3 year old computer fried its mother board...what to do? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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mixflip
11-13-2010, 12:04
I have a 3 year old desk top PC (HP) that crashed hard a few weeks back. It wont even power up anymore!

Turns out something happened to the mother board because more than half of the capacitors are popped. (those little barrel looking thingies, tops are bulged) I think too much dust build up lead to over heating? I feel kinda stupid for not keeping it clean. It did have alot of dust inside when it died.

I was told by a tech that its going to cost as much as a new computer to replace the mother board. That being said...what can I salvage out of this computer?

It has a 360 Gig HD,AMD Athlon 64x2 dual core processor, a DVD burner, 2 Gig memory. I was thinking I could take out those parts and get a shop to make my HD into an external HD for storage?

What else can I salvage from it? As you can tell I am not a computer guy.

JFrame
11-13-2010, 12:10
Mixflip -- unless there's something unusual about the HD in your toasted machine, I'm thinking you can just get a USB housing online (or at a local Best Buy or other electronics store), and put together the external drive yourself. You just have to make sure the housing is appropriate to the size of the drive -- then it's pretty much a matter of plugging the connectors and screwing it into the housing...

.

Green_Manelishi
11-13-2010, 12:16
That being said...what can I salvage out of this computer?


The drive is a keeper. The decision to make is do you want it external or an additional drive within the new box.

srhoades
11-13-2010, 12:20
If you are looking to get out on the cheap you can probably find a used or even new board for less than $50 on eBay. Swap it out and your good to go.

mixflip
11-13-2010, 12:29
Is it hard to remove th eold mother board and install a new one if I got a used on on ebay? (or some where on the internet)

srhoades
11-13-2010, 12:45
Not that hard. Unplug everything, remove the processor and heat sinc, take out 6-9 screws, and then just reverse the process with the new board.

mixflip
11-13-2010, 12:52
I think I might give it a try if I can find a mother board for it? I was just going to gut it and trash it anyway.

I have all the original start up disks so maybe there is still hope?

j-glock22
11-13-2010, 13:26
unfortunately the store tech is right. One of the down sides of buying a brand name pc, OEM parts are generally exclusive (mainly the motherboard) and not easily replaceable unless you are very well educated in how pc's work and compatibility of parts and locating drivers and such.

IndyGunFreak
11-13-2010, 14:04
I think I might give it a try if I can find a mother board for it? I was just going to gut it and trash it anyway.

I have all the original start up disks so maybe there is still hope?

The bigger question is, why did the motherboard Spaz.

If it shorted out, there's a chance it ruined other things connected directly to it (memory, cpu). Your hard drive and Optical drive are likely fine.

You might be able to get a motherboard to fit in an OEM case, but it can be difficult. Worse case scenario, pick up a cheap case to. If everything happens to be good(memory, cpu,fan, optical, hard drive, etc..) and you can fix it for $50 motherboard and $50 case... you'll come out way ahead (assuming you are happy w/ the PC otherwise of course)

IGF

Drjones
11-13-2010, 15:19
The bigger question is, why did the motherboard Spaz.

If it shorted out, there's a chance it ruined other things connected directly to it (memory, cpu). Your hard drive and Optical drive are likely fine.




I'd also put my money on this; it's likely that other parts are fried too if the mobo was screwed up enough to be physically damaged like that...

Pull the hard drive, put it in a USB enclosure so you can get to your old data and buy a new machine. Also buy a new power strip/battery backup since that is probably fried too if you had a power surge that killed your computer.

In the end, you'll save yourself a ton of time, money and headache by just buying a new computer that will be faster than your old one ever was anyway.

Linux3
11-13-2010, 16:15
My employer, for a previous project, use to by Dell servers by the skid load.
We had hundreds of systems fail because of the capacitor plague.
You can read about it here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague

HP was one of the manufacturers hit by the plague.

In a nutshell some Taiwanese capacitor makes stole the formula for a new type of cap. Sad to say they didn't get the whole formula and the caps burst open. Funny story unless you were impacted by it.

Have you contacted HP?

mixflip
11-13-2010, 20:21
I havent talked to HP. I figured since I bought it a few years ago (Dec of 2007) that it would be a waste of time? Its well past the warranty.

mixflip
11-14-2010, 00:45
Ah haaa I found out exactly what happened to my CPU. I took off the fan and heat sink off to take a look at my processor and it looked burnt just like this video I found on youtube. It sucks!!!! It was a dual core processor too!!! I am fairly certain that me neglecting to clean off all the lint that was on the fan was the reason it fried.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgOmMAasqto&feature=related

Patrick Graham
11-14-2010, 09:34
The bigger question is, why did the motherboard Spaz.
....................

IGF

Yes, that's the question.

Electrolytic caps will look swelled if they get hit with serious over-voltage.

If that's the case almost everything in that system could be toast..

c6601a
11-14-2010, 21:58
Ah haaa I found out exactly what happened to my CPU. I took off the fan and heat sink off to take a look at my processor and it looked burnt just like this video I found on youtube. It sucks!!!! It was a dual core processor too!!! I am fairly certain that me neglecting to clean off all the lint that was on the fan was the reason it fried.That video was posted 4 years ago and the copyright was from 2001. The information in it is no longer valid. All recent Intel and AMD processors have thermal protection built in. If you run one without a heat sink, they will slow down and then shut down. They will not smoke like the AMD processors did in the video.

The only way for the processor to smoke like that is if it saw too much voltage. Dead output caps on the processor's power supply will do that. An over voltage on the main power supply will also do that. Considering that a lot of caps on the board are blown, I would suspect that it is an over-voltage out of the main power supply, which means everything in the box is damaged or dead, possibly including the hard drives.

Whatever you do, I would not use the main power supply or anything form the motherboard on another computer. I would not even try it to see if it still works, because doing that may damage the new computer. I would test the hard drives and see if they work. If they do, I would pull the data from them and discard them too. It is just not worth the risk.

If you want more details, lots and lots more, here's the detailed explanation. The power plug in your computer connects to the main power supply. This power supply takes 110V or 220V and produces 3.3V, 5V, +12V and -12V for use by everything else on the computer. The motherboard has several additional power supplies on it, some time as many as 15 to 20 of them. These take the 3.3V, 5V and 12V and produce the voltages required by various things on the board.

The biggest one of them typically runs from 12V and generate the roughly 1V for the processor. In order to keep the cost low, the voltage rating on the power supply components (capacitors and MOSFETs) is usually fairly close to the maximum input voltage. If the main power supply fails and the 5V or +12V gets much higher than it is supposed to be, the input capacitors and MOSFETs fail, causing the 1V to the processor to get much higher, causing it to smoke.

The hard drive uses the 5V and +12V for its operation. If those voltages get much higher, circuits on the hard drives will fail, killing the drive. The platters (which store the actual information) and likely the motor are still good. The heads may or may not have survived. If you test the drive and it turns up bad, there are companies that can still recover the data from them by replacing the circuit board with one from an identical drive (there is actually more to it). The service costs a lot of money. If the data you have on the disk is really important and you are willing to spend a lot of money, the companies can ever replace the dead heads. Like I said, be prepared to spend a lot of money if you need to have that done.

Good luck.

mixflip
11-16-2010, 00:51
Thanks for the great info. I have scraped the blown HP Pavilion A6200N desktop computer. It was just not worth it for me to invest in it after reading what everybody explained could be the possible problem.

I salvaged the 2 memory cards. (1Gig each)
I salvaged the 360Gig HDD.
I salvaged the DVD RW optical drive w/ light scribe

...and thats pretty much it. I picked up a used Dell Optiplex GX520 tower only (it was a refurbished desktop from a dentist office I bought from a computer shop for $200) with a Pentium 4HT processor, 80Gig HD, running windows XP, AVG, malwarebytes and ccleaner, I swapped in the 2 Gig of RAM and I plan to piggybacked the 360Gig HD internally but have not connected it yet. As c660ia mentioned, I will have the old HDD tested then install it if I can?

The Dell already has a DVD drive so I dont think I really need to swap in the DVD RW drive do I? Plus the DVD RW drive has a SATA connection while the Dell uses a IDE connection. I heard there is an adapter that allows SATA to IDE but like I said, I dont know if I even need the other DVD RW drive?

Question? If the 360Gig HD is not fried, what do I need to do to use it? I cant just plug and play right? Do I have to wipe it clean and reformat it?

I actually like this industrial looking Dell Optiplex. Its the same model computer I use at work which is probably why it looks so business/commercial/HUGE?

IndyGunFreak
11-16-2010, 04:38
Question? If the 360Gig HD is not fried, what do I need to do to use it? I cant just plug and play right? Do I have to wipe it clean and reformat it?

Yes, you should be able to just plug it in and use it.

If it's SATA, just plug it in, and boot the first hard drive(80gig). The OS will load, and simply detect your 360gig drive as an additional hard drive.

If it's IDE.. You need to check the back of the drive and look to see where the little plastic "jumper" is set. It's likely set to Master now. You're going to need to change it to either Slave or Cable Select, then you should be able to "daisy chain"(two drives on one cable) it to the other drive. Then just boot the 80gig drive and use the 360gig as a slave.

As for formatting the drive, it's really up to you. Personally, if I could find a way, I would. However, there's a big difference in space between 80gigs and 360gigs. If you can get all data you want to keep, temporarily onto the 80gig drive, and format it, then I would. You figure w/ the "OS" files, the restore partition, etc. That drive probably has a pretty good amount of space being taken by files, etc.. that you do not need anymore.

If the 80gig is to small to get your important data from the 360gig... then I would just go through and start deleting system files, etc.. that the old OS was using, since you will not need them anymore.

IGF

mixflip
11-16-2010, 18:24
Update, I plugged in the 360gig HD via SATA and the computer does not recognize it at all. I just plugged it in the additional HD slot and kept the 80gig as the master but when I went to "my computer" to look at the 360gig HDD it just did not exist. So I am assuming it is fried right?

IndyGunFreak
11-16-2010, 19:07
Update, I plugged in the 360gig HD via SATA and the computer does not recognize it at all. I just plugged it in the additional HD slot and kept the 80gig as the master but when I went to "my computer" to look at the 360gig HDD it just did not exist. So I am assuming it is fried right?

Possibly...

Is the 80gig SATA?
Did you try booting just the 360gig drive, w/o the 80gig drive attatched?

mixflip
11-16-2010, 21:05
Yes, I tried to boot the computer with just the 360gig drive and nothing happened. I swapped in the 80gig and it started right up. I then tried to daisy chain the 360gig drive to the 80gig...and like mentioned earlier...no recognition.

I really hope the 360gig drive isnt trashed but oh well it is what it is.

Sgt. Schultz
11-16-2010, 22:36
If the Dell Optiplex GX520 came with IDE drives installed you need to check the BIOS settings and make sure that the SATA drives option is enabled ... on most Dell's this is turned off by default unless SATA drives are present.


.

IndyGunFreak
11-16-2010, 22:40
If the Dell Optiplex GX520 came with IDE drives installed you need to check the BIOS settings and make sure that the SATA drives option is enabled ... on most Dell's this is turned off by default unless SATA drives are present.


.

Exactly, you've still not really said if the 80gig is IDE or SATA.

IGF

mixflip
11-17-2010, 03:35
oops, yes the 80gig is SATA. The DVD drive is IDE. I didnt check the BIOS setting since the 80gig is SATA connected.

Sgt. Schultz
11-17-2010, 07:44
oops, yes the 80gig is SATA. The DVD drive is IDE. I didnt check the BIOS setting since the 80gig is SATA connected.That should be the next thing to check, since the other SATA connections aren't being used they are probably disabled ... another Dell default.

mixflip
11-17-2010, 10:55
Indy and Sgt...you were absolutely right. Dell BIOS was defaulted to "off" for the 2nd SATA port. I pressed F2 on start up to access BIOS and selected "on" for the 2nd SATA drive and it now shows up on "my computer" as additional disk drives.

Thanks for the help!!!

Now something else came up that I cant figure out. The drive is a 360gig but when it shows up on "my computer" is shows up as 2 separate drives. Even more perplexing is that both drives do not add up to 360gigs? One drive is showing 48gig and the other shows 9gigs when I check the "properties" of each drive. Thats nowhere near 360gigs!

I have already wiped the 360gig clean of all the old HP files so the 360gig drive is blank.

Any idea why the 360gig HD is showing up as 2 drives and only showing up as 57gigs(total) and not 360gigs?

IndyGunFreak
11-17-2010, 11:10
Indy and Sgt...you were absolutely right. Dell BIOS was defaulted to "off" for the 2nd SATA port. I pressed F2 on start up to access BIOS and selected "on" for the 2nd SATA drive and it now shows up on "my computer" as additional disk drives.

Thanks for the help!!!

Now something else came up that I cant figure out. The drive is a 360gig but when it shows up on "my computer" is shows up as 2 separate drives. Even more perplexing is that both drives do not add up to 360gigs? One drive is showing 48gig and the other shows 9gigs when I check the "properties" of each drive. Thats nowhere near 360gigs!

I have already wiped the 360gig clean of all the old HP files so the 360gig drive is blank.

Any idea why the 360gig HD is showing up as 2 drives and only showing up as 57gigs(total) and not 360gigs?

That really doesn't make any sense, what tool did you use to format it?

IGF

mixflip
11-17-2010, 11:24
Format? I did not format it. (sorry I am a computer noob)

(Geez, I hope I dont screw this thing up lol) I have never messed around with computers this much so this is all new to me. How do I format the 360gig HD? Just right click and choose format right?

update - I formatted the drive but it still only showed 48gigs and 9 gigs? This is weird???

IndyGunFreak
11-17-2010, 13:36
Format? I did not format it. (sorry I am a computer noob)

(Geez, I hope I dont screw this thing up lol) I have never messed around with computers this much so this is all new to me. How do I format the 360gig HD? Just right click and choose format right?

update - I formatted the drive but it still only showed 48gigs and 9 gigs? This is weird???

Well... When you said you had already "wiped it clean".. I assumed that meant you formatted it, which erases all the data. So hopefully anything you had on there, you had backed up, if you did indeed format it.

It sounds like there's some parts of the drive, that for some reason, the new XP is not seeing. Do you have a blank CD... I can talk you through downloading a pretty easy Drive partition tool and burning it to a CD.. Then we can use that to look at the partitions on the drive, and try to figure out what's going on.

If you want some more info, you can shoot me a PM... It'll be easier to help you when I know we are both going to be online for about 20-30min... It shouldn't take very long.

Sgt. Schultz
11-17-2010, 14:47
Start - Run "diskmgmt.msc" minus the quotes, select the drive in question, right click and delete the partitions. then you should have one the full size of the drive, create a new partition and format it.

IndyGunFreak
11-17-2010, 15:08
Start - Run "diskmgmt.msc" minus the quotes, select the drive in question, right click and delete the partitions. then you should have one the full size of the drive, create a new partition and format it.

Sometimes, I think I'm worse for the wear because my Windows-foo has gotten so weak, and I always look to Linux tools first.. ;)

Never even know that existed. The only question of course, becomes if there's still data on the drive he wants/needs, then that will delete it.

IGF

Sgt. Schultz
11-17-2010, 15:32
Sometimes, I think I'm worse for the wear because my Windows-foo has gotten so weak, and I always look to Linux tools first.. ;)

Never even know that existed. The only question of course, becomes if there's still data on the drive he wants/needs, then that will delete it.

IGF He updated a post saying that he did in fact format the drive so I figured he must have retrieved any data that he needed ... if not it's too late now :whistling: ... unless he uses a 3rd party recovery tool.

kc8ykd
11-17-2010, 16:20
My employer, for a previous project, use to by Dell servers by the skid load.
We had hundreds of systems fail because of the capacitor plague.
You can read about it here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague

HP was one of the manufacturers hit by the plague.

In a nutshell some Taiwanese capacitor makes stole the formula for a new type of cap. Sad to say they didn't get the whole formula and the caps burst open. Funny story unless you were impacted by it.

Have you contacted HP?

we had the same thing happen to us with our dell 1-u boxes back in the day. the ones that didn't blow their caps would eat bios batteries like candy.

the battery thing was equally as bad as the cap problem, since if you reboot one remotely, it won't come up since it sits at the bios waiting to be configured along with a no keyboard error :(

mixflip
11-17-2010, 18:14
Start - Run "diskmgmt.msc" minus the quotes, select the drive in question, right click and delete the partitions. then you should have one the full size of the drive, create a new partition and format it.

Hey Sgt. I did what you said and it worked perfectly. Very simple and easy process. Its slowly formatting as we speak.

Who would have thought a gun forum would be so versatile?lol. Thank you all for walking me through this.