IWB small-of-the-back [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Recurve
06-24-2011, 11:27
Does anyone make an IWB for small-of-the-back carry? I've done some looking on 4 or 5 hoslter sites, but haven't found anything.

IndyGunFreak
06-24-2011, 11:59
Get ready for the flood of posts telling you you'll be paralyzed if you ever fall on the ice, etc..

Regardless, look for "SOB" holsters.. (Small of Back)... They are designed for this sort of carry.

Edit: Curious.. What gun are you trying to carry, what holsters have you tried, and why is carrying in the traditional places (2:30-5:00) not working for you?

IGF

fastbolt
06-24-2011, 15:13
SOB holsters have seemingly fallen off in popularity and demand, although they can still be found among the offerings on the market.

As just mentioned, there are any number of folks who won't carry using this method for fear of increasing their risk of injury.

I'm one of them, BTW.

I used to wear a thin profile leather ammo dump pouch in the SOB position on my gun belt, later followed by a single handcuff case. Both caused me discomfort and eventual pain from having them pressed up against my spine when seated in my patrol car. Upon many occasions I also found myself bumping my back against hard surfaces (doorways, furniture, etc) and felt increased discomfort and pain in my lumbar spine depending on how hard I impacted the surface. I'm very glad I never fall directly on my back while wearing my gun belt with those things in the SOB position.

I've known other cops who experienced similar discomfort and pain in their lumbar spines due to having equipment located at the SOB position of their gun belts.

Among the many instances where this subject has come up in other threads, on this and other forums, you can usually find someone who claims to have experienced anywhere from minor to major injury when using this type of carry method. In one thread on another forum a member one claimed knowing a friend who suffered serious back injury when he fell onto his holstered handgun he carried SOB. Maybe so.

The potential for suffering injury from falling upon a gun holstered SOB aside, there are also some tactical considerations which might make this carry method less favorable ...

It's very difficult, if not impossible, to access a weapon carried SOB when belted into a motor vehicle, and difficult when sitting, in general.

It's less easy to avoid printing when bending to pick something up.

Drawing a weapon from a SOB holster can present more opportunity for someone to sweep their muzzle across their body during drawing and presentation. A negligent discharge during this sort of situation can create the risk for suffering a gunshot wound.

Drawing and presenting from this position can make for a long draw, time-wise.

Reaching the holstered weapon with the non-dominant hand (like in the event of an injury to the dominant hand) may be more problematic, especially if the SOB holster selected is of the type that's noticeably canted outward toward the dominant side. Too far back to reach around from the front, and yet also positioned quite a ways from being easily reached from the rear using the non-dominant hand.

The location in the SOB makes it more difficult to protect against a gun grab attempt. Not as easily or as quickly reached and protected by the wearer's arms/elbows and hands. Not as "instinctive" to reach, and probably not as easy to exert strength with the hands and arms, trying to gain leverage, when it is reached.

I'd think the SOB style carry method has more potential disadvantages than advantages.

I've seen it more on TV and in the Movies than I've ever seen it used in real life, among either LE or non-LE folks ...

Just my thoughts.

TACC GLOCK
06-24-2011, 15:19
SOB holsters have seemingly fallen off in popularity and demand, although they can still be found among the offerings on the market.

As just mentioned, there are any number of folks who won't carry using this method for fear of increasing their risk of injury.

I'm one of them, BTW.

I used to wear a thin profile leather ammo dump pouch in the SOB position on my gun belt, later followed by a single handcuff case. Both caused me discomfort and eventual pain from having them pressed up against my spine when seated in my patrol car. Upon many occasions I also found myself bumping my back against hard surfaces (doorways, furniture, etc) and felt increased discomfort and pain in my lumbar spine depending on how hard I impacted the surface. I'm very glad I never fall directly on my back while wearing my gun belt with those things in the SOB position.

I've known other cops who experienced similar discomfort and pain in their lumbar spines due to having equipment located at the SOB position of their gun belts.

Among the many instances where this subject has come up in other threads, on this and other forums, you can usually find someone who claims to have experienced anywhere from minor to major injury when using this type of carry method. In one thread on another forum a member one claimed knowing a friend who suffered serious back injury when he fell onto his holstered handgun he carried SOB. Maybe so.

The potential for suffering injury from falling upon a gun holstered SOB aside, there are also some tactical considerations which might make this carry method less favorable ...

It's very difficult, if not impossible, to access a weapon carried SOB when belted into a motor vehicle, and difficult when sitting, in general.

It's less easy to avoid printing when bending to pick something up.

Drawing a weapon from a SOB holster can present more opportunity for someone to sweep their muzzle across their body during drawing and presentation. A negligent discharge during this sort of situation can create the risk for suffering a gunshot wound.

Drawing and presenting from this position can make for a long draw, time-wise.

Reaching the holstered weapon with the non-dominant hand (like in the event of an injury to the dominant hand) may be more problematic, especially if the SOB holster selected is of the type that's noticeable canted outward toward the dominant side. Too far back to reach around from the front, and yet also positioned quite a ways from being easily reached from the rear using the non-dominant hand.

The location in the SOB makes it more difficult to protect against a gun grab attempt. Not as easily or as quickly reached and protected by the wearer's arms/elbows and hands. Not as "instinctive" to reach, and probably not as easy to exert strength with the hands and arms, trying to gain leverage, when it is reached.

I'd think the SOB style carry method has more potential disadvantages than advantages.

I've seen it more on TV and in the Movies than I've ever seen it used in real life, among either LE or non-LE folks ...

Just my thoughts.

Fastbolt, great explanations, even for non-leo's the same problems will prevail.

I also was a great fan of the s-o-b idea until I started carrying a Supertuck at 3:30, now I would not carry any other way.

IndyGunFreak
06-24-2011, 15:42
SOB holsters have seemingly fallen off in popularity and demand, although they can still be found among the offerings on the market.

As just mentioned, there are any number of folks who won't carry using this method for fear of increasing their risk of injury.

I'm one of them, BTW.

I used to wear a thin profile leather ammo dump pouch in the SOB position on my gun belt, later followed by a single handcuff case. Both caused me discomfort and eventual pain from having them pressed up against my spine when seated in my patrol car. Upon many occasions I also found myself bumping my back against hard surfaces (doorways, furniture, etc) and felt increased discomfort and pain in my lumbar spine depending on how hard I impacted the surface. I'm very glad I never fall directly on my back while wearing my gun belt with those things in the SOB position.

I've known other cops who experienced similar discomfort and pain in their lumbar spines due to having equipment located at the SOB position of their gun belts.

Among the many instances where this subject has come up in other threads, on this and other forums, you can usually find someone who claims to have experienced anywhere from minor to major injury when using this type of carry method. In one thread on another forum a member one claimed knowing a friend who suffered serious back injury when he fell onto his holstered handgun he carried SOB. Maybe so.

The potential for suffering injury from falling upon a gun holstered SOB aside, there are also some tactical considerations which might make this carry method less favorable ...

It's very difficult, if not impossible, to access a weapon carried SOB when belted into a motor vehicle, and difficult when sitting, in general.

It's less easy to avoid printing when bending to pick something up.

Drawing a weapon from a SOB holster can present more opportunity for someone to sweep their muzzle across their body during drawing and presentation. A negligent discharge during this sort of situation can create the risk for suffering a gunshot wound.

Drawing and presenting from this position can make for a long draw, time-wise.

Reaching the holstered weapon with the non-dominant hand (like in the event of an injury to the dominant hand) may be more problematic, especially if the SOB holster selected is of the type that's noticeable canted outward toward the dominant side. Too far back to reach around from the front, and yet also positioned quite a ways from being easily reached from the rear using the non-dominant hand.

The location in the SOB makes it more difficult to protect against a gun grab attempt. Not as easily or as quickly reached and protected by the wearer's arms/elbows and hands. Not as "instinctive" to reach, and probably not as easy to exert strength with the hands and arms, trying to gain leverage, when it is reached.

I'd think the SOB style carry method has more potential disadvantages than advantages.

I've seen it more on TV and in the Movies than I've ever seen it used in real life, among either LE or non-LE folks ...

Just my thoughts.

Great post, and a few of the reasons I don't carry SOB are listed here... Also, although I sounded facetious in my first post... I'm also of the belief that a slip/fall while carrying SOB, could easily lead to a serious injury.

IGF

Cream Soda Kid
06-24-2011, 15:56
Does anyone make an IWB for small-of-the-back carry? I've done some looking on 4 or 5 hoslter sites, but haven't found anything.

Mernickle Holsters

http://www.mernickleholsters.com/ps/ps2sobr1/ps2sobr1.html (http://www.mernickleholsters.com/ps/ps2sobr1/ps2sobr1.html)

Never tried it, but someone I know has one and likes it.

poodleplumber
06-24-2011, 16:02
In addition to fastbolt's excellent post, it is very easy to have your cover garment ride up and expose your firearm without you knowing it.

fastbolt
06-24-2011, 18:21
... although I sounded facetious in my first post...

I didn't take your post that way, not with the followup sentence. It just occurred to me to add some of my own thoughts and experiences, especially those that supported your comment regarding a possible increased risk exposure of injury.

Recurve
06-24-2011, 20:15
Mernickle Holsters

http://www.mernickleholsters.com/ps/ps2sobr1/ps2sobr1.html (http://www.mernickleholsters.com/ps/ps2sobr1/ps2sobr1.html)

Never tried it, but someone I know has one and likes it.




This is about what I was looking for. Lately, I've been carrying a G19 in a remora holster tucked into the back of my waistband. I use a beltman belt. I'm sure I'll catch some flack, but it has suited my purposes. I take the gun/holster out while riding in the car, and tuck in the back of my pants when inside a store, etc.

This isn't the way I carry ALL the time, but it is quite convenient and comfortable on weekends or quick evening outings...times when I don't tuck my shirt in. During the week I tuck my shirt in and the gun is in the car....I drive A LOT for work and basically work out of my car and home...don't go to the office much.

As for falling down or injuring my spine...I understand the concerns, but I personally feel like that is very remote. At least here, since we get ice about once a year.

As for concealment, I have a big butt, wide shoulders, and a regular sized waist. Believe it or not, SOB is actually the easies way for me conceal...there seems to be a hollow area (sway) to my lower back...the gun fits well. IWB in another position just insn't an option. I can OWB carry at 4oclock during the winter months.

Thanks for the informative replies. They are helpful and give my something to consider. Please keep them coming.

aeroengr
06-25-2011, 02:09
When I first started carrying, I did so in SOB (G19 as well). Quite honestly I thought it had the best potential for concealment, because just like you described, there was a little "hollow area" for it to rest. This is however contingent upon your shirt being long enough for it to cover during occasions where you bend over or lift your arms up.

I eventually decided against doing so for a couple of reasons, most of which have been explained already. Namely, it was very uncomfortable to sit down! Extended periods of time made things more painful, which I'm surprised you don't encounter as you said you work out of your car a lot. The other reason was I found I would need to stop wearing alot of my everyday shirts, or just avoid bending over altogether. It seemed to peak out alot, and also didn't seem to fit as tightly with my beltline as a 2-4 o'clock position would (probably because of the "hollow area" and it being more loose). Combine these 2 things with it being harder to access on SOB, and you get the hip position is altogether the best.

Recurve
06-25-2011, 09:13
When I first started carrying, I did so in SOB (G19 as well). Quite honestly I thought it had the best potential for concealment, because just like you described, there was a little "hollow area" for it to rest. This is however contingent upon your shirt being long enough for it to cover during occasions where you bend over or lift your arms up.

I eventually decided against doing so for a couple of reasons, most of which have been explained already. Namely, it was very uncomfortable to sit down! Extended periods of time made things more painful, which I'm surprised you don't encounter as you said you work out of your car a lot. The other reason was I found I would need to stop wearing alot of my everyday shirts, or just avoid bending over altogether. It seemed to peak out alot, and also didn't seem to fit as tightly with my beltline as a 2-4 o'clock position would (probably because of the "hollow area" and it being more loose). Combine these 2 things with it being harder to access on SOB, and you get the hip position is altogether the best.


Thanks for your reply. When I'm in the car, I take the gun/hoslter out and place in the center console.

tag
06-25-2011, 09:21
It seems that most new carriers, at one time or another, believe that SOB carry is the best suited for their needs. As they gain experience, most forego that method of carry for something more suitable.

Shinesintx
06-25-2011, 09:29
It seems that most new carriers, at one time or another, believe that SOB carry is the best suited for their needs. As they gain experience, most forego that method of carry for something more suitable.

The above describes me perfectly!!!

I started out carrying a LCP Mexican Carry and then graduated to a G33 in SOB. Yesterday at a Church function with kids everywhere and having to sit Indian Style on the floor...SOB kinda sucked. At one point, I exposed my handgun. No one saw it, but I think I am gonna have to try something else. I guess I am gaining experience and am seeking something else just like you stated.

Recurve
06-25-2011, 10:49
It seems that most new carriers, at one time or another, believe that SOB carry is the best suited for their needs. As they gain experience, most forego that method of carry for something more suitable.


You're right. It is definitely an evolving process.

ranburr1
06-25-2011, 16:50
You will eventually go to hip or appendix carry. SOB just doesn't work.

Dr.Midnight
06-25-2011, 17:01
This thread is of particular interest to me. I've been kicking around the idea of SOB carry because all other positions just aren't comfortable FOR ME. I've got a little bit of a belly and some love handles, and I just can't find a position to suit me. I ususally carry OWB when dress allows, or pocket carry an LCP, LCR, or J Frame.

Maybe I'm not using the right holster, but I really don't want to go through the expense of finding the "right" one. Maybe I'll keep the status quo and focus on a treadmill versus a SOB holster. :rofl:

Recurve
06-25-2011, 19:02
This thread is of particular interest to me. I've been kicking around the idea of SOB carry because all other positions just aren't comfortable FOR ME. I've got a little bit of a belly and some love handles, and I just can't find a position to suit me. I ususally carry OWB when dress allows, or pocket carry an LCP, LCR, or J Frame.

Maybe I'm not using the right holster, but I really don't want to go through the expense of finding the "right" one. Maybe I'll keep the status quo and focus on a treadmill versus a SOB holster. :rofl:


I'm with you on many of those points. The reason I think SOB will work for me is b/c I won't wear it that way all day every day. It's a situational thing. Much like when I OWB carry or pocket carry.

Moonfish
06-25-2011, 20:20
I use the Galco SOB in the 3:00 to 4:00 position when on long road trips... the cant is much more accessible while seated.

http://www.impactguns.com/data/default/images/catalog/535/galco_sob.jpg

tag
06-26-2011, 07:54
You will eventually go to hip or appendix carry. SOB just doesn't work.

Ah, the appendix fad. I'm looking forward to that one going the way of SOB shortly, too.

ranburr1
06-27-2011, 00:52
Ah, the appendix fad. I'm looking forward to that one going the way of SOB shortly, too.


I don't know how you can call a form of carry that has been around for centuries a fad.