USPSA. The first time you drop a mag of "lubed rounds" into the dirt you won't do that again. Of course if you are one of the "prima donnas" who doesn't tape or record scores or RO then you will have time to take your mags apart and clean the dirt out of them and off your "lubed" rounds.
I don't even lube my mags (Glock) after cleaning them.


I referenced BE cause thats the first time I ever heard of lubing pistol brass with HOS. I shoot IDPA and USPSA equally (hence my 2K month round count) and NEVER had the problem wet/dry or otherwise. If you have tried HOS you will know it actualy dries very well.
And yes I SO, tape, help take score, come in early before the crowd to help set-up stages whenever I can. We have over 100 shooters every match and there is plenty of time to clean out a mag, if you have to, but I never have specifically because I use HOS.
Like said to each his own, I'll continue to use it no skin off my nose. Regardless of Dudels xplaination may appear valid (for a bolt action firearm, not a semi auto) but at this point my G34 has over 36K of lubed rounds through it and appears no worse for wear in the breach or otherwise.
Your reason for being amused baffles me, bt now looking at your profile and reading a number of your past posts I see why, your new and obviously had taken the time to do the same would know, that I'm a avid shooter and though as Jack says a student of the art or reloading, take great pains to learn and pass on experiences to others.

GTG, monthly IDPA match at the home club this morning...

jwc17
10-16-2010, 09:24
I use Horandy One shot to lube all my 9mm and .45 brass (2K a month).

No you don't NEED to if you use carbide dies, but it makes a huge difference in operation of the press specially a progressive and I would venture to say your SS too. Some guys I know use the Dillon lube, I prefer the HOS as it dires almost instantly. I rarely even tumble it off, as it if anything helps enhance feeding into the firearm.

My experience exactly. I have tried other case lubes, but HOS is easiest and works best for me.

Uncle Don
10-16-2010, 11:13
The only pistol case I use HOS on is 357 Sig. Guess it must be a solid bench, but count me with the camp that doesn't bother lubing.

Bello
10-16-2010, 11:54
to be honest i never lubed or prolly will ever lube my brass i just dont see the need

GeorgiaRedfish
10-16-2010, 11:57
OP Bruce Lee died a long time ago

norton
10-16-2010, 12:24
OP Bruce Lee died a long time ago

And Kung Fu movies have never been the same.

Wonder if B. Lee was a reloader?

WiskyT
10-16-2010, 15:13
Pledge doesn't attract dirt or collect sand. You take about 1/3 of the overall batch of cases you are going to reload, and put a very light spritz on them, less than one second. Mix the "lubed" cases in with the unlubed ones and load away. I got the idea from Richard Lee, who is still alive AFAIK. Well, I didn't get it from him personally, I read it in his book. Sierra may be referring to actual case lube, relatively large quantities of very slippery stuff used on very high rearward thrust rounds like 30-06.

My ammo smells lemony fresh and my wife really notices the difference:supergrin:

Colorado4Wheel
10-16-2010, 18:13
1) Mix 99% Alcohol and Lee Lube ($3) 10:1. Basically 16 oz alchohol to 1 tube of lube. MIX. That is the only hard part as it's a PITA to mix. I make a 50/50 past first to get it started. Then add more alcohol till it's mixed real good.
2) Spray that a couple times in a big zip lock bag.
3) Pour in the brass you just tumbled and shake.
4) Pour in a bucket.

Takes about 30 secs on the high side. It's not oily, can't even feel it. But makes it run so much easier.

robin303
10-16-2010, 18:42
1) Mix 99% Alcohol and Lee Lube ($3) 10:1. Basically 16 oz alchohol to 1 tube of lube. MIX. That is the only hard part as it's a PITA to mix. I make a 50/50 past first to get it started. Then add more alcohol till it's mixed real good.
2) Spray that a couple times in a big zip lock bag.
3) Pour in the brass you just tumbled and shake.
4) Pour in a bucket.

Takes about 30 secs on the high side. It's not oily, can't even feel it. But makes it run so much easier.

This is what I been doing and it works great. Seems cheaper than HOS.

shotgunred
10-16-2010, 18:51
To be perfectly honest I have never lubed pistol cases before reading this thread. I was just making up my ammo for next weeks match. So I decided to give it a go. I loaded up 100 rounds. Then I got out my dillion one shot and sprayed the next 100 rounds. All I can say is I can't find a good reason not to use it. It reduces drag by 3/4. So the machine runs smother. It runs faster and takes me less effort. I can't seem to find a down side. I am a convert!

If you are worried about attracting dirt or sand just run the finished round back through the case cleaner for a quick cleaning and another polish.

WiskyT
10-16-2010, 18:53
To be perfectly honest I have never lubed pistol cases before reading this thread. I was just making up my ammo for next weeks match. So I decided to give it a go. I loaded up 100 rounds. Then I got out my dillion one shot and sprayed the next 100 rounds. All I can say is I can't find a good reason not to use it. It reduces drag by 3/4. So the machine runs smother. It runs faster and takes me less effort. I can't seem to find a down side. I am a convert!

If you are worried about attracting dirt or sand just run the finished round back through the case cleaner for a quick cleaning and another polish.

Red, I never used the Dillon spray, but try lubing only half the cases next time and mix them back in with the unlubed ones. It will probably work just as well.

Colorado4Wheel
10-16-2010, 18:56
This is what I been doing and it works great. Seems cheaper than HOS.

It is pretty cheap. 20 oz or so for $4-5 bucks. Last forever because it's just for pistol when you use carbide dies anyway so you only need a little to make a bid difference.

norton
10-16-2010, 20:16
I just ran 100 rounds through the decapping/resizing die. First 50 or so were lubed-Dillon DCL- the last 50 not.
It is much smoother lubing, but not enough to get me to convert.

Back to dry for me.

DWARREN123
10-16-2010, 20:32
I have used only Lee dies and have reloaded 380 ACP, 9mm, 32 mag, 40 S&W, 38 SPL and 357 mag and never lubed the brass but I do clean the dies ever so often.

njl
10-16-2010, 22:07
What I've been doing for pistol brass is get just a little bit of pure lanolin on my thumb and index finger and just handling the brass on the way to station 1 lubes it a tiny bit. I don't bother doing anything to remove it. I've done several thousand rounds of 9mm and .45 like this.

I have Dillon and HOS...but haven't gotten around to actually trying either of them.

Colorado4Wheel
10-17-2010, 07:34
I just ran 100 rounds through the decapping/resizing die. First 50 or so were lubed-Dillon DCL- the last 50 not.
It is much smoother lubing, but not enough to get me to convert.

Back to dry for me.

Single stage or progressive?

I prefer the Lee stuff I use because it's not oily at all. Dillon is a oil, Lee is some sort of powder when you dilute it for use. Never used HOS so I don't know if it's oily or not.