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ronduke
04-09-2011, 02:36
A while back our city passed an ordinance outlawing "fake weed", ie K2. Now, I am reading about the rise in popularity of bath salts. Have any cities passed ordinances outlawing them? If so, can you post info about that city. I would like to proposs a similar ordinance with my town, and it would be easier if I could duplicate the efforts of another city.

CBennett
04-09-2011, 07:08
No but get it done its actually KILLED a few kids around here.

Agent6-3/8
04-09-2011, 07:53
No ordinance here either, but its getting more and more popular.

Dragoon44
04-09-2011, 07:56
It's not nice to mess with mother nature or her program of natural selection.

:tongueout:

RussP
04-09-2011, 18:49
It's not nice to mess with mother nature or her program of natural selection.

:tongueout:So this is the post that did it!!!!!!!!

Dragoon44
04-09-2011, 19:03
So this is the post that did it!!!!!!!!

Nah, Sgt.127 squeaked by me for the last post before CT disappeared.

Sgts. are sneaky like that.
:rofl:

BamaTrooper
04-09-2011, 19:25
Not a city, the state did it.

http://blog.al.com/breaking/2011/02/sythetic_bath_salts_illegal_in.html

JTipper.45
04-09-2011, 19:49
We had such a sudden and large influx of it almost overnight. Within a few weeks the Gov. used his "special" powers and bypassed legislation and made it illegal.

http://http://www.ksla.com/Global/story.asp?S=13795795

Morris
04-09-2011, 21:22
Force Science is doing a research project on this.

Steve in PA
04-09-2011, 23:05
Several counties in my area have passed ordinances against bath salts.

Lot's of incidents involving people on bath salts here lately.

lawman800
04-10-2011, 11:56
We got a briefing on it 6 months ago... that was the last I heard of it.

RyanNREMTP
04-10-2011, 12:04
I don't know of any local cities or counties banning it here but here is an EMS article about it that could help further the cause.

http://www.emsworld.com/print/EMS-World/Bath-Salts--What-the-EMS-Provider-Needs-to-Know/1$16562

EOD3
04-10-2011, 12:41
I think it's a pretty sure bet that anyone that would lick a frog to get high WILL find some other kind of poison to kill themselves with. Outlawing this, that, and the other is a losing game.

Are they planning to form a "bathtub enforcement" department or will it just go hand-in-hand with the "dripping faucet" enforcement? :cool:

glock_19guy1983
04-10-2011, 13:16
No but get it done its actually KILLED a few kids around here.

Darwinism at its finest. You cant protect every stupid person on the planet.

lawman800
04-10-2011, 13:29
I think it's a pretty sure bet that anyone that would lick a frog to get high WILL find some other kind of poison to kill themselves with. Outlawing this, that, and the other is a losing game.

Are they planning to form a "bathtub enforcement" department or will it just go hand-in-hand with the "dripping faucet" enforcement? :cool:

I'll volunteer to be the inspector at the Playboy Mansion.:whistling:

EOD3
04-10-2011, 16:17
I'll volunteer to be the inspector at the Playboy Mansion.:whistling:

I suppose there are worse things. :faint:

My ticker ain't what it used to be, I'd never make it out alive. :wow:

DaBigBR
04-11-2011, 08:53
I think it's a pretty sure bet that anyone that would lick a frog to get high WILL find some other kind of poison to kill themselves with. Outlawing this, that, and the other is a losing game.

Are they planning to form a "bathtub enforcement" department or will it just go hand-in-hand with the "dripping faucet" enforcement? :cool:

You do understand that "bath salts" does not involve the use of actual bath salt (although it is sometimes labeled as such), but rather a synthetic hallucinogen called methylenedioxypyrovalerone, right?

CBennett
04-11-2011, 09:16
Darwinism at its finest. You cant protect every stupid person on the planet.

yeah, but kids are kids...one kid gets in with some friends and peer pressure takes over and the kid does something dumb which may be his first and last time doing it..I have no problem with full time idiots knocking themselves off but its the kids that make 1 mistake which is their last over wanting to be "in"/Popular or what ever... that still bugs me.

Hack
04-11-2011, 11:24
yeah, but kids are kids...one kid gets in with some friends and peer pressure takes over and the kid does something dumb which may be his first and last time doing it..I have no problem with full time idiots knocking themselves off but its the kids that make 1 mistake which is their last over wanting to be "in"/Popular or what ever... that still bugs me.

:agree:

EOD3
04-12-2011, 00:54
You do understand that "bath salts" does not involve the use of actual bath salt (although it is sometimes labeled as such), but rather a synthetic hallucinogen called methylenedioxypyrovalerone, right?

No, I don't... Try to remember, I'm from the "Killer Weed" and "Reefer Madness" generation. Most of the stuff the current crop of kids deal with either didn't exist or was unknown in most of the US the last time I was checking pockets for "contraband". :yuck:

DaBigBR
04-12-2011, 08:58
No, I don't... Try to remember, I'm from the "Killer Weed" and "Reefer Madness" generation. Most of the stuff the current crop of kids deal with either didn't exist or was unknown in most of the US the last time I was checking pockets for "contraband". :yuck:

I gotcha.

Might want to read up on K2 ("spice") and "bath salts" if you have some spare time. This synthetic stuff is pretty nasty.

wprebeck
04-12-2011, 09:14
Made illegal by the legislature this last session. Good call.

QuietCarry
04-12-2011, 11:27
Related, but not really...wasn't there some kind of "bath salt" used in suicides by creating a concoction that released H2S recently trending in from Japan?

JohnnyReb
04-12-2011, 11:46
yeah, but kids are kids...one kid gets in with some friends and peer pressure takes over and the kid does something dumb which may be his first and last time doing it..I have no problem with full time idiots knocking themselves off but its the kids that make 1 mistake which is their last over wanting to be "in"/Popular or what ever... that still bugs me.

While it bothers me too, but whats stopping that same kid from taking a hit of crack, weed, injecting heroin, sniffing glue, gas.. ect?

There is no lack if already illegal substances out there to kill yourself with.

The best solution is good judgement taught from good parenting, not by outlawing things.

DaBigBR
04-12-2011, 12:02
Related, but not really...wasn't there some kind of "bath salt" used in suicides by creating a concoction that released H2S recently trending in from Japan?

They were using a combination of household chemicals to make hydrogen sulfide gas.

CBennett
04-12-2011, 16:53
While it bothers me too, but whats stopping that same kid from taking a hit of crack, weed, injecting heroin, sniffing glue, gas.. ect?

There is no lack if already illegal substances out there to kill yourself with.

The best solution is good judgement taught from good parenting, not by outlawing things.

Because to the kid that knows that the Illegal stuff is "bad" and he may be getting swayed by "friends" the lure of something thats LEGAL makes it seem "ok". or safer than Illegal stuff. Kids are kids..sometimes as a result no matter the parenting they do DUMB things. if just the thought by a other wise good kid not to do something because its illegal and must be illegal for a reason if just that sways him not to do it...good with me...look I dont know how to say it but as a kid I never got messed up in the pot head crowd never took a hit of anything illegal EVER...but I will admitt to drinking as a kid in highschool..why...because even though the age limit for alcohol had gone up to 21 alcohol was not a "illegal" substance...it was just a age thing that made it wrong at 16-18.....Pot I didnt want to mess with anything that was Illegal lol...it made sense as a kid...

DaBigBR
04-12-2011, 19:15
Availability is a factor. Some of this stuff can be purchased legally on the internet. Then we have kids with no known drug history (or at least no "hard" drug history) ending up dead either from an overdose or from accidental death or intentional suicide while tripping out on this stuff.

JohnnyReb
04-12-2011, 23:02
Because to the kid that knows that the Illegal stuff is "bad" and he may be getting swayed by "friends" the lure of something thats LEGAL makes it seem "ok". or safer than Illegal stuff. Kids are kids..sometimes as a result no matter the parenting they do DUMB things. if just the thought by a other wise good kid not to do something because its illegal and must be illegal for a reason if just that sways him not to do it...good with me...look I dont know how to say it but as a kid I never got messed up in the pot head crowd never took a hit of anything illegal EVER...but I will admitt to drinking as a kid in highschool..why...because even though the age limit for alcohol had gone up to 21 alcohol was not a "illegal" substance...it was just a age thing that made it wrong at 16-18.....Pot I didnt want to mess with anything that was Illegal lol...it made sense as a kid...

Alcohol for me, was more of a social thing, even as a kid. It was nothing to go on camping trips with family members, and at 15 YO start putting down the brews. It was just how it was, and I never saw a problem with it, and I still don't.

Legality does not equal morality in some cases.

Am I going to tell you that no kid will have the thought process you described? No, because I'm sure a few will.

MB-G26
04-13-2011, 04:10
You do understand that "bath salts" does not involve the use of actual bath salt (although it is sometimes labeled as such), but rather a synthetic hallucinogen called methylenedioxypyrovalerone, right?

Ew, wah, I'm so confused............ I often use lavender-scented "bath salts" for pain (OA, RA, SLE)......... was I supposed to be getting "high" as I soaked in the tub and bath salts? Wah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This freaking world is so damn confuzzeling............. ::pout::

TreverSlyFox
04-13-2011, 21:22
Missouri passed emergency "K2" legislation a few months ago after several of the TV stations did stories on it. I don't think 2 weeks went by and something else was being sold over the counter that replaced "K2".

ronduke
05-09-2011, 21:42
Man arrested after being found standing over stolen pygmy goat, wearing women's underwear.

http://www.dailymail.com/News/breakingnews/201105020841

gemeinschaft
05-11-2011, 22:37
While it bothers me too, but whats stopping that same kid from taking a hit of crack, weed, injecting heroin, sniffing glue, gas.. ect?

There is no lack if already illegal substances out there to kill yourself with.

The best solution is good judgement taught from good parenting, not by outlawing things.

At least if it is made illegal, Law Enforcement can do something in regards to prosecuting people for the distribution of the substance. I understand what you are saying, but I would agree that some kids think it must be safe if it is legal to buy.

This stuff is not like Alcohol or Tobacco, one use and it could be death. My girlfriend's best friend from high school just lost her teenage son to an overdose of Bath Salts. As far as she knows, he has never experimented with drugs, but he was lead to believe it was ok since they bought it at the store prior to use.

Like another poster stated, it really sucks to see kids make one bad decision that leads to their death.

Louisiana has seen a large impact from these "Bath Salts."

tusk212
05-11-2011, 23:23
http://wearecentralpa.com/wtaj-news-fulltext/?nxd_id=274117

Morris
06-15-2011, 11:48
Speaking of bath salts . . .

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/123871869.html#idc-cover

Strictly a hunch but I'd say someone was using some himself.

redneck1861
06-15-2011, 12:37
From what I understand the people that are making "Bath Salt's" have several backup plans to make it, incase one gets banned.

Here the bath salt is not illegal, thats if it is just sold as "bath salt". There have been several arrests by UC officers that go inside head shops, if the head shop people tell how to snort it, they go to jail.

I dont see the chemicals that are used to make it getting outlawed, its just like Meth, the chemicals to make meth are legal.

DaBigBR
06-15-2011, 13:07
From what I understand the people that are making "Bath Salt's" have several backup plans to make it, incase one gets banned.

Here the bath salt is not illegal, thats if it is just sold as "bath salt". There have been several arrests by UC officers that go inside head shops, if the head shop people tell how to snort it, they go to jail.

I dont see the chemicals that are used to make it getting outlawed, its just like Meth, the chemicals to make meth are legal.

Yes and no. There are precursor laws in many places to deal with the chemicals used to manufacture meth. When possessed in the right quantities and/or combinations, you can be charged. We have a fairly tough pseudo-ephedrine law here that criminalizes buying more than a certain amount in a specific period of time. It also requires that it be locked up and that ID be presented to purchase. Obviously it is far from perfect and can be circumvented, but it (the registry and limits) have resulted in plenty of successful prosecutions.

redneck1861
06-15-2011, 13:31
Yes and no. There are precursor laws in many places to deal with the chemicals used to manufacture meth. When possessed in the right quantities and/or combinations, you can be charged. We have a fairly tough pseudo-ephedrine law here that criminalizes buying more than a certain amount in a specific period of time. It also requires that it be locked up and that ID be presented to purchase. Obviously it is far from perfect and can be circumvented, but it (the registry and limits) have resulted in plenty of successful prosecutions.


You are right, I was just being vague that to for most part the chemicals involved are legal.

We have the same pseudo-ephedrine restrictions here, but it is not enforced very well. A few years ago I was upper management at a grocery store, we had forms to be filled out when anyone buys restricted medication. The problem is that nobody looks into it, sure they fill the form out with the persons info, but nobody came to look into it. Some places dont even get your info.

Meth is a big problem around here. I live out in the country on 120 acres, in the last 6 years I have came across 3 meth labs out in the woods, this is all before I got into LE.

ray9898
06-15-2011, 13:49
I am all for making it illegal. Many people out there, especially kids, are influenced by the legality of a product. Ignoring a dangerous chemical compound designed to intoxicate people which is only legal because it is being sold under the guise of "bath salt" is improper.

Morris
06-15-2011, 16:52
Meth is a big problem around here. I live out in the country on 120 acres, in the last 6 years I have came across 3 meth labs out in the woods, this is all before I got into LE.

That is one of the continuing challenges for our rural property owners around here as well.

Davegrave
06-15-2011, 17:17
Why can't parents be responsible for what their kids do and teach them right from wrong, and smart from stupid?

Why not just let grown adults put whatever they want to into their own body?
If I want to eat a lightbulb like a circus freak, or pierce my back 1000 times and hang from the rings, or do a bunch of coke and break my teeth out with a hammer, or sit in my house and smoke a joint and watch Eastbound and Down and laugh till i can hardly breath...why does anyone think it's their business to tell me not to?
Some people want to get messed up. They had drugs, then we made them illegal so they came up with new stuff and we made that illegal too. They'll never stop trying to find a way to poison themselves, why fight it so hard?

Oh, but it leads to crime....:upeyes:
Those crimes are already illegal. Robbing and murdering and raping and assult etc are already illegal. Catch the people that commt those crimes and punish them more severely for hurting others, and let people make their own choice whether they want to hurt themselves or not.

DaBigBR
06-15-2011, 17:38
Why can't parents be responsible for what their kids do and teach them right from wrong, and smart from stupid?

Why not just let grown adults put whatever they want to into their own body?
If I want to eat a lightbulb like a circus freak, or pierce my back 1000 times and hang from the rings, or do a bunch of coke and break my teeth out with a hammer, or sit in my house and smoke a joint and watch Eastbound and Down and laugh till i can hardly breath...why does anyone think it's their business to tell me not to?
Some people want to get messed up. They had drugs, then we made them illegal so they came up with new stuff and we made that illegal too. They'll never stop trying to find a way to poison themselves, why fight it so hard?

Oh, but it leads to crime....:upeyes:
Those crimes are already illegal. Robbing and murdering and raping and assult etc are already illegal. Catch the people that commt those crimes and punish them more severely for hurting others, and let people make their own choice whether they want to hurt themselves or not.

It leads to a giant waste of resources is what it leads to. The people that do this stuff end up taking an ambulance ride to the hospital ER that they almost certainly can't pay for. They leach off "the system" by seeking and obtaining all manner of government aid so that they can spend their time "doing whatever they want to do." Even the ones that really don't give a **** exist in situations and around other people that will call for help for them.

On the crime end, I would rather have somebody locked up NOW for something that "didn't hurt anybody" than have them locked up in a month for trying to cut their dad's pacemaker out (happened not far from here) or for killing their friend over a chess game (happened in my county) or whatever the hell else. I suppose that you would like to see laws against speeding, running stop signs, drunk driving, etc all repealed since it would be illegal if somebody was hurt or killed. You cannot deny the connection.

Davegrave
06-15-2011, 18:16
It leads to a giant waste of resources is what it leads to. The people that do this stuff end up taking an ambulance ride to the hospital ER that they almost certainly can't pay for. They leach off "the system" by seeking and obtaining all manner of government aid so that they can spend their time "doing whatever they want to do." Even the ones that really don't give a **** exist in situations and around other people that will call for help for them.

On the crime end, I would rather have somebody locked up NOW for something that "didn't hurt anybody" than have them locked up in a month for trying to cut their dad's pacemaker out (happened not far from here) or for killing their friend over a chess game (happened in my county) or whatever the hell else. I suppose that you would like to see laws against speeding, running stop signs, drunk driving, etc all repealed since it would be illegal if somebody was hurt or killed. You cannot deny the connection.

As far as the wasted money for medical/ambulance related things. Very valid point. But none of that should be publicly funded in my opinion. So that eliminates that.

And as far as traffic regulations those are part of a privilage you choose to take part in...driving. They are de-facto agreed upon by receiving and using your drivers license. You abide by the laws of the road or just drive on your own property. (Not saying i agree with all, and not saying that a little common sense leniency wouldn't be a good thing in reguard to speed or roling a stopsign on a wide open intersection or running a red light when there is NO ONE else on the road)
But seatbelt laws? They don't get the pass for being a privilege activity since someone wearing a seatbelt doesn't affect the otehr drivers in anything but the most absurdly made up situation.Can you be more than 100% opposed to something? If so, I am. Go ahead and make it a law for children who don't know better. But if you're of a driving age it should be your choice. I wear mine almost all the time. But it infuriates me that I could get stuck paying $100 if I forget for some reason. It's a tax...at best. But it's more. It's the intrusion of others into your personal life and your very personal choice over taking care of yourself. What's next a ticket for being fat? For not taking vitamins?

But I'll leave my wannabe libertarian rant for GNG or PI, I just noticed I'm in coptalk and didn't mean to butt in. Usually I stay out here unless I have something supportive to say or a question.:supergrin:

Sharky7
06-15-2011, 18:18
It leads to a giant waste of resources is what it leads to. The people that do this stuff end up taking an ambulance ride to the hospital ER that they almost certainly can't pay for. They leach off "the system" by seeking and obtaining all manner of government aid so that they can spend their time "doing whatever they want to do." Even the ones that really don't give a **** exist in situations and around other people that will call for help for them.

On the crime end, I would rather have somebody locked up NOW for something that "didn't hurt anybody" than have them locked up in a month for trying to cut their dad's pacemaker out (happened not far from here) or for killing their friend over a chess game (happened in my county) or whatever the hell else. I suppose that you would like to see laws against speeding, running stop signs, drunk driving, etc all repealed since it would be illegal if somebody was hurt or killed. You cannot deny the connection.

:goodpost:


A lot of these "legalize it all" types don't have the street knowledge to back up their claims/facts/wishes. Dope is a tough game....I've talked to a straight 18 year old kid, senior in high school - went from being a football player last year to giving BJ's for heroin to his dealer this year. Gross stuff....drugs are tough, they really get a hold of people. More crime is motivated by heroin and coke addicts trying to get money for their fix than people realize.

There's open air drug markets all around my city. How is making it legal going to help? Addicts already know where to get it....but they will always need money to get it....once it is legalized it ain't going to be free.

I think people think criminals are like the movies - planning out big bank robberies or "professional" retail theft crews or home burglary crews, etc. That is very rare and far between. 90% of the time it's some junkie looking to "get right" and not be dope-sick, so they bust into your home and steal your $1,000 laptop to pawn it for $100.

MeefZah
06-15-2011, 22:07
22 minute video on Bath Salts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzlTaNZqlj0