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EL_NinO619
11-03-2010, 13:09
Right now i have a few different powder's on hand. So the other night i did a little "hand loading" The loading season took a lot longer the usually because i only loaded 12 rounds with each powder. So i just used the LEE dipper and my trusty RCBS trickler. I loaded all rounds with 168gr Sierra HPBT

1st load: Win once fired brass. OAL 2.013
CCI Bench Rest primer
Powder: 3031 39gr C.O.A.L 2.798

2nd: Win once fired. OAL 2.013
CCI BR. Powder: RE-15 42gr C.O.A.L 2.798

3rd: "Same brass and primer"
Powder: H-Varget 40.3gr C.O.A.L 2.798 Load #4 Powder: Tac 40.4 C.O.A.L 2.799

I am going to take them to the range and see which one shoots the best 3 shoot group @ 100yds.

I am not playing with the OAL yet, because i have tried to use the method with a Sharpie and seating the bullet long until you get a mark. I never got a mark, So i think my Remi has a huge chamber or something. But i will post the Range Report when i go. Has any one tried this tool from Hornady?:dunno:

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=570611

ilgunguygt
11-03-2010, 13:56
Are these .308?


ETA: Ok, i see, it is. You dont list the charge weight for varget, but hodgdon says 42 I believe. Alliant says max charge of 45gr of RE 15 @2.800" w/ a 168gr bthp.

Hodgdon also has 39gr max with the 3031. I dont think I would start at a max load.

PS I also notice you are missing a test round for reduced load WTF. I hear its all the rage out east from you.

XDRoX
11-03-2010, 14:35
PS I also notice you are missing a test round for reduced load WTF. I hear its all the rage out east from you.

:rofl:
That's not a problem, every time El Nino comes over he complains about all the spilled powder on my garage floor. Even though he's added his fair share of spills:rofl:

GioaJack
11-03-2010, 14:41
:rofl:
That's not a problem, every time El Nino comes over he complains about all the spilled powder on my garage floor. Even though he's added his fair share of spills:rofl:


Drop a match, quickest way to clean it up.

(Vacuuming it up could be dangerous.)


Jack

XDRoX
11-03-2010, 14:47
Drop a match, quickest way to clean it up.

(Vacuuming it up could be dangerous.)


Jack

That's what we usually do. The other night I swept and lit it. El Nino was loading and complained about the smell of burning dirt, powder, lint, and a few dead bugs:rofl: I thought it was fun.

I don't complain when he's sucking down cigarettes between caliber changes:whistling:

EL_NinO619
11-03-2010, 15:10
That's what we usually do. The other night I swept and lit it. El Nino was loading and complained about the smell of burning dirt, powder, lint, and a few dead bugs:rofl: I thought it was fun.

I don't complain when he's sucking down cigarettes between caliber changes:whistling:

WTF is it pick on justin day. I voted R blame your wife..

EL_NinO619
11-03-2010, 15:15
Are these .308?


ETA: Ok, i see, it is. You dont list the charge weight for varget, but hodgdon says 42 I believe. Alliant says max charge of 45gr of RE 15 @2.800" w/ a 168gr bthp.

Hodgdon also has 39gr max with the 3031. I dont think I would start at a max load.

PS I also notice you are missing a test round for reduced load WTF. I hear its all the rage out east from you.

I am not starting with 3031. I have been using that powder for awhile. Plus 3031 max is 41 gr. These are all load i already have shot or worked up to except tac, and that the starting load. Just going to see what s more accurate

P.S. Sorry for missing info on the 1st post, i got interrupted about 5 times while trying to write it...

EL_NinO619
11-03-2010, 18:00
That's what we usually do. The other night I swept and lit it. El Nino was loading and complained about the smell of burning dirt, powder, lint, and a few dead bugs:rofl: I thought it was fun.

I don't complain when he's sucking down cigarettes between caliber changes:whistling:

I don't complain when you have Sissy Vodka breath..:ack::rofl: Drink like a man..:drinkie: Man up with a Jack&Coke... Caliber Change :smoking:..

GioaJack
11-03-2010, 18:10
I don't complain when you have Sissy Vodka breath..:ack::rofl: Drink like a man..:drinkie: Man up with a Jack&Coke... Caliber Change :smoking:..


REAL MEN don't dilute their liquor with anything, including ice.

Rookies are ruining this whole world. :crying:


Jack

ilgunguygt
11-03-2010, 18:20
I am not starting with 3031. I have been using that powder for awhile. Plus 3031 max is 41 gr. These are all load i already have shot or worked up to except tac, and that the starting load. Just going to see what s more accurate

P.S. Sorry for missing info on the 1st post, i got interrupted about 5 times while trying to write it...
I was using hodgdon data, they show a max online of 39gr. So there!:tongueout:

Yeah, getting interrupted stinks. My 10 year old loves to carry on in-depth conversations when I am at my busiest.

EL_NinO619
11-03-2010, 18:54
I was using hodgdon data, they show a max online of 39gr. So there!:tongueout:

Yeah, getting interrupted stinks. My 10 year old loves to carry on in-depth conversations when I am at my busiest.

On my Hodgdon site it says this?

<table border="0" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="2" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td class="mini" align="center">168 GR. SIE HPBT </td> <td class="mini" align="center">IMR </td> <td class="mini" align="center">IMR 3031 </td> <td class="mini" align="center">.308" </td> <td class="mini" align="center">2.800" </td> <td class="mini" align="center">39.0 </td> <td class="mini" align="center">2507 </td> <td class="mini" align="center">43,900 PSI </td> <td class="mini" align="center">42.0 </td> <td class="mini" align="center">2710 </td> <td class="mini" align="center">58,900 PSI </td></tr></tbody></table>

PhantomF4E
11-03-2010, 19:13
Jack nails it again. No dilution in the solution. Water, ice, "sugary drinks" (I believe that's the new liberal definition), etc. If you like it cold, throw it in the freezer, it won't ice over.. It's like shoving fruit down a beer bottle. Or ordering a Heiniken in an American Legion in the midwest . You might try it once,..., once.

ilgunguygt
11-03-2010, 19:20
On my Hodgdon site it says this?

<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=2 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD class=mini align=middle>168 GR. SIE HPBT </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>IMR </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>IMR 3031 </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>.308" </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>2.800" </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>39.0 </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>2507 </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>43,900 PSI </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>42.0 </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>2710 </TD><TD class=mini align=middle>58,900 PSI </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Nope, thats only on your screen, not here at all :whistling:.

Sorry, I looked in a hurry at the wrong spot in the data. I could have said 46?:rofl:

n2extrm
11-03-2010, 20:41
El_nino

My Remingtons (700's in 308) all have long throats,the longest was about 2.980" using a 168 SMK.

I had my best results with the 42.0 of RE-15. Although I never broke 2600 fps. 5 shot groups well under half an inch at 100 yards. I also have one 700 that refuses to shoot any longer of an OAL then 2.800 inches.

You can try to find your distance to the lands another way. Try this.

Take a case fired in your rifle, DO NOT resize it just as it was fired. Use a crimping pliers or a something similar dent or distort the neck very slightly. Try to get it so you can seat a bullet by hand and move it in and out of the case with slight finger pressure. Leave it real long and chamber it. Carefully unload the rifle and carefully measure the OAL. Try to do it several times, if you keep getting 2.910 inches (or what ever you get) then that is your distance to the lands for THAT bullet. It will be different with a different brand or weight bullet. The key is to try to get repeatable results.

Most of the time you can subtract .010 to .015 inches from the number you get and work from there. This will give you a jump of .010" to .015". Keep in mind that everything has an effect on everything else. A jam into the lands can raise pressure, making the OAL longer will lower it, till you get to jamming into the lands. Watch for pressure signs.

You may end up getting a bullet stuck in the rifle, don't panic. Take a cleaning rod and place it down the barrel (use a bore guide if you have one to protect the crown) and a light tap will Knock it out.

EL_NinO619
11-03-2010, 21:05
El_nino

My Remingtons (700's in 308) all have long throats,the longest was about 2.980" using a 168 SMK.

I had my best results with the 42.0 of RE-15. Although I never broke 2600 fps. 5 shot groups well under half an inch at 100 yards. I also have one 700 that refuses to shoot any longer of an OAL then 2.800 inches.

You can try to find your distance to the lands another way. Try this.

Take a case fired in your rifle, DO NOT resize it just as it was fired. Use a crimping pliers or a something similar dent or distort the neck very slightly. Try to get it so you can seat a bullet by hand and move it in and out of the case with slight finger pressure. Leave it real long and chamber it. Carefully unload the rifle and carefully measure the OAL. Try to do it several times, if you keep getting 2.910 inches (or what ever you get) then that is your distance to the lands for THAT bullet. It will be different with a different brand or weight bullet. The key is to try to get repeatable results.

Most of the time you can subtract .010 to .015 inches from the number you get and work from there. This will give you a jump of .010" to .015". Keep in mind that everything has an effect on everything else. A jam into the lands can raise pressure, making the OAL longer will lower it, till you get to jamming into the lands. Watch for pressure signs.

You may end up getting a bullet stuck in the rifle, don't panic. Take a cleaning rod and place it down the barrel (use a bore guide if you have one to protect the crown) and a light tap will Knock it out.

I figured my Remington had a Large throat (just like my ex girlfriend) (And she used to fire when i thought i put her on safe mode to, Weird):dunno:

But i will try that out. Thanks a lot. I have also found my best group so far is RE-15 42gr. I guess .308 rounds like it. And i also have a bore guide, a must have if you care about your rifle:supergrin:. Will try with my next batch and make sure i watch for over pressure, again Thank you.:supergrin:

n2extrm
11-03-2010, 21:14
I figured my Remington had a Large throat (just like my ex girlfriend) (And she used to fire when i thought i put her on safe mode to, Weird):dunno:

But i will try that out. Thanks a lot. I have also found my best group so far is RE-15 42gr. I guess .308 rounds like it. And i also have a bore guide, a must have if you care about your rifle:supergrin:. Will try with my next batch and make sure i watch for over pressure, again Thank you.:supergrin:


I should have said Muzzle guide, a bore guide won't work at the muzzel end. Sorry for the typo. Just be carefull of the crown if you get a bullet stuck.

GioaJack
11-03-2010, 21:14
I figured my Remington had a Large throat (just like my ex girlfriend) (And she used to fire when i thought i put her on safe mode to, Weird):dunno:

But i will try that out. Thanks a lot. I have also found my best group so far is RE-15 42gr. I guess .308 rounds like it. And i also have a bore guide, a must have if you care about your rifle supergrin:


Why are you cleaning a 700 from the muzzle? Get Fred, or a Girl Scout to show you how to remove the bolt. :whistling:


Jack

EL_NinO619
11-04-2010, 00:44
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Why are you cleaning a 700 from the muzzle? Get Fred, or a Girl Scout to show you how to remove the bolt. :whistling:


Jack

:faint:I don't clean from the muzzle. He was talking about if you get a bullet stuck trying to find you OAL..GOOD MED'S:embarassed:

fredj338
11-04-2010, 13:37
The 308 is pretty forgiving as to accuracy & powders. IMO, you aren't likely to find the best load playing w/ 3 powders & one charge wt each. Rifle bbls have this harmonic vibration thing & small changes can net large accuracy diff. I would work w/ one powder, one bullet in 0.3gr increments from midrange to max, looking for the accuracy & watching pressures.
There is a method, if you have 300yds to shoot, called audette. Where you fire single shots in 0.3gr (for 308) into one target, note there location (requires good spotting scope or a long walk) & then you'll see a group form around a certain vel level.

EL_NinO619
11-04-2010, 17:47
The 308 is pretty forgiving as to accuracy & powders. IMO, you aren't likely to find the best load playing w/ 3 powders & one charge wt each. Rifle bbls have this harmonic vibration thing & small changes can net large accuracy diff. I would work w/ one powder, one bullet in 0.3gr increments from midrange to max, looking for the accuracy & watching pressures.
There is a method, if you have 300yds to shoot, called audette. Where you fire single shots in 0.3gr (for 308) into one target, note there location (requires good spotting scope or a long walk) & then you'll see a group form around a certain vel level.


Fred i have a Bull barrel, but i suspect you are talking about in the Chamber? But again it would be great if you ever get a chance to come down to SD. Then you could just show me..:embarassed:

P.S my range is 300yds. I would be glad to pay your fee for the day when you come down..

n2extrm
11-04-2010, 18:01
Harmonics are there no matter how heavy the barrel. The best thing is to usually work with one powder, try to nail down a charge as Fred said. You can shoot for groups at 100 200 or 300. Get the best groups you can consistently.

Now you play with the bullet depth, use the charge you picked and seat the bullet in and out in something like .005" increments and see what happens to your groups, watch for pressure signs etc. If you are close to a max charge I would back off before seating into the lands. When you get a seating depth that works you can try playing with powder again, but it probably won't change much if at all.

I don't know if you have read this but there is some good info here.
http://www.6mmbr.com/308Win.html

Rick from Kali
11-04-2010, 18:13
168 HPBT IMR 4064 41.5 grains.
Rick

fredj338
11-04-2010, 18:25
Fred i have a Bull barrel, but i suspect you are talking about in the Chamber? But again it would be great if you ever get a chance to come down to SD. Then you could just show me..:embarassed:

P.S my range is 300yds. I would be glad to pay your fee for the day when you come down..

As N2 notes, ALL bbls have a harmonic vbration when a bullet passes down it. The heavier, stiffer & shorter the bbl, the less the vibration should matter. If you have a really good spotting scope, you can see the bullet holes @ 300 & track them, crucial for the AAudette methode. You can google that to read more on how to interpret results. I would love to come down sometime. I am teaching a reloading class this Sat here & then off to Indian next week to hunt whitetail w/ Bob & my 44mag.:supergrin:

EL_NinO619
11-05-2010, 11:32
As N2 notes, ALL bbls have a harmonic vbration when a bullet passes down it. The heavier, stiffer & shorter the bbl, the less the vibration should matter. If you have a really good spotting scope, you can see the bullet holes @ 300 & track them, crucial for the AAudette methode. You can google that to read more on how to interpret results. I would love to come down sometime. I am teaching a reloading class this Sat here & then off to Indian next week to hunt whitetail w/ Bob & my 44mag.:supergrin:

I have a decent spotting scope ( Cabelas 60x) and will give that a try. Have fun with the whitetail. I don't hunt, but been waiting to try some venison meat.:tongueout:. A pistol huh? Got to get up close and personal with that, and what kind of rounds do you use.

GioaJack
11-05-2010, 11:36
As N2 notes, ALL bbls have a harmonic vbration when a bullet passes down it. The heavier, stiffer & shorter the bbl, the less the vibration should matter. If you have a really good spotting scope, you can see the bullet holes @ 300 & track them, crucial for the AAudette methode. You can google that to read more on how to interpret results. I would love to come down sometime. I am teaching a reloading class this Sat here & then off to Indian next week to hunt whitetail w/ Bob & my 44mag.:supergrin:




Bob2223 won't be able to witness the actual hunt, ya know because of that restraining order thingy and the 1000 foot limitation for being around guns. :whistling:


Jack

fredj338
11-05-2010, 12:05
I have a decent spotting scope ( Cabelas 60x) and will give that a try. Have fun with the whitetail. I don't hunt, but been waiting to try some venison meat.:tongueout:. A pistol huh? Got to get up close and personal with that, and what kind of rounds do you use.
Not that close. I am hunting w/ a scoped RBHB, good to100yds from a field rest. My backup is a 4" M29, 4" groups @ 50yds from a field postion w/ open sights. Plenty good for deer. My own handloads; 270grLHP @ 1200fps+ from the longer Ruger. I am looking forward to see if it does as well in meat as wetpack.:supergrin:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/44-272.jpg
Bob2223 won't be able to witness the actual hunt, ya know because of that restraining order thingy and the 1000 foot limitation for being around guns.
Now Jack, you know those charges were dropped. Besides, I think he lives so far back in the woods, the law can't find him!:rofl: