Kel-Tec KSG Bullpup Shotgun..... [Archive] - Glock Talk

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stmcelroy
01-02-2011, 17:01
Want badly......:wow::wow::wow::wow:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y12/HardShell/RWB%20-%20Shotguns/KSG.jpg


Kel-Tec KSG bullpup Shotgun
Yes, it's civilian legal, identical size to the RFB, just a little wider.
Cylinder bore 12 gage-2.75. 14+1 rounds.
manually switched dual-tube mag (7 each)
bottom ejecting
Available 2011
MSRP not yet set

Angry Fist
01-02-2011, 17:06
http://i.somethingawful.com/forumsystem/emoticons/emot-fappery.gif

g29andy
01-02-2011, 17:35
me likey

WiskyT
01-02-2011, 17:56
There's a lot of potential there.

gh0st614
01-02-2011, 18:10
yea that is sexy

arclight610
01-02-2011, 18:18
This is a ripoff of the Halo shotgun

http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/M90_Close_Assault_Weapon_System

Goodspeed(TPF)
01-02-2011, 18:21
Cool!!!!

WiskyT
01-02-2011, 18:25
This is a ripoff of the Halo shotgun

http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/M90_Close_Assault_Weapon_System

I went to grammer school with a kid whose father had one of those.

method
01-02-2011, 20:11
This is a ripoff of the Halo shotgun

http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/M90_Close_Assault_Weapon_System

Except the Kel Tec is a bullpup, and the Halo isn't. Other than that, yeah, they're exactly the same.

eta..is that even a real gun? I'm not a gamer at all.

If KT can give this gun a decent trigger, which is no small feat with a bullpup, they might have something. The twin magazines are interesting, should allow one to easily choose between shot and slug.

stmcelroy
01-02-2011, 20:24
If KT can give this gun a decent trigger, which is no small feat with a bullpup, they might have something. The twin magazines are interesting, should allow one to easily choose between shot and slug.

It should have the same trigger as the RFB, which is very nice. I'd have to say my RFB trigger is much nicer than a factory mil-spec AR15 trigger.

itstime
01-02-2011, 20:27
I should get on a list now.

I'm on one for the PMR that I may or not ever see.

Folsom_Prison
01-02-2011, 20:28
A.J. Likes!!!!

fnfalguy
01-02-2011, 20:41
If this shotgun is anything like the Keltec RFB, we may not see it until 2014!

PS

It'll also cost 2x too much unless they learned from their RFB experience!

DaGroaner
01-02-2011, 20:47
Very innovative!

ChuteTheMall
01-02-2011, 20:49
Looks like a nice choice for dove and quail, if you want to give Zumbo and the Fudds heart attacks!
:rofl:

mixflip
01-02-2011, 20:55
Me likey likey likey!!!!

PlayboyPenguin
01-02-2011, 21:16
I despise Kel-Tec, but even I might want one of these as long as the price is not outrageous. I could never pay a premium price for a Kel-Tec product.

T-Rod45
01-02-2011, 21:19
If it's under $600 I'm getting one...

Damn I really need to sell some of my crap...

aubie515
01-02-2011, 21:51
Not every gun shop in the US is out to screw their customers. I picked up my RFB three weeks ago for $1,300...I have another on order for $1,200...the MSRP on the RFB is $1,880, so I didn't pay double.

KT is like most companies...they do not have inventory...what they produce today will be shipped to their distributors. Pretty smart business plan to sell what they build...while I am not a fan of how they produce in batches and they cannot keep up with demand. Not having a storage facility saves them money...I do wished they would get on the ball and crank out more RFB's and PMRs...I hear people are having a tough time locating the PMRs...two shops in PA have had multiple PMRs, so they aren't that tough to get.

If this shotgun is anything like the Keltec RFB, we may not see it until 2014!

PS

It'll also cost 2x too much unless they learned from their RFB experience!

bikerdog
01-02-2011, 22:04
If they can make it reliable and keep the cost under 800 I think it will do really well but that dual feed system IDK about guess time will tell.

stmcelroy
01-02-2011, 22:06
Not every gun shop in the US is out to screw their customers. I picked up my RFB three weeks ago for $1,300...I have another on order for $1,200...the MSRP on the RFB is $1,880, so I didn't pay double.

KT is like most companies...they do not have inventory...what they produce today will be shipped to their distributors. Pretty smart business plan to sell what they build...while I am not a fan of how they produce in batches and they cannot keep up with demand. Not having a storage facility saves them money...I do wished they would get on the ball and crank out more RFB's and PMRs...I hear people are having a tough time locating the PMRs...two shops in PA have had multiple PMRs, so they aren't that tough to get.

Good deal on the RFB, picked mine up the week of Christmas for $1,279....:supergrin:

aubie515
01-02-2011, 22:11
Your state sales tax is higher, so I still got mine for less.

stmcelroy
01-02-2011, 22:16
Your state sales tax is higher, so I still got mine for less.

Damn straight it is, still $1,373 OTD wasn't too bad.....:supergrin:

aippi
01-02-2011, 23:29
What a country. Make anything look tacti-fool and they bead your door down to buy it. What an idiot I am to still want proven designs and not go for the cool stuff. Guys wanting one and have not even seen if the dang thing is going to work in real like or not. Good, you guys be the test dummies with your money and if it is still around in a couple years I will check one out. Look fun to shoot.

BlackPaladin
01-02-2011, 23:36
Looks nice, can't wait to play with one in a couple of weeks!

stmcelroy
01-03-2011, 00:03
What a country. Make anything look tacti-fool and they bead your door down to buy it. What an idiot I am to still want proven designs and not go for the cool stuff. Guys wanting one and have not even seen if the dang thing is going to work in real like or not. Good, you guys be the test dummies with your money and if it is still around in a couple years I will check one out. Look fun to shoot.

It's not like we will all sell off our other guns to buy a new toy.

MrMurphy
01-03-2011, 00:15
But some will.

Looks interesting, like a US-legal Neostead. Makes me wonder, pump or semi?

If Awerbuck beats the crap out of one and gives it a thumbsup, might be worth it.

mixflip
01-03-2011, 02:07
I'll keep an eye out for this one at ShotShow in a few weeks.

gdd363
01-03-2011, 02:30
What a country. Make anything look tacti-fool and they bead your door down to buy it. What an idiot I am to still want proven designs and not go for the cool stuff. Guys wanting one and have not even seen if the dang thing is going to work in real like or not. Good, you guys be the test dummies with your money and if it is still around in a couple years I will check one out. Look fun to shoot.

This is the first tube fed high capacity shotgun. I think it is very innovative and worth a try. It would be a great bear gun. And the ability to switch between shot and slug is truly cool stuff. If Mossberg made a double tube shotgun I would definately be sold.

MrMurphy
01-03-2011, 02:41
Actually, it's far from the first. The Neostead of S. Africa, adopted for British use, was essentially "this but flipped over". I would put the odds high that they borrowed much of the design.

Dual tube feed over the top of the barrel, selector switch, 12 round capacity, and it had a forward-pump action (reverse of the usual) to keep the length short.

It was tested in the US in the 90s but importing it or finding a manufacturer here was an issue.

It was/is? produced in South Africa, as are most of the really interesting nonstandard shotguns because they have fewer restrictions on "unusual' weapons, though their gun laws are far more jacked up.

dosei
01-03-2011, 06:57
Here is a link to a short article on the KSG:
http://cheaperthandirt.com/blog/?p=5659

It would be nice if the "tube selector" switch automaticly switched tubes when one runs dry.

dosei
01-03-2011, 07:05
Here are a few more pics:

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i170/dosei/KSG_3344web.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i170/dosei/KSG_3357web.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i170/dosei/KSG_4459web.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i170/dosei/KSG_C5L_4408web.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i170/dosei/advancing_KSG_4217hires.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i170/dosei/kirsten_ksg_4271.jpg

grecco
01-03-2011, 07:26
Would love to see a semi version!

dosei
01-03-2011, 07:41
The 14+1 capacity is based on 2-3/4" shells. I can't find anything on if it will handle 3" or 3-1/2" shells. Hopefully it will.

edited to add: Just found it on the KTOG forum...2-3/4 chamber...bummer. Price is being rumored to be half the price of a RFB. The RFB MSRP is $1880.00, street price is a little over $1200.00. So the KSG should be MSRP of $1440, street price of a little over $600.00 or $700.00.

mac66
01-03-2011, 10:24
What a country. Make anything look tacti-fool and they bead your door down to buy it. What an idiot I am to still want proven designs and not go for the cool stuff. Guys wanting one and have not even seen if the dang thing is going to work in real like or not. Good, you guys be the test dummies with your money and if it is still around in a couple years I will check one out. Look fun to shoot.

What is this "bead", the tacti-fools you are making fun of are using to down doors with, Mr. AI&P TACTICAL LLC owner?

stmcelroy
01-03-2011, 10:27
What is this "bead", people are using to down doors with, Mr. AI&P Tactical owner?

Probably meant "beat."

JK-linux
01-03-2011, 10:51
So is it semi-automatic, or pump? I'm not seeing the for end looking like a pump, but I don't see an obvious charging handle either. Stay tuned I guess...

Looks pretty dramatic. My guess is that if there is ever another AWB, this one will likely be on it for some reason or another.

mac66
01-03-2011, 10:59
So is it semi-automatic, or pump? I'm not seeing the for end looking like a pump, but I don't see an obvious charging handle either. Stay tuned I guess...

Looks pretty dramatic. My guess is that if there is ever another AWB, this one will likely be on it for some reason or another.

Reread the original post. The picture says it is a pump.

mgeoffriau
01-03-2011, 10:59
What an idiot I am to still want proven designs and not go for the cool stuff. Guys wanting one and have not even seen if the dang thing is going to work in real like or not. Good, you guys be the test dummies with your money and if it is still around in a couple years I will check one out.

Good thing not everyone shares your attitude, otherwise no gun would ever be "proven", and you'd still be throwing rocks.

JK-linux
01-03-2011, 11:11
Reread the original post. The picture says it is a pump.

It does, my mistake.

T-Rod45
01-03-2011, 11:20
Would love to see a semi version!

+1

This thing NEEDS to be auto!

mac66
01-03-2011, 14:22
Whoo-Hooo.............Just in time for rabbit season.

Hedo1
01-03-2011, 15:28
Interesting design.

cooden
01-03-2011, 15:54
What a country. Make anything look tacti-fool and they bead your door down to buy it. What an idiot I am to still want proven designs and not go for the cool stuff. Guys wanting one and have not even seen if the dang thing is going to work in real like or not. Good, you guys be the test dummies with your money and if it is still around in a couple years I will check one out. Look fun to shoot.

So according to you and "your knowledge" (because you took a Remington armorer course, you must be the only guy in the world to ever take an armorer course), the rest of the world is stupid to buy this shotgun? What if someone wanted something fun to shoot? You make tactical shotguns, they are on your website for sale--but since you didn't make this, then it is stupid? I think the real problem is that you are mad because you won't be able to take these shotguns, do a terrible job of engraving AIPPI on it and then marking it up $500 to claim that it is now perfect--and that's before you install aftermarket stocks & accessories and charge more than retail for them. You are one of the biggest hyprocrites on this forum, but yet you are an expert. Honestly, I can't believe that suckers pay you for your shotguns--they must not know how to research prices on the internet.

Flinger
01-03-2011, 16:07
That's one sweet looking shotgun. I hope she functions as well as she looks. :wow:

cosmose
01-03-2011, 16:31
man that is awesome:drool: i sure hope the street price is around $600

d1911r
01-03-2011, 17:42
Looks like it was inspired by the Neostead 2000.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neostead

MrMurphy
01-03-2011, 17:47
Yeah, it's only been mentioned in this thread at LEAST THREE TIMES already...

USMCsilver
01-03-2011, 18:39
So according to you and "your knowledge" (because you took a Remington armorer course, you must be the only guy in the world to ever take an armorer course), the rest of the world is stupid to buy this shotgun? What if someone wanted something fun to shoot? You make tactical shotguns, they are on your website for sale--but since you didn't make this, then it is stupid? I think the real problem is that you are mad because you won't be able to take these shotguns, do a terrible job of engraving AIPPI on it and then marking it up $500 to claim that it is now perfect--and that's before you install aftermarket stocks & accessories and charge more than retail for them. You are one of the biggest hyprocrites on this forum, but yet you are an expert. Honestly, I can't believe that suckers pay you for your shotguns--they must not know how to research prices on the internet.

Awe -- SNAP! No he didn't. :)

That's a pretty awesome paragraph. Mad props to ya, cooden! (And I know neither of you, and have probably only clicked on this forum a handful of times.)

hogarth
01-03-2011, 19:42
I think it's pretty cool. Not "mall ninja" cool, though I suppose it qualifies for that, but more like "innovative" cool, even if it is sort of copying another design. I gotta give Kel-tec credit: they try different things which aren't for everyone's taste, clearly, but they seem to be well thought out. If it functions well, I might actually have to snag one. I will NOT, however, be one of the test dummies.

GAFinch
01-03-2011, 19:47
Pros:

-High capacity in an 18.5" gun.
-Rail: flashlight and mount should be cheaper than a $350+ flashlight forend.

Cons:
-Not sure why you'd need rifle sights if it's a cylinder bore.
-I wonder if the 2 3/4" chamber will eject the longer star crimped shells.

WiskyT
01-03-2011, 20:10
Pros:

-High capacity in an 18.5" gun.
-Rail: flashlight and mount should be cheaper than a $350+ flashlight forend.

Cons:
-Not sure why you'd need rifle sights if it's a cylinder bore. Slugs?
-I wonder if the 2 3/4" chamber will eject the longer star crimped shells.2 3/4" is the length of the fired shell after the crimp is opened. Since probably 99% of all SG ammo fired in the USA uses star crimps, I think they anticipated that empty shells would need to be ejected from the gun. Star crimped rounds are shorter than roll crimped rounds before they are fired.

.....

stmcelroy
01-03-2011, 22:09
Pros:

-High capacity in an 18.5" gun.
-Rail: flashlight and mount should be cheaper than a $350+ flashlight forend.

Cons:
-Not sure why you'd need rifle sights if it's a cylinder bore.
-I wonder if the 2 3/4" chamber will eject the longer star crimped shells.

I'm sure it doesn't even come with the BUIS, they are just there for the pictures.

I can see this gun with a Eotech or Aimpoint......:supergrin:

Boxerglocker
01-04-2011, 01:18
So according to you and "your knowledge" (because you took a Remington armorer course, you must be the only guy in the world to ever take an armorer course), the rest of the world is stupid to buy this shotgun? What if someone wanted something fun to shoot? You make tactical shotguns, they are on your website for sale--but since you didn't make this, then it is stupid? I think the real problem is that you are mad because you won't be able to take these shotguns, do a terrible job of engraving AIPPI on it and then marking it up $500 to claim that it is now perfect--and that's before you install aftermarket stocks & accessories and charge more than retail for them. You are one of the biggest hyprocrites on this forum, but yet you are an expert. Honestly, I can't believe that suckers pay you for your shotguns--they must not know how to research prices on the internet.

You really need to cool your jets a little... Anyone that has read the posts in this forum knows that J.D. has made it a point of NOT mixing his business with pleasure in this particular forum. He's here like anyone else, to participate in discussion, and like veryone is entitled to his opinon and I for one somewhat agree with his particular view to an extent regarding this topic.
As far as his product, I myself have never purchased one of his shotguns. I have however handled and shot a couple at various shoots here locally in the Western WA area, owned by LEO's. His reputation is well know for providing a service that is not equaled by many... which is tuning the basic factory Remington shotgun platform to a point of reliability that many professional operators put thier lives behind on a daily basis. In addition, if you take a little time and read the many tips on his website you will see that he is a no nonsense individual who shares the knowledge. Lastly, do a little research and you'll see he's not just a armorer but a retired officer who served the community.
So man up and show a little respect, once again he is entitiled an opinion which he never directed to a particular individual as you have with your personal unfounded attacks.

Bren
01-04-2011, 04:59
Looks cool. I need one. The double magazine is too much to resist.

Except the Kel Tec is a bullpup, and the Halo isn't. Other than that, yeah, they're exactly the same.

eta..is that even a real gun? I'm not a gamer at all.


No, it isn't a real gun, but many GT members get their gun knowledge from comic books and video/computer games.

-Not sure why you'd need rifle sights if it's a cylinder bore.

Seriously? I'm guessing you haven't shot a lot of LE style shotguns. A little experience with those and slugs and you'll see why. I even prefer rifle sights for shotshells and use them in 3-gun competition and turkey hunting.

DaGroaner
01-04-2011, 06:59
You really need to cool your jets a little... Anyone that has read the posts in this forum knows that J.D. has made it a point of NOT mixing his business with pleasure in this particular forum. He's here like anyone else, to participate in discussion, and like veryone is entitled to his opinon and I for one somewhat agree with his particular view to an extent regarding this topic.
As far as his product, I myself have never purchased one of his shotguns. I have however handled and shot a couple at various shoots here locally in the Western WA area, owned by LEO's. His reputation is well know for providing a service that is not equaled by many... which is tuning the basic factory Remington shotgun platform to a point of reliability that many professional operators put thier lives behind on a daily basis. In addition, if you take a little time and read the many tips on his website you will see that he is a no nonsense individual who shares the knowledge. Lastly, do a little research and you'll see he's not just a armorer but a retired officer who served the community.
So man up and show a little respect, once again he is entitiled an opinion which he never directed to a particular individual as you have with your personal unfounded attacks.

http://earlyrecovery.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/authentic-drama-queen.jpg

:yawn:

GlockNRolla
01-04-2011, 07:14
Whoo-Hooo.............Just in time for rabbit season.

DUCK SEASON!
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
:whistling:

d1911r
01-04-2011, 07:53
But some will.

Looks interesting, like a US-legal Neostead. Makes me wonder, pump or semi?

If Awerbuck beats the crap out of one and gives it a thumbsup, might be worth it.

The AD in post #1 says PUMP.

Boxerglocker
01-04-2011, 08:21
:yawn:

No drama... I expect more a little more humility from a Marine but appears you may not be of the same mold - ΜΟΛ'ΩΝ ΛΑΒ'Ε :upeyes:





(Officially ignored)

DaGroaner
01-04-2011, 09:07
No drama... I expect more a little more humility from a Marine but appears you may not be of the same mold - ΜΟΛ'ΩΝ ΛΑΒ'Ε :upeyes:


:yawn: :yawn:

Bullman
01-04-2011, 09:35
Everything I ever wanted in a bullpup shotgun and more. now if it is just reliable and somewhere close to the realm of affordable.

cooden
01-04-2011, 11:11
You really need to cool your jets a little... Anyone that has read the posts in this forum knows that J.D. has made it a point of NOT mixing his business with pleasure in this particular forum. He's here like anyone else, to participate in discussion, and like veryone is entitled to his opinon and I for one somewhat agree with his particular view to an extent regarding this topic.
As far as his product, I myself have never purchased one of his shotguns. I have however handled and shot a couple at various shoots here locally in the Western WA area, owned by LEO's. His reputation is well know for providing a service that is not equaled by many... which is tuning the basic factory Remington shotgun platform to a point of reliability that many professional operators put thier lives behind on a daily basis. In addition, if you take a little time and read the many tips on his website you will see that he is a no nonsense individual who shares the knowledge. Lastly, do a little research and you'll see he's not just a armorer but a retired officer who served the community.
So man up and show a little respect, once again he is entitiled an opinion which he never directed to a particular individual as you have with your personal unfounded attacks.

Cool my jets? Show respect? Did you not see the thread about heat shields where JD basically said that you are an idiot if you want a heat shield on your shotgun. How about how JD has anything negative to say about anyone who mentions the word tactical? I am sick of his commentary about everything that he doesn't agree with, but yet he will sell the same products (check his website) and then charge you double for them. He is no more an expert than any other armorer or someone who has experience with the 870. If you want to promote your business, go about it in a different way, don't act like a jerkoff. If I was going to buy a high end 870, it would be from Wilson or Nighthawk--not from some guy who carves his business name in a receiver with a dremmel in his garage & claims to be the expert.

mac66
01-04-2011, 11:49
While this new shotgun is way cool and I would love to have one, I will simply go down to the basement, get out my 20+ year old stock beat to hell Mossberg 500 I bought at a police auction for $25 and fondle it a bit. I will then take out my $239 Saiga 12 which I bought before they became popular and fondle it for awhile. I then will put them back in the safe knowing that I have once again dodged the temptation to buy stuff I don't need and will never use.

I will then take a nap and dream of clearing the neighborhood of zombies with said shotguns and wake up knowing that all is well with the world and that life is good. :wavey:

Bullman
01-04-2011, 11:50
If you don't like what he has to say, put him on your ignore list. No sense in draggin out personal attacks on here. I came to this thread to read about the new Keltec shotgun, not to read about how everyone hates everyone else. I admit, I found JD a bit abrasive at first, but he does have some interesting perspectives on things. If you can't stand the rest of what he has to say, ignore him.

Tech knight
01-04-2011, 11:55
I'm not sure if this is a need or a want yet. If it's <1000 I found my new trunk gun!


....of course I'll need one in my home as well :)

Boxerglocker
01-04-2011, 12:17
Cool my jets? Show respect? Did you not see the thread about heat shields where JD basically said that you are an idiot if you want a heat shield on your shotgun. How about how JD has anything negative to say about anyone who mentions the word tactical? I am sick of his commentary about everything that he doesn't agree with, but yet he will sell the same products (check his website) and then charge you double for them. He is no more an expert than any other armorer or someone who has experience with the 870. If you want to promote your business, go about it in a different way, don't act like a jerkoff. If I was going to buy a high end 870, it would be from Wilson or Nighthawk--not from some guy who carves his business name in a receiver with a dremmel in his garage & claims to be the expert.


If you don't like what he has to say, put him on your ignore list. No sense in draggin out personal attacks on here. I came to this thread to read about the new Keltec shotgun, not to read about how everyone hates everyone else. I admit, I found JD a bit abrasive at first, but he does have some interesting perspectives on things. If you can't stand the rest of what he has to say, ignore him.

My point exactly, no need to personally attack someone cause you happen to disagree with his opinion. Argue it fine... like others did without getting beligerant about it.
As for acting like a quote "jerk off" did you read anything in my post that sounded at all like a personal attack to yourself? Hmmmm don't think so...
I merely requested that you show the man a little respect, BECAUSE like I clearly stated he is as you are ENTITLED to a opinion. No need for personal attacks unfounded attacks agains tghe man or his chosen profession. As stated by Bullman merely put him on your ignore list and add myself for what its worth.
That said... cooden, if you may have had your feelings hurt by what I said. I apologize.

ATL_GLOCK
01-04-2011, 12:44
double the tubes...double the fun.....droooolllllll

me likey

dnuggett
01-04-2011, 12:56
Back on this Keltec .... just called my dealer and put my name on the first one he gets. Like was said before everyone is titled to their own opinions. My opinion is that this looks interesting enough to order. I can see a few uses for it, as if I really need a particular reason to buy a bullpup designed shotgun that holds 14+1.

Angry Fist
01-04-2011, 13:01
What about a bayonet? :whistling:

Leigh
01-04-2011, 13:02
Did you not see the thread about heat shields where JD basically said that you are an idiot if you want a heat shield on your shotgun.

No highjacks BUT heat shields certainly seemed good enough for our boys since when, say around 1918 forward?

Of course, range/training/HD isn't anything like combat but they obviously serve a real role for "some" folks.

Back on topic, I kind of like the looks of KT's borrowed design.

ancient_serpent
01-04-2011, 13:27
If this works, may be something to pick up down the road.

dosei
01-04-2011, 13:43
What about a bayonet? :whistling:

...what about 'em? :whistling:
http://www.tomarskabars.com/PB_1__2__INFO.jpg

DaGroaner
01-04-2011, 14:04
What about a bayonet? :whistling:

No tacticool shottie is complete without one. :supergrin:

GAFinch
01-04-2011, 14:38
2 3/4" is the length of the fired shell after the crimp is opened. Since probably 99% of all SG ammo fired in the USA uses star crimps, I think they anticipated that empty shells would need to be ejected from the gun. Star crimped rounds are shorter than roll crimped rounds before they are fired.

Yeah, you would think, but a Mossberg 500 I used to own with a 3" chamber would have trouble ejecting fired 3" shells. Roll crimped would do fine, but the star crimped ones were slightly too long.

GAFinch
01-04-2011, 15:00
Seriously? I'm guessing you haven't shot a lot of LE style shotguns. A little experience with those and slugs and you'll see why. I even prefer rifle sights for shotshells and use them in 3-gun competition and turkey hunting.

I think rifle sights are good for hunting, with a choke or a rifled barrel, just not for indoor use with an open cylinder. 870P's usually come with an improved cylinder barrel and the FN SLP's with interchangeable chokes. I figured the main role of this Kel-tec would be for home defense and wouldn't need rifle sights, but I suppose it could be a good candidate for 3-gun competitions.

mdfd
01-04-2011, 16:04
I give Kel-Tec kudos for the innovation and stepping up to do this. I just hope they spend the time and effort to make it a quality and reliable shotgun. Some of their product lines are hit or miss...
Put in the quality and reliability and sign me up for a pump now and a semi-auto when it becomes available!

ETA: $800 MSRP is a bit too much IMHO, $500 MSRP seems to be more realistic...

gunman_23
01-04-2011, 21:38
If Im seeing it correctly there might be mounting points on the side of the pump to add more pic rail.

1. That would be perfect for a light.
2. This gun looks like something the Mag Pul AFG would actually serve a purpose on :) (dont hate me AFG fans)
3. I see the point for a front sight mixed w/an optic
4. Just like many others have said, SIGN ME UP!!!!

ordersman
01-05-2011, 08:43
What a country. Make anything look tacti-fool and they bead your door down to buy it. What an idiot I am to still want proven designs and not go for the cool stuff. Guys wanting one and have not even seen if the dang thing is going to work in real like or not. Good, you guys be the test dummies with your money and if it is still around in a couple years I will check one out. Look fun to shoot.

:upeyes: ah there's always one of you isn't there ... gotta poop in everyones cornflakes. Don't forget to go out and yell at those dang nappit kids to stay off you lawn.

It looks bad ***, if it works and isn't 1000 bucks I would buy one.

GoBow
01-05-2011, 11:37
I want one for hunting. I'll have to plug one tube and limit the other one to 2 shots...

B.Reid
01-05-2011, 12:59
:wow:

Boxerglocker
01-05-2011, 13:03
It looks bad ***, if it works and isn't 1000 bucks I would buy one.

I agree it looks appealing, the question is will it run as advertised? I personally don't collect guns, especially jam-mo-matics. I shoot every gun in my meager arsenal and rather than buy guns that sit in the safe. Spend the extra money I have on training and reloading components or ammo.
I think thats what Aippi meant earlier it looks cool... but not quite swayed just cause... will it run is the question? Or do we have another Gen 4 Glock issue here, where it will run...... if you have certain ammo, etc. :upeyes:

Electrikkoolaid
01-05-2011, 15:28
http://i.imgur.com/2G8Uc.jpg

Jamesey
01-05-2011, 15:53
Darn! This looks very similar to something I sketched out about 10 years ago--no, really!! I even tried to cobble some parts together to modify my 20" Mossberg 500 to test the concept. Never actually got to the range with it. I was concerned that the unusual appearance might spook someone into calling the feds, reporting a homemade assault weapon. Everything worked mechanically but it looked like Rube Goldberg was dabbling in gun design. Only had one 7-round mag tube and retained the side eject but it had the same configuration. Don't ya hate when someone else "steals" your idea and runs with it--because you didn't??

method
01-05-2011, 16:42
Darn! This looks very similar to something I sketched out about 10 years ago--no, really!! I even tried to cobble some parts together to modify my 20" Mossberg 500 to test the concept. Never actually got to the range with it. I was concerned that the unusual appearance might spook someone into calling the feds, reporting a homemade assault weapon. Everything worked mechanically but it looked like Rube Goldberg was dabbling in gun design. Only had one 7-round mag tube and retained the side eject but it had the same configuration. Don't ya hate when someone else "steals" your idea and runs with it--because you didn't??


If you're simply talking about a bullpup configuration, it goes back quite a few years.

nursetim
01-05-2011, 17:40
What a country. Make anything look tacti-fool and they bead your door down to buy it. What an idiot I am to still want proven designs and not go for the cool stuff. Guys wanting one and have not even seen if the dang thing is going to work in real like or not. Good, you guys be the test dummies with your money and if it is still around in a couple years I will check one out. Look fun to shoot.

A bit hypocritical seeing as your company's name has the word "tactical" in thus exploiting the same term you ridicule.:shocked: Isn't this what you do?

You make a valid point though about weather they are any good though, owing to Kel-Tec's reputation with P3AT.

SergeantC
01-05-2011, 18:49
That's a really cool shotgun. I think I'll wait a year or two, until any problems are ironed out, then get one. I don't need it, but I want it, and isn't that what matters?

(And it would make a great HD gun, I reckon.)

DaGroaner
01-05-2011, 20:33
Darn! This looks very similar to something I sketched out about 10 years ago--no, really!! I even tried to cobble some parts together to modify my 20" Mossberg 500 to test the concept. Never actually got to the range with it. I was concerned that the unusual appearance might spook someone into calling the feds, reporting a homemade assault weapon. Everything worked mechanically but it looked like Rube Goldberg was dabbling in gun design. Only had one 7-round mag tube and retained the side eject but it had the same configuration. Don't ya hate when someone else "steals" your idea and runs with it--because you didn't??

Did it look anything like this?


http://www.gungarage.com/mossberg500-bullpup-shotgun-manual.jpg

DaGroaner
01-05-2011, 20:36
A bit hypocritical seeing as your company's name has the word "tactical" in thus exploiting the same term you ridicule.:shocked: Isn't this what you do?

You make a valid point though about weather they are any good though, owing to Kel-Tec's reputation with P3AT.

That's too bad too. Mine had to go back for a tune-up when I first got it but it's been solid ever since.

Jamesey
01-05-2011, 23:01
Did it look anything like this?


http://www.gungarage.com/mossberg500-bullpup-shotgun-manual.jpg
I saw this model many years ago and was not impressed with it. Looked a little cheesy with all the plastic slapped on a standard 500, and the carry handle/sights were a bad joke. My version looked almost identical, especially viewed from the side, to the Kel Tec model. You could still see most of the original shotgun; even used an AR-15 grip. Nice to see my idea fleshed out in a (hopefully) more viable form!

mac66
01-06-2011, 09:36
Speaking of bullpup shotguns, I carried a High Standard Mod 10 in my patrol car back in 1976. Very cool and tactical before the word "tactical" was attached to everything. Problem was that it only held 3 rounds. The ahead of its time carry handle sights also held a built in flashlight.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v489/mac66/hs10a-r.jpg

DaGroaner
01-06-2011, 10:43
Speaking of bullpup shotguns, I carried a High Standard Mod 10 in my patrol car back in 1976. Very cool and tactical before the word "tactical" was attached to everything. Problem was that it only held 3 rounds. The ahead of its time carry handle sights also held a built in flashlight.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v489/mac66/hs10a-r.jpg

I almost bought one of those at a gunshow back in the early 80s. The guy selling it seemed a bit off so I passed on it.

I wonder if you could put a mag extension on it.

method
01-06-2011, 15:22
Kel Tec has a FAQ thread going on over at KTOG. This gun seems to be getting a lot of attention.

http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1294097299

"the trigger mechanism is very similar in design to the RFB trigger, using hammer bars instead of a long trigger bar (like most other bullpups do). So the trigger will be very good"

Answers my main question.

Glockdude1
01-06-2011, 18:07
I almost bought one of those at a gunshow back in the early 80s. The guy selling it seemed a bit off so I passed on it.

I wonder if you could put a mag extension on it.

Yes.
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f159/unnamed-source/DSC00259.jpg

:cool:

Angry Fist
01-06-2011, 18:48
Yes.
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f159/unnamed-source/DSC00259.jpg

:cool:Was that in Wolfenstien? :supergrin:

DaGroaner
01-06-2011, 18:49
Yes.
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f159/unnamed-source/DSC00259.jpg

:cool:

Very cool.

ScrappyDoo
01-06-2011, 18:58
so whats the deal with these, gimme the info please.

MacG22
01-06-2011, 22:33
If they can make it reliable and keep the cost under 800 I think it will do really well but that dual feed system IDK about guess time will tell.

That is a lot to ask of Kel-Tec.

MadMonkey
01-06-2011, 22:53
Yes.
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f159/unnamed-source/DSC00259.jpg

:cool:

Man... that doesn't look like a really difficult modification...

Glockdude1
01-06-2011, 23:34
Man... that doesn't look like a really difficult modification...

No modification, they were built that way.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Standard_Model_10

:cool:

MadMonkey
01-06-2011, 23:40
No modification, they were built that way.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Standard_Model_10

:cool:

I mean for an existing shotgun :wavey:

Glockdude1
01-07-2011, 06:45
I mean for an existing shotgun :wavey:

:agree:___ :wavey:

mac66
01-07-2011, 08:43
I mean for an existing shotgun :wavey:

Those were semi autos. The biggest problem with bullpups is usually the trigger linkage. If you look at that one, the linkage is internal which is hard to do. As far as I can tell The HS 10 was the only semi-auto bullpup shotgun ever in production. If it was easy to do I suppose everyone would be making them.

DaGroaner
01-07-2011, 09:55
I'm thinking about getting one of these kits for one of my S-12s. I just don't like the whole pre-order thing. I've been burned that way a couple of times. I think I'll let others be the guinea pig with this one.

http://www.kushnapup.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/photo1.jpg
http://www.kushnapup.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/home-kush-1.jpg
http://www.kushnapup.com/order

mdfd
01-07-2011, 10:09
Aside from the internet drama around it, the final straw for losing my business was when they posted that ridiculous Youtube video of the kid hip firing the protoype in sunglasses and a raincoat.....in the dark no less....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC-DLydbFQQ


I'm thinking about getting one of these kits for one of my S-12s. I just don't like the whole pre-order thing. I've been burned that way a couple of times. I think I'll let others be the guinea pig with this one.

http://www.kushnapup.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/photo1.jpg
http://www.kushnapup.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/home-kush-1.jpg
http://www.kushnapup.com/order

DaGroaner
01-07-2011, 10:13
Aside from the internet drama around it, the final straw for losing my business was when they posted that ridiculous Youtube video of the kid hip firing the protoype in sunglasses and a raincoat.....in the dark no less....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC-DLydbFQQ

I'm glad I missed it.

Bullman
01-07-2011, 12:10
They look better than the Muzzlelite stocks they used to make for the Remington 870. Those things were crap, and I could never make my shotgun work right, too much recoil on too cheap a plastic stock.

cyrsequipment
01-07-2011, 14:24
What a country. Make anything look tacti-fool and they bead your door down to buy it. What an idiot I am to still want proven designs and not go for the cool stuff. Guys wanting one and have not even seen if the dang thing is going to work in real like or not. Good, you guys be the test dummies with your money and if it is still around in a couple years I will check one out. Look fun to shoot.

Yes, thank you for sharing your impressive wisdom with us. :upeyes:

You ever thought that maybe we would be able to decide for ourselves what we wish to do with our money?

And by the way, the phrase is "beat your door down", not "bead your door down"...:supergrin:

tslex
01-07-2011, 15:00
aippi wrote:

Make anything look tacti-fool and they bea[t] your door down to buy it.

But when you go to his company at the webpage in the sig line www.aiptactical.com

we find that he sells "tactical combat shotguns" many of which contain the word "tactical" in their model names, many of which have pistol grips and AR-style adjustable stocks.

So one has to ask: Are you revealing your contempt for your own customers, who buy things that are likewise "tacticool" or just slamming potential competition?

No one here is running out to buy one of these to stake his life on. But there are meaningful innovations here -- practical bullpup configuration, bottom eject, ambi controls, large ammo capacity, ability to "slug select" via a switch -- that bear discussing and maybe trying. To suggest so sanctimoniously that anyone expressing an interest in these things is some sort of dupe would be going too far for anyone. For a guy in the business of selling "tactical" shotguns . . .

mac66
01-08-2011, 09:19
Aside from the internet drama around it, the final straw for losing my business was when they posted that ridiculous Youtube video of the kid hip firing the protoype in sunglasses and a raincoat.....in the dark no less....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC-DLydbFQQ

You got that right. Almost like saying "Coming soon to a high school near you". Bunch of Azzhats.

Notice they don't shoot drums with that stock.

Bullman
01-08-2011, 11:04
I thought the gun in that video with the dork in the rain coat was shooting a drum fed gun.

kindaclever1
01-11-2011, 23:09
Kel tec test video......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwN8jHSEhCE

Norske
01-14-2011, 19:01
Kel tec test video......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwN8jHSEhCE

The guys shooting it didn't look like they were comfortable with it; that they are not regular trombone-gun shooters.

I think they should have set up 15 Pepper Poppers at various distances between 10 to 30 yards, put it in the hands of a USPSA 3-gun competitor, load that sucker up with 15 rounds of nought-nought buck, and see how fast he can take down all 15.

:cool:

Bullman
01-14-2011, 19:48
I would like to see that myself

Noblinger
01-14-2011, 22:06
It will be like the RFB hard as hell to get and $$$ as hell. They need to step up production.

mrt949
01-15-2011, 10:40
The guys shooting the KSG is GEORGE KELGREN & TOBIAS the chief designer for KELTEC.

method
01-15-2011, 10:45
my mistake

WiskyT
01-15-2011, 14:34
The guys shooting it didn't look like they were comfortable with it; that they are not regular trombone-gun shooters.

I think they should have set up 15 Pepper Poppers at various distances between 10 to 30 yards, put it in the hands of a USPSA 3-gun competitor, load that sucker up with 15 rounds of nought-nought buck, and see how fast he can take down all 15.

:cool:

I agree. The gun LOOKS difficult to operate. They don't make a good impression with that video. If it's a prototype, they should work out the bugs before demonstrating it. If the guys shooting it are good gun designers, but mediocre shooters, they should use better shooters to demonstrate it.

Anyway, we are while away from seeing and shooting this things ourselves. In the meantime, I'm keeping an open mind. It looks like a great idea. I probably won't buy one as I'm not as keen on SG's as I used to be for combat purposes. Overall, I still like them for the cool factor and that's why I lurk this forum. The KT SG appeals to me from a coolness standpoint.

Bullman
01-16-2011, 17:06
New video up of some Lakewood PD officers shooting it. Check the comments, they do make an excuse for the lack of familiarity with the manual of arms.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hi0OWQCkcVc&feature=player_embedded

WiskyT
01-16-2011, 17:19
New video up of some Lakewood PD officers shooting it. Check the comments, they do make an excuse for the lack of familiarity with the manual of arms.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hi0OWQCkcVc&feature=player_embedded

That looks better.

As an aside, the chubby cop didn't handle the recoil as well as the one in the hoody because his stance left a little to be desired. The video is a good illustration of how a good stance can make a difference.

Bullman
01-16-2011, 19:56
Also noticed once that it appeared that one or two of the hulls hung up in the ejection port once. don't know if it was operator induced since it was the hefty fella.

dosei
01-17-2011, 08:28
New video up of some Lakewood PD officers shooting it. Check the comments, they do make an excuse for the lack of familiarity with the manual of arms.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hi0OWQCkcVc&feature=player_embedded

This video confirms one of my main concerns, the system is not designed to automatically switch feed tubes when one runs dry. It also looks like the action is in major need of smoothing up.

Bullman
01-17-2011, 08:55
This video confirms one of my main concerns, the system is not designed to automatically switch feed tubes when one runs dry. It also looks like the action is in major need of smoothing up.

I don't see the magazine switch being that big an issue. With the Saiga, you have to switch mags, with another tube fed gun you would just run dry and be SOL so I think just switching a button is quicker than either. It also gives you the option of selecting a slug by pushing a button.

tslex
01-17-2011, 14:32
Bullman -- that's what I'm talking about -- the easiest slug select ever would be nifty.

WiskyT
01-17-2011, 14:39
Also noticed once that it appeared that one or two of the hulls hung up in the ejection port once. don't know if it was operator induced since it was the hefty fella.

Yeah, I didn't watch it enough to figure out why. If he short stroked it, is the gun easy to short stroke? If it caught on his clothing, is the gun going to be prone to that kind of thing? Or maybe he's just not up to speed working a pump gun?

Mike5560
01-20-2011, 01:26
Was fortunate to see this at the SHOT show, looks well built. I think the MSRP was mid 800s. Still considering if that's worth the squeeze.

Rifle sights are better than a bead IMO because of its in-line design, no comb hight. Imagine putting a bead on an AR. Not a shotgun, I know, but still.

I don't see why having to switch tubes is a real issue either, when ONE tube holds just about as much as any other pump shotgun.

Seems like a great HD gun, for the maneuverability of the bullpup design if not anything else. Some good range reports detailing the reliability could make or break sales of this piece.

Packin' Heat
01-20-2011, 08:01
I love the over all length. I can imagine that the Feds would be all over this, and by that I mean wanting it for themselves.

than again they get 6" saigas:

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l246/TonyRumore/Saiga%20Shotguns/Bodyguard1.jpg


I can see myself with a KSG as my car gun. Its a bit pricey though at over $800 - one can get two mossberg 500's for that. I would think 600 or so if fair for a dual-tube pump.

B.Reid
01-20-2011, 08:45
Seems the trigger will not reset unless you release it before you pump the action.


http://gunnuts.net/2011/01/20/kel-tec-ksg-shotgun-video/

Glockdude1
01-20-2011, 09:39
I love the over all length. I can imagine that the Feds would be all over this, and by that I mean wanting it for themselves.

than again they get 6" saigas:

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l246/TonyRumore/Saiga%20Shotguns/Bodyguard1.jpg


http://i781.photobucket.com/albums/yy95/jjlovik/DSCN1425.jpg

I like the side folders.

:supergrin:

Bullman
01-21-2011, 16:13
Seems the trigger will not reset unless you release it before you pump the action.


http://gunnuts.net/2011/01/20/kel-tec-ksg-shotgun-video/

that's not so good. :(

ScrappyDoo
01-21-2011, 16:26
Whoah those 6inch saigas are amazing, are they Legal?!

WiskyT
01-21-2011, 16:59
Seems the trigger will not reset unless you release it before you pump the action.


http://gunnuts.net/2011/01/20/kel-tec-ksg-shotgun-video/

I'm not going to join the author of the blog regarding this possible defect. I don't doubt it happened with the SHOT demos, but those guns are disabled. I'll wait until a porduction gun has been tested to see if it has this flaw. If the trigger is like the blog says, on production guns, that would be bad no doubt.

pesticidal
01-21-2011, 17:28
Want badly......:wow::wow::wow::wow:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y12/HardShell/RWB%20-%20Shotguns/KSG.jpg


Kel-Tec KSG bullpup Shotgun
Yes, it's civilian legal, identical size to the RFB, just a little wider.
Cylinder bore 12 gage-2.75. 14+1 rounds.
manually switched dual-tube mag (7 each)
bottom ejecting
Available 2011
MSRP not yet set

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b200/pesticidal/GT/Raccoon_Really_Really_Want.jpg

Sharkey
01-22-2011, 10:47
Was fortunate to see this at the SHOT show, looks well built. I think the MSRP was mid 800s. Still considering if that's worth the squeeze.

Rifle sights are better than a bead IMO because of its in-line design, no comb hight. Imagine putting a bead on an AR. Not a shotgun, I know, but still.

I don't see why having to switch tubes is a real issue either, when ONE tube holds just about as much as any other pump shotgun.

Seems like a great HD gun, for the maneuverability of the bullpup design if not anything else. Some good range reports detailing the reliability could make or break sales of this piece.

Saw it at the Show and I'm pretty interested. I was told release of 10/11 and price was $880. Manually switching the tubes isn't a big deal to me either.

We'll see.......................
Mossberg also had a display where "Aimpro"? was customizing some of their stuff. They had a 14" decked out 590 ythat was pretty sweet.

mixflip
01-22-2011, 17:15
Check out my visit to the KelTec booth at shotshow 2011.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6l4XE4B7HAo

WiskyT
01-22-2011, 17:40
Check out my visit to the KelTec booth at shotshow 2011.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6l4XE4B7HAo

Nice report. It would have been nice to see if you had the same trigger reset situation as the blog poster, but I could see you were too well schooled to dry fire even an inert gun in a large room stuffed with people. I felt the same way at the NRA convention.

mixflip
01-22-2011, 19:12
Yeah I am one of those guys that cringes every time I see folks dry fire guns they have no experience with. Some guns take well to dry firing and some gun break. Sure all the firing pins are removed to get into Shot Show but I just dont like doing it personally. I also didnt feel comfortable pointing it at people in the show even though thousands of people were getting swiped with muzzles all day. When I do a video you will often see me instinctively point up or low ready. Its just habit even at shot show where every gun is made safe (so they say). Mr Murphy has been trying to get into shot show for years and I dont want to be there when he does.lol.

On a side note, I saw some serious range violations at the media day shoot. I wont drop dimes but I saw some stuff that I would not want to see done around anyone with an empty gun (or so they said it was without checking it) on a hot range. Flame me if you like, but I actually went to the shoot with my body armor on. You can see it in my media day videos. I thought it was appropriate when shooting around thousands of strangers from all over the world?

CAcop
01-22-2011, 19:34
Seems the trigger will not reset unless you release it before you pump the action.


http://gunnuts.net/2011/01/20/kel-tec-ksg-shotgun-video/

I wonder if that means the hammer fell when the trigger was held back and the foreand brough forward. Like the Win 1897 and 12 did.

B.Reid
01-22-2011, 21:04
I wonder if that means the hammer fell when the trigger was held back and the foreand brough forward. Like the Win 1897 and 12 did.

That would be nice.

gnasty1521
01-23-2011, 09:13
^^^ Same with the Ithaca I believe...

beforeobamabans
01-23-2011, 11:01
In one of those videos, the KT employee in the booth says MSRP of $880 released third quarter.

Scattergun1187
01-28-2011, 15:43
This is a ripoff of the Halo shotgun

http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/M90_Close_Assault_Weapon_System


Halo. LMAO:rofl:

Scattergun1187
01-29-2011, 12:02
I'm thinking about getting one of these kits for one of my S-12s. I just don't like the whole pre-order thing. I've been burned that way a couple of times. I think I'll let others be the guinea pig with this one.

http://www.kushnapup.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/photo1.jpg
http://www.kushnapup.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/home-kush-1.jpg
http://www.kushnapup.com/order


I'll stick with my Red Jacket 8" SBS. This thing looks like crap. That's just MHO.