Russian Izhmash Molot Making Ar15s [Archive] - Glock Talk

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humanguerrilla
10-21-2011, 06:57
Had read about Russian interest in the AR. Now they are making an M4gery.

Pretty soon they will have the chart.

http://therightofthepeople.org/izhmash-subsidiary-molot-to-manufacturer-russian-ar-15-rifle.html

M&P15T
10-21-2011, 07:11
The Chart must absolutely not fall into the hands of the Russians. It's information is too powerful. It must be hidden from prying eyes, and secreted away in an ancient building carved into the stone face of a canyon. To enter this catacomb, one must find faith and cross an imaginary bridge. There we all must take turns guarding it for eternity.

:rofl::rofl:

ghostman1960
10-21-2011, 08:45
As someone who lived almost his entire life during the cold war and being an avowed anti communist this just makes my head spin. First the Chicoms and now the Russians are making ARs.

american lockpicker
10-21-2011, 08:47
I want a Swiss AR.

ghostman1960
10-21-2011, 08:57
I want a Swiss AR.

Believe it or not the the components for the Swiss AR are made in Spain and just assembled in Switzerland.

Javelin
10-21-2011, 09:01
I am not really sure what to think.

MrMurphy
10-21-2011, 10:36
China has made M16 clones for at least 15-20 years and sold them many places in the world (i've seen pics of them in the hands of Fatah members).

Nothing new.

mvician
10-21-2011, 11:08
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f240/mvician/m4chartbutthurt-1.jpg

TedG
10-21-2011, 12:28
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f240/mvician/m4chartbutthurt-1.jpg

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

american lockpicker
10-21-2011, 13:10
Believe it or not the the components for the Swiss AR are made in Spain and just assembled in Switzerland.

I heard it was Vietnam.

China has made M16 clones for at least 15-20 years and sold them many places in the world (i've seen pics of them in the hands of Fatah members).

Nothing new.

In North America they can be found in the hands of Canadian gun owners.

KalashniKEV
10-21-2011, 13:54
The receiver says VEPR-15.

KalashniKEV
10-21-2011, 13:56
The Chart must absolutely not fall into the hands of the Russians. It's information is too powerful.

It's OK to share with our allies though, right?

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r220/Kalashnikev/chartiraqhcopy.jpg

M&P15T
10-21-2011, 15:01
It's OK to share with our allies though, right?

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r220/Kalashnikev/chartiraqhcopy.jpg

If I owned and knew how to use photochop!!:rofl::rofl:

The Chart, it must be protected.

Do you suppose the guy at The Chart with the pointy thing is telling the others "But choose wisely, for while the true Chart will bring you life, the false Chart will take it from you."?

KalashniKEV
10-21-2011, 16:36
Do you suppose the guy at The Chart with the pointy thing is telling the others...

That's me... or if you subscribe to Jethro's theory from the JROTC thread, it's a fragment of my personality or whatever.

fnfalman
10-21-2011, 17:05
Even Russians must make a buck.

WayaX
10-21-2011, 21:49
The question is...will the Russian AR-15 be stamped or milled? Will it be shipped to the US in a sporting configuration with all the holes in the wrong places?

Alaskapopo
10-21-2011, 21:53
Even Russians must make a buck.

Well its official the Russians have finally admitted the AR is superior to their AK.
:supergrin::supergrin:

Glockdude1
10-21-2011, 21:57
5.45x39 or a new caliber maybe?

:cool:

fnfalman
10-21-2011, 21:59
Well its official the Russians have finally admitted the AR is superior to their AK.
:supergrin::supergrin:

When it comes to sales for the tactical American market, yes.

panzer1
10-21-2011, 23:33
Well its official the Russians have finally admitted the AR is superior to their AK.
:supergrin::supergrin: Drunk maybe?

Novocaine
10-22-2011, 05:55
Itís assembled from the German components (Schmeisser) around Molotís own cold forged barrel. The price supposed to be around $2K in Russia. For comparison Norinco goes for around $1.5K and quality US made ARs on average fetch $4K, about the same as SIG or HK. Importation process is not exactly user-friendly, AR is still an exotic beast in Russia. At this point you will sell every single one you can import/ built. Ukraine is trying to build ARs too. All flavors, even .308.

PS Molot has nothing to do with Izhmash, different factories in different towns.

humanguerrilla
10-23-2011, 08:39
PS Molot has nothing to do with Izhmash, different factories in different towns.

Besides technically owning and operating them.

humanguerrilla
10-23-2011, 08:53
.......

DAIadvisor
10-23-2011, 10:29
Probably better built then most ARs on the market and will sell for 400 bucks. :D

Also the name is VEPR-15, and "Made in Russia" it's right on the mag well.

Novocaine
10-23-2011, 15:30
Besides technically owning and operating them.

Right. Well, technically the other way around. But the name Izhmash is commonly associated with a certain factory that is most famous for AK production. Not with a joint stock entity with the same word in its name that is a part of ginormous state corporation along with hundreds of other companies. To say ďIzhmash Molot ARĒ is to give an impression that iconic AK producer has anything to do with building ARs which it does not. Thought Iíd clarify that.

Novocaine
10-23-2011, 15:48
Probably better built then most ARs on the market and will sell for 400 bucks. :D
Why sell for $400 in U.S. when you can sell every last one in Russia for $2000? They are planning on a pilot run of 100 units late this year, perhaps yearly next year and have little idea of whatís beyond. It will be very long time (if ever) before this rifle hits these shores and if it does I doubt that the pricing will be appealing. Especially by the time it will have the mandatory U.S. parts installed.

But importing Molot AR barrels might be an interesting option. I understand they also plan on Grendel and 7.62X39 versions.

cciman
10-23-2011, 16:25
Economics are Global

If profits were not to be made, this would not happen. This further dilutes out the AR branding - adds another label, infinitely more internet threads. Great for the consumer.

Chinese, Korean companies should jump in next.

raven11
10-23-2011, 18:06
Economics are Global

If profits were not to be made, this would not happen. This further dilutes out the AR branding - adds another label, infinitely more internet threads. Great for the consumer.

Chinese, Korean companies should jump in next.

The Chinese already make a AR copy since the 1980's called the Norinco CQ 311-1 sold in Canada , Iran, China itself , etc

I would be surprised if the Koreans would make their own as Daewoo makes a rifle for their military that while different from a AR uses AR magazines - it would be strictly for export in a already crowded market

humanguerrilla
10-23-2011, 23:19
Right. Well, technically the other way around. But the name Izhmash is commonly associated with a certain factory that is most famous for AK production. Not with a joint stock entity with the same word in its name that is a part of ginormous state corporation along with hundreds of other companies. To say “Izhmash Molot AR” is to give an impression that iconic AK producer has anything to do with building ARs which it does not. Thought I’d clarify that.

Understand now. I didn't realize this, thinking Izhmash was just Izhmash. Izhmash Molot after Izhmash acquired Molot after enforcing their patents, but not necessarily the historic Izhmash factory. Was confused because of Kalashnikov and the same logo.

Novocaine
10-24-2011, 00:54
thinking Izhmash was just Izhmash. You wish :) The AK-producing factory is not called Izhmash anymore, yet there are at least half a dozen entities with Izhmash in their names.

Molot is not a factory either itís an OJSC with its own stock index. This joint stock company operates a factory called Vyatskie Polyany Machine-Building Plant where Veprs-15 are built and were PPShs were built during the war.

One easy thing to remember they ALL are owned by Rostehnologii, a state-owned corporation that does everything from oil production to insurance sales. Rostehnologii owns almost every Russian firearms and ammo brand.

american lockpicker
10-24-2011, 11:14
Chinese, Korean companies should jump in next.

Norinco makes an M4gery and the Koreans make drums and HK style mags...

Glockdude1
10-24-2011, 11:37
Norinco makes an M4gery and the Koreans make drums and HK style mags...

Can you imagine a Polytech M4 rifle???

:supergrin:

Decguns
10-27-2011, 14:34
Every Com-Bloc soldier I ever met in Iraq & Afghanistan would give their left nut to ditch their AK for an AR. Whether it was the gadgets or the fact we were routinely making head shots at 400+ meters, they loved the AR. With the former Com-Bloc joining NATO and buying up every M4 Colt can manufacture, it makes perfect sense for Russia to get into supplying NATO rifles to their former subjects.

After all, the Russians were quick to offer Saiga's in .223 and 308. I even have a Romanian PSL in 308 WIN. Isn't capitalism grand?

Novocaine
10-27-2011, 16:10
What Com-Block country is buying Colts? I know of Georgia procuring few Bushmasters (and those Bushmasters got dumped in a hurry when the Russian incursion started) but who else?

I seriously doubt these countries can afford M16. I mean if it’s something like Lithuania with a standing army of 3 men and 2 in reserve where the whole army can be equipped for hundred bucks sure, why not. But what ex-Soviet nation with a real army is buying up M4s?

Russia is not going to export these things. It’s a novelty, destined for internal market which is VAST. They don’t really build these things, just slap together German kits. People are so hungry to see anything other than Saiga they will buy a turd if it looks like a rifle. And BTW an average Saiga that is sold in Russia is a completely different animal from what we see here. Quality control for domestic civilian market is pretty much non-existent in Izhevesk. It's kinda like Russian Century.

DAIadvisor
10-29-2011, 05:42
Why sell for $400 in U.S. when you can sell every last one in Russia for $2000? They are planning on a pilot run of 100 units late this year, perhaps yearly next year and have little idea of whatís beyond. It will be very long time (if ever) before this rifle hits these shores and if it does I doubt that the pricing will be appealing. Especially by the time it will have the mandatory U.S. parts installed.

But importing Molot AR barrels might be an interesting option. I understand they also plan on Grendel and 7.62X39 versions.

I think it's a day late and a dollar short as they say. I would make gold plated AKs before I'd invest into yet another AR clone operation.