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cderk
03-31-2011, 09:32
Is it just me, or does anyone else find that the info on Power Pistol load data on the Alliant website weak?

I have some 147g CMJ plated bullets that I'm trying to load for 9mm. The only 147g bullets they list are for GDHPs. I emailed them through their website a few days ago and have not gotten any response.

Does anyone have any load data for 147g using PP?

Thanks

-cd

Colorado4Wheel
03-31-2011, 10:33
Almost no one list Plated Bullet data on their website. Your in the world between Lead and Jacketed so you need to do some homework. The Lyman Manual would help you a lot. But I will give you the data. 1.058" OAL. 4.1-4.6grs. 1033 fps at max. Use it at your own risk. Buy the manual.

dudel
03-31-2011, 11:04
Almost no one list Plated Bullet data on their website. Your in the world between Lead and Jacketed so you need to do some homework. The Lyman Manual would help you a lot. But I will give you the data. 1.058" OAL. 4.1-4.6grs. 1033 fps at max. Use it at your own risk. Buy the manual.


+1. The web sites generally give you starting loads. The manual will give more detailed and complete loadings. Buy the manual (or get the loadbooks for the caliber you want).

cderk
03-31-2011, 12:11
Almost no one list Plated Bullet data on their website. Your in the world between Lead and Jacketed so you need to do some homework. The Lyman Manual would help you a lot. But I will give you the data. 1.058" OAL. 4.1-4.6grs. 1033 fps at max. Use it at your own risk. Buy the manual.

Thanks for the reply. I realize that one has to improvise slightly, but I'm just surprised that all they list were GDHP. My Lyman manual is on its way to me as we speak. I have the Lee book... but it seems like its lacking good data.

I've loaded 10 each of 4.6, 4.8 and 5.0g with an OAL of 1.145. My local reloading shop has Frontier bullets from South Africa. Never heard of them, but they are fairly inexpensive ($65 for 750).

Thanks again,
-cd

PCJim
03-31-2011, 12:56
Thanks for the reply. I realize that one has to improvise slightly, but I'm just surprised that all they list were GDHP.......
Thanks again,
-cd

Actually, it is not surprising at all, when you consider that both Alliant and Speer are owned by ATK...

http://www.alliantpowder.com/general/links.aspx

cderk
03-31-2011, 12:59
Actually, it is not surprising at all, when you consider that both Alliant and Speer are owned by ATK...

http://www.alliantpowder.com/general/links.aspx


How nice of them to "keep in in the family". I finally got a response from them.

115 gr lead bullet
Bullseye start 4 grs max 4.5 grs
Unique start 4.5 max 5 grs
Power Pistol start 5 grs max 5.5 grs

115 gr jacketed bullet
Bullseye start 4 grs max 4.5 grs
Unique start 4.5 grs max 5.5 grs
Power Pistol start 5.9 grs max 6.3 grs

124/125 gr lead
Bullseye start 3.8 grs max 4.3 grs
Unique start 4 grs max 4.5 grs
Power Pistol start 4.8 grs max 5.3 grs

124/125 gr jacketed
Bullseye start 3.9 grs max 4.3 grs
Unique start 4.5 grs max 5 grs
Power Pistol start 5 grs max 5.5 grs

147 gr lead
Bullseye start 2.8 grs max 3.3 grs
Unique start 3.2 grs max 3.6 grs
Power Pistol start 4 grs max 4.5 grs

147 gr jacketed
Unique start 4 grs max 4.5 grs
Power Pistol start 4.5 grs max 5 grs

Note: Start with the minimum charge wt. Reload just a few and be sure they will properly cycle the action of your pistol before reloading a quantity.

PCJim
03-31-2011, 13:10
And, with their reply, you still have no specific plated bullet data from Alliant.

As a general rule, do not exceed the mid-level charge for a jacketed bullet.

Philippe
03-31-2011, 13:16
I agree, I love their products but the website for loading data sucks.

fredj338
03-31-2011, 13:16
It's why we advocate mutliple manuals so you can better extrapolate data. Accurate is the only one I am aware of that has some plated data. Load plated using starting lead data or just a bit higher & you'll be fine. I just ran some PP test loads w/ 147grLTC, I'll let you know the data when I get home this afternoon.

TheGrimReaper
03-31-2011, 17:33
I love Alliant powders....but their website/data blows!!!!

cowboy1964
03-31-2011, 19:17
Yeah it's pretty lame. Almost all of their recipes for pistols are for Gold Dot JHPs.

WiskyT
03-31-2011, 19:25
Gold Dots are plated bullets.

And, there was a time when people didn't demand specific data for every single bullet known to Mankind.

skselby
03-31-2011, 21:55
Here's what plated data I was able to find when I was looking to load 115gr 9mm Berry's under Unique:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=113431&d=1263654521

Sadly, no 147gr with PP

fredj338
03-31-2011, 22:15
Here's what plated data I was able to find when I was looking to load 115gr 9mm Berry's under Unique:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=113431&d=1263654521

Sadly, no 147gr with PP
Always keep in mind that internet data, even from the smartest guys, is really not vetted/pressure tested data & should be approached w/ caution.

Boxerglocker
03-31-2011, 22:19
I have some 147g CMJ plated bullets that I'm trying to load for 9mm.

Okay to clarify, are these CMJ (Complete Metal Jacket) or Plated 147g's :dunno:

cderk
04-01-2011, 09:03
Okay to clarify, are these CMJ (Complete Metal Jacket) or Plated 147g's :dunno:

Sorry, yes, they are CMJ...
I would assume that you would use the same recipe as a FMJ... but you know what they say about assuming things :whistling:

-cd

dla
04-01-2011, 16:16
Is it just me, or does anyone else find that the info on Power Pistol load data on the Alliant website weak?

I have some 147g CMJ plated bullets that I'm trying to load for 9mm. The only 147g bullets they list are for GDHPs. I emailed them through their website a few days ago and have not gotten any response.

Does anyone have any load data for 147g using PP?

Thanks

-cd

Alliant's information in general is terrible. There are so many good powders out there today that I don't bother with Alliant precisely because they can't be bothered to publish decent load data anymore.

They used to, but some rocket-scientist at Alliant decided that the new "recipe based" approach was best.

Probably one more reason why they were swallowed up. I don't miss them. Like I said, there are too many good powders out there today. I suppose for the nimrods who can't get past "Elmer used it" thinking, Alliant's demise was wrenching.

Boxerglocker
04-01-2011, 16:43
Sorry, yes, they are CMJ...
I would assume that you would use the same recipe as a FMJ... but you know what they say about assuming things :whistling:

-cd

I use Speer GDHP load data for power pistol and 147 CMJ's

WiskyT
04-01-2011, 19:22
I suppose for the nimrods who can't get past "Elmer used it" thinking, Alliant's demise was wrenching.

Demise? You can't buy a book or email Alliant to get data and that means they have gone out of business? There is more data for Alliant powders available, and much of it is old and therefore will actually get a bullet out of the barrel, than any of the new wonder powders. Powders that have been in continuous production for 100 years have 100 years of data.

I wanted data for Power Pistol and a 180 cast bullet in 40SW and didn't have any since it PP is newer than any of my manuals. I emailed Alliant and got an answer with specific data from Ben Ammonet in a day or so. Great products, great support.

dbarry
04-01-2011, 21:13
Demise? You can't buy a book or email Alliant to get data and that means they have gone out of business? There is more data for Alliant powders available, and much of it is old and therefore will actually get a bullet out of the barrel, than any of the new wonder powders. Powders that have been in continuous production for 100 years have 100 years of data.

I wanted data for Power Pistol and a 180 cast bullet in 40SW and didn't have any since it PP is newer than any of my manuals. I emailed Alliant and got an answer with specific data from Ben Ammonet in a day or so. Great products, great support.

+1 on great products, great support. I've emailed them and got prompt response from Ben too.

Boxerglocker
04-01-2011, 22:51
Alliant's information in general is terrible. There are so many good powders out there today that I don't bother with Alliant precisely because they can't be bothered to publish decent load data anymore.

They used to, but some rocket-scientist at Alliant decided that the new "recipe based" approach was best.
Probably one more reason why they were swallowed up. I don't miss them. Like I said, there are too many good powders out there today. I suppose for the nimrods who can't get past "Elmer used it" thinking, Alliant's demise was wrenching.

ROFL... I was busy answering the OP's original question and completely missed this.
I too have spoken to Ben and specifically asked why they give the data in this manner. His answer was to keep the inexperienced reloaders at check. Meaning they give an optimum load and it is pretty conservative from max when compared to others. This way if anything you can load down a little but loading up toward max, having the lack in data will make you think twice. All you need to do is email them and they will give you the range for any of thier powders.

dla
04-01-2011, 23:25
ROFL... I was busy answering the OP's original question and completely missed this.
I too have spoken to Ben and specifically asked why they give the data in this manner. His answer was to keep the inexperienced reloaders at check. Meaning they give an optimum load and it is pretty conservative from max when compared to others. This way if anything you can load down a little but loading up toward max, having the lack in data will make you think twice. All you need to do is email them and they will give you the range for any of thier powders.

Totally retarded way to do it.

Alliant is a loser company. Their products were eclipsed years ago and their service went downhill. I have Alliant data from their old website - data that was actually useful.

I don't have time to mess around with stupid companies. If Alliant was a good company with good products, they wouldn't have been swallowed up. But they suck and there is nothing special about their products. Only old ninnies cling to Alliant's inferior products.

Boxerglocker
04-02-2011, 03:25
Totally retarded way to do it.

Alliant is a loser company. Their products were eclipsed years ago and their service went downhill. I have Alliant data from their old website - data that was actually useful.

I don't have time to mess around with stupid companies. If Alliant was a good company with good products, they wouldn't have been swallowed up. But they suck and there is nothing special about their products. Only old ninnies cling to Alliant's inferior products.

The phrase "old ninnies" was way way before my time so I don't understand the relavence, the modern Alliant ammunition systems company was founded in 1999 as a division of ATK a Fortune 500 company.

You are more than entitled to your opinon though I really don't see the basis for your claim that Alliant was "swallowed up" like pretty much every competitor Alliant is owned by a much bigger parent company.

The purpose of these threads are to assist and discuss the OP had a specific question and was given helpful answers by many. You stance apparently negative is noted, but to make claims such you have as there products have been eclipsed long ago are hardly justified. They come out with new powders all the time. A number of thier powders are highly regarded in many competitive circles and used by private and commercial loaders alike.

The latest Alliant reloaders guide online is actually pretty comprehensive IMO regarding range of powders, calibers and bullets http://glarp.atk.com/2011/2011_Catalogs/AlliantPowderCatalog.pdf They only give MAX loads but for any reloader with common sense you would just reduce the max load by 10% and work up... No biggie, though I could understand some people needing the hand holding to get through it. :upeyes:

WiskyT
04-02-2011, 05:52
+1 on great products, great support. I've emailed them and got prompt response from Ben too.

Are you a ninnie or a nimrod?

cderk
04-02-2011, 08:30
It's why we advocate mutliple manuals so you can better extrapolate data. Accurate is the only one I am aware of that has some plated data. Load plated using starting lead data or just a bit higher & you'll be fine. I just ran some PP test loads w/ 147grLTC, I'll let you know the data when I get home this afternoon.

Fred -

Curious as to how you made out with your test loads. I loaded 30 rounds... ten each at 4.6, 4.8 and 5.0 using 1.14" OAL and a 147g CMJ bullet from Frontier. I shot at 10 yards resting my G19 on my range bag. I think I need to do some more testing, but it seems like I got the best accuracy out of the 4.6g load. Out of 10 rounds, I had a 1.5" group and only 5 holes on the target (and no, I did not miss the other 5 shots).

I'm still pretty new at all of this (I've loaded about 600 rounds so far)... but I was pretty impressed. Originally, I decided to reload to a) give me a new hobby and b) to save a little cash. I'm finding that a) I'm shooting more, thus not saving any cash and b) I like the accuracy of my loads over WWB that I had been purchasing at Wally World WAY better.

Overall, I'm pretty happy with my decision to get into reloading. Its been fun, a good learning experience and oddly enough, good therapy!

Thanks for the replies
-cd