Need advice on AR 15? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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tonyparson
01-20-2011, 09:54
I'm about to buy a AR 15 and don't know a thing about them, what I need to know is what one is the better out of these two brands? DPMS AR-15 or BUSHMASTER AR-15. Thanks for your help on this...

JBnTX
01-20-2011, 10:24
Forget the rest and buy the best!

Check out Bravo Company's complete rifles and carbines.
Quality is impeccable and they're built Mil-Spec.

I have the full size A4 rifle with a 4x ACOG scope. It's
perfect and extremely accurate.

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-Bravo-Company-Rifle-Carbine-M4-AR15-M16-s/140.htm


Here's the A4. I love this rifle!
http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-M16-A4-AR15-Bravo-Company-carbine-rifle-s/146.htm

WayaX
01-20-2011, 11:09
Ask yourself "what is this gun for?". If the answer is anything but personal protection, buy the cheaper. If you want it as a gun for protection, neither. Save yourself heartache in the long run with a Colt or BCM. Save up for it if you have to. If anyone tells you their dpms, bushmaster, etc is just as good as a Colt for a protection gun, ask "why?" You'll never get a good answer.

FatBoy
01-20-2011, 11:43
I'm about to buy a AR 15 and don't know a thing about them, what I need to know is what one is the better out of these two brands? DPMS AR-15 or BUSHMASTER AR-15. Thanks for your help on this...

They're both owned by the same company and would do fine for range use IMHO. My 1990's BM has never failed me after 1000's of rounds, but my Bravo is my current go to gun.

You will get the same answers that come every few weeks when this is asked.

Colt, Bravo, LMT, DD etc.only for fighting guns, or the other group will say all ARs are essentially the same so way pay for the name.

Figure out what you want to do w/ first then buy what you want.

FB

surf
01-20-2011, 11:48
Are you restricted to those 2 manufacturers?

mvician
01-20-2011, 11:56
I'm about to buy a AR 15 and don't know a thing about them



What's the big hurry?

STOP, take your time, EDUCATE yourself.
Do you make all purchases without studying them at least a little bit?
If all you want to do is to buy an AR from your local store and those are what they carry......flip a coin.

DieselNut
01-20-2011, 12:39
Out of the two brands I'd pick the bushmaster.

tx787
01-20-2011, 13:26
Smith and Wesson's M&P15's are the same price as Bushmasters but generally better made and incorporate more of the desired features (like properly staked gas keys).

tonyparson
01-20-2011, 14:33
Thanks guys I will keep looking. The guy at my gun-shop said these were the best to brands out there, I guess he was worng. I'll look in to Smith and Wesson's M&P15 and other brands with the links you provided here , again thanks. I hate buying something I have no clue whats good or bad. I've always wanted a AR but don't have a clue about them. So I'll do a lot of reading on them before I buy...

Quigley
01-20-2011, 14:38
Thanks guys I will keep looking. The guy at my gun-shop said these were the best to brands out there, I guess he was worng. I'll look in to Smith and Wesson's M&P15 and other brands with the links you provided here , again thanks. I hate buying something I have no glue whats good or bad. I've always wanted a AR but don't have a glue about them. So I'll do a lot of reading on them before I buy...

The correct word you were looking for is CLUE:tongueout:, just had to poke a little fun. Also take a look at RRA and STAG

RWBlue
01-20-2011, 14:51
Different guns have different advantages. You can not get a top end gun for a rock bottom price. There isn't a ban on now, so you have time to make an informed decision.

First question is "Why do you want an AR-15?"

Is this your one and only SHTF rifle, or is this a weekend target shooter, or is this a long range precision varmint rifle?

Second question: Are you planning on reselling it in the future?

Budget?

tonyparson
01-20-2011, 14:52
double post...

tonyparson
01-20-2011, 14:52
The correct word you were looking for is CLUE:tongueout:, just had to poke a little fun. Also take a look at RRA and STAG

:embarassed: :supergrin:

K. Foster
01-20-2011, 14:54
First, what do you intend to do with it? Personal defense, competition, range toy?
I recommend you take some time and research this. Read all the relevant threads here and on other forums. Google M4 comparison chart by Rob S and look at the features listed. When you have an understanding of what those features are and how they will or will not affect your use requirements, then you can make an informed decision.
While it may sound simple to just ask what’s a good brand? If you do your own research, you won’t have to worry about some 14 year old key board commando telling you “I’ve been a SWAT cop for 18 years and I only use DPMS ‘cause they’re the best!” Just because somebody works in a gun store, doesn’t mean he can give good advice.

tonyparson
01-20-2011, 14:55
Different guns have different advantages. You can not get a top end gun for a rock bottom price. There isn't a ban on now, so you have time to make an informed decision.

First question is "Why do you want an AR-15?"

Is this your one and only SHTF rifle, or is this a weekend target shooter, or is this a long range precision varmint rifle?

Second question: Are you planning on reselling it in the future?

Budget?

I want one for SHTF and for the range. I have a $2000 budget.

boomhower
01-20-2011, 15:18
If you really wanted to spend 2k on the rifle, KAC SR15.

My suggestion:
BCM LW 16" midlength upper w/ BCG, CH, MOE handguards, and BCM rear site for $762 and a BCM lower for $270. Total for rifle $1032 plus shipping. Now add 1k off brass ammo and a few PMAGS. Go shoot. Save the rest for an optic and more ammo later.

RWBlue
01-20-2011, 15:27
I want one for SHTF and for the range. I have a $2000 budget.

You can do better than a DPMS/Bushmaster.

For the most part, most things can be upgraded but it will cost. So you are probably best off to buy what you want.

IMHO, a rail is essential on a SHTF rifle. My guns with rails allows me to add a light, laser, forward mount my optics. IF you are going with a free float rail, it is best to do it from the beginning.

Do you want a fixed front sight? Some people love the fixed front sight. The claim is that it is robust. I prefer to have a sight that lays down out of the way. This way it doesn't show up when using zero magnification optics. If you go fixed, be sure to get one with the correct height.

Shorter barrels are better up to a point. If you NEVER plan on upgrading your AR, you can go with a 14.5. If you are like the rest of us, a 16inch is better.

TedG
01-20-2011, 17:14
What's the big hurry?

STOP, take your time, EDUCATE yourself.
Do you make all purchases without studying them at least a little bit?
If all you want to do is to buy an AR from your local store and those are what they carry......flip a coin.

Yep, that's some good advice.


With a $2k budget, I wouldn't pick either choice. Look at Noveske or BCM. You can get a really good BCM for under a grand.

MikeinCincy
01-20-2011, 17:42
I was in a similar situation. Had roughly $3,000 to spend and after a TON of research, went with the Colt LE6940 with a Trijicon ACOG TA31H 4x32. Then, I bought about 1,000 rounds, 3 PMAGS, 2 H&K mags, some Breakfree CLP, Slip2000 EWL, etc. etc.

chineseboxer
01-20-2011, 17:52
I would opt for Stag, Rock River or S&W over either of the brands you asked about.

Steve34
01-20-2011, 18:01
Rock River Arms + an AK. Spend the rest of your money on ammo. :supergrin:

gemeinschaft
01-20-2011, 18:11
I want one for SHTF and for the range. I have a $2000 budget.

You don't have to spend $2,000 to get a good rifle. That being said, take some of your budget, borrow a rifle and take a good carbine course.

This will give you a taste of what you like/dislike. There are many features that people like/dislike for many reasons.

My Go to Gun is a Frankenstein M4gery that I pieced together to fit my needs. I have put over 32,000+ rounds through it alone and I have it setup just the way I want it.

I am one of those weird Iron Sights kinda guys. Optics are great for this that or the other, but they are not the solution to collection of issues you may face.

For this reason, my rifle is not a flat top, instead it has an upper receiver that has the carry handle. I don't like anything "removable" on my rifle except for my sling.

If you are looking for something that you may have to rely on, I would ask yourself this question:

"What rifle will allow me to engage targets from 0-300yds without regard to weather or lighting; without having to make any adjustments."

glock22357
01-20-2011, 18:21
You don't have to spend $2,000 to get a good rifle. That being said, take some of your budget, borrow a rifle and take a good carbine course.

This will give you a taste of what you like/dislike. There are many features that people like/dislike for many reasons.

My Go to Gun is a Frankenstein M4gery that I pieced together to fit my needs. I have put over 32,000+ rounds through it alone and I have it setup just the way I want it.

I am one of those weird Iron Sights kinda guys. Optics are great for this that or the other, but they are not the solution to collection of issues you may face.

For this reason, my rifle is not a flat top, instead it has an upper receiver that has the carry handle. I don't like anything "removable" on my rifle except for my sling.

If you are looking for something that you may have to rely on, I would ask yourself this question:

"What rifle will allow me to engage targets from 0-300yds without regard to weather or lighting; without having to make any adjustments."


I know you have the best of intentions, but your advice seems geared towards someone that already has alot of experience. The OP has 2k to spend, and instead of getting a rifle, you're suggesting that he spend his rifle funds taking a course. At the end of which, he will be a better shooter, but not own a rifle. Hmmmmm.....

As far as the question you would use to qualify his purchase, maybe thinking about starting out at 50 yards and learning to shoot would be a wiser idea that worrying about hitting at 300 yards. This is civilian life, not the Military...no one in civilian life will ever have a reason to hit at 300 yards with an AR, unless it's for funzies.

For the money the OP has to spend, he could build a very nice BCM, get a quality optic and weapon light, mags and ammo, and have tons of fun, with a great all around weapon that can serve him in SD/HD SHTF. Not many people run without optics these days, they make every shooter better, no matter what their skill level.

Halojumper
01-20-2011, 19:07
If anyone tells you their dpms, bushmaster, etc is just as good as a Colt for a protection gun, ask "why?" You'll never get a good answer.

Or if anybody says that (insert favorite brand) is not as good as a Colt, ask them to explain why. You'll not likely get a good answer.

AFPD118
01-20-2011, 19:58
Stag Arms are good, they make parts for other companies as well

RWBlue
01-20-2011, 20:06
Or if anybody says that (insert favorite brand) is not as good as a Colt, ask them to explain why. You'll not likely get a good answer.

I prefer a Franken rifle.
This way I know all my parts.

IMHO, if you are running a factory rifle you have not used your rifle enough.

gemeinschaft
01-20-2011, 20:53
I know you have the best of intentions, but your advice seems geared towards someone that already has alot of experience. The OP has 2k to spend, and instead of getting a rifle, you're suggesting that he spend his rifle funds taking a course. At the end of which, he will be a better shooter, but not own a rifle. Hmmmmm.....

As far as the question you would use to qualify his purchase, maybe thinking about starting out at 50 yards and learning to shoot would be a wiser idea that worrying about hitting at 300 yards. This is civilian life, not the Military...no one in civilian life will ever have a reason to hit at 300 yards with an AR, unless it's for funzies.

For the money the OP has to spend, he could build a very nice BCM, get a quality optic and weapon light, mags and ammo, and have tons of fun, with a great all around weapon that can serve him in SD/HD SHTF. Not many people run without optics these days, they make every shooter better, no matter what their skill level.

Maybe my advice was misunderstood. I know some very good instructors that would respect a shooter, with very little knowledge on a specific weapons platform, coming to them asking to shoot a rifle before they commit big money to something they may find out later doesn't work for them. I am not advocating spending $2,000 on instruction. Depending on where the OP lives, he might very well be able to find a decent instructor + ammo for under $500.

There are so many configurations that an AR platform can be rigged, that I think personal preference should weigh into the decision of what configuration to buy.

I have to respectfully disagree that optics make every shooter better.

Of course, everyone has an opinion and we all know, they all stink :whistling:

At the end of the day, the core skills are the same regardless of configuration, optics and other accessories. Learning how to manipulate your weapon and keep it in the fight is IMHO a lot more important than spending good hard-earned money on Optics, weapons light and other accessories.

Training is the one thing that can't be taken away from you, you can't lose it in a house fire, etc...

I can't tell you how many times I have watched guys strip things off their rifles because they just got in the way during intense training sessions on the range.

You'll probably laugh at me, but a weapons mounted light was required for an Operator's Course that I took with a very well known instructor. I was completely against spending a bunch of money for landing light on the end of my rifle, so I used a Surefire 6P and a 1" Weaver scope ring to mount it to a piece of Picatinny rail that I drilled into the left side of my handguard.

The other guys who showed for the course laughed and gawked at my setup, but it worked for me. Everyone shut up when the instructor pulled out his rifle and he had the same rig except his had a Pelican light instead of Surefire.

My point is, gear doesn't make you high speed low drag; ability is what makes the difference. Stick with the basics and learn the fundamentals and you will be better than most of the guys toting black rifles.

The more basics you know, the more advanced you are.

Captains1911
01-20-2011, 21:02
Or if anybody says that (insert favorite brand) is not as good as a Colt, ask them to explain why. You'll not likely get a good answer.

BS, there are plenty of good answers based on fact, the problem is some people fail to accept them.

Captains1911
01-20-2011, 21:06
Thanks guys I will keep looking. The guy at my gun-shop said these were the best to brands out there, I guess he was worng. I'll look in to Smith and Wesson's M&P15 and other brands with the links you provided here , again thanks. I hate buying something I have no clue whats good or bad. I've always wanted a AR but don't have a clue about them. So I'll do a lot of reading on them before I buy...

Once again, gun store employees are almost always wrong. He most likely has lots of DPMS and BM in stock, so obviously he is going to hype them.

With a $2000 budget, you can get the best and then some. Look at BCM, Daniel Defense, Colt, and LMT. My first recommendation would be BCM, you will have plenty of $$ left over to buy a quality optic, mags, and ammo.

Do as much research as you can before buying, it will pay off.

Halojumper
01-20-2011, 21:33
BS, there are plenty of good answers based on fact, the problem is some people fail to accept them.

While there are certainly good answers out there, you more often hear the BS ones.

mjkeat
01-20-2011, 22:24
BS, there are plenty of good answers based on fact, the problem is some people fail to accept them.

:thumbsup:

Especially true if your talking about such rifles as Bushmaster and DPMS. Its funny how guys will defend their non mil-spec rifles to the death even after being confronted w/ actual data.

DieselNut
01-21-2011, 04:09
I've had 2 negatives about DPMS so far. I bought a bolt carrier group from them back when I was new to AR15s and it was out of spec. Gas key wasn't staked and was mis-aligned. It wouldn't even cycle in either of my ARs at the time (colt and dsc).
Second was at the range. I was able to out shoot one with a beater T-53 mosin at 50 yards. Something was definitely wrong with it. Nobody at the range could get any decent grouping from it.
In my opinion as long as you stat away from Hesse, Vulcan, Olympic, and dpms, you should be fine. And if you got a higher budget go with noveske or Wilson combat if you're a luxury kind of guy.

AFPD118
01-21-2011, 06:01
get a good enough AR that you like and buy lots of ammo and shoot a lot, that will make you a better marksman :)