Help need total cartridge weights! [Archive] - Glock Talk

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WilyCoyote
04-18-2011, 13:17
I'm doing some chrono tests with a variety of ammo for my new ruger LCR in .357 magnum. I have some older ammo that I wish to test, but I am unsure of the bullet grain weight in the loaded cartridge because I don't have the boxes anymore. I have been unable to find any helpful pictures or info on the web that can tell me what weight the bullets are.

I have a

.357 Magnum Speer Gold Dot
.38 Spl +P Speer Gold Dot

that I wish to test.

If anyone can help me with some identifying characteristics of the bullet or that can help me ID the actual weight of the bullet that would be very helpful, like weighing your own Speer HP total cartridges in the same caliber so i can compare the overal total weight to mine. Or identifying the bullet weight from my descriptions of the bullets below.

Looking at them, The .357 mag has a shallow HP cavity with six tiny triangles of the jacket pointing in towards the center, making the exposed lead appear as an asterisk (*)

The .38 Spl +P has a deep cavity to the HP with very little of the jacket wrapping over the rim of the HP into the cavity. Almost unnoticable.

Thanks in advance

W

GioaJack
04-18-2011, 13:19
Why don't you just pull a couple sample bullets and weigh them, that should give you a definitive answer.


Jack

WilyCoyote
04-18-2011, 13:52
Im not a releader and I don't have that equipment.

PCJim
04-18-2011, 15:21
Well, you could fire two of each into wetpack, recover the bullets and weigh them. You do have to have a scale if you're looking for weight comparisons. Take the average of the two fired bullets in each case, as there "may" be some fragmentation loss.

You might also call a local gunshop and ask if any of their employees might be a reloader (they probably all are). If so, ask if they would help you out with a kinetic bullet puller. Its worth a try.

EL_NinO619
04-18-2011, 16:03
If you badly want to find out go buy a bullet puller and save it if you evet decide to load. But if you cheap a pait of channel locks will do the job...

Cavalry Doc
04-18-2011, 18:18
If you badly want to find out go buy a bullet puller and save it if you evet decide to load. But if you cheap a pait of channel locks will do the job...

:faint: Might want to include some instructions on avoiding any pressure to the primer.


Grab the upper part of the case from the side, the bullet from the top.

Wear safety glasses.

The bullet puller is really cheap, easy, and worth it's weight in gold if you are unsure about what you are doing.

http://www.manventureoutpost.com/product_images/out/franpic836017.jpg

http://www.manventureoutpost.com/products/Frankford-Arsenal-836%252d017-Sudden-Impact-Bullet-Puller.html

$10.90 on sale.:wavey:

WiskyT
04-18-2011, 18:35
Primed 38 spl case: 72 grains

Primed 357 case: 87 grains

Cavalry Doc
04-18-2011, 18:46
Primed 38 spl case: 72 grains

Primed 357 case: 87 grains

Wouldn't you need to know how much powder weight also?

Total weight - powder weight - primed case weight = bullet weight.

WiskyT
04-18-2011, 18:50
Wouldn't you need to know how much powder weight also?

Total weight - powder weight - primed case weight = bullet weight.

For a 158 vs 125 situation, I think you could just wing it. The problem is, Speer makes a 125 AND 135 in those calibers. Also, they could have changed to powder weights over different lots depending on the powder they used.

The OP might be able to find pics online of the different GD bullets. At some point, other posters with those ammos on hand will be able to give him what he wants.

EL_NinO619
04-18-2011, 19:03
You will never get a accurate wieght, to may varibles..brass etc..pull the bullet...10.90 looks like im getting a 2nd puller

WilyCoyote
04-18-2011, 19:22
Ok, I may have a solution...I just chrono'd the rounds at the range. The .38 +p gold dot came in at 734-868, with most clock'd at about 850. The .357 Magnum clock'd at 1138-1147. Again, out of a Ruger LCR .357. Im hoping there's enough of a spread in velocities between the 125g and the 158g that the answer should be obvious. Maybe one of you guys with some tables could help me out on that one

PCJim
04-18-2011, 20:43
Direct from Speer's website....

http://www.speer-ammo.com/ballistics/ammo.aspx

If I now better understand what you're trying to determine... The velocity you listed for the 357 Magnum would be closer to what Speer lists (1,235fps) as the muzzle velocity for their 158gr GD ammo as tested thru a 4" barrel, instead of the 1450fps for their 125gr GD.

Speer only lists one 38spl load in their GD line, a 125gr GD that should have a muzzle velocity of 945fps thru a 4" test barrel.

WiskyT
04-19-2011, 15:13
Direct from Speer's website....

http://www.speer-ammo.com/ballistics/ammo.aspx

If I now better understand what you're trying to determine... The velocity you listed for the 357 Magnum would be closer to what Speer lists (1,235fps) as the muzzle velocity for their 158gr GD ammo as tested thru a 4" barrel, instead of the 1450fps for their 125gr GD.

Speer only lists one 38spl load in their GD line, a 125gr GD that should have a muzzle velocity of 945fps thru a 4" test barrel.

You left out the Speer 135 grain loads in 38 and 357.

PCJim
04-19-2011, 15:37
You left out the Speer 135 grain loads in 38 and 357.

True, but those GD loads are specifically designed for short barrels. He stated he has had the bullets for a while, so I doubt they were bought specifically for the LCR.

The most accurate method will be to pull the bullets with pliers, take them to a local shop with a scale, and ask for a favor. :cool:

WiskyT
04-19-2011, 16:11
True, but those GD loads are specifically designed for short barrels. He stated he has had the bullets for a while, so I doubt they were bought specifically for the LCR.

The most accurate method will be to pull the bullets with pliers, take them to a local shop with a scale, and ask for a favor. :cool:

"I see" said the blind man, as he picked up his hammer and saw.

WilyCoyote
04-19-2011, 23:03
True, but those GD loads are specifically designed for short barrels. He stated he has had the bullets for a while, so I doubt they were bought specifically for the LCR.

I love it when people pay attention, lol. I have had the .357's for at least 6 years, the .38's for at least 5. I have samples with a firend, but he's a busy guy. He's gonna try to get back to me on Monday.

Speer .357 SB scares me because I've read things about the front part of the bullet snapping off at .357 velocities. I like what I hear though about it being a low recoil .357 round, almost like a hot .38 +p. The 158 speers in .357, if that's what they were, were pretty brutal on me out of my snubby. noticably more so than the .357 125g Hornady CD. I could just go with a .38 +p LSWCHP, or the .38+p SB, but I feel I'm wasting the potential of the .357 chambering of my LCR. I may get into reloading just to try and find the best of both worlds.

On a side note, The most consistent velocity out of all the loads I tested was that of the Federal Classic 38+p 125g SJHP...almost 815 on the nose with all five shots.

Blah

WiskyT
04-20-2011, 20:47
I love it when people pay attention, lol. I have had the .357's for at least 6 years, the .38's for at least 5.

Blah

The short barrel loads have been around that long, so you could be back to the 135 grain thing again.

gwalchmai
04-21-2011, 13:28
Send me two of each and I'll pull & weigh 'em for ya.

WilyCoyote
04-22-2011, 19:27
I already have a friend with samples, hes supposed to get back to me on monday