Gang warfare has broken out here. [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Electrikkoolaid
07-24-2011, 17:53
The bloods and the Crips have started a war (http://www.witn.com/searchresults?searchKeywords=greenville+shooting&dateRange=60) in sleepy Greenville, NC.

When not shooting each other, they are now pulling daily armed robberies. In one case, they keep robbing the same Sonic drive-in (http://www.witn.com/searchresults?searchKeywords=sonic+robbery&dateRange=90) every few weeks.

While some of you in larger metro areas may laugh at my concern, we have had more people shot this month than Detroit and Chicago combined! (15 vs. 9)

The level of violence is unprecedented in this college town of 82,000 people! It really wasn't like this as recently as 2 years ago!

The police spend more time arresting drunk college kids and writing seatbelt tickets than confronting the gang-bangers.

The mayhem is not just limited to the "bad areas" of town. Just last night 4 people were shot (http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/NEW_INFO_4_People_Shot_In_Greenville.html?storySection=story) at a large convenience store in town -- the second time this summer at the same store.

While some of the comments posted on the news stories are very racistly macho and suggest forming vigilante groups, the police really seem powerless to do anything. Local church groups are holding "prayer meetings" about this.

Has anyone else lived in an area that was able to overcome this kind of explosion in violence? How did your people do it?

seanmac45
07-24-2011, 17:56
Didn't you just finish posting a nasty and snide comment about NYC on another thread?


Good luck with your town:rofl::rofl::rofl:

GeorgiaRedfish
07-24-2011, 17:59
Didn't you just finish posting a nasty and snide comment about NYC on another thread?


Good luck with your town:rofl::rofl::rofl:
Wow, seriously?

BailRecoveryAgent
07-24-2011, 18:08
nasty and snide comment about NYC

Is there any other kind?:whistling:

Search
07-24-2011, 18:08
Lol at the prayer groups. The only way to fight violence is with violence. The police dept will have to adapt to a changing town and it will take time. It happens all the time. We are currently experiencing a growth in gang activity too but luckily management has always been proactive about training for it.

packsaddle
07-24-2011, 18:11
old school policing will help make a dent.

(pun intended)

poodleshooter1
07-24-2011, 18:11
The police spend more time arresting drunk college kids and writing seatbelt tickets than confronting the gang-bangers.


That's because it's easy money to pick on college kids and speeders. It's all about the pension and six figure pay don't you know?

BailRecoveryAgent
07-24-2011, 18:14
Lol at the prayer groups. The only way to fight violence is with violence.

They're not mutually exclusive. "Dear Lord, be with the gangbangers and prepare them for the butt kickin they're about to receive..."

Electrikkoolaid
07-24-2011, 18:17
Didn't you just finish posting a nasty and snide comment about NYC on another thread?


Good luck with your town:rofl::rofl::rofl:

What does it take to get a weapons permit in NYC or NYS? The average citizen is severely restricted from purchasing a handgun in the whole state, and legal carry by "average Joes" is essentially unheard of in NYC.

As others have mentioned, the police stop and frisk people, taking "pointy flashlights" away as "weapons". Use of stun guns or pepper spray can get you FELONY charges in New York.

Removing any form of self-defense from citizens isn't the answer, nor is armed bands of citizens rolling around dispensing vigilante justice.

HANSOLLIG
07-24-2011, 18:25
Lol at the prayer groups. The only way to fight violence is with violence. The police dept will have to adapt to a changing town and it will take time. It happens all the time. We are currently experiencing a growth in gang activity too but luckily management has always been proactive about training for it.


Exactly. Do something productive, like shooting back. Stop talking to your imaginary friend in ths sky. It doesn't help at all.

Patchman
07-24-2011, 18:36
What does it take to get a weapons permit in NYC or NYS? The average citizen is severely restricted from purchasing a handgun in the whole state, and legal carry by "average Joes" is essentially unheard of in NYC.

As others have mentioned, the police stop and frisk people, taking "pointy flashlights" away as "weapons". Use of stun guns or pepper spray can get you FELONY charges in New York.

Removing any form of self-defense from citizens isn't the answer, nor is armed bands of citizens rolling around dispensing vigilante justice.

I read the on-line local papers from many cities around the country. And to be perfectly honest, I have not read that NYC has the same problem you described. And yes, their citizens do not own guns like NC citizens. Not even close.

Seems to me what Seamac45 is posting is that what's good for the goose is good for the gander. If it bothers you the Bloods and the Crips are engaged in a shooting war where you're at, perhaps you should consider moving to NYC (or Boston or Philly or even Washington DC) until all that shooting dies down. Be a lot safer. :rofl:

You and other concerned local NC citizens do have guns, no? :whistling:

Electrikkoolaid
07-24-2011, 18:52
You can bet nearly every house, and every other car, has a firearm of some type. This is The South after all.

Rednecks driving around in pick-ups with armed posies of concerned citizens shooting at black males age 14-30 as alleged gang members won't help either.

I have a CCW permit, and don't go to areas where this type of trouble would be expected.

But when shots ring out while pumping gas (I use that station), what am I supposed to do? Hide under my bed?

HarleyGuy
07-24-2011, 19:17
A few years ago I remember seeing that Salt Lake City had impported some policemen experienced with gangs from Los Angeles in hopes that they could help their officers address the growing gang problem.

The feds seen to be getting a llittle tougher on the gangs also so perhaps there's some light at the end of the tunnel.

Stay safe

Patchman
07-24-2011, 19:19
You can bet nearly every house, and every other car, has a firearm of some type. This is The South after all.

Rednecks driving around in pick-ups with armed posies of concerned citizens shooting at black males age 14-30 as alleged gang members won't help either.


That's why laws are state specific. To me, it's presumptious for a citizen from one state to say "we have this in MY state/city, so YOUR state/city must suck because you don't have it/allow it."

What works for NC may not work for NY or OR or NM or some other state. And each state lives with the consequences of their laws and what they allow their LE to do.

I'm sure the fight between the Crips and the Bloods will die down eventually.

1canvas
07-24-2011, 19:27
gangs are taking over many cities and for what ever reason police are powerless against them, there is nothing that can be done. send them to prison with the rest of their friends and they just get worse, they also earn credibility with other gang members. heck, they even run most prisons. its a win win situation for them. where is the deterrent in our politically correct society?

05FLHT
07-24-2011, 20:07
While some of you in larger metro areas may laugh at my concern, we have had more people shot this month than Detroit and Chicago combined! (15 vs. 9)


Any violence is too much, but I think your numbers for Chicago are too low. We average 15 people shot every weekend in the Summer. The number of actual shooting is exponentially more because there is a serious street war on both the West and Southside of the city. We even had a week recently with four police officers shot. The Chicago PD is about 2K officer short and it shows. This is the reason my family and I rarely, if ever, travel to the city.

Just1More
07-24-2011, 20:14
old school policing will help make a dent.

(pun intended)

The police are powerless because everything they say/do is recorded. Old Al Sharpton and Jessie Jackson sit by waiting for one of their boys to get roughed up so they can have a march. They're a drag on our country and sooner or later they're going to have to be thinned out.

Warp
07-24-2011, 20:20
You can bet nearly every house, and every other car, has a firearm of some type. This is The South after all.

IMO and IME gun ownership in most parts of "The South" is overrated and exaggerated...and most of those that have a gun don't have it readily accessible.

Sam Spade
07-24-2011, 20:27
You can bet nearly every house, and every other car, has a firearm of some type. This is The South after all.

Then it seems that there should be more dead perps.

Seriously, I wish you well, and hope your town takes the gloves off. But the tool is nothing without the will.

Angry Fist
07-24-2011, 20:38
Why not try a little vigilante justice? It's the 21st century... maybe the bastards won't see it coming. If anyone goes down hard for it, and the 'bangers aren't, then you have a real problem. It is The South. Can't you people figure out how to bring back the good ole boy network?

64ti
07-24-2011, 20:44
The police can not take out the gangs since a catch 22 and politics rule without gangs and violence no funding and they know where the drugs are and are afraid to be labeled racist if they arrest too much of minority commiting crimes. Too many NC departments run by democrats here. Fight fire with fire.

RyanBDawg
07-24-2011, 20:54
Two words, concentration camps..

Warp
07-24-2011, 20:58
The police can not take out the gangs since a catch 22 and politics rule without gangs and violence no funding

...no.

rahrah12
07-24-2011, 21:01
Couple of simple rules

-Do NOT wear all of one color
-no weird hand gestures
-hat worn straight forward or straight backwards

and if you hear someone say "f **k ni**a!" get the hell out of there because some stuff is about to go down...

michael e
07-24-2011, 21:02
Well you got two options. Watch your surrondings and be ready for anything at anytime. Or stay in your house and be a hermit. Get a gun, get a permit to carry , and practice and carry everywhere.

cowboywannabe
07-24-2011, 21:05
you can blame the mayors, city council, and police chiefs for not admitting they have a problem, not forming a plan to confront it, and basically sticking their heads in the sand.

bustedknee
07-24-2011, 21:05
The state police here have a way of handling such nonsense in short order.

They would post a sign that says, "Safety Zone --- All Fines Doubled!" :animlol:

rem2429
07-24-2011, 21:06
But when shots ring out while pumping gas (I use that station), what am I supposed to do? Hide under my bed?

As John Wayne said "It isn't being fast or accurate. It's being willing."

I suppose that applies to fighting with a gun or with your voice. Exercise your first two amendments.

OldScribe2009
07-24-2011, 21:23
Stay strapped. Stay alert. Carry extra magazines.

You can't dictate others' behavior, but you can decide how YOU will respond to their actions.

I lived in Little Rock during the height of the gang wars. If you watched the local news at night, it was just one shooting after the next, over and over and over.

The police finally received Federal funding which enabled them to create more effective Gang Task Forces. These police officers compiled a list of names and targeted specific gang members and went after them. It's the only thing they did. Pulaski County. North Little Rock. Little Rock. The police worked together and worked with the Prosecutor's Office to give the gang members real prison time when they got caught. In time, the violence decreased substantially but it never went away.

Your local police administration better get their heads out of their asses. These gangs can be incredibly organized (and ruthless). They'll start recruiting soon and then the problem will spread like cancer. The police are going to have to be more aggressive. If these gang bangers sense weakness (which I think they already have), it's like a shark smelling blood.

UtahIrishman
07-24-2011, 21:35
A few years ago I remember seeing that Salt Lake City had impported some policemen experienced with gangs from Los Angeles in hopes that they could help their officers address the growing gang problem.

The feds seen to be getting a llittle tougher on the gangs also so perhaps there's some light at the end of the tunnel.

Stay safe

I don't recall the specifics but yes they did. We still have our share of gang troubles here but it's not as bad as a lot of major metropolitan areas.

Calico Jack
07-24-2011, 21:42
The bloods and the Crips have started a war (http://www.witn.com/searchresults?searchKeywords=greenville+shooting&dateRange=60) in sleepy Greenville, NC.

When not shooting each other, they are now pulling daily armed robberies. In one case, they keep robbing the same Sonic drive-in (http://www.witn.com/searchresults?searchKeywords=sonic+robbery&dateRange=90) every few weeks.

While some of you in larger metro areas may laugh at my concern, we have had more people shot this month than Detroit and Chicago combined! (15 vs. 9)

The level of violence is unprecedented in this college town of 82,000 people! It really wasn't like this as recently as 2 years ago!

The police spend more time arresting drunk college kids and writing seatbelt tickets than confronting the gang-bangers.

The mayhem is not just limited to the "bad areas" of town. Just last night 4 people were shot (http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/NEW_INFO_4_People_Shot_In_Greenville.html?storySection=story) at a large convenience store in town -- the second time this summer at the same store.

While some of the comments posted on the news stories are very racistly macho and suggest forming vigilante groups, the police really seem powerless to do anything. Local church groups are holding "prayer meetings" about this.

Has anyone else lived in an area that was able to overcome this kind of explosion in violence? How did your people do it?

Finally, a GT member from Greenville. :wavey:

South Fla
07-24-2011, 21:45
That's because it's easy money to pick on college kids and speeders. It's all about the pension and six figure pay don't you know?

Did you work for my department? :dunno:

Calico Jack
07-24-2011, 21:52
That's because it's easy money to pick on college kids and speeders. It's all about the pension and six figure pay don't you know?

No six figure pay for officers down here boss.

AZson
07-24-2011, 21:54
Didn't you just finish posting a nasty and snide comment about NYC on another thread?


Good luck with your town:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Didn't you guys let gays marry? Good luck with your whole STATE.
:rofl::rofl::rofl:
I know where I'm not vacationing and all I can say is arm your self, criminals hate armed citizens.

Warp
07-24-2011, 21:55
Did you guys let gays marry?

Good for them!

brisk21
07-24-2011, 22:00
We should treat these "gangs" like domestic terrorists and use our military to destroy every one of them. Make them "open season" like feral pigs!!! Thats what it really is, domestic terrorism.

KommieforniaGlocker
07-24-2011, 22:05
What does it take to get a weapons permit in NYC or NYS? The average citizen is severely restricted from purchasing a handgun in the whole state, and legal carry by "average Joes" is essentially unheard of in NYC.

As others have mentioned, the police stop and frisk people, taking "pointy flashlights" away as "weapons". Use of stun guns or pepper spray can get you FELONY charges in New York.

Removing any form of self-defense from citizens isn't the answer, nor is armed bands of citizens rolling around dispensing vigilante justice.

:whistling:

These type of individuals needs to be reminded that the police and their enemies are not the only predators out there for them......An example being made of a couple and they will find a new town to set up shop in

Bigpoppie50
07-24-2011, 22:56
You can bet nearly every house, and every other car, has a firearm of some type. This is The South after all.

Rednecks driving around in pick-ups with armed posies of concerned citizens shooting at black males age 14-30 as alleged gang members won't help either.

I have a CCW permit, and don't go to areas where this type of trouble would be expected.

But when shots ring out while pumping gas (I use that station), what am I supposed to do? Hide under my bed?I use that station also and like you said this is the South and I do have a CCW and I do pack daily and I have been approached by panhandlers while pumping gas at that station. It's sad to see the decline in G'Vegas because I remember a time when it was not like this at all and it probably will not get any better any time soon.

GAFinch
07-24-2011, 23:15
We should treat these "gangs" like domestic terrorists and use our military to destroy every one of them. Make them "open season" like feral pigs!!! Thats what it really is, domestic terrorism.

You want to impose martial law on US soil to deal with some thugs? Do you have any sense of what all martial law entails? Most, if not all, of the Bill of Rights is suspended. As ordinary people start liking the increased sense of security, it can become very hard to reverse.

Gunnut 45/454
07-24-2011, 23:37
Yep if the cops will not nor can not protect the citizens its time for the people to do the job! Seeing that most big cities are broke -the Feds are broke! It will fall to the people to clean up the streets! Lock an load folks! I'm glad I got another 1200 rounds coming in the mail -might need them!:supergrin:

Electrikkoolaid
07-25-2011, 01:34
While I feel competent to protect myself if directly confronted, not everyone carries, or is willing to.

I can also be minding my own business when some thug decides to rob the Sonic again and catch a bullet by accident. So can my family, and if one of my kids was killed by a gang banger, I would probably loose it in a big way, and that wouldn't be pretty.

I can't imagine every kid working at Sonic or Sheetz needs to be packing a gun, even if they were allowed to do so by management.

My neighbor works at the big regional hospital in town, and is not even allowed to have a weapon in the car, much less on him in the hospital -- and he has to ride a shuttle bus to even GET to the employee parking lot a mile from the building.

As romantic as the whole "lock-n-load" daydreams may be for some keyboard commandos, it just replaces one band of predators with another.

However, it seems to be wildly spiraling out of control, and the local law enforcement seems unprepared (if not outright clueless) on how to handle this violence.

It really seems to have come out of nowhere though, almost like a biker gang rolled into Mayberry, and the Sheriff took away Barney's one bullet so no one gets hurt.

mrsurfboard
07-25-2011, 02:07
Two words, concentration camps..

John Carpenter had it right with "Escape from NY" Put them all in a walled city and let them prey on each other.

eracer
07-25-2011, 05:33
Somebody needs to organize rotating shifts at the Sonic Drive-In.

Just1More
07-25-2011, 05:41
John Carpenter had it right with "Escape from NY" Put them all in a walled city and let them prey on each other.

And make sure Obamas flightpaths fly right over it. He could be their leader....more than he already is.

happyguy
07-25-2011, 06:03
The bloods and the Crips have started a war (http://www.witn.com/searchresults?searchKeywords=greenville+shooting&dateRange=60) in sleepy Greenville, NC.

When not shooting each other, they are now pulling daily armed robberies. In one case, they keep robbing the same Sonic drive-in (http://www.witn.com/searchresults?searchKeywords=sonic+robbery&dateRange=90) every few weeks.

While some of you in larger metro areas may laugh at my concern, we have had more people shot this month than Detroit and Chicago combined! (15 vs. 9)

The level of violence is unprecedented in this college town of 82,000 people! It really wasn't like this as recently as 2 years ago!

The police spend more time arresting drunk college kids and writing seatbelt tickets than confronting the gang-bangers.

The mayhem is not just limited to the "bad areas" of town. Just last night 4 people were shot (http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/NEW_INFO_4_People_Shot_In_Greenville.html?storySection=story) at a large convenience store in town -- the second time this summer at the same store.

While some of the comments posted on the news stories are very racistly macho and suggest forming vigilante groups, the police really seem powerless to do anything. Local church groups are holding "prayer meetings" about this.

Has anyone else lived in an area that was able to overcome this kind of explosion in violence? How did your people do it?

Round them all up, take them to the gravel pit, and let them finish their little war. Put the survivors in prison for 20 to life.

If they are robbing stores in the same area it might be time to orchestrate an old fashioned police ambush like they used to do in LA and Detroit, before the libs took over.

Stay safe and keep in mind where all the exits are.

Regards,
Happyguy :)

reniram
07-25-2011, 07:23
I read the on-line local papers from many cities around the country. And to be perfectly honest, I have not read that NYC has the same problem you described. And yes, their citizens do not own guns like NC citizens. Not even close.

Seems to me what Seamac45 is posting is that what's good for the goose is good for the gander. If it bothers you the Bloods and the Crips are engaged in a shooting war where you're at, perhaps you should consider moving to NYC (or Boston or Philly or even Washington DC) until all that shooting dies down. Be a lot safer. :rofl:

You and other concerned local NC citizens do have guns, no? :whistling:

This post got me curious, so I googled "shootings in new york city". In the first 11 weeks of 2010 there were 293 shootings in NYC according to a NY Daily News article. 97 of those died. So it's not as if gun violence in unknown in NYC. And it's a safe bet that at least some of that is gang related. Not ragging on NYC, It's a great city, but their gun laws are very draconian for the average person, and this is a gun forum.

dreis454
07-25-2011, 07:50
Watch the "Deathwish" series....Then get to be friends with "Wildey:.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JS9BdSChngE

kirgi08
07-25-2011, 08:04
I live in Buncombe cty,that carp wouldn't fly here.'08.

Toorop
07-25-2011, 08:06
You didn't have more people shot then Chicago. Chicago had 5 shot just over the weekend.

Toorop
07-25-2011, 08:07
Oh and I thought CCW and open carry would have prevented this?

OldScribe2009
07-25-2011, 08:39
An old sheriff named Tommy Robinson in Pulaski County, Arkansas found a solution to a rash of store robberies.

He isolated the areas that were most prone to these armed robberies. At random, he chose stores that agreed to conceal a Pulaski County Deputy who was fully armed, including a bullet proof vest and a 12-gauge shotgun with 00 buckshot. He cycled these officers through stores, never revealing which ones contained an officer, or when they would be there. And he made sure the media heard about it, inviting reporters to write stories about his new strategy and put it on the news. The thugs were now playing Russian Roulette. If they tried to rob a convenience store with an LEO hiding in the office or stockroom...

Weeks later, the robberies all but stopped.

Gunnut 45/454
07-25-2011, 08:49
Toorop
It would but NC is not a very freindly firearms state! The large cities - run by very liberal mayors! So there you go! Yea they have CCW but it's not easy to get nor carry in NC! Lots of restrictions! As you can see there is way to much wiggle room for the Liberal mayors to restrict carry How they are rated a Gold Star OC state is beyond me with all these restrictions! :whistling:

North Carolina

Summary
North Carolina is a traditional open carry state. You MAY open carry in a motor vehicle. However, localities may regulate the carrying of firearms under certain circumstances.


Preemption Complete state preemption of firearms laws except localities may regulate the possession of firearms:
In public-owned buildings
On the grounds or parking areas of those buildings
In public parks or recreation areas
Additionally, under NC Code Chapter 14 � 160A.189, a city may by ordinance ... regulate the display of firearms on the streets, sidewalks, alleys, or other public property.

While the word "display" does not appear to be defined in the Code, some localities in NC have adopted, or are considering adopting ordinances like the city of Chapel Hill's which restrict the open carry of handguns.

This was challenged in State v. Fennell (1989) and the NC Court of Appeals upheld previous NC court decisions stating that the guarantee of an individual right to openly bear arms in the NC constitution was subject to reasonable regulation declaring that "a pistol shall not be under a certain length."

NOTE: Almost all states allow local regulation of the discharge of firearms

kirgi08
07-25-2011, 08:58
Toorop
It would but NC is not a very freindly firearms state! The large cities - run by very liberal mayors! So there you go! Yea they have CCW but it's not easy to get nor carry in NC! Lots of restrictions! As you can see there is way to much wiggle room for the Liberal mayors to restrict carry How they are rated a Gold Star OC state is beyond me with all these restrictions! :whistling:

North Carolina

Summary
North Carolina is a traditional open carry state. You MAY open carry in a motor vehicle. However, localities may regulate the carrying of firearms under certain circumstances.


Preemption Complete state preemption of firearms laws except localities may regulate the possession of firearms:
In public-owned buildings
On the grounds or parking areas of those buildings
In public parks or recreation areas
Additionally, under NC Code Chapter 14 � 160A.189, a city may by ordinance ... regulate the display of firearms on the streets, sidewalks, alleys, or other public property.

While the word "display" does not appear to be defined in the Code, some localities in NC have adopted, or are considering adopting ordinances like the city of Chapel Hill's which restrict the open carry of handguns.

This was challenged in State v. Fennell (1989) and the NC Court of Appeals upheld previous NC court decisions stating that the guarantee of an individual right to openly bear arms in the NC constitution was subject to reasonable regulation declaring that "a pistol shall not be under a certain length."

NOTE: Almost all states allow local regulation of the discharge of firearms

I live in a county that the county seat is full blown liberal,however most of the LEO tend ta ignore open carry.GATTTOTP has been tried here and failed.That's in A towns city limits,out in Buncombe county most/95% of the deputies don't really care if someone carries open.'08.

Bren
07-25-2011, 09:02
That's because it's easy money to pick on college kids and speeders. It's all about the pension and six figure pay don't you know?

And if the police actually go deal with the problem like we did 20-30 years ago, your next post would be about police brutality and jack-booted thugs.

Why do criminals take control? Because there are plenty of "good" citizens like you, who want the police to do nothing, not get paid for it, but prevent all crime. Good luck.

happyguy
07-25-2011, 10:43
An old sheriff named Tommy Robinson in Pulaski County, Arkansas found a solution to a rash of store robberies.

He isolated the areas that were most prone to these armed robberies. At random, he chose stores that agreed to conceal a Pulaski County Deputy who was fully armed, including a bullet proof vest and a 12-gauge shotgun with 00 buckshot. He cycled these officers through stores, never revealing which ones contained an officer, or when they would be there. And he made sure the media heard about it, inviting reporters to write stories about his new strategy and put it on the news. The thugs were now playing Russian Roulette. If they tried to rob a convenience store with an LEO hiding in the office or stockroom...

Weeks later, the robberies all but stopped.

L.A. and Detroit both had anti-robbery details back in the '60s and '70s that did the same thing. Jim Cirillo was infamous for his work on the NYC stakeout squad.

Unfortunately it is no longer fashionable to kill criminals and deprive us of the opportunity to provide them with tens of thousands of dollars in care, education, and entertainment.

Regards,
Happyguy :)

RetailNinjitsu
07-25-2011, 10:48
That's because it's easy money to pick on college kids and speeders. It's all about the pension and six figure pay don't you know?

Or its about 3/4 of cops being too scared and too naive to target real criminals. It is far easier and less scary to write a soccer mom a speeding ticket, or arrest a 19 year old girl for being drunk.

PawDog
07-25-2011, 10:55
Greenville obviously has a Democratic majority on their city council, and are choosing to ignore the gang issues due to the racial aspect, and have probably informed the police chief to be somewhat hands off in handling the growing crimes.

Gangs prey on communities and people who they've found will tolerate their criminal behavior, and word travels fast in the criminal underground of where they can victimize the easiest areas, where local police and city administrators turn a blind eye to the crimes. This problem didn't just "pop" up, and has no doubt been brewing for a couple of years, having now come to a head.

If such were occurring in my community, I'd find out when the city council meetings are scheduled and, with as many concerned friends,family, and local media, attend and directly ask the mayor and council what their contingency plans are to combat the growing gang violence problem.

Ignoring it, and not holding the police and city administrators accountable will only add to the problem, and you can expect more gang activity as word spreads your city is easy prey.

Rev. ChadW
07-25-2011, 11:05
You can bet nearly every house, and every other car, has a firearm of some type. This is The South after all.

Rednecks driving around in pick-ups with armed posies of concerned citizens


You are right in the South, we have guns everywhere and we know how to use them. Perhaps if we had more personal involvement of the public in active pursuit of criminals, that just might weed out of some of the bad apples we see in police work. The type that have a us vs. them mindset. And a posse sounds just like the answer to gangs.

Markasaurus
07-25-2011, 11:06
Give 'em more ammo until they kill each other off. End of problem.

dosei
07-25-2011, 11:55
While I feel competent to protect myself if directly confronted, not everyone carries, or is willing to.

I can't imagine every kid working at Sonic or Sheetz needs to be packing a gun, even if they were allowed to do so by management.

As romantic as the whole "lock-n-load" daydreams may be for some keyboard commandos, it just replaces one band of predators with another.

Seems to me that you've posted in the wrong forum. You are completely convinced that armed responsible citizens cannot possibly help. Take you concerns and post them in the Cop Talk forum, asking for their advise on methods and strategies that have proven highly successful elsewhere. Then begin hounding your city's leadership to put such strategies into effect.

Here's a thought...Sonic can offer 1/2 price off everything to anyone with a Blackwater I.D., and unllimited free cheezy tots & Route 44s to Blackwater parties of 4 or more.
:supergrin:

smokeross
07-25-2011, 12:13
Print up Reward Posters and offer a sizable Bounty on them. Only requirement is that they 'look like a gangbanger'.

Sharky7
07-25-2011, 12:41
You are WAY off with Chicago shooting numbers. Maybe 15 injured in the last 48 hours....I've been to about a half dozen shots fired calls in last week...heat wave up here, lots of violence.

4 dead, 13 wounded just on Saturday night in city limits...not even counting all the collar suburbs.

mikegun
07-25-2011, 13:33
this can be a real problem in a college town, as the police in general do not seem to be as aggressive as in a non univ town, as i see it nyou can have a double problem...good luck

jakebrake
07-25-2011, 13:48
i think a lot of the "gang" related problem has been brewing for years. youth have had it drilled into their heads, that they will never have an even shake. after hearing it day in, day out in every media imaginable, they will believe it. a gang may seem like the only way out. maybe it became join or get seriously messed up.

this will only perpetuate until there are none left. they will kill each other, get locked up, or killed by the police or armed citizens.

i hope your community gets through this. this is a problem with no easy answer...if any at all.

Misty02
07-25-2011, 14:19
Or its about 3/4 of cops being too scared and too naive to target real criminals. It is far easier and less scary to write a soccer mom a speeding ticket, or arrest a 19 year old girl for being drunk.

The good ones would get suspended, sued (personally) or sent to a desk for months during investigation for the slightest offense if they were to do much else.

.

hk45c
07-25-2011, 14:26
you can thank the demoncraps for every bit of it... historically the dems have been in the pockets of the gangsters and cater to them for the $$$...(NY & SF esp) i'm certain that as long as there is a live demoncrap, there will be criminal working with it...

cgaler
07-25-2011, 14:26
Shoot, Shovel, Shut-up

NOLA_glock
07-25-2011, 14:43
:rofl: @ only 9 people being shot in Chicago AND Detroit in a whole month.

Those numbers sound waaaaaaay off. We have more than three times that many people who die from their gunshot wounds in a month, let alone those who are shot but not killed. Detroit and Chicago have a combined population of around 3.5 million people, while we are <350k. This is just speculation, but I'm thinking those shooting numbers may need a second look.

1canvas
07-25-2011, 14:50
Or its about 3/4 of cops being too scared and too naive to target real criminals. It is far easier and less scary to write a soccer mom a speeding ticket, or arrest a 19 year old girl for being drunk.

its not the cop on the street. its the fact that there is no political will from the polititions or the voters that vote them in. if the majority of the public demanded something to be done it would.
as far as the comment that 3/4 of the cops are to scared or naive, well thats just wrong:steamed:.

OldScribe2009
07-25-2011, 15:11
L.A. and Detroit both had anti-robbery details back in the '60s and '70s that did the same thing. Jim Cirillo was infamous for his work on the NYC stakeout squad.

Unfortunately it is no longer fashionable to kill criminals and deprive us of the opportunity to provide them with tens of thousands of dollars in care, education, and entertainment.

Regards,
Happyguy :)

Unbelievable.

I think "dead" is the only appropriate condition for these kinds of criminals. They're not going to "drop out" of the gang and change their ways. If they go to prison, it only offers additional training on our dollar.

Misty02
07-25-2011, 16:37
:rofl: @ only 9 people being shot in Chicago AND Detroit in a whole month.

Those numbers sound waaaaaaay off. We have more than three times that many people who die from their gunshot wounds in a month, let alone those who are shot but not killed. Detroit and Chicago have a combined population of around 3.5 million people, while we are <350k. This is just speculation, but I'm thinking those shooting numbers may need a second look.

We have a few more than those here on a single weekend. :(

.

Misty02
07-25-2011, 16:44
its not the cop on the street. its the fact that there is no political will from the polititions or the voters that vote them in. if the majority of the public demanded something to be done it would.
as far as the comment that 3/4 of the cops are to scared or naive, well thats just wrong:steamed:.

I wouldn’t totally disagree. They are scared of what would fall upon them should they do what they believe is the right thing to do. They don’t have the backing from their superiors nor ours.

.

BailRecoveryAgent
07-25-2011, 17:10
You are WAY off with Chicago shooting numbers. Maybe 15 injured in the last 48 hours....I've been to about a half dozen shots fired calls in last week...heat wave up here, lots of violence.

4 dead, 13 wounded just on Saturday night in city limits...not even counting all the collar suburbs.

I'm calling bs. Everyone knows in cities and states that don't allow civilian carry, that there is no violent crime committed with guns.











































:whistling:

Duck of Death
07-25-2011, 17:23
*QUOTE*
Lol at the prayer groups.

Nothing wrong w/prayer groups as long as they're all armed.

RetailNinjitsu
07-25-2011, 18:28
its not the cop on the street. its the fact that there is no political will from the polititions or the voters that vote them in. if the majority of the public demanded something to be done it would.
as far as the comment that 3/4 of the cops are to scared or naive, well thats just wrong:steamed:.

That was not a jab...it was my educated opinion. I work in LE in a very proactive assignment. I am often troubled by the lack of TRUE police work going on. Too many guys (and gals) are content being thugs for the Dept. of Motor Vehicles or arresting 17 year old kids with a dime-bag in their pocket...

I get frustrated with other LE when I deal with scummy people with drugs in their pocket, stolen property laying on their back seat, and passengers with felony warrants...then I find the traffic ticket they were issued by another "cop" 20 minutes earlier.

The true trouble makers are older, more dangerous, more difficult to deal with, and generally aren't found behind the wheel of speeding mini vans. Therefore (at least in my area) they are rarely contacted by the police. Instead, your hard working Joe watches the scum bag drive by as he is being written a ticket for 12 over the speed limit. :upeyes:

I did not mean to offend anyone. I just often get frustrated with my peers. I don't know what else would cause this other than fear/lack of recognition. We have all been trained the same and given the same authority. However, the majority fail to make any dent in true criminal behavior.

Electrikkoolaid
07-25-2011, 19:00
I get frustrated with other LE when I deal with scummy people with drugs in their pocket, stolen property laying on their back seat, and passengers with felony warrants...then I find the traffic ticket they were issued by another "cop" 20 minutes earlier.

The Greenville police did a recent "Gang Sweep (http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/Greenville_Gang_Suppression_Plan_Nabs_33_Arrests_125797763.html?storySection=story)" after 7 people were shot in 9 days.

33 people were arrested.
15 of those were on outstanding warrants.

When the TV station checked the jail logs the next day, only 13 were still behind bars.

Once captured, the offenders seem to use the drive-thru lane and return to the streets ASAP.

There are supposed to be over 3,000 outstanding arrest warrants, but no one seems to care. Busting underage keg parties (and laying felony charges on the college kids who hosted it) is the priority here.

1canvas
07-25-2011, 19:40
That was not a jab...it was my educated opinion. I work in LE in a very proactive assignment. I am often troubled by the lack of TRUE police work going on. Too many guys (and gals) are content being thugs for the Dept. of Motor Vehicles or arresting 17 year old kids with a dime-bag in their pocket...

I get frustrated with other LE when I deal with scummy people with drugs in their pocket, stolen property laying on their back seat, and passengers with felony warrants...then I find the traffic ticket they were issued by another "cop" 20 minutes earlier.

The true trouble makers are older, more dangerous, more difficult to deal with, and generally aren't found behind the wheel of speeding mini vans. Therefore (at least in my area) they are rarely contacted by the police. Instead, your hard working Joe watches the scum bag drive by as he is being written a ticket for 12 over the speed limit. :upeyes:

I did not mean to offend anyone. I just often get frustrated with my peers. I don't know what else would cause this other than fear/lack of recognition. We have all been trained the same and given the same authority. However, the majority fail to make any dent in true criminal behavior.

many in my family are LE and i have grown up hearing there frustrations as both the public, their superiors, and even fellow officers has become their adversaries. i have heard what you are saying from them also and it is probably gotten worse as new officers tow the line for their liberal supervisors.

James Dean
07-25-2011, 21:27
I'd move

Calico Jack
07-25-2011, 23:36
***UPDATE***

http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/GPD_Arrest_32_More_In_Gang_Suppression_Operation__126154528.html

Misty02
07-26-2011, 04:46
***UPDATE***

http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/GPD_Arrest_32_More_In_Gang_Suppression_Operation__126154528.html

That is good! The question now is, how long before they are back in the street?

.

quichedem
07-26-2011, 08:07
...This sounds like where I live...
It's a shame these animals can't kill each other faster than they reproduce. A damn shame.

windplex
07-26-2011, 10:22
some cities found when they enforced the little offenses they picked up the big fish on outstanding warrants.

in Milwaukee when we have gang or flash mobs or other bad behavior the cops and or sheriffs hit the streets en-mass. the sheriff calls it occupying the parks or whatever is the problem area. i frequent one of the parks and can attest to his occupations and that they make a huge difference. they bring a buss so they detain each arrested person in the bus and don't waste manpower running individuals back and forth to the station.

we are by no means crime and murder free. however it does keep areas safe and gets areas safe in a hurry. when they are occupying an area they write citations for bad behavior of all kinds, including driving. from there run wants and warrants.

OldScribe2009
07-26-2011, 11:20
***UPDATE***

http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/GPD_Arrest_32_More_In_Gang_Suppression_Operation__126154528.html

Did you read the names and what these people were arrested for?

Great group of people. I hope the judge gives them probation and drug court so they can quickly be reintegrated into society to live productive lives. :rofl:

BuckeyePPC
07-27-2011, 10:29
[QUOTE=Electrikkoolaid;17677474]Rednecks driving around in pick-ups with armed posies ....
QUOTE]

I know this is a serious problem but I read this and started giggling thinking of armed posies.

I know Sheriff Joe keeps talking about putting together an armed POSSE for one reason or another. He usually gets sued for even thinking about it.

windplex
07-27-2011, 10:31
from the charges it appears they are getting pulled over or stopped for minor things and then find drugs or wants and warrants.

broken windows still seems to work to a certain degree.

slama683
07-27-2011, 11:25
from the charges it appears they are getting pulled over or stopped for minor things and then find drugs or wants and warrants.

broken windows still seems to work to a certain degree.

Cue Revs. Sharpton and Jackson crying profiling and racism.

tarheeltrav
07-27-2011, 11:54
Unfortunately it is no longer fashionable to kill criminals and deprive us of the opportunity to provide them with tens of thousands of dollars in care, education, and entertainment.

Regards,
Happyguy :)

Truth. The prison system is a private, FOR-PROFIT organization (money is made for each criminal housed). How could they make money if the criminals are being killed before they make it to prison? We all know that it costs more to keep a man in prison than it does to educate one. Seems like a revolving door...we are prohibited from "'vigilante justice", so that the criminals can get a trial (not that that's the ONLY reason, ijs), go to jail (or in many cases, get a slap on the wrist/probation, only to violate again in a worse case), etc. IMO, if we had more people to stand up and fight back against these criminals that prey on the weak, then I think many of them would think twice about who they attack. There may be a spike in violence for a short amount of time, due to more people fighting back, idk, but i'd rather see a short span of increased violence than a long, chronic problem. It's like a bully...the bully keeps bullying until someone stands up...

Me? I'd rather die on my feet than live on my knees...idk about everyone else.

Warp
07-27-2011, 12:01
Truth. The prison system is a private, FOR-PROFIT organization (money is made for each criminal housed). How could they make money if the criminals are being killed before they make it to prison? We all know that it costs more to keep a man in prison than it does to educate one. Seems like a revolving door...we are prohibited from "'vigilante justice", so that the criminals can get a trial (not that that's the ONLY reason, ijs), go to jail (or in many cases, get a slap on the wrist/probation, only to violate again in a worse case), etc. IMO, if we had more people to stand up and fight back against these criminals that prey on the weak, then I think many of them would think twice about who they attack. There may be a spike in violence for a short amount of time, due to more people fighting back, idk, but i'd rather see a short span of increased violence than a long, chronic problem. It's like a bully...the bully keeps bullying until someone stands up...

Me? I'd rather die on my feet than live on my knees...idk about everyone else.

Do not confuse self defense with "vigilante justice".

Bren
07-27-2011, 12:07
Truth. The prison system is a private, FOR-PROFIT organization (money is made for each criminal housed). How could they make money if the criminals are being killed before they make it to prison?

You really have no clue how that works, huh?

tarheeltrav
07-27-2011, 12:18
Do not confuse self defense with "vigilante justice".

Sorry, not confused at all. I'm just saying, in my own opinion, that sometimes it's better to be proactive, and approach things head on, as opposed to waiting for something to happen and then acting. I will admit that I could be wrong in my approach, and that not everyone thinks as I do. If a criminal were to hurt my son, it would be past the point of self-defense, and moving towards vigilante justice, IF AND ONLY IF, I chose to pursue that route. Not saying I would. I'm just saying.

windplex
07-27-2011, 12:18
Cue Revs. Sharpton and Jackson crying profiling and racism.

difficult if you are pulling over every speeder; every car with broken taillights; every car with expired tags. arresting all who disrupts the peace. everyone who jumps the subway turnstiles (nyc example); everyone who won't pay for a bus ride. everyone who grafitees...everyone.

tarheeltrav
07-27-2011, 12:30
You really have no clue how that works, huh?

Maybe I don't. I could be wrong. Could you explain it to me, show me where I'm going off?

My thoughts are that prisons are privately owned--NOT by the government. Those owners are paid to keep the prison running--by us, as taxpayers. How do they get paid? By each inmate. For every inmate that is housed, the owner gets a certain amount of money to keep them there. A person can even invest in prison stock...

If I'm going off, please correct me. All I know is what I've researched myself.

Warp
07-27-2011, 13:47
Sorry, not confused at all. I'm just saying, in my own opinion, that sometimes it's better to be proactive, and approach things head on, as opposed to waiting for something to happen and then acting. I will admit that I could be wrong in my approach, and that not everyone thinks as I do.

But...

If a criminal were to hurt my son, it would be past the point of self-defense, and moving towards vigilante justice, IF AND ONLY IF, I chose to pursue that route. Not saying I would. I'm just saying.

...this is not being proactive. That is waiting for something to happen and then (re)acting

tarheeltrav
07-27-2011, 14:43
But...



...this is not being proactive. That is waiting for something to happen and then (re)acting

You're right, in a way. I really don't know if there is a right or wrong answer, I'm just looking at it different, I guess. What I'm saying in regards to being proactive and "vigilante justice" is instead of waiting for the system to kick in, taking it into one's own hands. Again, not that I would or would not go that route, just saying. I can defend myself 24/7, but to expect for a young child or person otherwise unable to fend for themselves to stand up to gang members or other criminals is a stretch, IMO.

Let me give an example. This is all hypothetical, I'm not trying to start an argument or anything like that. Just asking you to think about it...A person carries 24/7 for the purpose of self defense/family defense or whatever the reason may be. At some point when you weren't around, some criminal decides to harm your child, niece, nephew, etc. For this example, let's say major physical harm or sexual abuse. You weren't there to protect them. Therefore, it is past the point of self defense. It already happened. Whatever you did to be proactive up until that point doesn't matter. That protector then has a choice...let the law handle it, or do it yourself. I have nothing to do with individual choices, all I was saying is that person has a choice to either be passive and let the system take care of it (when that perp could easily be out sooner than later, the way things are now) or be proactive, which could mean many different things. "Vigilante Justice", could, in turn, lead one to becoming a criminal. But the point I was trying to make in my original post is that, if "vigilante justice" was more common, I think that criminals would think twice about preying on the weak.

In terms of the crime itself, I would like to think that most people are proactive in terms of the safety of their loved ones. Sometimes, it's just not enough. And we all know, even LEOs, can't be there all the time. I didn't intend to step on toes, so to speak. @Warp, I completely understand where you are coming from, and I respect your comment. Thanks for not being sarcastic or condescending about it!

windplex
07-27-2011, 15:09
in Milwaukee over the july 3 weekend we had flash mobs that 1) robbed a convenience store and then 2) attacked random people at a park watching fireworks.

then at a music festival another group pulled people from the crowd randomly and beat them up.

cops and sheriffs reacted by occupying the music festival -- i was there the night before the attacks and the night after went from zero cops (that i saw) to high thirties -- everywhere plus huge security guys everywhere.

sheriff "occupied" the city park i exercise in. again the day before they were there but laid back. the day after the attacks they were pulling over every car that did anything wrong they were everywhere and in every form - car; walking; motorcycle; horse patrol -- its a miles long park that buts against the music grounds. not the first time he has "occupied" the lakefront park -- his term.

the cops set up foot patrols in the part of mwk where the flash mob attacked as well as cars.
so far no more flash mobs. no additional random beatings.

year or two ago we had a shooting - many bullets let loose at the 4th at a park with families around. gangbangers and woman jealousy stuff. i dont go to that park but i suspect it was occupied afterward. seems to have simmered down since.

Warp
07-27-2011, 15:39
"Vigilante Justice", could, in turn, lead one to becoming a criminal.

By it's very definition "vigilante justice" requires criminal behavior. There is no maybe or could about it.

Bren
07-27-2011, 15:46
Maybe I don't. I could be wrong. Could you explain it to me, show me where I'm going off?

My thoughts are that prisons are privately owned--NOT by the government. Those owners are paid to keep the prison running--by us, as taxpayers. How do they get paid? By each inmate. For every inmate that is housed, the owner gets a certain amount of money to keep them there. A person can even invest in prison stock...

If I'm going off, please correct me. All I know is what I've researched myself.

Well, to start with, prisons are government, not privately owned. Here is the web site for your state department of corrections: http://www.doc.state.nc.us/

To make it even better, your state doesn't even have private prisons for the state to contract with; they only appear to have a handful of private drug treatment facilities. So that makes NC one of the least privatized states.

How did you even come to think prisons were privately owned?

Second (or third) they have a set budget, like any state agency. They don't get "per inmate" pay, they make due for the year or 2-years with a set budget, no matter how many inmates they get. They have to make the cuts to employees, rehab programs, equipment, etc.

Then, if they are anything like KY, they also have to pay out money to local jails for holding some state prisoners.

pugman
07-27-2011, 15:59
The problem with gangs is simple...they will go farther than you.

Put one in jail...they will shoot your friend.

MS13 is notorious for very, very violent and bloody action against anyone who touches one of their own. Wasn't is several years ago they cut the hands or feet off some cop's kid?

dosei
07-27-2011, 16:01
Maybe I don't. I could be wrong. Could you explain it to me, show me where I'm going off?

My thoughts are that prisons are privately owned--NOT by the government. Those owners are paid to keep the prison running--by us, as taxpayers. How do they get paid? By each inmate. For every inmate that is housed, the owner gets a certain amount of money to keep them there. A person can even invest in prison stock...

If I'm going off, please correct me. All I know is what I've researched myself.

Your research is, at best, outdated. I suspect your "research" consists of talking with people who don't know anything and are convinced they know everything. NC has only ever had 2 privately owned prisons, Pamlico Correctional Institution in Bayboro and Mountain View Correctional Institution in Spruce Pine. Both facilities were opened by Corrections Corporation of America in 1998. In 2000, the North Carolina Department of Correction assumed control of both.

http://www.doc.state.nc.us/admin/page1.htm

Got a link for the "data" you used in your "research"?

windplex
07-27-2011, 16:42
The problem with gangs is simple...they will go farther than you.

Put one in jail...they will shoot your friend.

MS13 is notorious for very, very violent and bloody action against anyone who touches one of their own. Wasn't is several years ago they cut the hands or feet off some cop's kid?

pug, you're right criminals in general will go farther than we law abiding folks. ms13 is at an extreme end of behavior as are some other groups. still gotta find a means to combat them -- im sure you agree.

i remember when the Colombians came to the nyc area. they scared the mafia. the mafia would not go after your family or each other's family. the Colombians would. in one case they killed the kids while the parents (father was the target) were out and the baby sitter. no freakin rules.

so what does ms13 do if one is arrested on warrants?

g29andy
07-27-2011, 19:05
Thuggery and murders have long been a problem in neighboring Kinston, my hometown. Most of it was centered in east K-town, unless things have changed recently.

Angry Fist
07-28-2011, 10:43
Sorry, not confused at all. I'm just saying, in my own opinion, that sometimes it's better to be proactive, and approach things head on, as opposed to waiting for something to happen and then acting. I will admit that I could be wrong in my approach, and that not everyone thinks as I do. If a criminal were to hurt my son, it would be past the point of self-defense, and moving towards vigilante justice, IF AND ONLY IF, I chose to pursue that route. Not saying I would. I'm just saying.
Well, I'm sayin'. If some mope hurts one of my kids, they are dead.

John Rambo
07-28-2011, 10:46
The Greenville police did a recent "Gang Sweep (http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/Greenville_Gang_Suppression_Plan_Nabs_33_Arrests_125797763.html?storySection=story)" after 7 people were shot in 9 days.

33 people were arrested.
15 of those were on outstanding warrants.

When the TV station checked the jail logs the next day, only 13 were still behind bars.

Once captured, the offenders seem to use the drive-thru lane and return to the streets ASAP.

There are supposed to be over 3,000 outstanding arrest warrants, but no one seems to care. Busting underage keg parties (and laying felony charges on the college kids who hosted it) is the priority here.

Follow the money, as always.

LApm9
07-29-2011, 21:17
That was not a jab...it was my educated opinion. I work in LE in a very proactive assignment. I am often troubled by the lack of TRUE police work going on. Too many guys (and gals) are content being thugs for the Dept. of Motor Vehicles or arresting 17 year old kids with a dime-bag in their pocket...

I get frustrated with other LE when I deal with scummy people with drugs in their pocket, stolen property laying on their back seat, and passengers with felony warrants...then I find the traffic ticket they were issued by another "cop" 20 minutes earlier.

The true trouble makers are older, more dangerous, more difficult to deal with, and generally aren't found behind the wheel of speeding mini vans. Therefore (at least in my area) they are rarely contacted by the police. Instead, your hard working Joe watches the scum bag drive by as he is being written a ticket for 12 over the speed limit. :upeyes:

I did not mean to offend anyone. I just often get frustrated with my peers. I don't know what else would cause this other than fear/lack of recognition. We have all been trained the same and given the same authority. However, the majority fail to make any dent in true criminal behavior.

We citizens appreciate your work!