Bushmaster Carbon 15 [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Colt452zigzag28
11-16-2011, 13:45
I am somewhat new to the AR-15 world, however I am looking to get my first AR. The Carbon 15 is on sale everywhere the day after thanksgiving sale, ie Cabela's, Gander Mtn., for $600. Is that really a deal? And would it be a good rifle for patrol/3 gun comp? As my first one I want a decent rifle but one I can also try putting new parts on/customizing to make something that fits what I'm looking for. Thanks

MrMurphy
11-16-2011, 15:12
They're on sale for a reason.......avoid them.

Look at Bravo Company, Daniel Defense, Colt of course, LaRue, Noveske, a few others. The S&W M&P15 series for the money is also an excellent deal.

For a 'real world' use rifle these will hold up to severe usage.

For games and range time, most ARs will work. I would never shop at Gander Mountain or Cabelas for an AR.

bmoore
11-16-2011, 17:49
Im very happy with my Smith M&P15. I have had it for a few years now, and it has been 100%; even when I ran it dry thinking a spray of Remoil was enough lube. Im also extremely happy with my PSA dissy. BCM, Colt and other proven brands would make fine patrol rifles. That being said there are many people with thousands of rounds down their Bushmaster partol rifles. If I were a LE officer I would have an M1A socom 16 and or my scout squad but that is just me.

faawrenchbndr
11-16-2011, 18:12
Avoid the Carbon15 like the plague!

arclight610
11-16-2011, 18:30
You can get a PSA for 600

Matthew Courtney
11-17-2011, 10:41
I am somewhat new to the AR-15 world, however I am looking to get my first AR. The Carbon 15 is on sale everywhere the day after thanksgiving sale, ie Cabela's, Gander Mtn., for $600. Is that really a deal? And would it be a good rifle for patrol/3 gun comp? As my first one I want a decent rifle but one I can also try putting new parts on/customizing to make something that fits what I'm looking for. Thanks

The most positive attribute of the Carbon 15 rifles is their weight. They are 1-2 pounds lighter than comparably comfigured AR-15's and M-4's. If by "patrol" you mean foot patrol, the light weight may be a consideration. If by "Patrol" you mean a gun primarily borne by a vehicle, I'd go with a caliber heavier than .223. For 3 gun, I would advise a more robust rifle that would hold up better to high round counts and allow the shooter to better manage recoil for fast follow up shots.

WoodenPlank
11-17-2011, 10:44
You can get a PSA for 600


...and the PSA is a massive upgrade in quality over the Carbon 15. Stay FAR away from the Carbon 15.

pag23
11-17-2011, 17:21
If you are on a budget and you are comparing the Carbon 15 vs a PSA . Get the PSA as it is a good value for all the stated mil-spec parts you get with it. IMHO I like my Carbon 15, the updated ones are better than the first ones.

jobob
11-20-2011, 20:50
I bought a Carbon 15 for my wife a few years ago. As far as I can tell it's an excellent weapon for the money. No, I wouldn't deploy to the sandbox with it, but it isn't a bad gun at all. Those who say to avoid it, don't know it.

MrMurphy
11-20-2011, 22:23
Some of us who say avoid it, mean avoid it.

I've got over 500 rounds through several Carbon 15s. I wouldn't take one for free.

#1, it's a Bushmaster.

#2, it's a Carbon 15 with known associated issues.

crazymoose
11-21-2011, 02:38
EDIT: I also say go with the Palmetto State. In the price range, nothing can touch it.

Pic from another site. Guy claims a 120 lb female cop fell on the rifle during training:

http://i.minus.com/ibV6xy.JPG

WoodenPlank
11-21-2011, 10:34
Some of us who say avoid it, mean avoid it.

I've got over 500 rounds through several Carbon 15s. I wouldn't take one for free.

#1, it's a Bushmaster.

#2, it's a Carbon 15 with known associated issues.

If I remember correctly, several of the parts are proprietary, making repairs and upgrades harder.

Matthew Courtney
11-21-2011, 10:54
Pic from another site. Guy claims a 120 lb female cop fell on the rifle during training:

http://i.minus.com/ibV6xy.JPG

Somebody make an AR that won't break when one drops 120 pounds on it?

arclight610
11-21-2011, 11:13
Somebody make an AR that won't break when one drops 120 pounds on it?

I remember in Marine SOI that we did "2 man assisted lift" using our rifles as the lifting platform. Essentially one guy grabs the stock, another grabs the barrel, the guy stands on the receiver/handguard section, and you lift them onto the roof of a small building. The rifles didn't break, and didn't really lose zero if I can remember.

mjkeat
11-21-2011, 11:19
Somebody make an AR that won't break when one drops 120 pounds on it?

I fell on a Colt traipsing through the woods of Ft Drum. It was a night movement w/ ruck w/ your typical training load out. I got tangled up on some underbrush and went down hard on top of the M4.

At the time I was roughly 170 w/ 40 pounds of gear.

I got up and continued on my way a little pissed off at myself for being clumsy.

MrMurphy
11-21-2011, 15:11
I did a running faceplant on top of my M4 on top of concrete after tripping over a 'dead' guy in a nighttime training exercise.

185lb MrMurphy. 35lb of armor. 11lb of rifle (M203 attached). Approximately 20+lbs of equipment and grenades.

Didn't even scratch it.

faawrenchbndr
11-21-2011, 16:45
Somebody make an AR that won't break when one drops 120 pounds on it?


Come on over to my house,......I'll let ya step on mine!

Matthew Courtney
11-21-2011, 17:41
I remember in Marine SOI that we did "2 man assisted lift" using our rifles as the lifting platform. Essentially one guy grabs the stock, another grabs the barrel, the guy stands on the receiver/handguard section, and you lift them onto the roof of a small building. The rifles didn't break, and didn't really lose zero if I can remember.

Handy to know that they are so solid. I bent a gun barrel once by putting it behind the seat of a p/u and have tread upon them very lightly ever since.

pag23
11-21-2011, 17:51
Brief Carbon 15 review since I have one.

Pro: cost, very lightweight, chrome lined BCG, TRS-25 red dot (good value) extractor insert is blue with black o-ring. M4 feedramps with no alignment issues.

Con: thin barrel gets hot pretty quick, Buffer tube is Commercial not mil-spec, it doesn't like steel ammo. You will be itching to upgrade parts (buffer, spring, sight, etc). Unknown if bolt is mil-spec or not (not sure if Bushmaster labels them). Little more recoil felt than with aluminum built AR's.

Just my 2 cents...

jobob
11-21-2011, 22:41
Some of us who say avoid it, mean avoid it.

I've got over 500 rounds through several Carbon 15s. I wouldn't take one for free.

#1, it's a Bushmaster.

#2, it's a Carbon 15 with known associated issues.

Well, your #1 is a pro: I have 3 Bushmasters, 4 including the C-15. All are excellent firearms. My 20" Vmatch is superbly accurate and all are very reliable.

Your #2 (as is #1) is non-specific and just appears to be personal prejudice spawned from reading too much internet commando spew.

mjkeat
11-21-2011, 23:35
I did a running faceplant on top of my M4 on top of concrete after tripping over a 'dead' guy in a nighttime training exercise.

185lb MrMurphy. 35lb of armor. 11lb of rifle (M203 attached). Approximately 20+lbs of equipment and grenades.

Didn't even scratch it.

I completely forgot about the IBA and plates. What do those plates weigh, 15 or so pounds each?

So in reality Id say 170 plus 70 pounds of gear w/ IBA and plates.

I used to curse every oz. of weight and in the moment would have traded the Colt for something lighter but when it was time to work I doubt there was a guy around who didn't appreciate the reliability of a quality rifle.

For a $600 range gun, your choice. I don't want to get invovled in another "just as good as" debate but you did mention the word patrol.

Colt452zigzag28
11-22-2011, 01:05
Thanks for all the replies...I'm thinking of just waiting until the $600 turns into $1000 and getting something a little more higher quality! I'm a little more than 120lbs soo a rifle that wont break if I fall on it would be a plus. hahaha

MrMurphy
11-22-2011, 04:18
The #1 is...it's a Bushmaster. QC has noticeably dropped in the last 10 years and the probability of a lemon is significantly higher. Swapping BCG, charging handle and giving the internals a long look (proper staking, etc) would make me slightly more warm and fuzzy, but being a Bushmaster or similar brand means straight out of the box, the odds of it not being right are simply higher. Dislike it all you want, i've seen it and others have as well.

For a range piece or hunting, sure, no issues. For a patrol gun, i'd go over it with a fine toothed comb and run a solid 500 rounds through it without issues before trusting it.

On #2, Carbon 15s do have known issues. Such as cracking and shattering, using nonstandard parts (I consider any commercial tube a nonstandard part as well) and generally having more trouble as the gun heats up.

For a carry lots shoot never gun, probably not an issue. It is an issue for myself and anyone who might use the gun on duty or run significant round counts through it.

Call it 'internet crap' all you want, i'm not going on somebody's brother's cousin's next door neighbor's sister's boyfriend's barber's son's account, these are well known issues from legitimate sources.

crazymoose
11-22-2011, 19:39
Thanks for all the replies...I'm thinking of just waiting until the $600 turns into $1000 and getting something a little more higher quality! I'm a little more than 120lbs soo a rifle that wont break if I fall on it would be a plus. hahaha

The Palmetto State guns are getting the thumbs-up from the kinds of guys lots of people would call "internet snobs." The kinds of guys worth listening to because they shoot a lot, and see even more guns shot a whole lot.

Personally, I would buy one of the Palmetto State hammer forged barrel kits (preferable a mid length), and just buy a stripped lower locally. The kits have all the parts you need minus the lower receiver. It will be cheaper, and putting the parts in a lower is not tough. The only tools you need are a light hammer, a wrench for the castle nut ($10-20), and a couple of punches. Trust me, once you get one AR-15, you'll buy or build more later, so the tools are worth having.

txglocker23
11-23-2011, 15:30
I was considering a carbon 15 but I went with a stag arms model 2 instead

rkwrichard
11-23-2011, 19:46
Friends don't let friends buy AR 15 carbon..

faawrenchbndr
11-23-2011, 19:50
Friends don't let friends buy AR 15 carbon..



:rofl:

larry_minn
11-23-2011, 23:21
I have only got to (almost) fire one Carbon 15. It was at a range and the receiver... well I got it on video as it disintergrated. I saw part of it in viewfinder and a splash of black graphite. (what it looked like to me/thru veiwfinder)

I have to be fair. It did have a "fun switch" in it. (registered one) Good thing. The shooter had no injury.