flash hider question [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Fwdftw
01-13-2011, 10:08
So I'm going with a 14.5 inch middy from bcm, my question is would I see it being worthmy money to get the pws or battle comp vs the 40 bcm a2x?

Bushflyr
01-13-2011, 10:11
Do you want a comp or a flash suppressor? They do different things.

Fwdftw
01-13-2011, 10:13
To be honest man I've never had oy anything more then a birdcage so its al kinda new to me

mikekjg
01-13-2011, 10:24
I went with the PWS on my BCM 14.5 middy. I had one on a 16" previously, and I really liked it.

It's louder than an A2 and a little more flash, but it is a really great comp.

I don't have any experience with the battle comp, but have heard nothing but good things about it.

NeverMore1701
01-13-2011, 10:35
My BattleComp is amazing. I'll never have anything else on a <18" rifle.

I did a LOT of reading when trying to decide on a comp, and the main thing that steered me toward the BC was the comparative lack of concussion. That, coupled with better flash suppression and outstanding muzzle control are what sealed the deal for me vs. the PWC and Surefire offerings.

jdodd
01-13-2011, 10:41
I went with a PWS FSC556, couldn't be more happy.

-J

BBJones
01-13-2011, 13:42
battle comp IMO. Amazing recoil control (same as FSC556 again IMO) and less blast laterally. battle comp is the best "jack of all trades" muzzle device.

mjkeat
01-13-2011, 14:40
I have both and think the BC 1.5 is better. Is it a $55 difference? I think so.

Fwdftw
01-13-2011, 15:26
Well its 45 for the a2x vs 200 for the bc

mjkeat
01-13-2011, 17:08
Well its 45 for the a2x vs 200 for the bc

I was talking about the dif in price b/w the PWS and BC. Either will be a big step up from the Birdcage.

boomhower
01-13-2011, 18:57
BC is the way to go. PWS will piss off your neighbors at the range. Go with the BC.

ezterra
01-14-2011, 14:09
I'm a big fan of the PWS. I highly recommend it. With that being said I don't have experience with the Battle Comp. So I can't give any personal opinion on it. Yes, the PWS does cause more blast than a standard A2 birdcage, but I wouldn't let that deter me from getting one.

surf
01-14-2011, 21:00
The BattleComp does everything better than any of the other comp/hider combo's.

G19 Elite
01-15-2011, 06:28
as soon as BCM gets more of the BCM 14.5" w/ DD RIS II rails, I will be going with the surefire FH556-212A.

WhiskeyUnicorn
01-15-2011, 07:13
Another vote for the battle comp 1.5 Pure seks and is phenomenal.

Fwdftw
01-15-2011, 18:10
think im goin for a vortex flash hider

just a shooter
01-15-2011, 19:10
think im goin for a vortex flash hider

yeah, I did that too on my 14.5 upper.

then I had to spend another $40 to my gun smith to remove vortex and install a BC after I actually shot a gun with one on it, and in the process it uglied up the old vortex from having to drill out the two blind pins.

so I was out the $ for the vortex, the $40 for the gunsmith, and $200 for the BC.

so I guess you could profit from my mistake and just start out with the BC and save a bunch of money because you will end up with one in the end anyway.

mjkeat
01-15-2011, 19:13
yeah, I did that too on my 14.5 upper.

then I had to spend another $40 to my gun smith to remove vortex and install a BC after I actually shot a gun with one on it, and in the process it uglied up the old vortex from having to drill out the two blind pins.

so I was out the $ for the vortex, the $40 for the gunsmith, and $200 for the BC.

so I guess you could profit from my mistake and just start out with the BC and save a bunch of money because you will end up with one in the end anyway.

Take this advise!!!!

Fwdftw
01-15-2011, 19:30
So what was the problem ?

mjkeat
01-15-2011, 19:35
So what was the problem ?

No problem other than the BC 1.5 is far better.

Sounds like he realized the BC was so much better than his Vortex it was worth demolishing it and paying to have a BC installed. To me that says alot due to the money involved.

Fwdftw
01-15-2011, 19:37
I'm sorry I'm really new to the whole flashhider /comp what makes em better? The vortex has like zero flash

mjkeat
01-15-2011, 19:42
I'm sorry I'm really new to the whole flashhider /comp what makes em better? The vortex has like zero flash

From your original post I think we thought you were in the market for a comp. As a civilian a comp is more functional than a FH. The BC does the FH role well but is an awesome comp. Youtube BC and you'll see how well it works. $155 is a lot of $ but once you shoot it the wallet shock goes away.

surf
01-15-2011, 21:27
Just so there is no confusion, the BattleComp really is a compensator with decent flash hiding properties for a compensator. The A2 works better as a flash hider. The Smith Vortex IMO is the best flash hider on the market, but it does nothing in regards to compensation and it is a pure flash hider. They are different things for different needs. On an SPR type rifle in a duty or deployment situation, flash hider all the way. IMO the BattleComp is the first type of compensator that I would consider duty worthy. But be aware there is more flash, more side blast and slightly louder than an A2, but nowhere near as bad as the PWS FSC or the Surefire.

Fwdftw
01-15-2011, 21:40
Hate to pull this card but shtf , range the a2x is fine?

NeverMore1701
01-15-2011, 21:52
Hate to pull this card but shtf , range the a2x is fine?

Nothing wrong with the A2X, it just doesn't do anything particularly well.

BBJones
01-15-2011, 21:56
Hate to pull this card but shtf , range the a2x is fine?

Yes it is fine. Yes the Vortex is fine for flash suppression (in fact awesome at flash suppression). The BC is still my choice for my rifles. It is not hype.

just a shooter
01-15-2011, 22:13
No problem other than the BC 1.5 is far better.

Sounds like he realized the BC was so much better than his Vortex it was worth demolishing it and paying to have a BC installed. To me that says alot due to the money involved.

hey, who you callin' a monkey.:wavey:

sorry, first time I read that it's what I saw.

mjkeat
01-16-2011, 09:50
Hate to pull this card but shtf , range the a2x is fine?

Its fine but once again your OP made it seem like you were looking for something better in the lines of a comp.

Though I dont think much about it to me SHTF is going to be an urban fight. This would consist of close engagements which often times require follow up shots. The BC will get you back on target FAST. At close ranges who cares about flash other than if it blocks your line of sight. The BC wont distort your LOS. As for the range Ill use an old Army phrase, Train Like You Fight.
hey, who you callin' a monkey.:wavey:

sorry, first time I read that it's what I saw.

Touchy touchy :supergrin:

mjkeat
01-16-2011, 09:54
Just so there is no confusion, the BattleComp really is a compensator with decent flash hiding properties for a compensator. The A2 works better as a flash hider. The Smith Vortex IMO is the best flash hider on the market, but it does nothing in regards to compensation and it is a pure flash hider. They are different things for different needs. On an SPR type rifle in a duty or deployment situation, flash hider all the way. IMO the BattleComp is the first type of compensator that I would consider duty worthy. But be aware there is more flash, more side blast and slightly louder than an A2, but nowhere near as bad as the PWS FSC or the Surefire.

If I still used a M4/SAW for a living Id rock the BC. I have a PWS FSC in the mail to try out on a .300 BLK. Going straight to the indoor range to test it out :whistling:

Singlestack Wonder
01-16-2011, 10:36
think im goin for a vortex flash hider

Good choice. In many reviews over the last several years, the Vortex provides superior flash supression vs. other manufacturers. I am not sure as to why some choose to put a compensator on 5.56 rifles. With little to no recoil, if one is getting muzzle rise, their technique should be evaluated.

NeverMore1701
01-16-2011, 10:55
Good choice. In many reviews over the last several years, the Vortex provides superior flash supression vs. other manufacturers. I am not sure as to why some choose to put a compensator on 5.56 rifles. With little to no recoil, if one is getting muzzle rise, their technique should be evaluated.

Obviously you've never shot with a good comp.

mjkeat
01-16-2011, 11:33
Good choice. In many reviews over the last several years, the Vortex provides superior flash supression vs. other manufacturers. I am not sure as to why some choose to put a compensator on 5.56 rifles. With little to no recoil, if one is getting muzzle rise, their technique should be evaluated.

Makes me wonder where youre coming from. BCs of all makes are selling out constantly. Most going to guys who run in crowds Im sure have very good technique.

Bushflyr
01-16-2011, 12:05
The fact of the matter is that the guys that question the utility of a compensator simply don't have the level of skill required to recognize the benefits. Not everyone with high competency will chose to run one, but at least they can make an informed decision.

surf
01-16-2011, 12:06
Good choice. In many reviews over the last several years, the Vortex provides superior flash supression vs. other manufacturers. I am not sure as to why some choose to put a compensator on 5.56 rifles. With little to no recoil, if one is getting muzzle rise, their technique should be evaluated.I have very little recoil with my technique however I will say that the BC does make me faster with better accuracy at similar speeds. This shows up on a timer and cannot be discounted. At certain skill levels it might be splitting hairs but I will take any bit of an advantage that I can get.

As an example this is a 16" barrel with a Smith Vortex
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEYXdQebzA8

This is a 10.5" barrel with a BattleComp. The 10.5" is inherently more violent but the BattleComp completely solves that issue.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOibQKB0CNk

Even running split times in the .16-.17 range with rapid fire the first video has minimal muzzle rise. However the second video I run similar splits with absolutely no muzzle rise which equates to tighter groups. Sure at combat distances and combat accuracy both are similarily fast but accuracy using the BC cannot be denied. This allows for better speeds especially when I shoot on the move. Where you can really see the difference is when your tracking the red dot from shot to shot. No denying that the dot moves less on the BC.

I should run the same drill side by side for comparison.

If I still used a M4/SAW for a living Id rock the BC. I have a PWS FSC in the mail to try out on a .300 BLK. Going straight to the indoor range to test it out :whistling:I ran one for a short stint on one rifle. We did a pretty in depth head to head comparison on the BC, FSC and Surefire MBK. The FSC and Surefire are very loud with a lot of side blast. Not an option for CQB and working in tight quarters with others. Indoor range will be extremely loud. The Surefire had the better compensator properties but they were all so close it was almost a wash. The concussion felt by the shooter was the worst in the FSC. The nasal blast from the FSC was down right irritating. When shooting prone in the dirt the FSC and Surefire were head to head at throwing up A LOT of dirt. BC did not. At night the FSC and the Surefire were like watching a fireworks show, the Surefire being the worse. It did have a nice pattern but both threw flame that interrupted the follow up shots. Both unacceptable IMO. The BC does throw more flame than the A2 but with a light on or light off it does not disrupt the sight picture to the point that quick follow ups become difficult.

I no longer run an FSC, on any of my rifles. Of course everyone has different opinions but I mostly find those who really like the FSC have yet to try a BC. :)

Bushflyr
01-16-2011, 12:21
The nasal blast from the FSC was down right irritating.

What a perfect description. Shooting near some comps is exactly like getting punched inside the head. Makes my eyes feel like :wow:

Singlestack Wonder
01-16-2011, 12:55
Obviously you've never shot with a good comp.

No, I've used several including the Battlelcomp. The benefit for me on a 5.56 16" barrel was negligible. At 25 yards, the split times vs. changes in hits on a 8" circle amounted to maybe .75" to 1" at .16 to .19 split times. No overwhelming benefit. On a 7.62x51, the difference is very noticiable.

Singlestack Wonder
01-16-2011, 12:58
The fact of the matter is that the guys that question the utility of a compensator simply don't have the level of skill required to recognize the benefits. Not everyone with high competency will chose to run one, but at least they can make an informed decision.

Been shooting 3gun for 15+ years. Used everything out there in attempting to get a competitive advantage including the Battlecomp. I have made an informed decision and very much have the skill to do so.

mjkeat
01-16-2011, 13:05
I ran one for a short stint on one rifle. We did a pretty in depth head to head comparison on the BC, FSC and Surefire MBK. The FSC and Surefire are very loud with a lot of side blast. Not an option for CQB and working in tight quarters with others. Indoor range will be extremely loud. The Surefire had the better compensator properties but they were all so close it was almost a wash. The concussion felt by the shooter was the worst in the FSC. The nasal blast from the FSC was down right irritating. When shooting prone in the dirt the FSC and Surefire were head to head at throwing up A LOT of dirt. BC did not. At night the FSC and the Surefire were like watching a fireworks show, the Surefire being the worse. It did have a nice pattern but both threw flame that interrupted the follow up shots. Both unacceptable IMO. The BC does throw more flame than the A2 but with a light on or light off it does not disrupt the sight picture to the point that quick follow ups become difficult.

I no longer run an FSC, on any of my rifles. Of course everyone has different opinions but I mostly find those who really like the FSC have yet to try a BC. :)

At under $100 and the fact I dont shoot at night the FSC30 will work for now. I like my BC1.5 a lot but was curious about the FSC30. Youre correct, Im sure the BABC would have been a wiser choice. For $119 savings the guy next to me can deal w/ the added noise. The .300 BLK will predominately be a hunting rig. The DD w/ BC 1.5 will be the run and gun weapon.

NeverMore1701
01-16-2011, 13:06
No, I've used several including the Battlelcomp. The benefit for me on a 5.56 16" barrel was negligible. At 25 yards, the split times vs. changes in hits on a 8" circle amounted to maybe .75" to 1" at .16 to .19 split times. No overwhelming benefit. On a 7.62x51, the difference is very noticiable.

Well, good for you then. Wish the rest of us had the mastery of the platform that you do.

Singlestack Wonder
01-16-2011, 13:10
Well, good for you then. Wish the rest of us had the mastery of the platform that you do.

No mastery, just a lot of rounds downrange. If a compensator works for you, great! Some of us go down a different path. Choose whatever works best for you.

Fwdftw
01-16-2011, 13:30
god im still confused hahah im really on somewhat of a budget.. and as of now its kinda down to.. moe handguards with BC or DD rail with a2x

surf
01-16-2011, 14:15
god im still confused hahah im really on somewhat of a budget.. and as of now its kinda down to.. moe handguards with BC or DD rail with a2xI personally think you should learn good control of the weapon with the standard A2 first. You will be that much better if you decide to go with a compensator down the line.

Singlestack Wonder
01-16-2011, 14:53
i personally think you should learn good control of the weapon with the standard a2 first. You will be that much better if you decide to go with a compensator down the line.

+1....

Singlestack Wonder
01-16-2011, 14:56
god im still confused hahah im really on somewhat of a budget.. and as of now its kinda down to.. moe handguards with BC or DD rail with a2x

Midway has a great deal on Daniel Defense Omega-X FSB rails at $199.99 (these normally sell for around $350)
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=944140

surf
01-16-2011, 15:02
You might also consider the Troy or VTAC Extreme Battle Rails at about $155 - $185.

mjkeat
01-16-2011, 15:48
Midway has a great deal on Daniel Defense Omega-X FSB rails at $199.99 (these normally sell for around $350)
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=944140

You might also consider the Troy or VTAC Extreme Battle Rails at about $155 - $185.

Both are very good rails. I dont have an Omega but I do have a DD and its built like a brick **** house. I have a couple Troy EXT rails and they are sturdy and light.

Fwdftw
01-16-2011, 16:02
with those troys can u keep the fsp?

mjkeat
01-16-2011, 17:13
with those troys can u keep the fsp?

If you pick the right size rail for your gas system. I think an 11" rail will fit behind a standard FSB on a midlength and 7" rail on a carbine. Double check this though to make sure.

NeverMore1701
01-16-2011, 17:24
If you pick the right size rail for your gas system. I think an 11" rail will fit behind a standard FSB on a midlength and 7" rail on a carbine. Double check this though to make sure.

The 11" would be too long for a midlength, he'd need a 9", so the Troy/VTAC is out if he wants to keep the FSP.

Fwdftw
01-16-2011, 18:25
Def want fsp

mjkeat
01-16-2011, 18:35
Def want fsp

Out of curiosity, why?

surf
01-16-2011, 18:49
with those troys can u keep the fsp?The Troy and VTAC Extreme Battle Rails both come in a 9" version. No need to get rid of the frpnt sight post.

Viking Tactics 9" Extreme Battle Rail $165 (http://store.vikingtactics.com/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=VT01&Product_Code=VTAC-TRX-9&Category_Code=)

Troy TRX Extreme Battle Rail $165 (http://troyind.com/%20/battlerails/troy-battlerail-trx-extreme-9-black)

Both are made by Troy and pretty much the difference is if you prefer slots or holes.

This is not my rifle as both my Troy rails are 13" rails. But this is a pic of a 9" VTAC on a midlength gas.

http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/6425/vtac9midlength.jpg

Fwdftw
01-16-2011, 19:27
Just bc is rather have it, tell me why I shouldn't ?

NeverMore1701
01-16-2011, 19:48
The Troy and VTAC Extreme Battle Rails both come in a 9" version. No need to get rid of the frpnt sight post.

Viking Tactics 9" Extreme Battle Rail $165 (http://store.vikingtactics.com/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=VT01&Product_Code=VTAC-TRX-9&Category_Code=)

Troy TRX Extreme Battle Rail $165 (http://troyind.com/%20/battlerails/troy-battlerail-trx-extreme-9-black)

Both are made by Troy and pretty much the difference is if you prefer slots or holes.

This is not my rifle as both my Troy rails are 13" rails. But this is a pic of a 9" VTAC on a midlength gas.

http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/6425/vtac9midlength.jpg

Huh, last time I looked (it's been a while), I didn't see any lengths beside the 11" and 13". Cool!

mjkeat
01-16-2011, 20:45
Just bc is rather have it, tell me why I shouldn't ?

Its not that I think you shouldn't. Its as simple as what the question asks. I was just curious as to why you wanted to keep the FSB. I happen to like the rail + FSB look liked pictured above.

One plus to going with a longer rail is increased sight radius. Another is better weapon control due to being able to grip further out w/ your support hand.

Seriously do what suits you. Its your hard earned $ going into this rifle. And its your shooting style you have to accommodate. I'm just trying to answer your question to the best of my knowledge.

Fwdftw
01-16-2011, 20:56
Thanks !