Carrying on trip to Virginia Beach.. Bars? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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geofri
06-27-2011, 10:55
Going down with some friends to visit family, and a night out on the boardwalk/ bar hopping is on the agenda. I'm not much of a drinker, and plan to tag along while carrying.

per handgunlaws.us Carry in Restaurants That Serve Alcohol
YES
Note: What is defined as carry in a restaurant that serves alcohol is a place like Friday’s or Red Lobster.
Handgunlaw.us believes you should never consume alcohol when carrying your firearm. In some states it is
illegal to take even one drink while carrying a firearm.

I've heard some states only allow carry in restaurants where liquor sales are less than half the revenue( or some such number).

It doesn't mention a Bar where alcohol is the main revenue.

Since it doesn't say you can't I assume it to be legal?

Any of you try to get into any "clubs" or places that pat-down?

Only recently got my permit and haven't been patted down while carrying. If there is nothing posted against carrying, I'm fine right?

If a pat down occurs and my gun is found, all they can do is deny entry, and leaving to stash gun in the car will remedy that? ( I'd probably go elsewhere, rather than leave gun in car).

RussP
06-27-2011, 11:27
Going down with some friends to visit family, and a night out on the boardwalk/ bar hopping is on the agenda. I'm not much of a drinker, and plan to tag along while carrying.

per handgunlaws.us

I've heard some states only allow carry in restaurants where liquor sales are less than half the revenue( or some such number).

It doesn't mention a Bar where alcohol is the main revenue.

Since it doesn't say you can't I assume it to be legal?

Any of you try to get into any "clubs" or places that pat-down?

Only recently got my permit and haven't been patted down while carrying. If there is nothing posted against carrying, I'm fine right?

If a pat down occurs and my gun is found, all they can do is deny entry, and leaving to stash gun in the car will remedy that? ( I'd probably go elsewhere, rather than leave gun in car).Virginia does not have a defined "bar". All places serving liquor must serve food, therefore they are a restaurant. :cool: You may carry into a restaurant.

Now, if an establishment does not permit firearms, there will probably be a sign saying so. If someone is patting down or wanding patrons, you may expect them to tell you whether your weapon is allowed. If asked to leave, failure to do so is trespass.

Just use common sense and don't try to get around the law. You'll be fine.

ProactiveShooters
06-27-2011, 13:30
Virginia does not have a defined "bar". All places serving liquor must serve food, therefore they are a restaurant. :cool: You may carry into a restaurant.

Correct.



Now, if an establishment does not permit firearms, there will probably be a sign saying so.

Just keep in mind that there is no sign requirement in Va. You can simply be told that firearms are not allowed.

geofri
06-27-2011, 13:32
Virginia does not have a defined "bar". All places serving liquor must serve food, therefore they are a restaurant. :cool: You may carry into a restaurant.

Now, if an establishment does not permit firearms, there will probably be a sign saying so. If someone is patting down or wanding patrons, you may expect them to tell you whether your weapon is allowed. If asked to leave, failure to do so is trespass.

Just use common sense and don't try to get around the law. You'll be fine.

Great, thanks RussP!

geofri
06-27-2011, 13:36
Correct.





Just keep in mind that there is no sign requirement in Va. You can simply be told that firearms are not allowed.

Good to know.

I'm pretty observant, so as unlikely as it might be, if I were to miss a posted sign, would I be trespassing(unknowingly) , or would I need to be asked to leave first?



Thanks.

RussP
06-27-2011, 14:59
Good to know.

I'm pretty observant, so as unlikely as it might be, if I were to miss a posted sign, would I be trespassing(unknowingly) , or would I need to be asked to leave first?



Thanks.You must be asked to leave, however, people do mean things, like tell police they asked you to leave and you refused.

furioso2112
06-27-2011, 15:08
Don't forget to carry a printout of something showing VA's reciprocity - if you are stopped by an officer, don't count on him knowing your PA permit is good here. The Virginia Citizen's Defense League web site might have links to VA laws, FAQ's, etc. I'm a member of VCDL.

dugo
06-27-2011, 20:33
Virginia does not have a defined "bar". All places serving liquor must serve food, therefore they are a restaurant. :cool: You may carry into a restaurant.

Now, if an establishment does not permit firearms, there will probably be a sign saying so. If someone is patting down or wanding patrons, you may expect them to tell you whether your weapon is allowed. If asked to leave, failure to do so is trespass.

Just use common sense and don't try to get around the law. You'll be fine.


And, no drinking at all if carrying concealed in such a restaurant, right?

(Although it is legal to drink a little if open carrying? Is that correct? ... not that I would condone it.)

swinokur
06-28-2011, 05:07
And, no drinking at all if carrying concealed in such a restaurant, right?

(Although it is legal to drink a little if open carrying? Is that correct? ... not that I would condone it.)

Correct but drinking anything while carrying is a very bad idea IMO.

RussP
06-28-2011, 05:31
Just use common sense ... You'll be fine.And, no drinking at all if carrying concealed in such a restaurant, right?

(Although it is legal to drink a little if open carrying? Is that correct? ... not that I would condone it.)My opinion is that having alcohol in your system and carrying where there is a 0.0001% chance you'll have to use your firearm does not fall under "use common sense".

As to open carry at this time of year in the nightspots on Atlantic Ave., I would suggest you not OC. Off season, when mostly locals are out on the town, maybe. But, VaBch, at this time of year, attracts good people and bad people, normal people and weirdos.

My basic rule for OC is ONLY open carry when and where appropriate. Atlantic Ave. at night in the middle of the summer season fits neither of those criteria.

And, yes, I personally open carry in VaBch on Atlantic Ave., just not between sunset and sunrise.

tehama
06-28-2011, 05:48
Co-sign what RussP said about the clientele of Va Beach right about now. Was on the news just a week ago or so of an update on a case caught on surveillance video of some out of towner getting surrounded by 5 or so people and punched out COLD in the back of his head then robbed. He was out before he hit the concrete.

Wouldnt want BG's to factor into the equation your armed status.

Why/how the victim just stood there and waited for a small mob to surround him from all directions is a topic of discussion for another day.

ProactiveShooters
06-28-2011, 19:12
Good to know.

I'm pretty observant, so as unlikely as it might be, if I were to miss a posted sign, would I be trespassing(unknowingly) , or would I need to be asked to leave first?


Thanks.

You must be asked to leave, however, people do mean things, like tell police they asked you to leave and you refused.

Incorrect. You could be charged with trespassing right off the bat, but most business owners and police officers would simply ask you to leave. If you refused, then you'd get stroked.

cowboy1964
06-28-2011, 19:26
Drinking while OCing.... wow. Way to really attract attention.

Drinking "a little" is legal? What about drinking "more than a litttle"? Is that how the law is actually worded? (somehow I doubt it)

RussP
06-28-2011, 21:23
Incorrect. You could be charged with trespassing right off the bat, but most business owners and police officers would simply ask you to leave. If you refused, then you'd get stroked.Yes, any sign posted does give constructive notice of the property owner's desire to prohibit firearms, and the prohibited places language does read: "Private property when prohibited by the owner of the property, or where posted as prohibited. Violation is a trespass charge and not a firearms violation. § 18.2-308.

I should have posted, and I usually do, that you must be informed either verbally or by signage before a trespass charge can be made. My omission...

dugo
06-29-2011, 05:45
Correct but drinking anything while carrying is a very bad idea IMO.


Absolutely agree.

dugo
06-29-2011, 05:49
...

As to open carry at this time of year in the nightspots on Atlantic Ave., I would suggest you not OC. Off season, when mostly locals are out on the town, maybe. But, VaBch, at this time of year, attracts good people and bad people, normal people and weirdos.

My basic rule for OC is ONLY open carry when and where appropriate. Atlantic Ave. at night in the middle of the summer season fits neither of those criteria.

...

I'm admittedly not familiar with the area, but that sounds like some common sense to me.

dugo
06-29-2011, 05:56
Drinking while OCing.... wow. Way to really attract attention.

Drinking "a little" is legal? What about drinking "more than a litttle"? Is that how the law is actually worded? (somehow I doubt it)

Completely agree that drinking and carrying in any manner is always a bad risk, for a number of reasons. If asked for advice about this, I would say something like, "You want to do WHAT!? Are you crazy?!"

Of course, nobody has asked.

That said, I don't think drinking while OCing is, by itself, illegal in VA.

Not sure of the language (I'm sure others here can provide it), but I'm pretty sure you can't be "intoxicated", or " under the influence" while OCing. Reason I said "a little" in the prior post is that I believe it is the impairment, not the drinking itself, that is the technical offense.

If that's correct, this parallels some states' driving laws, where the charge is "driving while impaired", and not actually "drinking and driving". Proof may be different. (In those jurisdictions, for example, even if someone conclusively blows a 2.0, the jury doesn't have to convict without more facts. Generally, they may convict on that alone, since it may be evidence of impairment, but they don't have to, since there is not a law -- presumptions aside -- specifically against blowing a 2.0.)

Disclaimner: I yield in advance to those here who know more about the VA law on this than I do ... at least unless I brush up on it first.

ProactiveShooters
06-29-2011, 06:03
Yes, any sign posted does give constructive notice of the property owner's desire to prohibit firearms, and the prohibited places language does read: "Private property when prohibited by the owner of the property, or where posted as prohibited. Violation is a trespass charge and not a firearms violation. § 18.2-308.

I should have posted, and I usually do, that you must be informed either verbally or by signage before a trespass charge can be made. My omission...

Agreed.

Now, I have spoken to a prosecutor who said that in his opinion someone could be charged under 308 for a violation of 308 O. The theory being that if you carry on private property where prohibited, its as if you are carrying concealed without a valid permit. I do think that they would go the trespass route instead.

byf43
06-29-2011, 09:02
Going down with some friends to visit family, and a night out on the boardwalk/ bar hopping is on the agenda. I'm not much of a drinker, and plan to tag along while carrying.

Only recently got my permit and haven't been patted down while carrying. If there is nothing posted against carrying, I'm fine right?




I see that you are from/in PA.

You most likely already know this, but. . . . .
If you are traveling through Maryland, you need to keep your firearm(s) in a separate compartment (read as 'not readily accessible) and should be 'locked' in a case.
Also, the ammunition MUST be stored separately, from the firearm(s).

MSP (Maryland State Police) aren't usually 'casual' about this.
They WILL arrest you and confiscate the firearm(s) if you have them 'accessible'.
I've seen them give LEOs from neighboring states some 'grief', when stopped for traffic violations. ("Professional Courtesy" is spotty, in Maryland!!)












"Maryland. The Free State."
(My rear-end!)

:supergrin:

swinokur
06-29-2011, 10:16
I see that you are from/in PA.

You most likely already know this, but. . . . .
If you are traveling through Maryland, you need to keep your firearm(s) in a separate compartment (read as 'not readily accessible) and should be 'locked' in a case.
Also, the ammunition MUST be stored separately, from the firearm(s).

MSP (Maryland State Police) aren't usually 'casual' about this.
They WILL arrest you and confiscate the firearm(s) if you have them 'accessible'.
I've seen them give LEOs from neighboring states some 'grief', when stopped for traffic violations. ("Professional Courtesy" is spotty, in Maryland!!)

FOPA does not require ammo to be packed separately from the firearm.

§ 926A. Interstate transportation of firearms




Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.











"Maryland. The Free State."
(My rear-end!)

:supergrin:[/quote]