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Sonnytoo
02-09-2011, 19:25
I worked with CanyonMan in the beginning of these recipes. I was using W231, and he encouraged me to go to Power Pistol, which worked out very well. CM's is always out in the boonies blasting holes in the mountain-side with his G36, so I knew his loads would be fine. Yes, you do get some vigorous ejection with the 7.6-7.7gr loads of PP and 230gr bullets, but no problems with any signs of overpressure.

I had a thread on here that was titled ".45 bullets." I honestly don't know where it is; I guess the boogie-men got it. But here it is again.
Sonnytoo (S2 when I'm lazy...which is often)

Some .45 Auto loads, commercial and reloads:

These worked fine in my G36. Use at your own risk. Some of these loads
are max'd out for W231 powder.

Speer Nickel case, JHP, 970, 979, 1006 avg 985 fps. (Pers Protection - 185gr Gold Dots HP)

--------------------------------

sample size: 10 rounds or more with all reloads...----------------------------------

Rainier, 230 gr plated RN, 5.1 gr W231, avg veloc 704 fps
0.470” crimp, 1.235” COL

--------------------------------------------

Rainier, 200 gr plated RN, 5.4 gr W231, avg veloc 720 fps
0.470” crimp, 1.235” COL (too long for 200 gr)

Rainier, 230 gr plated RN, 5.4 gr W231, avg veloc 765 fps
0.470” crimp, 1.235” COL

Remington, 230 gr RN, 230 gr FMJ RN, 5.4 gr W231, avg veloc 738 fps
0.470” crimp, 1.235” COL

Hornady XTP, 230 gr, , 5.4 gr W231, avg veloc 772 fps
0.470” crimp, 1.208” COL

Obviously, many of these above loads are light.


XTP book data, Gander Mt. 5.7gr = 800 fps, 6.1 gr = 850 fps, 6.4 gr = 900 fps



Heavier .45 ACP Loads
New G36 loads ran fine.
________________________________________
I ran these .45 ACP loads in G36 this a.m. at the range (11/22/10) and chrono'd them all.

I saw no signs of high pressure on any of the following loads. Primers were not flattened or cratered. Extraction/ejection was fine and vigorous. Cases were thrown about 20 feet over my right shoulder. Cases from the 200 gr loads at the bottom of this list went six feet or so over rt shlder.

Loaded up a bunch of new Starline brass, .45 ACP, with 7.6gr of Power Pistol. Using Rainier 230 gr plated RN, 1.250" COL and 0.470" crimp.
AVG = 875 fps. std dev = 8 fps

Loaded Power Pistol, 7.6gr powder charge with Remington 230 FMJ RN at 1.260" COL.
AVG = 866 fps std dev = 11 fps

Also ran Hornady 230 XTP's with 1.210" COL and 7.6 gr PP.
AVG = 901 fps std dev = 12 fps

Rainier plated 200gr RN, 7.0 grains Power Pistol, and 1.225" COL, Recoil much lighter than above loads, but still
AVG = 800 fps. with std dev = 15 fps

Only fired about 25 cartridges, so fouling was very light and easily swabbed from bore. No evidence of any copper fouling from Rainier plated bullets. None was expected, as Rainier advertises that their copper plating is secure under 1200-1250 fps.

I was very happy with the above loads. The recoil was not objectionable with any of the 230 grain loads. The lessened recoil with the slower 200-grain loads (800 fps) was surprising and pleasant, when I shot them at the end of my range stay.

I use WLP primers. Always had good luck with them; halfway between standard and magnum strength.

I may order some additional Rainier 200gr plated bullets. Running at 800 fps, they are a nice range load with good ejection. p.s. I did. I like them.
Sonnytoo

Dave T
02-09-2011, 21:39
If you're happy with your PP loads then more "power" to you (pun intended). I think your 231 loads are way light. I know that those charges are listed as max in some manuals but not even reaching the performance of Ball is kind of sad.

I get 832 fps from a 5" Government Model Colt with 6g of 231 under a Berry's Plated 230g RN. Thats virtually on for MilSpec Ball (830 fps +-15).

I also duplicate one of my carry loads (Hornady 200g XTP standard pressure) with the same 6g charge but under Berry's 200g Plated RS (round shoulder). Both the factory and handload do 900 fps from a 5" barrel.

Obviously the performance of the above would be a little less from a G36. Don't have one around anymore so I can't say what the results actually are. Just wanted to point out that most 230g 231 loads in the manuals don't even match Ball.

Dave

Ridgerunner665
02-10-2011, 01:32
7 grains of Power Pistol, Remington brass, CCI primer, 230 grain XTP, OAL 1.23"...790 fps, ES 14 (this was the load I used in my 1911...it worked better in that pistol)

6.1 grains of Unique...all other factors same as above...820 fps, ES 2 fps...I like this load so far but it needs to be tested a little more. Brass ejects quite high but lands about 4 feet behind me and to the right a little.

No crimp on either load (.471")

Sonnytoo,
I don't wanna come across as a know it all new guy but I gotta tell you...by the time you get a 45acp to flatten a primer you are WAAAAY above any pressure that is safe to fire in a Glock chamber...non +P brass will let go long before you flatten a primer.

I know this because of my testing with the 45 Super...using the same primers with 28,500 psi loads, and they looked fine. It takes upwards of 37,500 psi (10mm pressure) to flatten a large pistol primer...that would be a catastrophic failure in any 45acp.

Again...not being a know it all...just don't wanna see you blow your fingers off.

Sonnytoo
02-10-2011, 12:50
Sonnytoo,
I don't wanna come across as a know it all new guy but I gotta tell you...by the time you get a 45acp to flatten a primer you are WAAAAY above any pressure that is safe to fire in a Glock chamber...non +P brass will let go long before you flatten a primer.

I know this because of my testing with the 45 Super...using the same primers with 28,500 psi loads, and they looked fine. It takes upwards of 37,500 psi (10mm pressure) to flatten a large pistol primer...that would be a catastrophic failure in any 45acp.

Again...not being a know it all...just don't wanna see you blow your fingers off.

Sir, I thank you for that information.
S2

Sonnytoo
02-10-2011, 12:53
If you're happy with your PP loads then more "power" to you (pun intended). I think your 231 loads are way light. I know that those charges are listed as max in some manuals but not even reaching the performance of Ball is kind of sad. Just wanted to point out that most 230g 231 loads in the manuals don't even match Ball.

Dave

Thanks, Dave. Yes, I know that loads below 800 fps are very light. I prefer between 800 and 900 fps for easy shooting. Appreciate your comments.
S2

CanyonMan
02-10-2011, 23:35
I worked with CanyonMan in the beginning of these recipes. I was using W231, and he encouraged me to go to Power Pistol, which worked out very well. CM's is always out in the boonies blasting holes in the mountain-side with his G36, so I knew his loads would be fine. Yes, you do get some vigorous ejection with the 7.6-7.7gr loads of PP and 230gr bullets, but no problems with any signs of overpressure.

I had a thread on here that was titled ".45 bullets." I honestly don't know where it is; I guess the boogie-men got it. But here it is again.
Sonnytoo (S2 when I'm lazy...which is often)

Some .45 Auto loads, commercial and reloads:

These worked fine in my G36. Use at your own risk. Some of these loads
are max'd out for W231 powder.

Speer Nickel case, JHP, 970, 979, 1006 avg 985 fps. (Commercial - 230gr Gold Dots)

--------------------------------

sample size: 10 rounds or more with all reloads...----------------------------------

Rainier, 230 gr plated RN, 5.1 gr W231, avg veloc 704 fps
0.470 crimp, 1.235 COL

--------------------------------------------

Rainier, 200 gr plated RN, 5.4 gr W231, avg veloc 720 fps
0.470 crimp, 1.235 COL (too long for 200 gr)

Rainier, 230 gr plated RN, 5.4 gr W231, avg veloc 765 fps
0.470 crimp, 1.235 COL

Remington, 230 gr RN, 230 gr FMJ RN, 5.4 gr W231, avg veloc 738 fps
0.470 crimp, 1.235 COL

Hornady XTP, 230 gr, , 5.4 gr W231, avg veloc 772 fps
0.470 crimp, 1.208 COL

Obviously, many of these above loads are light.


XTP book data, Gander Mt. 5.7gr = 800 fps, 6.1 gr = 850 fps, 6.4 gr = 900 fps



Heavier .45 ACP Loads
New G36 loads ran fine.
________________________________________
I ran these .45 ACP loads in G36 this a.m. at the range (11/22/10) and chrono'd them all.

I saw no signs of high pressure on any of the following loads. Primers were not flattened or cratered. Extraction/ejection was fine and vigorous. Cases were thrown about 20 feet over my right shoulder. Cases from the 200 gr loads at the bottom of this list went six feet or so over rt shlder.

Loaded up a bunch of new Starline brass, .45 ACP, with 7.6gr of Power Pistol. Using Rainier 230 gr plated RN, 1.250" COL and 0.470" crimp.
AVG = 875 fps. std dev = 8 fps

Loaded Power Pistol, 7.6gr powder charge with Remington 230 FMJ RN at 1.260" COL.
AVG = 866 fps std dev = 11 fps

Also ran Hornady 230 XTP's with 1.210" COL and 7.6 gr PP.
AVG = 901 fps std dev = 12 fps

Rainier plated 200gr RN, 7.0 grains Power Pistol, and 1.225" COL, Recoil much lighter than above loads, but still
AVG = 800 fps. with std dev = 15 fps

Only fired about 25 cartridges, so fouling was very light and easily swabbed from bore. No evidence of any copper fouling from Rainier plated bullets. None was expected, as Rainier advertises that their copper plating is secure under 1200-1250 fps.

I was very happy with the above loads. The recoil was not objectionable with any of the 230 grain loads. The lessened recoil with the slower 200-grain loads (800 fps) was surprising and pleasant, when I shot them at the end of my range stay.

I use WLP primers. Always had good luck with them; halfway between standard and magnum strength.

I may order some additional Rainier 200gr plated bullets. Running at 800 fps, they are a nice range load with good ejection. p.s. I did. I like them.
Sonnytoo



S2,

Hey amigo. EXCELLENT report and information. Great job man ! :thumbsup:

Thank you for the time and energy you put into this for everyone...

Also ran Hornady 230 XTP's with 1.210" COL and 7.6 gr PP.
AVG = 901 fps std dev = 12 fps

Man this is one nice load. I really like this one. Mine were (u guessed it) 7.7gr PP. haha. But the 7.5 and 7.6grs are plenty good enough for the 230gr in the G36 for SD.

For the record (for other folks reading this). I have run, even with the stock spring set up in the G36 these loads I worked up at 7.5 and 7.7grs of Power Pistol with a 230gr bullet of choice, and have fired now around 1200/1400 rounds through the G36 with not ONE single problem, pressure sign, no battering of the frame or slide or any parts for that matter, and not one single malfuntion of any nature what soever.

These are holding tennis ball size groups out at 35 yds at half as fast as i can pull the trigger. They are holding tremendous groups at 50yds.

Again. Out of this much testing , with this many rounds, and not one negitive report to the gun of any kind at all.

I thank S2 once again, for being so very much fun to work with through this gig we've had going here with these loads, and the excitment he has had has blessed me all to pieces as well. haha.

S2 Good work, and let's see what we can cook up next amigo ! :supergrin:


Bless ya and watch your six ! it has been a great ride my friend. ;)



CM