Do you count your shots when shooting? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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X-Centric
11-11-2011, 19:58
I think itís very important to know how many shots you fired and how many rounds remain in your firearm whether youíre practicing or in a live fire situation. When I practice I count my shots. I know I have 5-shots with my LCR and my SP-101, 6-shots with my speed 6, 10 or 17-shots with my SR9C (depending on which magazine is in), 15-shots with my Glock 19 and 20-shots with my Mini-14. I think itís a good habit to know how many rounds remain before I reload or run for cover. Do any of you practice the same way?

JaPes
11-11-2011, 20:01
Yes. I keep track of how many rounds I've fired out of the cylinder or mag.

Shark1007
11-11-2011, 20:05
Hell, I count everything. The Rifleman fired 12 shots from an 11 shot 44/40 rifle in the opening scene. I count shots on cop shows, count my own, count ceiling tiles in lobbies, love counting.

DaneA
11-11-2011, 20:06
Not as a focal point of practice. I have an idea in my head but if I stop and someone asks they will likely get a 5-6 or 6-7 type answer. I know when I get past 10 because the slide is locked back :tongue out:

FPS
11-12-2011, 01:33
Yes.
.

Search
11-12-2011, 01:56
I do. It keeps my mind focused. I once thought I should break the habit before I end up in a firefight and realize I'm counting shots instead of focusing on the target. Had an instructor tell me once the Rangers count theirs so they always know how many shots are left. Not sure how true.

JuneyBooney
11-12-2011, 01:59
I try to keep track for things like hang fire etc.

Glockrunner
11-12-2011, 05:57
I doubt in a real encounter, you'll count your shots. Simply way too many things going on if you have to put more than three downrange.

You may count them at the time of fire but after the event you'll most likely have so much going thru your head, round count will fuzz out and you're mind will forcus on other moments of the fight.

Besides if it is necessary, forensics whiil determine the shots fired.

ronin.45
11-12-2011, 06:09
I doubt in a real encounter, you'll count your shots. Simply way too many things going on if you have to put more than three downrange.

You may count them at the time of fire but after the event you'll most likely have so much going thru your head, round count will fuzz out and you're mind will forcus on other moments of the fight.

Besides if it is necessary, forensics whiil determine the shots fired.

Agreed, you will probably not be in the counting mindset if you have to use your gun defensively. Most people interviewed after a shooting are way off when asked how many rounds they fired.

pipedreams
11-12-2011, 06:15
Counting your shots is important if you can discipline yourself that much. In most personal defense cases you will never shoot enough to change magazines but it is a good practice. Some years ago I took a advanced shooting course and we practiced over and over counting our shots and changing magazines before the last round locked backed the slide. We also practiced with pump shotguns and we were taught to keeps track of our shots and shove more rounds into the gun while on the move. Don't know if I could do it under stress now but a good practice.

cadillacguns
11-12-2011, 06:36
Count.....ONE ah ha ha, TWO ah ha ha Like the COUNT on Seseme Street?

seriously I do because I have been doing it subconsiously forever.

Four_T_Five
11-12-2011, 06:48
Training - Yes. When the RO or instructor says, "when the targets turn, run to the 15yd line, draw and fire 12 rounds to include a mandatory reload."... you had better only shoot 12 or you will get DQ'd.

Actual Shooting - No. It is not realistic. 99.9% of the world cannot do it successfully anyway. Oh, and then there's the point that if you are in a shooting... you have plenty of much more important things to occupy your brain with than counting rounds.

unit1069
11-12-2011, 09:28
I think itís very important to know how many shots you fired and how many rounds remain in your firearm whether youíre practicing or in a live fire situation.

I agree, and while I generally count when I go to the range I don't usually put enough emphasis on the importance of this issue.

Lior
11-12-2011, 09:51
Yes, including when firing machine guns.

usmc4641
11-12-2011, 09:57
I've been in firefights. I never counted rounds. Either the bolt locked back, or if I was getting ready to do an entry I would do a hot reload. When bullets are going both ways, there are far more important things to worry about. Being able to reload quickly is more important than being able to count to 30 or 15.

Schrag4
11-12-2011, 09:58
Count me in the group that counts somewhat subconsciously but thinks they should probably stop. I find when I'm doing IDPA - I'm pretty new to it - I actually stop counting total rounds since I have to count rounds on each target, and I have to do it as quickly as possible.

I truly believe if I ever had to use my gun in self defense, unless I only fired one shot (or zero), I probably wouldn't know how many I fired.

I always count rounds fired on TV shows and movies, though, without thinking about it. They usually fire an unrealistically high number of rounds. It's refreshing to see a reload after someone fires the exact capacity of some specific weapon.

JackMac
11-12-2011, 10:05
yes, except for full auto

G22DaD
11-12-2011, 11:21
I try to keep track of my shots. But, honestly even in training, I lose track of what shot I'm on. I really want to do IDPA, but I figure I'd just get DQ'd in the first stage b-cuz I'll shoot too many @ a certain target.

But, who knows... maybe that's what I need to get better. But, in a combat situation, I think it's more important to focus on surviving than keeping track of rounds shot. ...Just me talking, though.

michael e
11-12-2011, 11:32
Some times. But usually just with my revolvers. With SA I will load some mags to diff amounts, makes you pay atteniot to slide being locked back on empty.

Warp
11-12-2011, 11:55
Yes.

I have at times had to count my shots during courses of fire in order to do it correctly. The habit stuck. If I'm just punching paper at the range the counting happens whether I think about it or not.

I am well aware that counting is not to be trusted if you ever have to fire in earnest, though.

Gary Slider
11-12-2011, 12:42
I want to add a point about counting rounds. I do it a lot when shooting matches that have you shooting a certain amount of rounds at a certain target. But other times I don't count on purpose. The reason I do that is I have heard it said by so many instructors that in a real gunfight you will not count your rounds. In fact Massad Ayoob told me that the saying in California when the LAPD carried Revolvers it was shoot twice and reload 6 as many times they thought they had only fired 2 rounds and the firearm was empty. He also has stated in the courses more than once I have taken from him and in articles he has written you will not know how may rounds you fired. Same with Ken Hackathorn. He has told me the same thing.

That shoot 2 and reload 6 is the biggest reason I seldom carry a revolver. I depend on one thing to tell me I have an empty autoloader. When the slide locks back I see what looks like a hole in the back of the gun and I know the firearm is empty and I need to reload. It just looks totally different to me when the slide is locked back than when it is in battery and ready to fire.

Twice I have had my 3914 fail to go completely into battery when stripping a round off the mag and moving it into the chamber. The slide stopped just short of going into battery. Both times it was because I moved the firearm and had the slide against cover when the round was fired. Both times I knew from the look of the firearm that the slide was not completely forward and automatically I slammed the rear of the slide with my off hand and then fired. There was no hesitation. Both those instances told me that by not counting rounds and knowing what everything looked like in all situations that I would know when the firearm was empty or just short of going into battery. I believe that has served me well and that fits with what the Professionals have told me that you won't know how many rounds you have fired when your life is in danger.

This is just the way I do it. Not saying that is the way everyone should do it. What works for me may not work for you. But what I have come to depend on serves me well and just sharing it as it may help someone else.

Bogey
11-12-2011, 12:55
[QUOTE=G22DaD;18152453]I try to keep track of my shots. But, honestly even in training, I lose track of what shot I'm on. I really want to do IDPA, but I figure I'd just get DQ'd in the first stage b-cuz I'll shoot too many @ a certain target.

QUOTE]


This is a non-DQable offense. :supergrin:

I don't count rounds. In shooting IDPA, I know where my reload points are. If I screw up and need to do a make up shot, I just rely on my slide locking back.

I don't shoot outside of comps anymore. Too boring, unless someone wants to play for something.

Deye76
11-12-2011, 12:58
"I know what your thinking, did he fire 6"
"Feeling lucky...welll punk":rofl:

cowboy1964
11-12-2011, 13:25
Do you really think you are going to actually count each round in a life-and-death defensive situation? I'd rather focus on the more important things at the moment. People don't even remember hearing the shots, you think they are going to count 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10-11...

It's especially ridiculuous with hi-cap pistols. "Hmm I've fired 13 shots, only have 2 left, maybe I should consider moving to cover now??"

SCmasterblaster
11-12-2011, 13:38
Can't say that I do. I have a 17-round mag in my G17, but I only have 10 fingers. I guess that I'll have to CCW while barefoot!

Glockrunner
11-12-2011, 14:30
Can't say that I do. I have a 17-round mag in my G17, but I only have 10 fingers. I guess that I'll have to CCW while barefoot!

IMPPOSIBLE! SC "Masterblaster" with all ten fingers and toes?
How'd that happen? :supergrin:

X-Concealment
11-12-2011, 15:54
Not very good with math, but luckly, handgun mags don't usually carry more than 20 rds, so, can still manage to count everytime I pull the triger.

WI Hunter
11-12-2011, 16:16
Yes

Peter

Jason D
11-12-2011, 16:36
I do keep a mental tally of shots.
For me it comes from shooting Highpower and Bullseye.

poodleplumber
11-12-2011, 18:14
I count shots at the range. I thought it was a symptom of borderline OCD until I read this thread. Maybe it still is. ;-)

slama683
11-12-2011, 21:38
Training - Yes. When the RO or instructor says, "when the targets turn, run to the 15yd line, draw and fire 12 rounds to include a mandatory reload."... you had better only shoot 12 or you will get DQ'd.

Actual Shooting - No. It is not realistic. 99.9% of the world cannot do it successfully anyway. Oh, and then there's the point that if you are in a shooting... you have plenty of much more important things to occupy your brain with than counting rounds.

The one time it counted, I was sure I fired four rounds. Afterwards, I checked my mag and counted five down, so I was then sure it was five. When the investigation was completed, I was told it was four and I had miscounted when I checked.

And, at least in my experience, there are a lot of things that your brain will ignore in order to focus on the information keeping you alive. Not just auditory exclusion, but other things that your mind decides are just not relevant at that time.

Reb 56
11-12-2011, 23:09
Nope just shoot to slide lock.

runcible68
11-12-2011, 23:50
You won't be counting in an armed encounter. Have a reload or another gun.

USDefender
11-13-2011, 13:48
I doubt in a real encounter, you'll count your shots. Simply way too many things going on if you have to put more than three downrange.

You may count them at the time of fire but after the event you'll most likely have so much going thru your head, round count will fuzz out and you're mind will forcus on other moments of the fight.

Besides if it is necessary, forensics whiil determine the shots fired.

Training - Yes. When the RO or instructor says, "when the targets turn, run to the 15yd line, draw and fire 12 rounds to include a mandatory reload."... you had better only shoot 12 or you will get DQ'd.

Actual Shooting - No. It is not realistic. 99.9% of the world cannot do it successfully anyway. Oh, and then there's the point that if you are in a shooting... you have plenty of much more important things to occupy your brain with than counting rounds.

I've been in firefights. I never counted rounds. Either the bolt locked back, or if I was getting ready to do an entry I would do a hot reload. When bullets are going both ways, there are far more important things to worry about. Being able to reload quickly is more important than being able to count to 30 or 15.

The one time it counted, I was sure I fired four rounds. Afterwards, I checked my mag and counted five down, so I was then sure it was five. When the investigation was completed, I was told it was four and I had miscounted when I checked.

And, at least in my experience, there are a lot of things that your brain will ignore in order to focus on the information keeping you alive. Not just auditory exclusion, but other things that your mind decides are just not relevant at that time.




^^^What they said^^^

dakrat
11-13-2011, 14:08
You won't be counting in an armed encounter. Have a reload or another gun.

how'd ya know? been there done that? you will be surprised some people can manage the effect of adrenaline rush to the body.

unit1069
11-13-2011, 14:24
I have no clue what I'd do in a real situation, but I do know it will be better for me to know how many rounds I've expended than not, especially against multiple assailants.

Sure there are more import things to concentrate on in the immediacy of the moment, but as those who have been through these encounters write the mind very well may keep track of the important things, with round count being one of these somewhere in the mind's unfathomable ability to direct physical movements. Isn't that why everyone says training's important?

Glockbuster
11-13-2011, 16:13
I never count my shots. When I practice a stage in IPSC I know ahead of time when I'll be changing mags. I am firmly convinced that in a live encounter if I get to the point where my mag runs dry I will be taken by surprise and that's just the way it is. I'd rather not be distracted by this task and concentrate on the many other things at the time. You really think you can get around tunnel vision in a live encounter ?

G31
11-13-2011, 18:38
I don't count them, and actually have no desire to get int the habit of doing so. IMO, it is a bad idea to side track your mind with such things when you need to be thinking about the situation at hand. Not only that, but an inaccurate count can get you killed, either by giving you a surprise slide lock when you don't expect it (requiring you to go into troubleshooting mode, not combat mode), or by making you think you have more than you do.

I have never been taught by any serious LE or Mil instructor to count rounds. I have been taught administrative reloads ("hot reloads", as mentioned above) and shoot to slide lock.

DustyJacket
11-13-2011, 18:47
I've counted every since my first police academy (I had 6 shots then) but nowadays I'll lose count.

DustyJacket
11-13-2011, 18:51
Training - Yes. When the RO or instructor says, "when the targets turn, run to the 15yd line, draw and fire 12 rounds to include a mandatory reload."... you had better only shoot 12 or you will get DQ'd.


I bought a Beretta 92F and a new holster, and used my duty gun as a trade-in.

I went to the range to qualify so I could go on duty that night.

The holster was so stiff I got flustered. We were supposed to so some number and reload and shoot 2, then do it again. In the first time I shot that number, then shot the whole rest of my ammo. I didn't bother shooting the second time, since I actually did it all in less time.

Got 100% :whistling:

slama683
11-13-2011, 19:00
how'd ya know? been there done that? you will be surprised some people can manage the effect of adrenaline rush to the body.

All I can refer to is the one time it mattered to me: I didn't even start to think about how many rounds I had fired until it was done. Then, I thought about it and was right, then checked and convinced myself I was wrong, then was told that I was right the first time.

Oramac
11-14-2011, 12:38
I count rounds all the time at the range. I carry 10+1 in my CCW, so I just got used to counting. Didn't even really intend to start the habit, it just kinda happened.

That said, my dad doesn't count a damn thing. I could probably stop him after one round and he wouldn't know how many he shot.

I think somewhere in between is probably ideal.