9mm Lugar with 5.1gr Unique [Archive] - Glock Talk

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rookie1
10-27-2011, 04:41
I just started reloading after buying the Lee Anniversary kit that comes with almost everything you need. The scale that comes with it is a bit sketchy. I zeroed it out and then loaded up 5.1gr of Unique. I am using 115gr jacketed round nose bullets. After measuring this out I load it into the case and it is about 3/4 way full or a little more. Is this right?. I dont have anyone close buy who reloads to borrow their scale and the closest store that sells scales is 25 min away and I would have spend $45. Can someone confirm is that is right or attach a picture of a 9mm case with 5.1gr of Unique powder. I can get a photo also if need be.

Colorado4Wheel
10-27-2011, 06:58
If you don't know how to use that scale then you need to get a real scale. That scale sucks. Get a Dillon Eliminator from Dillon. $55. You might find something cheaper, but it will be a compromise and you will wish you spent the extra $10. A picture won't help. Your measuring to .1gr. Pictures won't show us anything.

DoctaGlockta
10-27-2011, 07:17
I know 6.0 grains fills the case. Your observations seem correct. But I have a Lee scale and check it with a small electronic.

Really need to order a Dillon I suppose.

XDRoX
10-27-2011, 07:19
The Lee scale is crappy and a hassle to use and read, but IME it does work.
Here's a picture of 5.1gr of Unique in a 9mm Norma case if it helps. I'd say you're GTG.

http://members.cox.net/chrismosteller/5.1unique.JPG

rookie1
10-27-2011, 07:20
Thats what it looks like. When you zero the scale it is stupid because it goes farther to the right and you have to find the 0. The case just seemed real full, but looks exactly like the picture above. Thanks for everyones input.

XDRoX
10-27-2011, 07:27
Thats what it looks like. When you zero the scale it is stupid because it goes farther to the right and you have to find the 0. The case just seemed real full, but looks exactly like the picture above. Thanks for everyones input.

I don't think you could even get enough Unique in a 9mm case to blow up a gun.

Colorado4Wheel
10-27-2011, 07:31
If you don't trust your scale then what good is it?

PCJim
10-27-2011, 08:21
Thats what it looks like. When you zero the scale it is stupid because it goes farther to the right and you have to find the 0. The case just seemed real full, but looks exactly like the picture above. Thanks for everyones input.

Rookie, I'm not familiar with that scale, but... Most beam scales use a leveling foot on the pointer end, and also may have some balancing weights in/under the pan holder. You might want to recheck the directions for the scale on proper zeroing. You shouldn't have to "find the 0" as you've described.

For what its worth, I have added as much as a 1/2" square piece of paper under the pan on my 5-0-5 to get a good level zero, depending upon the location where I'm doing load development.

AF-Odin
10-27-2011, 08:35
Rookie1,

5.2gr of Unique behind either a 115gr FMJ or 115gr FMJ-FP is my normal load for target/plinking/even match. That load fills the case 3/4 to a little more full, is easy to see that there is powder as the round cycles through the Dillon 550, and will completely overflow if for some reason you double charge. I use an old RCBS balance beam scale (don't remember the model number as it is over 30 years old) when I am working up the measurement, but use a cheap electronic scale from Midway as my check during reloading--check scale fluctuates about .1 grain from round to round, but that is acceptable--I check loads by weight about every 100 rounds, but like the ability to SEE the powder at the 3/4 full point on each round.

Sounds like you are good to go, but a good scale is imperative to good/safe reloading.

fredj338
10-27-2011, 08:38
I don't think you could even get enough Unique in a 9mm case to blow up a gun.

You are probably right. I have used pretty well compressed loads of Unique in 9mm to get into +P range. There isn't much room in the tiny 9mm case & Unique is pertty bulky. To the OP, if it looks scary, switch to WSF. Almost identical performance but it's a spherical instead of flake so it has about 30% less vol per charge wt.

rpgman
10-27-2011, 09:02
You are probably right. I have used pretty well compressed loads of Unique in 9mm to get into +P range. There isn't much room in the tiny 9mm case & Unique is pertty bulky. To the OP, if it looks scary, switch to WSF. Almost identical performance but it's a spherical instead of flake so it has about 30% less vol per charge wt.


I have this scale that comes in the Lyman kit I purchased, if you want to buy it from me:

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/scales-measures/1000-XP.php

I use the RCBS 1500 Chargemaster to load, which I love.

Greg

oops sorry wrong message to reply too.

rpgman
10-27-2011, 09:03
I just started reloading after buying the Lee Anniversary kid that comes with almost everything you need. The scale that comes with it is a bit sketchy. I zeroed it out and then loaded up 5.1gr of Unique. I am using 115gr jacketed round nose bullets. After measuring this out I load it into the case and it is about 3/4 way full or a little more. Is this right?. I dont have anyone close buy who reloads to borrow their scale and the closest store that sells scales is 25 min away and I would have spend $45. Can someone confirm is that is right or attach a picture of a 9mm case with 5.1gr of Unique powder. I can get a photo also if need be.


I have this scale that comes in the Lyman kit I purchased, if you want to buy it from me:

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/s...es/1000-XP.php (http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/scales-measures/1000-XP.php)

I use the RCBS 1500 Chargemaster to load, which I love.

Greg <!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

F106 Fan
10-27-2011, 09:35
I have the old RCBS beam scale from way back but I use my Dillon Eliminator for everything. I also have the RCBS calibration weights:

http://www.midwayusa.com/browse/BrowseProducts.aspx?pageNum=1&tabId=1&categoryId=19937&categoryString=9315***731***9211***19935***

If I had any question about the powder charge, I would be VERY worried. For some powders, the difference between a minimum and maximum charge is about 0.4 gr. I prefer to stay away from maximum loads and above minimum loads so if, for example, the minimum is 4.2 gr and the maximum is 4.6 gr, I like to stay at 4.4 gr. That doesn't leave much room for measurement error.

Bottom line: at least get some check weights and try to get one of the digital scales as soon as possible. Not that the RCBS beam scale doesn't work. It works very well. It's just not very handy.

Richard

fredj338
10-27-2011, 11:39
Bottom line: at least get some check weights and try to get one of the digital scales as soon as possible. Not that the RCBS beam scale doesn't work. It works very well. It's just not very handy.

Richard
Digital scales, particularly cheap ones, are not all that accurate. A good beam scale is as accurate as a good digital, just slower to use. IMO, there are few good dig scales under $100.:dunno: I have the Dillon, great rpoduct, but I also have a RCBS beam scale. The Dillon beam is quite good, same as the more expensive RCBS model.

F106 Fan
10-27-2011, 11:54
Digital scales, particularly cheap ones, are not all that accurate. A good beam scale is as accurate as a good digital, just slower to use. IMO, there are few good dig scales under $100.:dunno: I have the Dillon, great rpoduct, but I also have a RCBS beam scale. The Dillon beam is quite good, same as the more expensive RCBS model.


I messed up when I said Dillon Eliminator - that is a beam scale.

I actually use the Dillon D-Terminator - a $140 digital scale. I have checked it with the RCBS calibration weights and with the provided weight. It all checks out fine.

http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/25213/catid/7/D_Terminator_Electronic_Scale

There's nothing wrong with a decent beam scale. I used one for many years before I broke down and bought the D-Terminator and it is still sitting on the bench.

Richard

Disregarded9-side
10-27-2011, 11:56
I use the same set up and have loaded thousands of 115-121gr 9mm with Unique charges weighing from 4.2-5.6grains.

You're fine. Good luck.

E: Unique meters very poorly, and the Lee measure that comes with that kit doesn't like it. That said, it works just fine.

Shadyscott69
10-27-2011, 11:59
I went through about 6 different scales before I found one worth a hoot.

I now have a Lyman 1000XP that seem to be pretty good.

http://www.sportsmanswarehouse.com/sportsmans/Lyman-1000XP-Electronic-Scale/productDetail/Powder-Measures/prod9999002457/cat100153

http://images.bidorbuy.co.za/user_images/931/1187931_101206083446_Scale_XP_1000.jpg

rpgman
10-27-2011, 12:00
I went through about 6 different scales before I found one worth a hoot.

I now have a Lyman 1000XP that seem to be pretty good.

http://www.sportsmanswarehouse.com/sportsmans/Lyman-1000XP-Electronic-Scale/productDetail/Powder-Measures/prod9999002457/cat100153

http://images.bidorbuy.co.za/user_images/931/1187931_101206083446_Scale_XP_1000.jpg

yep, and that's the one that came with my kit and I'm trying to sell it.
I liked it, but I do like my RCBS ChargeMaster better.

WiskyT
10-27-2011, 14:52
Holy carp! The guy is new to reloading and a little unsure of the process and "the Lee scale is crap and can't be trusted"! Way to go guys:rolleyes:

OP, the Lee scale is fine. It is cumbersome but highly accurate. It's good that you asked on here about something you were unsure of, but take the answers with a grain of salt as people will have you spending a fortune on stuff that yet others will still decry as "crap". I load 6.0 Unique with a 125 JHP and if you want to know what that looks like, it looks just like your powder charge except the case is 20% more full.

Colorado4Wheel
10-27-2011, 15:41
Holy carp! The guy is new to reloading and a little unsure of the process and "the Lee scale is crap and can't be trusted"! Way to go guys:rolleyes:

Your missing the point. If HE doesn't know how to use it and isn't able to get repeatable results he should not be reloading with it. TO ME, it's crazy to move forward with a scale you don't trust. Even crazier to look at a picture and decide your load is OK. I know it's unique and it's bulky. I just couldn't do that and would never recommend anyone do that.

I don't know what "Sketchy" means but I know it was a PITA to get repeatable results easily with my lee scale.

WiskyT
10-27-2011, 15:49
Your missing the point. If HE doesn't know how to use it and isn't able to get repeatable results he should not be reloading with it. TO ME, it's crazy to move forward with a scale you don't trust. Even crazier to look at a picture and decide your load is OK. I know it's unique and it's bulky. I just couldn't do that and would never recommend anyone do that.

I don't know what "Sketchy" means but I know it was a PITA to get repeatable results easily with my lee scale.

That's like a guy getting a new car, pushing the button briefly for the window to go down and the window goes down all the way and since he didn't know the newer cars have "auto down" that he should get a new car because his car is "crap".

The window on the new car works properly, as does the Lee scale, as does a full case of Unique.

Colorado4Wheel
10-27-2011, 15:59
That's like a guy getting a new car, pushing the button briefly for the window to go down and the window goes down all the way and since he didn't know the newer cars have "auto down" that he should get a new car because his car is "crap".

The window on the new car works properly, as does the Lee scale, as does a full case of Unique.

Rolling a window down on a car has nothing to do with safety. Reloading has to have safety as it's top priority. Not knowing how to use your scale reliably and consistently is a HUGE problem. That is a horrible analogy.

Yes I get that Unique fills the case pretty well. I would still want to know how much powder I am actually using. We are teaching him horrible habits in this thread. Learn how to use your equipment. If you can't do that with what you got, get equipment that works easier. We all know the Lee Scale is a PITA.

WiskyT
10-27-2011, 16:01
Rolling a window down on a car has nothing to do with safety. Reloading has to have safety as it's top priority. Not knowing how to use your scale reliably and consistently is a HUGE problem. That is a horrible analogy.

Yes I get that Unique fills the case pretty well. I would still want to know how much powder I am actually using. We are teaching him horrible habits in this thread. Learn how to use your equipment. If you can't do that with what you got, get equipment that works easier. We all know the Lee Scale is a PITA.

He did use the scale properly, he just got queezy looking at all that powder in his case.

Colorado4Wheel
10-27-2011, 16:14
He called it Sketchy and doubts his results.

WiskyT
10-27-2011, 16:30
He called it Sketchy and doubts his results.

And he would have called it sketchy and doubted the results if he used a 505. That is until he saw a pic of how full the case should be. One free digital photo saved him $50.00.

dbarry
10-27-2011, 18:19
I've got a lee scale and it is very accurate.

WiskyT
10-27-2011, 18:48
I've got a lee scale and it is very accurate.

CRAP! CRAP I tell you!!!

PhantomF4E
10-27-2011, 19:24
As previously stated Unique is very Noob and reloader error friendly . You can't double charge Unique in 9mm without standing on a packing rod to tamp it down... I would recommend against that :-) I have an old beam scale use it to set the charge. use a dillion electronic as a co-witness and then do a visual on a rack of charged rounds before seating . Works for me... Never a squib or a double... In 30+ years.... It's all about the precision in my book.

wanderinwalker
10-27-2011, 19:42
I've got a lee scale and it is very accurate.

Yeah, I've used a simple little LEE scale to load quite a bit of ammo on. I've shot some good 600-yards scores at Highpower matches with that ammo. (FWIW, I don't believe in weighing or trickling charges for this work either. Thrown charges gets me ammo that's good for 2-MOA or less; the 8s and 9s originate behind the buttplate... :crying: )

As to the OP, the best part of bulky charges is the prevention of double charges. I've grown to like Unique in the last year, trying it in .38 Special and 9mm so far. Next up will probably be some .44 Magnum-lites. Wait until you start loading rifle rounds, they're almost always very full.

ejs54
10-29-2011, 19:17
CRAP! CRAP I tell you!!!

Yes, its crap, but its also very accurate to my surprise. I tested it against others and measuring devices and when use correctly that crappy scale is dead on every time. I use it for my 300 WIN MAG loads all the time. I have the auto disk set up for my pistol loads so the scale is not used much for that anymore.

WiskyT
10-30-2011, 06:42
Yes, its crap, but its also very accurate to my surprise. I tested it against others and measuring devices and when use correctly that crappy scale is dead on every time. I use it for my 300 WIN MAG loads all the time. I have the auto disk set up for my pistol loads so the scale is not used much for that anymore.

Agreed. The Auto disk is another brilliant piece of simplicity. Cheap, effective, repeatable, and simple.

Kentguy
10-31-2011, 09:11
Rockie1,
I too started out using the Lee scale. After fighting for a year with this interesting piece of junk... I cracked opened my wallet and purchased a RCBS 10 - 10 scale and never looked back!

http://www.midwayusa.com/Product/415607/rcbs-model-1010-magnetic-powder-scale-1010-grain-capacity

I know this model is very pricie comparied to others, but if you plan on reloading for the next say 40 - 50 years of so :supergrin: you will not need to buy another scale. Just my opinion.

CitizenOfDreams
10-31-2011, 09:51
One good thing about Unique - you cannot overcharge a 9mm round with it even if you try.

squirreld
10-31-2011, 20:15
I run 5.0 gr. of unique in mixed brass under 124 gr FMJ PD.
Sitt'n right at 1100.