For the people who get worked up about the privileges LE has... [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Rabbi
05-21-2011, 01:21
We all know the type...they will be along here in short order. It doesnt matter what it is, someone will get pissy about it because they "cant"

"Why do you get to speed"
"why do you get to open carry"
"why do you get to...."

Whatever.

My question is this...why are there not as many "Doctor" bashers (or any profession that requires a license to practice)

I dont think I have ever seen a thread started by someone for the sole reason to bich about how silly it is that a Surgeon is "allowed" to operate on people and *I* am not. Afterall, *I* am an American and no one should be special....

Rant off. The "should cops have rifles..." thread just stuck in my craw

Navy HMC
05-21-2011, 02:58
What, wait....LEO's have privledges???? Hmm: In a job where you try to make a difference and usually come out seen as a bad guy, no matter what you do, Have to go to work each day knowing that there are folks who would like to end your life or that you may be forced to end someones life yourself, having to see a lot of the dregs of society and the evil thet men inflict on each other is privledges? Long hours, low pay?

All I can say is thank god that these men and women exist!!!!

Oh, and to my recall, surgeons kill and maim more people per year that LEO'scould ever dream of.... Personally, out of the two, I'll take the cop.

Patchman
05-21-2011, 04:28
In most states (like 48 out of 50?), people get to own the same guns as their LEOs. The difference is that for some, guns are the idols they worship while for LEOs guns are merely tools of the trade. Those people envious that LEOs can carry 24/7 while they need to get a CCW needs to get a life.

Some will respond that they need to do all that paperwork, etc.. to get a CCW and how that's unfair. Well, equate the hours spent on submitting a CCW against the months a LEO puts through the academy before being allowed to carry. No comparison.

I'd also like to know what some of the bashers do for a living because I know I can tell them how to do their job better. Like "hey guy, after the fries come out of the frier, don't put too much salt on them." :)

CJStudent
05-21-2011, 05:29
In most states (like 48 out of 50?), people get to own the same guns as their LEOs. The difference is that for some, guns are the idols they worship while for LEOs guns are merely tools of the trade. Those people envious that LEOs can carry 24/7 while they need to get a CCW needs to get a life.

Some will respond that they need to do all that paperwork, etc.. to get a CCW and how that's unfair. Well, equate the hours spent on submitting a CCW against the months a LEO puts through the academy before being allowed to carry. No comparison.

I'd also like to know what some of the bashers do for a living because I know I can tell them how to do their job better. Like "hey guy, after the fries come out of the frier, don't put too much salt on them." :)


And make sure the pickles are CENTERED on the burgers! :supergrin:

Dragoon44
05-21-2011, 05:51
It is not about whether or not the police have rifles, or anything else, that is just a smokescreen. it is about people that detest authority of any kind and the police are simply the visible manifestation of authority.

They are like two year olds stuck in the terrible twos who resent anyone that can tell them NO.

They don't care that they really have no clue about police work and how it is done, that is irrelevant to them. All that is relevant to them is they get to vent their spleen towards authority figures.

And when all their arguments are refuted they will invariably wrap themselves in their pseudo patriotism and pretend they are freedom loving patriots.

COBRA90GT
05-21-2011, 06:38
Haters gonna hate...LOL

Panzergrenadier1979
05-21-2011, 06:43
It is not about whether or not the police have rifles, or anything else, that is just a smokescreen. it is about people that detest authority of any kind and the police are simply the visible manifestation of authority.

They are like two year olds stuck in the terrible twos who resent anyone that can tell them NO.

They don't care that they really have no clue about police work and how it is done, that is irrelevant to them. All that is relevant to them is they get to vent their spleen towards authority figures.

And when all their arguments are refuted they will invariably wrap themselves in their pseudo patriotism and pretend they are freedom loving patriots.

This is the part that gets to me; how they seem to consider anarchy as some form of conservative Utopia.

I take a person's liberties very seriously (even a brief detention, such as a traffic stop) because I value my own freedom. I thank God that I was born in this country and I know that I share this thanks with many others. So, why do some of them lash out at those who would very likely agree with most of their own beliefs?! I don't believe that all cops are right-of-center, but a good portion of them (at least where I am located) hunt, fish, shoot, and resent the current political climate.

With a socialist occupying the oval office, why a "patriot" would choose something like a DUI checkpoint or officers being equipped with AR style rifles as a the tipping point of our nation is beyond my comprehension.

razdog76
05-21-2011, 06:50
In most states (like 48 out of 50?), people get to own the same guns as their LEOs. The difference is that for some, guns are the idols they worship while for LEOs guns are merely tools of the trade. Those people envious that LEOs can carry 24/7 while they need to get a CCW needs to get a life.

Some will respond that they need to do all that paperwork, etc.. to get a CCW and how that's unfair. Well, equate the hours spent on submitting a CCW against the months a LEO puts through the academy before being allowed to carry. No comparison.

I'd also like to know what some of the bashers do for a living because I know I can tell them how to do their job better. Like "hey guy, after the fries come out of the frier, don't put too much salt on them." :)

I will bet, that I have more paper pushing after issuing a cite, than filling out an Ohio CCW application.

redbrd
05-21-2011, 07:06
What, wait....LEO's have privledges???? Hmm: In a job where you try to make a difference and usually come out seen as a bad guy, no matter what you do, Have to go to work each day knowing that there are folks who would like to end your life or that you may be forced to end someones life yourself, having to see a lot of the dregs of society and the evil thet men inflict on each other is privledges? Long hours, low pay?


I will second the above. It is without question one of the most noble professions. The problem lies more with a society. The community wants them around but doesn't support them the way they should. This will erode any profession. The 10% er's are always out there and will always get 90% of the attention. Law makers need to make good laws and cops will enforce them.

Unfortunately the decades of poor support, law makers have made crappy laws often failing to hold to the constitution. Law Enforcement constantly faced with no win situations, micro-management, and catch and release judicial system.

Dragoon44
05-21-2011, 07:15
This is the part that gets to me; how they seem to consider anarchy as some form of conservative Utopia.

That is the root of the problem. They think everyman doing that which is right in his own eyes is liberty and freedom. But the founding Fathers said it was licentiousness and anarchy, which always leads to tyranny.

Their version of "liberty and freedom" is vastly different form the founding Fathers, they take liberty for license, something the founding Fathers did not. The founding fathers considered liberty and freedom as liberty and freedom to do the right thing without Govt. dictating it to you and codifying it into laws.

Look at the standard mantra of these folks, "If there is no law against it I will do as I damn well please". and they are first to whine when laws get passed to stop them from doing as they damn well please.

A6Gator
05-21-2011, 07:16
It is not about whether or not the police have rifles, or anything else, that is just a smokescreen. it is about people that detest authority of any kind and the police are simply the visible manifestation of authority.

They are like two year olds stuck in the terrible twos who resent anyone that can tell them NO.

They don't care that they really have no clue about police work and how it is done, that is irrelevant to them. All that is relevant to them is they get to vent their spleen towards authority figures.

And when all their arguments are refuted they will invariably wrap themselves in their pseudo patriotism and pretend they are freedom loving patriots.

I agree. I think it goes along with the oversized sense of entitlement a lot of people seem to feel. Personal responsibility? Naw, it's all about me.

txleapd
05-21-2011, 07:18
"why do you get to open carry"

I've never understood why some people feel such a strong need to OC. I hate carrying my pistol in the open, even with a badge right next to it. It draws unnecessary attention to me (but, I'm not an attention whore either).

redbrd
05-21-2011, 07:26
In most states (like 48 out of 50?), people get to own the same guns as their LEOs. The difference is that for some, guns are the idols they worship while for LEOs guns are merely tools of the trade. Those people envious that LEOs can carry 24/7 while they need to get a CCW needs to get a life.


Sounds like maybe you need a life of your own. I have carried a gun professionally for much of my adult life and have yet to develop the sense of superiority that you seem to have. In my world carrying a gun doesn't make you that big a deal. In my opinion its the way you have presented yourself here that draws a great deal of the negativity directed at the LEO community. You want respect earn it. Pinning a badge doesn't make that automatic, its what you do while representing it. In your post you have failed to represent your self and your fellow officers in a respectful way.

Dragoon44
05-21-2011, 08:00
I've never understood why some people feel such a strong need to OC. I hate carrying my pistol in the open, even with a badge right next to it. It draws unnecessary attention to me (but, I'm not an attention whore either).

After reading their own words and interacting with them, once you get past the "It's more comfortable", "you can draw faster", "I just prefer it", the common denominator for them is deterrence.

They firmly believe that open carried guns frighten the BG's. And if they open carry then the BG's will see they are armed an won't mess with them.

Which reveals a fundamental difference between the average OC'er and the average cop who carries cocncealed off duty. The average cop would LOVE for a BG to mess with them. it would be one of those "surprise ***********!!! moments, when the BG suddenly realizes they just bit off more than they can chew.

Detectorist
05-21-2011, 08:06
In most states (like 48 out of 50?), people get to own the same guns as their LEOs. The difference is that for some, guns are the idols they worship while for LEOs guns are merely tools of the trade. Those people envious that LEOs can carry 24/7 while they need to get a CCW needs to get a life.

Some will respond that they need to do all that paperwork, etc.. to get a CCW and how that's unfair. Well, equate the hours spent on submitting a CCW against the months a LEO puts through the academy before being allowed to carry. No comparison.

I'd also like to know what some of the bashers do for a living because I know I can tell them how to do their job better. Like "hey guy, after the fries come out of the frier, don't put too much salt on them." :)

You hit the nail on the head.

Ship A'Hoy
05-21-2011, 08:07
It is not about whether or not the police have rifles, or anything else, that is just a smokescreen. it is about people that detest authority of any kind and the police are simply the visible manifestation of authority.

They are like two year olds stuck in the terrible twos who resent anyone that can tell them NO.

They don't care that they really have no clue about police work and how it is done, that is irrelevant to them. All that is relevant to them is they get to vent their spleen towards authority figures.

And when all their arguments are refuted they will invariably wrap themselves in their pseudo patriotism and pretend they are freedom loving patriots.

Great post!

Dragoon44
05-21-2011, 08:13
You want respect earn it. Pinning a badge doesn't make that automatic

This is only partially true, Respect is indeed earned by your conduct and demeanor in interacting with those you have reason to be in contact with in the course of your duties.

However... I will give anyone who has the balls to strap on a badge and gun a certain level of respect just for having the cojones to do it. until they prove they are not worthy of that respect. ( and the same goes for those who volunteer to serve their country in the armed forces they get a level of respect from me right off the bat for doing so.)

Because having the guts to do that is far more than what most of the sniveling , whining, malcontents, that are their detractors have been willing to do.

And as far as the "air of superiority" goes, I would say the SWM's show far more of that than most cops do, one of their hallmarks is usually the old, "I have a higher education than the average cop, I make more money than the average cop, therefore I am superior tot he average cop."

DanaT
05-21-2011, 08:43
It is not about whether or not the police have rifles, or anything else, that is just a smokescreen. it is about people that detest authority of any kind and the police are simply the visible manifestation of authority.

They are like two year olds stuck in the terrible twos who resent anyone that can tell them NO.

They don't care that they really have no clue about police work and how it is done, that is irrelevant to them. All that is relevant to them is they get to vent their spleen towards authority figures.

And when all their arguments are refuted they will invariably wrap themselves in their pseudo patriotism and pretend they are freedom loving patriots.

Now now.

Just because some of us believe that the police are servants of "we the people" and "we the people" are not servants of police shouldn't get your whity tighties all in a bunch.

There is a big difference between believing government serves the people (as opposed the people serve the government) and being anti-authority. By government, I mean everyone from my wife (who is a government employee…funny fact here…she is HR over a PD….) to the President. Govt officials who don’t believe this, have what I believe is the incorrect attitude.

You are specifically referring to me. If I was so "anti-authority" do you think I would be able to fly as much as I do? I would refuse to because of TSA. Do you really think that I would obey any speed limit (3 of my 4 vehicles..the slowest is 165mph..I am omitting the truck as its slow..thats why 3 of 4). Sor you think my house would be immaculate? Do you think I would live in a very nice area with an HOA?

As a point of reference, many bureaucrats that my wife work with have pet projects (i.e. light rail) and they really don’t give a damn what the people want (most people think it’s a waste of money and don’t think a $200M train to the airport is a good deal) but say they know what’s best for the people. I think this is just as bad of an attitude.

If you say believing in limited government and that the believing that government officials (at all levels) serve the people (as opposed to people serving the government) is a pseudo-patriotic attitue , well, I guess you can brand me a pseudo-patriot. I guess that is a label I can live with.

-Dana
-Dana

Vigilant
05-21-2011, 08:46
Sounds like maybe you need a life of your own. I have carried a gun professionally for much of my adult life and have yet to develop the sense of superiority that you seem to have. In my world carrying a gun doesn't make you that big a deal. In my opinion its the way you have presented yourself here that draws a great deal of the negativity directed at the LEO community. You want respect earn it. Pinning a badge doesn't make that automatic, its what you do while representing it. In your post you have failed to represent your self and your fellow officers in a respectful way.

I must be missing something, because I see no "air of superiority", only the making of a valid point. Let's not mince words.

And, for the record, to address one lame complaint I hear now and then, coppers most certainly DO have rules to live by. It's called SOP. Its formation comes from several directions, but is, in the vast majority of cases, well thought out and defined, providing strict guidelines under which Officers must conduct themselves.

DanaT
05-21-2011, 08:54
After reading their own words and interacting with them, once you get past the "It's more comfortable", "you can draw faster", "I just prefer it", the common denominator for them is deterrence.

They firmly believe that open carried guns frighten the BG's. And if they open carry then the BG's will see they are armed an won't mess with them.

I disagree to some extent.

OC, for example in the mountains (except Aspen and Vail) near where I am at, is mostly about convenience. There is no requirement for a permit to OC in CO. One just has to be able to legally own a gun and it cannot be in a prohibited area (this by state law states that OC can only be forbidden in some places and it has to be marked with signs at all entrances). To CCW, one has to go through the extensive background checks, pay the fees, etc. So for the occasional mountain carry, it is much easier to OC. Also, hunting is very normal in the mountains (in the fall…between summer camping season..and winter ski season… I would suspect that is 75% of the economy for that part of the state) and so no-one (except out of state tourist or hippies from Boulder) take a second look at a gun.

Now, although OC is legal in Boulder. It will draw attention of many people and someone can expect LEO contact. Anyone OC isn’t doing it because they think it is a crime deterrent in this situation, they are doing it as a political statement. Its not hard to get a CCW here. We are a shall issue state for CCW.

-Dana

TBO
05-21-2011, 09:55
Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
-Dr. Samuel Johnson
...4/17/1775

A real patriot is the fellow who gets a parking ticket and rejoices that the system works.
-Bill Vaughan

Heroism on command, senseless violence, and all the loathsome nonsense that goes by the name of patriotism - how passionately i hate them!
.~Albert Einstein


....

Dragoon44
05-21-2011, 10:36
You are specifically referring to me.


If I were specifically referring to you, I would have quoted you or named you, I am not bashful. Although I do think you fit the category, it isn't about just you.

If I was so "anti-authority" do you think I would be able to fly as much as I do? I would refuse to because of TSA. Do you really think that I would obey any speed limit (3 of my 4 vehicles..the slowest is 165mph..I am omitting the truck as its slow..thats why 3 of 4). Sor you think my house would be immaculate? Do you think I would live in a very nice area with an HOA?

You are making an assumption here that I think you would "put your money where your mouth is". Sorry to disappoint you, I don't think that at all.

If you say believing in limited government and that the believing that government officials (at all levels) serve the people (as opposed to people serving the government) is a pseudo-patriotic attitue , well, I guess you can brand me a pseudo-patriot. I guess that is a label I can live with.

No, I am referring to your behavior when yo could not sustain your argument in the carry issues thread and so you started posting your nonsense that got deleted and moved to Civil liberties. And while you claim you do not have an issue with cops your posting history in Civil liberties indicates otherwise. seven current threads in Civil liberties, FIVE of them started by you, ALL of them about Cops. either online or off.

In police work we call that a clue.

I think you should change you screen name to Pharaoh, cuz you da king of De Nile.

Detectorist
05-21-2011, 10:40
In police work we call that a clue.

I think you should change you screen name to Pharaoh, cuz you da king of De Nile.

:rofl: :rofl:

steveksux
05-21-2011, 11:41
In most states (like 48 out of 50?), people get to own the same guns as their LEOs. The difference is that for some, guns are the idols they worship while for LEOs guns are merely tools of the trade. Those people envious that LEOs can carry 24/7 while they need to get a CCW needs to get a life.That may be true...

But you can't just buy jackboots out of the Sears catalog... :tongueout::rofl:

As to the comment by someone else earlier about "pinning a badge on" automatically getting respect, I would suggest its the extensive screening to weed out bad apples, the extensive training one goes through to become a cop, and the fact that they are putting their life on the line when they "pin on that badge" that earns that respect. Pinning on the badge has nothing to do with it.

Not going to bring up anything about OCers expecting to be treated as a good guy just for "pinning a gun on".... :whistling:

Randy

2-8 Marine
05-21-2011, 12:12
It is not about whether or not the police have rifles, or anything else, that is just a smokescreen. it is about people that detest authority of any kind and the police are simply the visible manifestation of authority.

They are like two year olds stuck in the terrible twos who resent anyone that can tell them NO.

They don't care that they really have no clue about police work and how it is done, that is irrelevant to them. All that is relevant to them is they get to vent their spleen towards authority figures.

And when all their arguments are refuted they will invariably wrap themselves in their pseudo patriotism and pretend they are freedom loving patriots.

Well said . . . thank you.

DanaT
05-21-2011, 12:17
No, I am referring to your behavior when yo could not sustain your argument in the carry issues thread and so you started posting your nonsense that got deleted and moved to Civil liberties.

You mistake my replies for ones that were in response to other name calling. Once name calling starts in a thread (i.e. "anti-thorative", etc) that is simply a way of admitting one has lost an argument and resorts to using name calling to discredit someone.


I think you should change you screen name to Pharaoh, cuz you da king of De Nile.

Maybe Russ can help me out and change it to PharaohDana....but if not...you can call me Pharaoh, your highness, your excellency, etc. That would stroke my ego a little...

-Dana