Looking into Fusion,....... [Archive] - Glock Talk

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faawrenchbndr
03-11-2011, 09:39
How is Fusion doing these days? I seem to hear very little about them here.
I've been thinking of having a "commander" built by Fusion.

Anyone have the 411 of Fusion these days?

Hokie1911
03-11-2011, 09:42
:popcorn:

bobtail1911
03-11-2011, 09:57
:popcorn:

:duel: lol

awpk03s
03-11-2011, 09:59
I don't hear much anymore either. Honestly, the stories and photos that I've seen out of them in the past 18 months, is enough to scare me away.

Cerebrus
03-11-2011, 10:00
How is Fusion doing these days? I seem to hear very little about them here.
I've been thinking of having a "commander" built by Fusion.

Anyone have the 411 of Fusion these days?

Sure just ask Hail Caesar.. I am sure he can fill you in on anything you need to know.. :innocent:

knedrgr
03-11-2011, 10:08
Have them build you a gun and then they'll throw in a few extra stuff that you didn't really ask for...it'll be like a nice 1911 grab bag.

Let just say that I can blend a GS better than some of the "custom" Fusion builds. And I've only stayed at a Holiday Inn...

faawrenchbndr
03-11-2011, 10:09
Sure just ask Hail Caesar.. I am sure he can fill you in on anything you need to know.. :innocent:

Yes I know all about that. I posted a few of my "opinions" in the Fusion page at TOS, and got banned for life plus one year.

Just looking to see if they straightened up their act.
Maybe I'll just get back in line for Bob Miller with a Colt Commander.

polizei1
03-11-2011, 10:11
Have you looked into John Harrison?

www.harrisoncustom.com

Sarge43
03-11-2011, 11:10
Okay, I'll try to give as objective an opinion as I can.
I own two Fusions. One bobtail commander which I received a little over two years ago, and a Fusion CCO which I received about a year ago.
The bobtail is dang near perfect. It outshoots my abilities with it, it has excellent fit and finish (ionbond) and has been a joy to own. I thought so much of it that I placed the order for my CCO. What higher opinion can you have of a builder than to come back and order another?
The CCO was ordered at a time of heavy growth for Fusion as word was getting out and more people were ordering from them than ever.
Long story short, when my CCO arrived, there were a couple of things missing from it that were on my build sheet, and a couple of things on the pistol that weren't on the build sheet. It's as if no one even bothered to check the build against the order before shipping it to me. I like everything about the pistol, so I'm okay with it, but not everyone would be. I was a little "miffed" at first, but after shooting the pistol, I decided to let it go as I liked the setup that arrived.
On both builds, I noticed that the quote build times were totally inaccurate. I was months longer on both pistols. I wish they would have simply told me up front that it was going to take almost a year to build it. I vastly prefer that than being told "it's almost done" time after time after time for months.
Bob is a nice guy - I don't think even those that are downright angry at Fusion can deny that. He always answered the phone and talked to me, even if the information he gave wasn't 100% accurate. He also offered to take back the CCO on Fusions dime and get everything that was "wrong" right for me. I'm the one that turned that down - I liked it the way it was, and I didn't want to wait a few more months to get it back.
It's just my opinion, but I think Fusion grew too quickly and just couldn't keep up. In their attempt to do so, things started slipping in the quality control department as evidenced by my CCO not matching the build sheet.
I'm thrilled with my first Fusion, and "okay" with my second, but I will not be ordering a third based on my experience. At least not until the current issues are corrected.
That's as honest as I can be. Good luck in your decision!
Sarge

MD357
03-11-2011, 11:16
Asking whether or not you should buy a fusion instead of waiting for a Miller custom is like wondering if you should pick up a Kia with ground effects or a Dinan BMW. One a pretender, there other is a true custom.

Hokie1911
03-11-2011, 11:19
Okay, I'll try to give as objective an opinion as I can.
I own two Fusions. One bobtail commander which I received a little over two years ago, and a Fusion CCO which I received about a year ago.
The bobtail is dang near perfect. It outshoots my abilities with it, it has excellent fit and finish (ionbond) and has been a joy to own. I thought so much of it that I placed the order for my CCO. What higher opinion can you have of a builder than to come back and order another?
The CCO was ordered at a time of heavy growth for Fusion as word was getting out and more people were ordering from them than ever.
Long story short, when my CCO arrived, there were a couple of things missing from it that were on my build sheet, and a couple of things on the pistol that weren't on the build sheet. It's as if no one even bothered to check the build against the order before shipping it to me. I like everything about the pistol, so I'm okay with it, but not everyone would be. I was a little "miffed" at first, but after shooting the pistol, I decided to let it go as I liked the setup that arrived.
On both builds, I noticed that the quote build times were totally inaccurate. I was months longer on both pistols. I wish they would have simply told me up front that it was going to take almost a year to build it. I vastly prefer that than being told "it's almost done" time after time after time for months.
Bob is a nice guy - I don't think even those that are downright angry at Fusion can deny that. He always answered the phone and talked to me, even if the information he gave wasn't 100% accurate. He also offered to take back the CCO on Fusions dime and get everything that was "wrong" right for me. I'm the one that turned that down - I liked it the way it was, and I didn't want to wait a few more months to get it back.
It's just my opinion, but I think Fusion grew too quickly and just couldn't keep up. In their attempt to do so, things started slipping in the quality control department as evidenced by my CCO not matching the build sheet.
I'm thrilled with my first Fusion, and "okay" with my second, but I will not be ordering a third based on my experience. At least not until the current issues are corrected.
That's as honest as I can be. Good luck in your decision!
Sarge

Great post, Ryan. :thumbsup:

faawrenchbndr
03-11-2011, 11:20
MD357,........why do you seem to always make the most sense?

Keeping my fingers crossed, I should get the Miller Springer GI next week. :supergrin:

98_1LE
03-11-2011, 12:06
I am very happy with my Fusion, but it is a very early build. I had high hopes for them, but the stories prevented me from having them build an aluminum frame CCO.

bac1023
03-11-2011, 19:23
I like my early Fusion build, but wouldn't pay today's prices.

They aren't that.

abraves
03-11-2011, 21:06
I sent in a frame, slide and barrel for them to fit for me and they did a very good job. They shipped it back along with all the parts I ordered and then had to ship the parts they overlooked. As stated Bob is very nice and willing to make it right. I don't know if I would have them do a complete build since I have not seen anything they have done but heard stories. This gun is costing my buddy a little more than if he would have had Fusion build it but it will be quicker and I know what it will look like. I'm not a pistol smith nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn but I do have good eye sight. I know what it is suppose to look like. One thing I don't like about the Fusion "bobtail" is that it is their own and not Ed Browns. You have to use their MSH which doesn't fit flush with the back of the frame. I will have to do some blending on the edges.

This is my experience with them so far.

abraves

abraves
03-11-2011, 21:09
bac,

What would be the best money spent on a semi/custom 1911? In other words who.

abraves

bac1023
03-11-2011, 21:35
Asking whether or not you should buy a fusion instead of waiting for a Miller custom is like wondering if you should pick up a Kia with ground effects or a Dinan BMW. One a pretender, there other is a true custom.

:agree:

bac1023
03-11-2011, 21:37
bac,

What would be the best money spent on a semi/custom 1911? In other words who.

abraves

Les Baer gives you good value for the dollar, in my opinion.

RRA was fantastic in that respect, but aren't built anymore.

airflyer
03-12-2011, 07:35
RRA was fantastic in that respect, but aren't built anymore.[/QUOTE]

I was talking to my gun dealer which is a large Rock river dealer and he is now taking orders for them
He is saying they are gearing up to offer all models ,and they are looking to wards putting them back in catalog they are in process of building up parts mostly getting frames with out rails . The prices went up , and is quoting 3 month wait
Looking forward to see one when he gets one in he has two ordered would like to compare them to my limited match (older build) to see if quality stayed the same.plus with higher prices i don't believe the value is the same as before though

Texas Bulldog
03-12-2011, 12:48
I have 2 and they are perfect. I have another that im getting ready to order. I have nighthawks, a wilson, STI's and Dan Wessons. Fusion has been the best 1 on 1 with me and given me the most freedom to do what i want to the gun with STI a close second.

http://i53.tinypic.com/2nv9s1z.jpg

faawrenchbndr
03-12-2011, 15:56
RRA was fantastic in that respect, but aren't built anymore......

Correct,.......but you can have a pistol made by a former RRA Gunsmith.:whistling:

I'm going to trust my gut & avoid Fusion........I think I'll be talking to Bob Miller again!

Comedian
03-12-2011, 19:49
My Fusion Commander couldn't get thru one mag without 3 or 4 failure to feed malfunctions. Also the rear sight came loose, after a few mags fired. When i talked to Bob about the issues, he kept telling me to try different guide rod recoil springs and magazines and said if i wanted him to look at the gun, it would be shipped at my expense.

After more complaints started pouring in on the Fusion forum, he changed that policy and started paying for shipping for a defective gun. I did not have confidence in him fixing my pistol and didn't think i should have to pay more than the $1800 price tag, i already laid out. So i sold the Fusion at a $600 loss.

Hokie1911
03-12-2011, 19:53
My Fusion Commander couldn't get thru one mag without 3 or 4 failure to feed malfunctions. Also the rear sight came loose, after a few mags fired. When i talked to Bob about the issues, he kept telling me to try different guide rod recoil springs and magazines and said if i wanted him to look at the gun, it would be shipped at my expense.

After more complaints started pouring in on the Fusion forum, he changed that policy and started paying for shipping for a defective gun. I did not have confidence in him fixing my pistol and didn't think i should have to pay more than the $1800 price tag, i already laid out. So i sold the Fusion at a $600 loss.

His smiths are top notch. You should have full confidence in them to make a high quality firearm. :thumbsup:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3171/3106109881_e4ec188885.jpg

Comedian
03-12-2011, 19:55
I sent in a frame, slide and barrel for them to fit for me and they did a very good job. They shipped it back along with all the parts I ordered and then had to ship the parts they overlooked. As stated Bob is very nice and willing to make it right. I don't know if I would have them do a complete build since I have not seen anything they have done but heard stories. This gun is costing my buddy a little more than if he would have had Fusion build it but it will be quicker and I know what it will look like. I'm not a pistol smith nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn but I do have good eye sight. I know what it is suppose to look like. One thing I don't like about the Fusion "bobtail" is that it is their own and not Ed Browns. You have to use their MSH which doesn't fit flush with the back of the frame. I will have to do some blending on the edges.

This is my experience with them so far.

abraves

Bob comes off nice and answers the phone, but NICE to me, would have been him telling me he was going to fix my gun and cover the shipping as well. Instead he gave me the runaround and i lost all confidence in him.

faawrenchbndr
03-12-2011, 19:59
Thanks for the opinions Fellas, both positive & negative! :supergrin:

HAIL CAESAR
03-13-2011, 19:31
Bob is super nice till he calls your home number screaming expletives.

I still get PM's and email from folks that are still getting the shaft from Fusion.

Still getting PM's and emails from smiths saying that Fusion they have seen is borderline trash and a scalding fraud at their pricing level.

Hokie1911
03-13-2011, 19:44
Bob is super nice till he calls your home number screaming expletives.

I still get PM's and email from folks that are still getting the shaft from Fusion.

Still getting PM's and emails from smiths saying that Fusion they have seen is borderline trash and a scalding fraud at their pricing level.

Was waiting for you to chime in. :rofl:

DD26
03-13-2011, 20:08
This thread makes me sad.:crying:


I was hoping to get a Fusion 1911 one day, for the simple fact that it would have my hometown engraved on the frame; Binghamton, NY, and I thought that was kinda cool.

My only dealings with Bob Serva were when I had him do a few transfers for me for some online purchases, when I was still living in NY. For one of them, I knew from the tracking info that my stuff had been delivered and signed for at his house. I waited a few days, and he hadn't called. So I called and asked when I could pick up my stuff. He said "I don't think it was delivered yet", and that's when I told him it was delivered and he had signed for it 3 days ago. Then he said "Oh yeah, it's right here". :dunno:

glock2740
03-13-2011, 21:17
I always thought that Fusion made a great looking gun. But after some of the stories I read about on here, I decided to saty away. Plus, for the prices they are charging, I feel I can get a better gun from a few other companies.

Texas Bulldog
03-13-2011, 21:45
Bob is super nice till he calls your home number screaming expletives.

I still get PM's and email from folks that are still getting the shaft from Fusion.

Still getting PM's and emails from smiths saying that Fusion they have seen is borderline trash and a scalding fraud at their pricing level.
Yeah, everyone goes to you... You are their savior....

Thank the lord for "Hail Cesar" :upeyes:

HAIL CAESAR
03-13-2011, 21:50
Nope...for some reason after reading my threads they contacted me for advice or to see if the lies they got were similar to the ones I heard. Or if the issues they have were like mine. Or wanting the names of smiths to call that have seen Fusion's.

MD357
03-13-2011, 22:41
Anyone know if he figured out that 9x23 round? I definately have faith in a 1911 "builder" when they ask about a round on an internet forum.

faawrenchbndr
03-14-2011, 03:18
Well, since things don't seem to be perking up at Fusion, I'm going to buy a 191 with better quality.
I figure one a Taurus PT1911 should be a good alternative to a Fusion. :supergrin:

airflyer
03-14-2011, 06:44
I really wanted a 10 mm long slide but decided to look somewhere else, night hawk or Wilson. didn't want to gamble or get to know Bob like a friend to make it work

Hokie1911
03-14-2011, 08:53
Well, since things don't seem to be perking up at Fusion, I'm going to buy a 191 with better quality.
I figure one a Taurus PT1911 should be a good alternative to a Fusion. :supergrin:

Quack and I hit a show yesterday and sadly, they didn't have a single PT1911 polished with mother of pearl grips and gold controls. :crying:

2c5s
03-14-2011, 15:58
anyone know if he figured out that 9x23 round? I definately have faith in a 1911 "builder" when they ask about a round on an internet forum.



lol!!

faawrenchbndr
03-14-2011, 16:13
Quack and I hit a show yesterday and sadly, they didn't have a single PT1911 polished with mother of pearl grips and gold controls. :crying:


Crap,.........Bac' must have bought them all!

Myself
03-14-2011, 18:50
I have 4. Two built when he was just starting and 2 the next year. All are great. All were very reasonable price wise. I did not know he had problems as I have not picked up any more recently.

harrygunner
03-14-2011, 20:28
I wanted something like a Dan Wesson CBOB in 10mm, but customized for me. Back in 2007, I had Fusion make one.

List of issues on delivery:

1) Stripped grip screw stud.
2) Barrel bushing not fitted.
3) Fusion's "black oxide" finish was flaking off.
4) Ambi safety was digging into the slide.
5) FTE/FTF.
6) POI +- 4 inches at 7 yards.
7) Extractor claw appeared to be filed.
8) Dremeled 10mm chamber!

They Dremeled out the chamber of a 10mm barrel and sent the dangerous gun to me.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d199/harrygunner/funsion%20commander/unsupported_chamber.jpg

I paid them twice the cost of a 2007 CBOB, then spent again the cost of a CBOB to de-Fusion the gun. I had just about everything they did removed and paid first class people to make it right.

On a constructive note, with some changes they could be a good source for 10mm handguns:

a) Removed "Gunsmithing" from their website.
b) Acknowledge they are assemblers of parts and reduce their prices.
c) Reduce the number of configurations to something they can manage.
d) Hire someone for build control and QC.

and lastly, learn how to capitalize words properly.

Hokie1911
03-14-2011, 20:31
I wanted something like a Dan Wesson CBOB in 10mm, but customized for me. Back in 2007, I had Fusion make one.

List of issues on delivery:

1) Stripped grip screw stud.
2) Barrel bushing not fitted.
3) Fusion's "black oxide" finish was flaking off.
4) Ambi safety was digging into the slide.
5) FTE/FTF.
6) POI +- 4 inches at 7 yards.
7) Extractor claw appeared to be filed.
8) Dremeled 10mm chamber!

They Dremeled out the chamber of a 10mm barrel and sent the dangerous gun to me.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d199/harrygunner/funsion%20commander/unsupported_chamber.jpg

I paid them twice the cost of a 2007 CBOB, then spent again the cost of a CBOB to de-Fusion the gun. I had just about everything they did removed and paid first class people to make it right.

On a constructive note, with some changes they could be a good source for 10mm handguns:

a) Removed "Gunsmithing" from their website.
b) Acknowledge they are assemblers of parts and reduce their prices.
c) Reduce the number of configurations to something they can manage.
d) Hire someone for build control and QC.

and lastly, learn how to capitalize words properly.

Wow........just...wow. :faint:

abraves
03-14-2011, 20:56
The more I get into this Fusion build the more I am wishing my buddy would have went with different parts at least.

MD357
03-14-2011, 22:41
I wanted something like a Dan Wesson CBOB in 10mm, but customized for me. Back in 2007, I had Fusion make one.

List of issues on delivery:

1) Stripped grip screw stud.
2) Barrel bushing not fitted.
3) Fusion's "black oxide" finish was flaking off.
4) Ambi safety was digging into the slide.
5) FTE/FTF.
6) POI +- 4 inches at 7 yards.
7) Extractor claw appeared to be filed.
8) Dremeled 10mm chamber!

They Dremeled out the chamber of a 10mm barrel and sent the dangerous gun to me.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d199/harrygunner/funsion%20commander/unsupported_chamber.jpg

I paid them twice the cost of a 2007 CBOB, then spent again the cost of a CBOB to de-Fusion the gun. I had just about everything they did removed and paid first class people to make it right.

On a constructive note, with some changes they could be a good source for 10mm handguns:

a) Removed "Gunsmithing" from their website.
b) Acknowledge they are assemblers of parts and reduce their prices.
c) Reduce the number of configurations to something they can manage.
d) Hire someone for build control and QC.

and lastly, learn how to capitalize words properly.

:wow: <---- that 10mm barrel. I'm sorry but there is no excuse whatsoever for that.

Bold highlighted for truth. I've said it several times, anyone that has an eye for custom work can see that their stuff is half-azzed on their website.

harrygunner
03-15-2011, 00:08
Ha ha, Bob had an excuse.

I emailed Bob photos of the barrel, the bulging spent cases, described the failures, etc. His email response: (Straight quote including Bob's issue with capitalizing words improperly.)

"Have you fired any factory ammo through it such as What I have over and over again suggested?"

He defended the gun, the barrel, discounted my FTE's, FTF's. No offer to look at the gun.

After his dismissal of my dismay about the gun as he dutifully cashed my bank checks, I let people know what I experienced. Few listened back then.

The good news is, with excellent gunsmiths and more money the gun is really nice now.

HAIL CAESAR
03-15-2011, 11:49
Harrygunner,

Take some solace that you are not alone out there. There are many that have had "issues".

Alan

harrygunner
03-15-2011, 16:31
Would be nice if 'faawrenchbndr' and others could buy from them with confidence.

There are lots of .45ACP 1911 vendors, but Fusion is also a source for 10mm handguns.

So, for the sake of what I consider to be a fantastic cartridge, I wish they would consider these changes among others:

a) Remove "Gunsmithing" from their website.
b) Acknowledge they are assemblers of parts and reduce their prices.
c) Reduce the number of configurations to something they can manage.
d) Hire someone for build control and QC.

Perhaps constructive criticism will help them if they are willing to factor in customer feedback. Are there any other suggestions on how they might improve their operations?

faawrenchbndr
03-15-2011, 16:46
"Bob the builder" does not take any criticism positively.
Lord forbid you post a negative comment on that popular 1911 forum.

No Fusion for me,.......& if I want a 10mm I'll get a Delta built.

Hokie1911
03-15-2011, 17:02
"Bob the builder" does not take any criticism positively.
Lord forbid you post a negative comment on that popular 1911 forum.

No Fusion for me,.......& if I want a 10mm I'll get a Delta built.

Why Greg...what are these negative comments on TOS that you speak of? I have never seen any. :whistling:

Quack
03-15-2011, 17:02
"Bob the builder" does not take any criticism positively.
Lord forbid you post a negative comment on that popular 1911 forum.

No Fusion for me,.......& if I want a 10mm I'll get a Delta built.

Leave Bob alone :rofl:

http://onsustainability.com/files/2011/02/bob-the-builder-icon-v8.jpg

faawrenchbndr
03-15-2011, 17:12
Why Greg...what are these negative comments on TOS that you speak of? I have never seen any. :whistling:

And you never will,.......shortly after I was "banned for like, plus one year"
they deleted the entire thread.

faawrenchbndr
03-15-2011, 17:16
Leave Bob alone :rofl:

http://onsustainability.com/files/2011/02/bob-the-builder-icon-v8.jpg


Sorry,..........
Come to think of it, if Bob the Builder worked at Fusion,
they would not have all the quality control issues that they have been having the last year or so.

Hokie1911
03-15-2011, 17:22
And you never will,.......shortly after I was "banned for like, plus one year"
they deleted the entire threads.

Fixed it for ya. :rofl:

faawrenchbndr
03-15-2011, 17:29
Thanks Hokie'


I actually found the thread.........
Ironically, I found out who complained about my "negative post" that got me banned as well!
It's a small world........

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=255470

Quack
03-15-2011, 17:42
how many people were banned in that thread?

Hokie1911
03-15-2011, 17:43
Thanks Hokie'


I actually found the thread.........
Ironically, I found out who complained about my "negative post" that got me banned as well!
It's a small world........

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=255470

Small world indeed. Guess cheerleaders are cheerleaders....no matter what the site. :whistling:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_ne8Q7TeybUc/Si2IuAsNHrI/AAAAAAAADHo/6l7gpRwXgdo/s400/male_cheerleader.JPG

abraves
03-15-2011, 19:21
So I spent my time reading that whole thread in 1911forum and I didn't get ALL the story. Did Ceasar ever get his pistol from Fusion and was it right?

I guess when I order my stuff to do my own build I don't know where to go.

abraves

Hokie1911
03-15-2011, 19:47
So I spent my time reading that whole thread in 1911forum and I didn't get ALL the story. Did Ceasar ever get his pistol from Fusion and was it right?

I guess when I order my stuff to do my own build I don't know where to go.

abraves

Alan eventually got a check from them. Not sure of how much or if it cleared the bank. :whistling:

abraves
03-15-2011, 19:58
Wow. I actually thought about ordering from them too. Good thing. If I'm gonna wait that long I will order a SA Professional.

abraves

Cerebrus
03-15-2011, 20:20
Wow. I actually thought about ordering from them too. Good thing. If I'm gonna wait that long I will order a SA Professional.

abraves
Good plan.. however if you order a custom carry, I hear the wait is shorter.. by 2 months... :supergrin:

Hokie1911
03-15-2011, 20:23
Good plan.. however if you order a custom carry, I hear the wait is shorter.. by 2 months... :supergrin:

Talked to Deb a few weeks ago. 10 months on a Custom Carry.

GJ1981
03-15-2011, 20:30
Talked to Deb a few weeks ago. 10 months on a Custom Carry.

SA isn't great about accurate quotes, trust me, I know.

My Pro was quoted for 9 months, took 16. The last CC I'm waiting for, quoted 10 months, going on 14 months. I won't get into supplied work.

abraves
03-15-2011, 20:38
As long as the finished product was right I would be ok. I know it may sound stupid but I will give you as long as you need to make it right.

Hokie1911
03-15-2011, 20:40
SA isn't great about accurate quotes, trust me, I know.

My Pro was quoted for 9 months, took 16. The last CC I'm waiting for, quoted 10 months, going on 14 months. I won't get into supplied work.

Man, I hate 'over promise - under deliver'. That's a lot of jibba jabba.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/05/12/article-1180911-004796B400000258-960_468x324.jpg

faawrenchbndr
03-16-2011, 03:41
how many people were banned in that thread?

I think three, I knew at one point I was pushing the envelope, but, sometime I just can't leave well enough alone. :supergrin:

Caspian17
03-18-2011, 23:04
I was banned... They said me pming hail also was making my opinion biased... I lol'd. Don't miss that site it has gone downhill fast after taking advertising.

HAIL CAESAR
03-18-2011, 23:28
I don’t understand why PMing me would get you in any trouble? ??

Caspian17
03-18-2011, 23:47
Bad egg haha, I dunno I got an email back from them saying if I apologized about fusion I could come back. I refused and the reply was "after you conversations with hail Caesar it seems you were only using his example to bash fusion." I also had a conversation with pw about fusion so meh oh well.