Hornaday Intros Critical Duty [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Tiro Fijo
11-10-2011, 17:34
http://www.hornady.com/store/Critical-DUTY-New

unit1069
11-10-2011, 18:49
http://www.hornady.com/store/Critical-DUTY-New

I like Hornady, especially the accuracy of its XTP bullet. It may be some time before the concensus is in on a brand new round like this, but it does look interesting.

With all the good ammo available today in service duty calibers --- and I have a dozen or so of them --- it will be a while before I spend on an unproven round. My next purchases are going to known JHP self-defense rounds in the 50/box variety.

NG VI
11-10-2011, 19:10
The 135+P looks interesting, the standard pressure 135 not so much. 147 grain velocities from a 135 grain bullet? No thanks. I've thought for a long time that the 135 would be a great weight class for the 9mm, good to see a manufacturer making one.

unit1069
11-10-2011, 19:35
The 135+P looks interesting, the standard pressure 135 not so much. 147 grain velocities from a 135 grain bullet? No thanks. I've thought for a long time that the 135 would be a great weight class for the 9mm, good to see a manufacturer making one.

I'm currently carrying the Federal 135-grain Tactical Bonded +P in my 9mm sub-compact. Check around at a few online sources; I think one or two of them may have it in stock.

clarkstoncz
11-10-2011, 20:54
The regular 9mm FTX Critical Defense load is watered down a bit, but very soft shooting and accurate.

Hour13
11-10-2011, 21:13
Hmm, like to see how that 175gr performs.

I keep a mag full of the 165gr Critical Defense in my G22 when it's at home. Like the idea of a heavier round with barrier ability when my little Glock's "out on the town". :supergrin:

My EDC round right now are the 180 Bonded Ranger JHPs. They'll certainly get the job done, but Hornaday sure makes some pretty ammo, lol.

cowboy1964
11-10-2011, 21:50
With all the good ammo available today in service duty calibers --- and I have a dozen or so of them --- it will be a while before I spend on an unproven round.

Yep. Too many good, street-proven rounds to take a chance on new stuff.

txgunguy
11-11-2011, 10:03
I like the idea of having a non lead core. Interesting concept.

That said, I will never buy 20 round boxes of ammo. The only time I buy 20 round boxes is when I'm buying rifle rounds.

NG VI
11-11-2011, 17:09
It's still got a lead core, it just has a plastic nosecap, kind of like the ballistic tip/Vmax type rifle bullets, only this one is flush with the nose of the bullet.

JimIsland
11-11-2011, 18:47
I shot a NADA book yesterday with a 9mm Critical D. out of a G26 and was amazed at how well it expanded. It went about 3/4 of the way through and would have left a sizeable hole in BG. Definitely a confidence booster as I like the 10mm and 45 acp much better.

TWS G26
11-11-2011, 20:59
+P 135 gr at 1110 fps? Considering that Hornady's velocities for me are typically running well under advertised, I'm just not seeing the benefit. It's not apples to oranges regarding bullet weight, but 115 FMJ for plinking comes in somewhat faster than this posted velocity.

off road
11-12-2011, 07:32
Seems like prefect ammo for LE like Highway Patrol who are around vehicles all day long....but not likely the hot setup for the average civilian. I load Critical Defense most of the time, and XTP on the rare occasions where I am around vehicles.

twisty
11-12-2011, 18:28
I have looked at it and it seems to be a good idea. It has the polymer tip to provide good expansion without clogging. It has a very good bullet design to offer reliable expansion and good connection between jacket and core. It also seems to be in the heavier end of the loadings for the calibers available so it will have good penetration and carry a lot of energy downrange. I believe it is only available in 9mm and .40 as of right now, but critical defense started that way too and was expanded to the popular calibers. I'm sure it is very good ammo. Is it better than other offerings? I don't know. Right now I carry Black Hills 230gr+P in all my guns with the Hornady XTP bullet. It works just fine, so I will have to wait and see how this one works.

Merkavaboy
11-12-2011, 18:43
Problem is Hornady's Critical Defense, Z-Max and now Critical Duty are all unproven loads in the real world. Until there is a database of actual shootings with these new bullets, I'd never use them nor trust them to defend my life.

RedHaze
11-12-2011, 22:48
I wish they'd sell that 135gr as a component bullet... looks like a good one for the .357 sig to me.

unit1069
11-13-2011, 08:37
I wish they'd sell that 135gr as a component bullet... looks like a good one for the .357 sig to me.

I agree with you! I recently switched to 147-grain JHP ammo in my .357sig after noting the milder recoil versus the 125-grain rounds I had been carrying. I hadn't shot any of the heavier rounds in the past few years and only had enough for a couple of magazines but on a whim decided to shoot some up.

Once I shot a few I did a comparison and because accuracy was the same for both rounds I decided to go with the heavier round. I then bought some Hornady 147-grain XTP rounds that I haven't had time to test. At the moment I have Double Tap 147-grain Gold Dot in the carry mag.

A 135-grain bullet would make a nice middleweight round choice and I wonder if any handloaders have driven this bullet weight at velocities higher than the 9mm +P round available. If it's not a component bullet available for handloading is it possible to pull bullets from factory ammo and use them in handloading?

clarkstoncz
11-13-2011, 09:27
Not to derail this thread, as I like the idea of a 135 gr. load as well, and the 147 gr. 357 SIG is intriguing.

I also like the soft shooting and extreme accuracy of the Double Tap 147 FMJ-FP-match load,
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb26/czrami/DOUBLE%20TAP%20357%20SIG/DT-357-8.jpg

but see that Mike only offers a Winchester for a 147 gr. JHP load now.

Having used his Gold Dot 9mm +P 147 load for years in my guns, I don't know if the Winchester bullet is up to par?


Having looked at the post from Jeffrey on this forum.
I'd still like to see DT offer a 125 gr. TAC-XP @ 1,400 fps or so..

Users of the traditional 125 gr. 357 SIG bullets would get a 125 that drives deeper
and still expands fully, without having to use a bonded bullet.

I think it would act like a heavier 115 gr. TAC-XP or DPX but I'm no expert on this
like some folks are.

The only real downside to the DPX and TAC XP loads are the cost of the Barnes X bullets for ammo companies and reloaders, but I hear they are getting cheaper.

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb26/czrami/DOUBLE%20TAP%20357%20SIG/DT-357-12.jpg

Both DT, Cor-Bon, and also Hornady offer outstanding products.

NG VI
11-13-2011, 09:38
I can't imagine the Critical Defense or this new load are that much different than the regular XTP bullet. In this case I wouldn't be too concerned about real life street shootings with it, I think the big ammunition companies have had plenty of time to figure out what works and delivers the performance users want and need by now.

Don't see many companies trying to push Safety Slug- or Extreme Shox-type of bullets anymore, and if Hornady can't make a proper and working variant on their long-lived premium hollowpoint bullet, I would be very surprised.

Tiro Fijo
11-13-2011, 13:28
IMO shooting 147 gr. bullets in a .357 SIG defeats the purpose of the cartridge, i.e., to duplicate the ballistics of the 125 gr. .357 Mag. in a semi-auto handgun. The 125 gr. will give you penetration in spades. If it's recoil that bothers you then I would suggest going down to a caliber you can handle.

NG VI
11-13-2011, 14:53
Tiro, some of the newer bullet designs give the designer more material to work with for expansion in the heavier bullet weights. The longer 147s are physically more capable of wide expansion than the 125s, and some bullets like the Ranger-T and HST capitalize on that.

unit1069
11-13-2011, 15:07
IMO shooting 147 gr. bullets in a .357 SIG defeats the purpose of the cartridge, i.e., to duplicate the ballistics of the 125 gr. .357 Mag. in a semi-auto handgun. The 125 gr. will give you penetration in spades. If it's recoil that bothers you then I would suggest going down to a caliber you can handle.

I don't have trouble with either 125- or 147-grain JHP ammo in .357sig. Both are quite capable of getting the job done according to everything I've read.

Because the 147-grain Gold Dot (2007 Double Tap load) is not being driven beyond its design capability per Bob's tests and because it yields a milder recoil than 125-grain ammo recoil it seems a good choice.

Throw in the 9mm advocates' contention that 147-grain JHP is the best bullet for self-defense in that caliber leads me to think that if that 147-grain Gold Dot performs so well at sub-1000 fps velocities what's not to like for the very same bullet running at 1250 fps without breaching its window of design? Especially when it delivers over 500 ft lbs of muzzle energy and less recoil impulse. I can't wait to try out that Hornady 147-grain XTP ammo I bought.

Tiro Fijo
11-13-2011, 17:40
I don't want to get into another weight vs. velocity battle so all I'll say is that when someone advocates the 147 gr. bullet ask them for some Real World data. There was a reason the 147 gr. 9mm failed miserably in the 80's and the +p+ 115 gr. stopped countless people DRT. Obviously, it wasn't bullet weight so I'll let you fellas draw your own conclusion. History is a wonderful teacher when we heed it. HST is not a death ray.

CanyonMan
11-13-2011, 18:03
I can't imagine the Critical Defense or this new load are that much different than the regular XTP bullet. In this case I wouldn't be too concerned about real life street shootings with it, I think the big ammunition companies have had plenty of time to figure out what works and delivers the performance users want and need by now.

Don't see many companies trying to push Safety Slug- or Extreme Shox-type of bullets anymore, and if Hornady can't make a proper and working variant on their long-lived premium hollowpoint bullet, I would be very surprised.



AH, but there is a difference, that makes a great deal of difference...

The regular XTP has more meat on the bones in the nose of the bullet because it works off the target being the Hydralic. The Others with all the fancy red tips have thinner skin (less copper and lead) in the nose so they can open "fast" using the red plug as the Hydralic to push the thinner pedals back, thus a loss in penetration, and especially againt bone and heavy clothes, and various other barriers.

Being a guy who demands penetration, I will stick with the XTP. What these puppies (the red plastic tips) do in jello is not what they do through heavy leather and muscle and bone and organs. The XTP 'without' the red Hydralic aid, does get more penetration from jello to various barrier test, even home boy test with all types of barriers.

Just another marketing product like the Zombie junk. It's all about $$$$ ! ;)



Good shooting.








CM