Bushmaster at Walmart... [Archive] - Glock Talk

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mhunter
11-12-2011, 14:58
Is the $897 Bushmaster M4 carbine at Walmart a decent price on a decent AR style rifle?

GermanyBound
11-12-2011, 15:25
In a word, no

M&P15T
11-12-2011, 15:28
http://www.straferight.com/photopost/data/500/medium/double-facepalm.jpg

ScrappyDoo
11-12-2011, 15:29
I love my Bushmaster. It's not from walmart and its not popular on the internet.

Otherwise its awesome. But if you buy a Bushmaster and especially at Walmart, be prepared for lots of Internet bashing. Thankfully I could care less. Others may not.

larry_minn
11-12-2011, 16:17
I would handle the gun. Find out which model,type, features. I.E. 18" with flash spreader, flat top W/carry handle/rear sight, Chrome barrel (I think all Bushmaster are BUT Wally World is known for buying "one off" of well known items for cheap)
Part of the reason (I was told) is if they sell "Sony 37" model 30821" and you find Sony 37" model 30820 they don't have to price match. So just double check stuff. Make sure its 5.56 (or .223 if that what YOU want)
Take all info and compare online, at a gunshop. Thats the only way to know if you are getting a good deal (in your area)

I have seen similar ARs for $600 more then others. Just because of barrel, flat top, stock, front grip, (dust cover/none, forward assist/none).....

I recall seeing a DPMS for just over $600. Dressed out ones are closer to 2x that. (shoot same ammo, in 90% of folks they really won't notice much difference.

mhunter
11-12-2011, 17:43
Risking another completely unhelpful M&P15T type smart ass post... :upeyes:

Can 5.56 be shot on a limited basis in a .223 rifle?

Glockdude1
11-12-2011, 17:45
I love my Bushmaster. It's not from walmart and its not popular on the internet.

Otherwise its awesome. But if you buy a Bushmaster and especially at Walmart, be prepared for lots of Internet bashing. Thankfully I could care less. Others may not.

:agree:

Spartacus100
11-12-2011, 17:46
Nope......223 through a 5.56 is ok but you should not run 5.56 through the .223.........make sure the barrel is stamped 5.56 and you'll be fine.....and you can find them cheaper than that by looking around at the local gun stores or on some of the online sites.

Glockdude1
11-12-2011, 17:46
Can 5.56 be shot on a limited basis in a .223 rifle?

It is made for any and all 5.56 ammo you wish to feed it.

:cool:

dvrdwn72
11-12-2011, 17:52
You can build a good ar for about $700. Just do your research,

mhunter
11-12-2011, 17:56
It is made for any and all 5.56 ammo you wish to feed it.

:cool:

Was that a sarcastic or genuine comment? :dunno:

robinsok
11-12-2011, 18:00
Not sure if it was genuine or not, or sure what he meant, but 5.56 should not be fired unless the upper/barrel are marked for it.

HollowHead
11-12-2011, 18:06
Interesting. My Bushmaster has "CAL .223-5.56MM" stamped right on the receiver. HH

robinsok
11-12-2011, 18:09
Interesting. My Bushmaster has "CAL .223-5.56MM" stamped right on the receiver. HH

Right, so you can shoot either. Not all rifles are designed/stamped for both.

Gokyo
11-12-2011, 18:23
Interesting. My Bushmaster has "CAL .223-5.56MM" stamped right on the receiver. HH
Your joking right?

Who cares what is on the receiver. What matters is how the barrel is chambered.

Your receiver was designed for either 223 or 556. heck none of my receiver say anything about caliber. Are you telling me that they can not shoot any caliber.

HollowHead
11-12-2011, 18:27
Right, so you can shoot either. Not all rifles are designed/stamped for both.

What's the difference? My Speer reloading manual lists both together (case dimensions, loads and bullets). They do mention barrel twists being an issue with bullet and load, but don't differentiate between .223 and 5.56. HH

bug
11-12-2011, 18:50
What's the difference? My Speer reloading manual lists both together (case dimensions, loads and bullets). They do mention barrel twists being an issue with bullet and load, but don't differentiate between .223 and 5.56. HH

As I understand it, you can fire .223 in a 5.56 gun but you can not fire 5.56 in a 223 chambered gun... I think the pressures are much higher in 5.56.

Edit: found a good link about this.

http://www.thegunzone.com/556v223.html

mhunter
11-12-2011, 18:57
As I understand it, you can fire .223 in a 5.56 gun but you can not fire 5.56 in a 223 chambered gun... I think the pressures are much higher in 5.56.

Edit: found a good link about this.

http://www.thegunzone.com/556v223.html

Thanks for the link! So, looks like my dilemma is solved. Buy a rifle chambered for 5.56 and have both bases safely covered. Just seems like the 5.56 rifles are either a lot more expensive or just not available. I'm basing that on the fact that I'm local to J&G Sales in Prescott, AZ and they just don't have a lot of 5.56 rifles in stock.

mhunter
11-12-2011, 18:59
The local Wallyworld does have the Sig 556 in 5.56 for the same $897 price. Thoughts on that one? I seem to remember it not being very well liked, but I might be wrong.

chris in va
11-12-2011, 19:00
Check out the S&W M&P Sport then. $600-ish and has everything needed for the average range shooter.

bug
11-12-2011, 19:02
Thanks for the link! So, looks like my dilemma is solved. Buy a rifle chambered for 5.56 and have both bases safely covered. Just seems like the 5.56 rifles are either a lot more expensive or just not available. I'm basing that on the fact that I'm local to J&G Sales in Prescott, AZ and they just don't have a lot of 5.56 rifles in stock.


http://palmettostatearmory.com/2557.php

seen this the other day somewhere on here seems like a much better deal than the AR at wally world All mil spec and has a aimpoint.

Now I will bad mouth bushmaster at least the old bushmaster I had one I bought in the 90s and it was a good gun never a problem. however it only had a few thousand rounds through it and I never ran it hard so there is my story good or bad.

hope that helps.

Ragnar
11-12-2011, 19:05
The local Wallyworld does have the Sig 556 in 5.56 for the same $897 price. Thoughts on that one? I seem to remember it not being very well liked, but I might be wrong.

There were quality control issues with some of the early ones, but from reading the sig556 forum it looks like the current ones are fine.

HollowHead
11-12-2011, 19:21
Your joking right?

I'm as serious as a heart attack. HH

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l249/marmadukeruggles/008.jpg

mhunter
11-12-2011, 19:32
http://palmettostatearmory.com/2557.php

seen this the other day somewhere on here seems like a much better deal than the AR at wally world All mil spec and has a aimpoint.

That looks like a nice rifle with a decent optic and backup sight for only $100 more than the Wallyworld Bushmaster. Nice... Never heard of that company, though. Are they well respected or at least "decent"?

mhunter
11-12-2011, 19:34
What's the difference? My Speer reloading manual lists both together (case dimensions, loads and bullets). They do mention barrel twists being an issue with bullet and load, but don't differentiate between .223 and 5.56. HH

I thought the chamber pressure of 5.56 was considerably higher than .223, though...

Oh, and yet another noob question... Am I correct in thinking that mags for both calibers are the same and not caliber specific?

robinsok
11-12-2011, 19:35
I'm as serious as a heart attack. HH

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l249/marmadukeruggles/008.jpg

No no no no no, he is talking about the fact that it makes absolutely no difference what it says on the receiver, you could swap out 5 different uppers with various calibers regardless of what it says on the receiver. It's the barrel and upper that count.

Rooster Rugburn
11-12-2011, 19:42
You can compare that price with Buds and others. If that is the Patrolman's Carbine, Bushmaster sells it for around $1200. The devil is in the details though. Wal-Mart has a habit of dictating price to manufacturers and to meet their price, manufacturers have to use less expensive options. Wal Mart calls it a "promotional model". The WM rifle might not have the A2 sight, where the Bushmaster model does.

If you don't already know, learn the available options on an AR-15 and their price ranges and make sure you are comparing apples to apples.


I'm not going to lecture or make snide comments about Wal-Mart dropping politically incorrect firearms and firearms in general to appease the liberals, and are now only coming back to us because they have been having some BAD years. I would rather you own an AR-15 that you can afford than to stand on principle. But if you can find one somewhere else for an acceptable price, don't get it at Wal-Mart. They deserted us when they thought it was politically expedient, now they are coming back because we took our other business elsewhere.

They are only selling guns now because they have been hemorrhaging business and have stated such. They are also bringing back layaway for the same reason.

FWIW: Wal-Mart has stated the reason they are stocking guns again is that they want to go back to the 'one stop shopping' model. They didn't realize how many gun owners would stand on principle.

Glockdude1
11-12-2011, 19:48
Was that a sarcastic or genuine comment? :dunno:

Not sarcastic at all. Genuine.

:wavey:

mhunter
11-12-2011, 20:01
I would rather you own an AR-15 that you can afford than to stand on principle. But if you can find one somewhere else for an acceptable price, don't get it at Wal-Mart.

That M4 from Palmetto State in 5.56 with an Aimpoint and BUIS for $999 looks mighty tempting...

bug
11-12-2011, 20:07
That looks like a nice rifle with a decent optic and backup sight for only $100 more than the Wallyworld Bushmaster. Nice... Never heard of that company, though. Are they well respected or at least "decent"?

I have never personally used them. but I have read a lot of positive stuff from other Glocktalk guys about them.
And if I had a $1000 bucks I would buy it right now.

HollowHead
11-12-2011, 20:24
No no no no no, he is talking about the fact that it makes absolutely no difference what it says on the receiver, you could swap out 5 different uppers with various calibers regardless of what it says on the receiver. It's the barrel and upper that count.

This is a stock rifle unchanged from factory configuration. What am I missing about, "CAL .223-5.56MM?" HH

bug
11-12-2011, 20:47
This is a stock rifle unchanged from factory configuration. What am I missing about, "CAL .223-5.56MM?" HH


What you are missing is that whats marked on the barrel of your upper is what matters.
I could put a
.22 lr
.223 .204 ruger,5.46x45, 5.45x39,7.62x39,9mm,.40,.45, fn 5.7, 450 busmaster
.458 socom, 300 whisper, 300 black out, 6.8, .50 bmg upper, and I am sure i missed some.

On that lower thats marked .223/5.56.

NeverMore1701
11-12-2011, 20:58
Saw the 522 and 516 at the local store tonight. Wouldn't buy either, but it's good that Wal-Mart is expanding it's selection at least a little bit.

larry_minn
11-12-2011, 23:07
As said what is printed on lower receiver is NOT important. Its whats on barrel. The lower was made with 5.56 or .223 being caliber PLANNED for upper. It does NOT mean you can shoot either. (even if a fully built factory gun...)

Some folks feel .223 is more accurate. Slight changes in chamber/pressure. (I don't reload .223 so I don't know them off top of my head. Check AR-15 forum or Black rifle section on GT.

While there are cheaper places to buy... Supporting your local gun shop is still a good idea. Finding out WHAT gun/how built, what is on it and comparing it to similar guns at gun shop, online WILL give you a idea of value in your area. (remember online you will have to pay FFL fees. Wally World/Gun shops normally include NICS/FFL costs in price. (as well as shipping/insurance....)
I really would suggest a 5.56 for new shooter. BTW if you go to gun shop/ask questions/fondle guns buy a box or three of ammo. Its only polite.

igorts
11-13-2011, 02:08
My receiver says MULTICAL, but it does not mean anything.
But my Lothar Walter Barrel chambered in Wylde, so I can shoot both 5.56 and .223 and still hit what i aim for. (yes, you can shoot .223 from 5.56, but groups usually wider, and no, dont shoot 5.56 from .223 barrel).

Google is still available, use it.:whistling:

herose
11-13-2011, 02:34
Our wally world is also selling Federal XM?? (couldn't make it out) in 420 round cans already on stripper clips for $145. That seems like a pretty good deal.

Cochese
11-13-2011, 02:35
That M4 from Palmetto State in 5.56 with an Aimpoint and BUIS for $999 looks mighty tempting...

I highly recommend it over the Bushy based solely on the cost/benefit for both.

<--- LEO FI/AR-15 armorer.

I support issued Colts and Bushy and personally owned everything else from LMT to sabre to LWRC to Noveske to DD blah blah for over 150 people.

Our dept. owned Bushy XM-15s are a raging pain in my ass.

Total trashpiles. In their defense, they are issued to patrolmen who can break **** with the best of them.

I finally have enough Colts to keep Bushy off the street and for training and quals only. They are still a pain in my ass. FWIW.

Go PSA

JuneyBooney
11-13-2011, 02:49
Risking another completely unhelpful M&P15T type smart ass post... :upeyes:

Can 5.56 be shot on a limited basis in a .223 rifle?

:rofl:

Search
11-13-2011, 03:39
One of the Reserves at our department works at the gun counter at out Walmart here. Almost had a heart attack when he told me Walmart was selling rifles.

Apparently, they selected the top 500 stores in the country to experiment with the idea to see if they can make money.

Our Walmart is actually in the top 3 in the country in sales. They sold 3 Sig rifles in one day.

They apparently aren't bottom end rifles either. Someone did their research.

Now.. what are the odds Walmart jacked the prices up to make a profit? I'd say pretty high. Now.. what are the odds the rifles are of poor quality? They aren't. The fact that they are selling Sigs should give some hint to that.

From what he told me it has been a giant success.. so I would expect to see Walmart slowly start to expand it's gun inventory.

I personally would rather buy from someone who will give me a better price but not everyone in the world feels this way. It can only help the gun world.

ScrappyDoo
11-13-2011, 16:58
I would have loved to have had the PSA carbine with the AImpoint Pro. It wasn't available but sure I would have definitely looked hard, maybe even bought it.

The Bushmaster I bought was a good deal to me at $850- the most important thing is I am adn was happy. I didn't know about the Bushmaster hate nor did I know about the love affair of BCM. Maybe I would have bought sa BCM... the Recce 16 looks great. But the same reason I didn't buy a Colt (In NJ it would be the MT6400) for $1200-1300 is the same reason I rprob wouldn;t have got the BCM.. to me $850 is still 300-400 less.. and that 300-400 got me a LOT OF MAgpul furniture and accessories and upgrades... i would STILL have to spend it on the COlot or BCM.


But regardless. IF you are hapy with what yo get, no one should be able to shout you down and tell you you're wrong... That is my opinion anywya.

arodgers
11-13-2011, 17:11
Go with the Palmetto State Armory. They also have one for $599 with no optics if you don't want the Aimpoint.

jwhite75
11-13-2011, 17:43
Was just out there a few minutes ago. They had a Sig M400 Hunter (Magpul furniture and f20" barrel) for 897 MSRP 1099. A sig 522 for 487, and a camo Remington R-15. All very high end stuff for what they usually carry.

bug
11-13-2011, 17:52
I think your intended use should factor in as well.

If you just want to go every 3-4 months to the range and pop of a few hundred rounds, The bushmaster is fine.

If you are going to a 3-4 day carbine class and are plan to shoot 2500 rnds
or are training to deal with active shooters in a life and death situation and you put 1000 rounds down range every month, The bushmaster is NOT fine.

arodgers
11-13-2011, 17:54
I think your intended use should factor in as well.

If you just want to go every 3-4 months to the range and pop of a few hundred rounds, The bushmaster is fine.

If you are going to a 3-4 day carbine class and are plan to shoot 2500 rnds
or are training to deal with active shooters in a life and death situation and you put 1000 rounds down range every month, The bushmaster is NOT fine.

Considering you can get several brands of rifles that will do option #2 for cheaper, I don't see why the Bushmaster would ever be "fine".

mhunter
11-13-2011, 19:44
Go with the Palmetto State Armory. They also have one for $599 with no optics if you don't want the Aimpoint.

Hmmm... I also just remembered the 10% Wallyworld discount... I have a friend who works there. :whistling:

edited to add before people flip out: That would NOT be a straw purchase. I'd just borrow the discount card and swipe it when I buy it myself on my own credit card. Done it before...works fine. :cool:

brickboy240
11-14-2011, 17:04
897 bucks for a Bushmaster?

For almost 100 dollars more, you can get the Colt 6920.

When there was 200-400 dollar difference between Bushy and Colt...the Bushy made sense. Not now.

- brickboy240

QNman
11-14-2011, 20:25
Risking another completely unhelpful M&P15T type smart ass post... :upeyes:

Can 5.56 be shot on a limited basis in a .223 rifle?

That depends. Are you morally opposed to shrapnel in your face? :supergrin:

But seriously, NO! Let me ask you... Is it OK to shoot .357 magnum in a .38 on a limited basis?

Same concept.

And read the barrel, not the receiver.

mhunter
11-14-2011, 22:36
Is it OK to shoot .357 magnum in a .38 on a limited basis?

Are you talking about a .38 revolver? Are you a retard that doesn't think .357 rounds won't stick out the front of the cylinder? :upeyes:

QNman
11-14-2011, 22:41
Are you talking about a .38 revolver? Are you a retard that doesn't think .357 rounds won't stick out the front of the cylinder? :upeyes:

No need to be rude. You asked a question and I answered by example. I didn't call you names about it.

5.56 operates at higher pressures than .223 - just as magnums operate at higher pressures than specials.

And yes, I know that. Just as I know you can't shoot 5.56 out of a .223 barrel, even though you can make it fit.

ETA: note the "same CONCEPT" comment. That's your big clue.

mhunter
11-15-2011, 10:26
5.56 operates at higher pressures than .223 - just as magnums operate at higher pressures than specials.

And yes, I know that. Just as I know you can't shoot 5.56 out of a .223 barrel, even though you can make it fit.

ETA: note the "same CONCEPT" comment. That's your big clue.

No, it's not the "same CONCEPT". You can't make .357 magnum "fit" into a .38 special revolver to where you can even begin to try to fire it, unlike 5.56 vs .223...you said it yourself above. That comparison is NOT even an issue because it can't mistakenly be done.

Now do you understand the "CONCEPT"?

QNman
11-15-2011, 11:41
No, it's not the "same CONCEPT". You can't make .357 magnum "fit" into a .38 special revolver to where you can even begin to try to fire it, unlike 5.56 vs .223...you said it yourself above. That comparison is NOT even an issue because it can't mistakenly be done.

Now do you understand the "CONCEPT"?

Some here laughed because you asked an elementary question. I didn't laugh, I tried to answer your question. If you're going to be a jerk, don't be surprised if no one answers your questions in the future.

I find it comical that someone who doesn't know the difference between 5.56 and .223 would toss rocks at someone who tries to show, by example, what you clearly didn't understand by others answers. Answer you're own ignorant questions from now on. Google is your friend.

ghostman1960
11-15-2011, 17:04
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/zz159/ghostman1961/duty_calls.png

mhunter
11-15-2011, 17:11
I find it comical that someone who doesn't know the difference between 5.56 and .223 would toss rocks at someone who tries to show, by example, what you clearly didn't understand by others answers.

I do know there's a difference...that's why I ASKED. If I didn't know there were any difference and assumed they were the same then would I have even asked? NOPE. 5.56 and .223 are completely interchangeable from a "will it fit and function" standpoint. Trying to compare .38 special and .357 magnum in a .38 only revolver in the same light is just...retarded... :upeyes:

Answer you're own ignorant questions from now on. Google is your friend.Ironic comedy gold is ironic. :rofl:

Glockdude1
11-15-2011, 17:29
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/zz159/ghostman1961/duty_calls.png

I am surprised the "chart" has not shown up yet........

:cool:

QNman
11-15-2011, 18:32
I do know there's a difference...that's why I ASKED. If I didn't know there were any difference and assumed they were the same then would I have even asked? NOPE. 5.56 and .223 are completely interchangeable from a "will it fit and function" standpoint. Trying to compare .38 special and .357 magnum in a .38 only revolver in the same light is just...retarded... :upeyes:

Ironic comedy gold is ironic. :rofl:

http://chzgifs.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/facepalmzzzp11.gif

Welcome to my ignore list, genius.

ghostman1960
11-15-2011, 19:08
This constant petty arguing that goes on here and all the other boards is going to make me burn my laptop.

mvician
11-15-2011, 19:20
This constant petty arguing that goes on here and all the other boards is going to make me burn my laptop.


That's why I seldom come here anymore. :wavey:

ScrappyDoo
11-15-2011, 20:02
I am wondering something serious - do these or at least some of these genius winners , do they thinking winningly that the rifle comes with a Walmart rollmark or special blue and yellow? Furniture to identify it as a Walmart Rifle. .... So your savings of money become a stigma ?


Or worse yet. SayWalmart gets SA M1A .... Are they suddenly sucky ? Or better yet WALMART GETS THE SCAR- what then. ESP if the price is right. Do you continue teh Holier and Doooooshyer than thou or say the money like most walmArt patrons?

Gribble
11-15-2011, 21:11
That's why I seldom come here anymore. :wavey:
:goodpost:Kinda like :deadhorse: :outtahere:

NeverMore1701
11-15-2011, 21:15
That's why I seldom come here anymore. :wavey:

Same, only time I go to the BR forum is to see if there's any additions to the picture thread.