How can I save money reloading 9mm/5.56?? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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schaibaa
04-22-2011, 22:21
Hi guys,

This was inspired by another thread - but I didn't want to hijack. I've considered getting into reloading, but every time I run the numbers, I can never come out ahead.

My current price for 9mm shipped to me is around $0.21 .. and 5.56 is about $.024. When I add up all of the components (besides brass, I can grab mine) I never seem to come out more than $.01 ahead of buying factory new.

Am I looking at this wrong?

Thanks!

Batesmotel
04-22-2011, 22:31
I don't think you are looking at it wrong. I don't see a big savings especially after I figure in my time. I only load for precision rifles but the advantage for me is to be able to tune ammo for each rifle.

ryanm
04-22-2011, 22:50
I'd recommend taking your question over to the reloading forum.
They may have better info
http://glocktalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=26

crsuribe
04-22-2011, 22:59
You're looking at it wrong. If you look at it the right way you'll see the benefits.

IndyGunFreak
04-22-2011, 23:02
http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1267966&page=2&highlight=calculator

I can't comment on the rifle, but post 62 in that thread will give you some insight on 9mm reloading costs.

robin303
04-22-2011, 23:07
After the initial cost of a press, dies, books, and ect ect your reloads will cost half price. I shot and reloaded 15,000 rounds last year alone and it is one fun hobby.

Go check out the reload forum and meet the best guys around that will go out of their way to help you out.

rick458
04-23-2011, 00:55
You shoot ammo custom tailored to YOUR rifle and you can shoot 77 gr bullets for 55 gr price.
plus the satisfaction that you did it yourself is hard to beat

Yo
04-23-2011, 01:02
.223 you can save money -- a lot.

9mm, compared to commercial reloads you won't save much at all, unless you laid in a huge supply of bullets back when they were cheap.

I reload for five rifle calibers, plus 10mm, 44mag, 44 special, 45LC, 45 ACP, .380 acp, .357 mag, .38 special. I say that just to indicate I'm not at all shy about reloading. I like to reload.

I stopped reloading 9mm because the savings was so minimal.

Boxerglocker
04-23-2011, 02:29
.223 you can save money -- a lot.

9mm, compared to commercial reloads you won't save much at all, unless you laid in a huge supply of bullets back when they were cheap.

I reload for five rifle calibers, plus 10mm, 44mag, 44 special, 45LC, 45 ACP, .380 acp, .357 mag, .38 special. I say that just to indicate I'm not at all shy about reloading. I like to reload.

I stopped reloading 9mm because the savings was so minimal.

Commercial reloads are crap in comparison to my own. Plus I would never trust them seeing the results of several blown up guns in competitions over the years.

OP if your not saving at least 50% reloading 9mm or .223 your doing something wrong. You need to think bulk, 8-16 pounds of powder at a time, 2-4K in bullets and at least 5K in primers. Then crunch the numbers.

I'm loading 124g FMJ at $97 to $107 a K depending on which bulk primer/powder price I use for the calculation. Moly coated lead $80 a K.

$157 a K for 55g Horandy FMHBT and TAC powder. (XM193 clone load)

The Key to saving is bulk buying in components and INVESTING in the equipment to get you through the task quickly and effieciently. I load on a casefeed XL650 at a average rate of 700 and hour, 2K a month roughly 3 hours behind the press gets me through my needs. Brass prep for pistol is maybe 2 hours total sorting and manipulating in and out of a tumbler.
I just started loading .223 use the XL650 and RT1200 trimmer for sizing and trimming. I just went through a batch of 500 tonight in less than an hour, another half hour to swage primer pockets on a Dillon super swage. I'll tumble those clean of lube and load those within an hour this afternoon.

As much as I like reloading, it's merely a means to an end, which is shooting and much as I have time for and can afford.

themighty9mm
04-23-2011, 02:34
I'm not a uber bargain shopper. When I do price compare I usually use what price walmart is asking.
Example, last I saw 9mm 115 gr wwb they were asking 25ish bucks a box for 100. The quick math in my head says it will be 250 for 1000 rounds. Before tax. 250 dollars for 1k of 115 gr 9mm bullets. 115 gr shoots kinda high and not poia/poi.

124 gr shoots poa/poi. With reloading, for that same 1k. It will cost me about 130 - 150 or less depending on what bullet company/profile I go with. So again with real quick math I save about 100 bucks per thousand. Could be considerably less, but so far I have used mor expensive componenets and only bought powder by the 1lb, primers n bullets by the 1k. Buy in bulk and save more

Along with that I also get better quality ammo, and a grain weight I prefer. These number are provided I have the brass on hand. If not, the first thousand (9mm) will cost an aditional 25-35 bucks. However every thousand after that provided you save your brass these numbers will be right or close to it.

This is just with 9mm. 357 are substantially amount more from wallmart. I think last I saw they were 30-35 bucks for 50. My cost for 1k 357 is just a hair over the cost for 9mm. 38 spcl I think last I saw at WM was 18-20 bucks for 50. My cost for 38 is identical to 9mm. These are provided you save your brass. Again if you dont your first 1k will be a bit more (more as it whatever price you get once fired brass in the caliber you choose for). Every 1k after that will be on par or close to it.

Now real quick numbers again 223/5.56. A case (1k) of brass cased 5.56 is in the ball park of 300ish? Maybe more?
To reload it cost about 150-160ish.

If you only shoot a couple houndred rounds per year, then the saving part is just about not part of the equation. If that is the case you have to look at, you can tailor your ammo to your gun. That really comes into play if you shoot hi powered rifle. Also the bigger caliber you go with or more calibers you reload for the more the savings kick in.

Another way to look at it. If you bought a very very basic single stage press and everything you need to reload 9mm, it can cost you around 200 bucksish. Or more, possibly less depending on what press and everything you go with. So 200 bucks for the equipment you need. If you have absolutly no brass what so ever. Your basic components will cost you... I go with the high side and say $190. So you have a total investment of 390 dollars for 1k of ammo. Its a very expensive 1k. Now compare that with WM of $250 with no time involved. You will spend $140 more for your own reloads. However, your next 1000 rounds will more or less pay for the press.The next is savings.

Point is you could buy 3000 rounds from WM and spend 250+250+250= $750 plus tax. Or your own reloads 200 (equipment) 190 (first 1k components) 150, 150 (next 2k components) $690.
750 for store bought vs 690 of your own better quality reloads. In your first 3000 you have paid for the equipment and still have a equal number of bullets. Made to higher standards and a gr weight you like.
Granted for 9mm alone you are only saving 60 bucks. Ad another caliber or 2 and you are looking at far bigger numbers in savings.

Again those were just real quick numbers off the top of my head. Might be a bit more might be a bit less, was close enough for a example.
If you go with a faster morexpensve press you will need to load/shoot more to see any real savings

Like I said as far as it being worth it? If you shoot alot, yes. You also gain a new hobby, and far better ammo.

themighty9mm
04-23-2011, 02:37
Commercial reloads are crap in comparison to my own. Plus I would never trust them seeing the results of several blown up guns in competitions over the years.

I'm loading 124g FMJ at $97 to $107 a K depending on which bulk primer/powder price I use for the calculation. Moly coated lead $80 a K.

$157 a K for 55g Horandy FMHBT and TAC powder. (XM193 clone load)

The Key to saving is bulk buying in components and INVESTING in the equipment to get you through the task quickly and effieciently. I load on a casefeed XL650 at a average rate of 700 and hour, 2K a month roughly 3 hours behind the press gets me through my needs. Brass prep for pistol is maybe 2 hours total sorting and manipulating in and out of a tumbler.
I just started loading .223 use the XL650 and RT1200 trimmer for sizing and trimming. I just went through a batch of 500 tonight in less than an hour, another half hour to swage primer pockets on a Dillon super swage. I'll tumble those clean of lube and load those within an hour this afternoon.

As much as I like reloading, it's merely a means to an end, which is shooting and much as I have time for and can afford.
Boxer
How are you liking that rt1200? After cranking on the le wilson I have been eyeballing that unit

Boxerglocker
04-23-2011, 02:46
Boxer
How are you liking that rt1200? After and cranking on the le wilson I have been eyeballing that unit

Loving it :supergrin:

Took a little effort to get it set up just right, I used a Dillon headspace gauge to match up both dies, FL size and decap at station one. RT1200 size/trim at four. Clean 500 peices of brass, lube with HOS. Dump in the case feeder 500 pulls and your sized and trimmed in about 35-40 minutes.
Tumble again in 50/50 walnut/corncob to clean off the lube and knock off any minor burrs (thier isn't any actually). Loading FMJBT's no chamfer is needed. Switch the toolhead to the loading setup, with a universal decap die at station one. 500 pulls later and your done, I take my time with the rifle about a full hour to load, the longer shells.

It was $400 to set up with the RT1200 and Super swage but the way I look at it. It will pay for itself and if worse comes you can always get 80 plus percent selling Dillon gear used. (Won't happen)

themighty9mm
04-23-2011, 02:50
Loving it :supergrin:

Took a little effort to get it set up just right, I used a Dillon headspace gauge to match up both dies, FL size and decap at station one. RT1200 size/trim at four. Clean 500 peices of brass, lube with HOS. Dump in the case feeder 500 pulls and your sized and trimmed in about 35-40 minutes.
Tumble again in 50/50 walnut/corncob to clean off the lube and knock off any minor burrs (thier isn't any actually). Loading FMJBT's no chamfer is needed. Switch the toolhead to the loading setup, with a universal decap die at station one. 500 pulls later and your done, I take my time with the rifle about a full hour to load, the longer shells.
Lol for me to do about 1000 just case prep alone took me around 3-4 hours. Along with some hand pain. On the bright side I have the time at the moment. That should fit on the 550 aswell right?

Boxerglocker
04-23-2011, 02:55
Lol for me to do about 1000 just case prep alone took me around 3-4 hours. Along with some hand pain. On the bright side I have the time at the moment. That should fit on the 550 aswell right?

Yes, it will....

On a XL650 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLyK1UwuK3M&feature=related

Here is a guy on a 550 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OE8lrfVcT4I

I'm gonna mount my swager on a board and do this mod when I get some time this weekend.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaZHeSUqQbk&feature=related

themighty9mm
04-23-2011, 03:06
Yes, it will....

On a XL650 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLyK1UwuK3M&feature=related

Here is a guy on a 550 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OE8lrfVcT4I

I'm gonna mount my swager on a board and do this mod when I get some time this weekend.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaZHeSUqQbk&feature=related
I had one of the dillon swagers. I liked the speed and ease. However I had the hardest time getting it set up right. Ended up selling it and bought the le wilson. For me it has been much more trouble free. Slow but so easy a caveman can do it

Colorado4Wheel
04-23-2011, 05:23
We need a

"Can you save money reloading?"

thread with the link to the excel spread sheet. Someone should post about reusing brass not buying new (that always seems to be the issue with cost being to high). That type of thing. Then get it stickied. I would do it, but I am to busy shooting my $3.00 per hundred rounds of 9mm today.

gotin
04-23-2011, 06:51
Well, if you buy all the components without shopping, it may not be a good money saver.
On the other hand, $20-40 will get you about 100lbs of wheel weights. $150 will get you a Lee bottom pour melting pot, 6-cavity mold and enough beeswax and vaseline to pan lube a gazillion bullets. You can cast about 1000 bullets/1 hr with this setup. Now suddenly your bullets are less then 1 cent each. Add the price of the primer (russian primers can be as low as 2 cents each) and the powder (less than a cent, if you buy 8-16lbs and spread the shipping and hazmat fee) and you are looking at $2 per box of 50. With the Lee turret press you can reload 150 rounds in 1 hr.
The really big savings come if you start reusing the lead you just shot - if you like physical activity and your range will let you mine the berm. Free lead beats cheap lead anytime.

jmorris
04-23-2011, 06:58
You are never going to send the kid to college on the money you save from reloading. Honestly you won't even save enough to "jumbo size" a drive through meal. You can however shoot a lot more for less money. If you compair "good" reloads to crap steel cased factory ammo you are not looking at it apples to apples.

A few years ago I ran across a smoking deal on BA10 powder and primer cost wasn't yet stupid and I loaded 20,000 rounds of 45 ACP for $18/1000. It did take awhile to get the almost 700#'s of lead out of all the tire shops, print shops and buddies garages around. Once the words out that you hoard lead it keeps comming for some reason.

shotgunred
04-23-2011, 08:33
With prices I checked today I can reload 9mm for
primers 21
bullets 77 (124 gr FMJ bullet)
powder 15
total $113 per K

You could save a tiny bit going to 115 gr or a lot more by using lead but this is a premium 9mm load. A lot better bullet than you are buying at your discount supplier. Tailored to shoot the way I am shooting.

primers 21
bullets 81.40 (55 gr soft point jacketed bullet)
powder 54
total $156.40 per K
Still less than Russian steel cased ammo.

You have to buy in bulk to make reloading pay!

fredj338
04-23-2011, 09:10
Hi guys,

This was inspired by another thread - but I didn't want to hijack. I've considered getting into reloading, but every time I run the numbers, I can never come out ahead.

My current price for 9mm shipped to me is around $0.21 .. and 5.56 is about $.024. When I add up all of the components (besides brass, I can grab mine) I never seem to come out more than $.01 ahead of buying factory new.

Am I looking at this wrong?

Thanks!
You certainly are. Using current prices, bought in bulk; just over 10c/9mm & 18c/223. Always assuming some bulk buying. Ya just gotta shop better.:supergrin: SHoot lead bullets in the 9mm & get down to 8c, cast your own form scrounged metal & you are shooting 9mm for the cost of 22lr.
I hate the time argument, if your time is that valuable, you don't need any hobbies. Keep working, pay someon to shoot for you, your results will probably be better too.

schaibaa
04-23-2011, 09:24
Thanks guys, I looked for a reloading forum on here but didn't see one. Not sure how I missed it.

ron59
04-23-2011, 09:47
While I can reload cheaper than buying it over the counter.... I don't SAVE money. I simply do more shooting with the money I have available for my hobby.

As was said...


Over the counter costs are pretty close to $250 per 1000 of WWB from Walmart. Good price.
With my most recent purchase (this year), I'm reloading $125 per 1000 or so. This was based on a 2-person (split) purchase of 20,000 primers and 2 8-pound jugs of TiteGroup. Also 10,000 147gr PD bullets. The larger bulk sizes you can get, the cheaper it's going to be.

Am I *saving* money? No, I still spend as much money as I did when I was buying it over the counter, but that money now pays for more ammo to be shot. I shoot something like 1500 rounds per month of 9mm, another 200-300 of .45ACP

EL_NinO619
04-23-2011, 10:23
I loaf .223 for 13c a round

BENCH
04-23-2011, 11:02
I'm with EL, I loaf for about .13 cents around.

Cheaper right now, because a friend gave me some bulk bullets that he didn't like.

Tortis

nothing
04-23-2011, 11:29
I think a lot of guys looking into costs of reloading make the error of basing the cost of supplies from bass pro and midway.

Buy your powder and primers in bulk from powder valley. Even with the hazmat costs I save $10 a pound. That's $160 dollars saved per order for me. Get your bullets in bulk from suppliers like precision delta, zero, montana gold or missouri bullet. If you try to base the costs off sierra or hornady bullets you won't save much at all.

Overall it costs me 12 cents per round for 124gr FMJ and 14 cents for 147gr. If I shoot lead I can get it down to about 8 cents a round. I really wish I had time to cast my own, I think I could get it down to 3 cents a round.

GioaJack
04-23-2011, 11:39
Even if you came out exactly dead even you now have a new hobby that is self-supporting... the woman that doesn't cost you anything isn't born yet and her mother's dead. :whistling:


Jack

Gunnut 45/454
04-23-2011, 11:42
fredj338

"I hate the time argument, if your time is that valuable, you don't need any hobbies. Keep working, pay someon to shoot for you, your results will probably be better too. "

Priceless!!! And I agree 100% :rofl: Since when does one pay himself to do things! Maybe I need to charge the wife for her honeydo list!:supergrin:

fredj338
04-23-2011, 14:39
I loaf .223 for 13c a round
And Xdrox complains about my spelling/typing??
I really wish I had time to cast my own, I think I could get it down to 3 cents a round.
Only if you get your alloy free. Lead ww are soon going to be a thing of the past, as states ban them & manuf stop making them. Yes, casting from free alloy gets you shooting 45acp for the cost of decent 22lr.
Priceless!!! And I agree 100% Since when does one pay himself to do things! Maybe I need to charge the wife for her honeydo list!
Oh, don't go there! Then she hits you w/ the bill for house cleaning, cooking, washing the cloths & let's not forget sex (sorry Jack)! That could get really expensive really quick!
I do dislike the time argument for doing a hobby or something to support the hobby. In the time it takes me to get the ammo from Wally world, I have already loaded 500rds! Please, too many people think their time is worth sooooo much, when it really is more an excuse to not try reloading based on fear of something new, JMO.

labdwakin
04-23-2011, 14:48
iT'S NOT CHEAPER... it's like a disease that drains your wallet and consumes all your time... really. LOL

shotgunred
04-24-2011, 11:47
Even if you came out exactly dead even you now have a new hobby that is self-supporting... the woman that doesn't cost you anything isn't born yet and her mother's dead. :whistling:


Jack

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

cole
04-24-2011, 12:29
I think a lot of guys looking into costs of reloading make the error of basing the cost of supplies from bass pro and midway. ...

OP, and anyone else who can't make the reloading "math" work:
Read the above post over, and over, and over again until it sinks in.

Buy in bulk online. I won't bother yet again quoting all my own numbers. Do the online research yourself:
http://www.powdervalleyinc.com/
Example 2: http://www.precisiondeltasales.com/catlist.php?indx=5
Example 3-MANY: Use Google or read this post

Buy in bulk online. Buy retail, in small amounts and you won't see much savings. Buy in bulk online and you can save 50% or more depending on caliber and components. Buy a calculator first if that helps. Buy in bulk online. (Have I said that enough times?)

Guss
04-24-2011, 13:03
If I just wanted to sling some lead, I would buy ammo rather than load it myself. My time simply isn't worth it now that prices have crept back down at Walmart. However, I keep on loading because I want quality and consistency. I've got potent rounds with low-smoke and low-flash that work every time. It also leaves me less worried about the next round of shortages, since I have more options.

fredj338
04-24-2011, 15:39
If I just wanted to sling some lead, I would buy ammo rather than load it myself. My time simply isn't worth it now that prices have crept back down at Walmart. However, I keep on loading because I want quality and consistency. I've got potent rounds with low-smoke and low-flash that work every time. It also leaves me less worried about the next round of shortages, since I have more options.
The gear you load on has a lot to do with the time element. While I have often said that 95% of us don't need our progressives, the time fqactor is where the come in handy. I was messing around in the garage & decided I would make a 100rd run on my 650. From primers & cases loaded to checking the powder drop, 10min for 100rds, if I kept at it, 300rds in less than 30min. WHo doesn't have 30min a week to reload?:dunno:

Boxerglocker
04-24-2011, 15:51
The gear you load on has a lot to do with the time element. While I have often said that 95% of us don't need our progressives, the time fqactor is where the come in handy. I was messing around in the garage & decided I would make a 100rd run on my 650. From primers & cases loaded to checking the powder drop, 10min for 100rds, if I kept at it, 300rds in less than 30min. WHo doesn't have 30min a week to reload?:dunno:

:agree: Like I said prior INVEST in good equipment and the loading vs time debate goes the wayside. Obviously bulk purchasesare still the main requirement.

fredj338
04-24-2011, 23:13
:agree: Like I said prior INVEST in good equipment and the loading vs time debate goes the wayside. Obviously bulk purchasesare still the main requirement.
You know what I think it really is, the shooters that don't want to reload don't want to have to chase their brass! It is belittling, crawling around scrounging brass like a peasent child after bread crumbs, but it's just part of the hobby. I can fix that though, just shoot a revolver.:tongueout:

labdwakin
04-24-2011, 23:54
Simplest solution yet... have your OWN range and spread out a big tarp to shoot from... pick the tarp up when you're done and dump all the brass in a bucket... VIOLA!!!

fredj338
04-25-2011, 16:15
Simplest solution yet... have your OWN range and spread out a big tarp to shoot from... pick the tarp up when you're done and dump all the brass in a bucket... VIOLA!!!

I think having your own range is the not so simple part for many of us.:crying:

JaeOne3345
04-25-2011, 16:20
I don't save any money. Instead, I just shoot about 4x as much, LOL. My spending budget for ammo and/or supplies is still the same, but I have access to much more ammo for the same weekly costs. If that makes any sense...

EL_NinO619
04-25-2011, 16:42
Fred I have my fat fingers and a small phone to blame for my spelling. Whats your excuse?

fredj338
04-25-2011, 20:16
Fred I have my fat fingers and a small phone to blame for my spelling. Whats your excuse?

One good eye between the two & I wash my hands often can't do anything with em after each time.:tongueout: