J-Frame [Archive] - Glock Talk

PDA

View Full Version : J-Frame


LT642
11-30-2011, 06:40
For those who choose to carry a j-frame as an off duty weapon what setups are you using? I pocket carry my 642 off duty, especially during the hot South Florida summers. I've tried belt carry, but I've always thought that if I'm going to put on a owb holster, I'll carry "more" gun.

Any input as to how you carry your j-frame would be appreciated, just curious what setups others have tried and what you decided was best for you when you carry a j-frame.

CAcop
11-30-2011, 06:45
I have a Tucker iwb that can be concealed uner a tucked in shirt.

off road
11-30-2011, 07:23
Even though it is only ounces....I definitely notice the difference between a pocket carried 15 oz 642, and say an 11 oz 342 or 340PD.

If I was carrying IWB or OWB, no sense at all in pack a little J-bird. Might as well step up to a G26 that has twice the firepower and a very quick reload....

MeefZah
11-30-2011, 08:37
That's exactly my thoughts on a J frame being carried OWB... why?

I'd opt for a bigger belt gun if I were going OWB.

I personally don't like IWB carry.

I do carry my J frame off duty most generally on my ankle, same place I carry on duty. I use a Renegade (I think it is model 51 or 52...?). Has a wide strap to go over the hamerless section of the backstrap and is very comfortable and secure.

I sometimes drop it in a pocket without a holster, but that's mainly because I haven't found a good pocket holster yet. I only do that on "I'll be right back" kind of errands. I have tried Desantis Nemesis and RKBA pocket holsters, and I thought both were okay, but nothing great. I'm looking for a used Kramer horsehide, but if I can't find one used I suppose after Christmas I will cough up the $100 for one new.

NMG26
11-30-2011, 08:58
I use a Remora Holster. It is a no clip tuck/pocket holster.
I mostly appendix carry.

I have a Ruger LCR and a S&W 638


I carry a 5 shot speed strip in my front pocket.

When shooting I always practice with the speed strips.

jwhite75
11-30-2011, 09:40
I use the Desantis Nemesis pocket rig, but latley hav been using a Galco Summer Special in Black leather IWB. Great little setup up with a speedloader or speed strip in my weak side pocket.

Small gun small easy on and off rig conceals great. I wear it about the 230 position.

Ajon412
11-30-2011, 09:43
+1 for pocket carry......I currently use a Mika Pocket holster for my 640 and CA Bulldog. I'm also fond of the Uncle Mikes #3 and #4. I find the Mika more functional, as it has an "open mouth" design that doesn't close up after the weapon is drawn. These also work better if wearing cargo shorts and not jeans... It can be carried in either pocket for OD BUG use or as a primary. I also like the IWB / appendix carry as well. I also strongly agree with the idea of carrying at least one reload / speed strips, if not more...Tuff Products has speed strips in just about every caliber and neat belt pouchs to hold them...

MeefZah
11-30-2011, 11:19
Great little setup up with a speedloader or speed strip in my weak side pocket.

Hmmm, I always carry speedloaders or strips in the STRONG side pocket since I switch the gun to my left hand, holding it by the open cylinder and frame, and use the right (strong) to reload it.

I kinda thought that was the way. No?

Ajon412
11-30-2011, 11:29
Hmmm, I always carry speedloaders or strips in the STRONG side pocket since I switch the gun to my left hand, holding it by the open cylinder and frame, and use the right (strong) to reload it.

I kinda thought that was the way. No?

I was thinking the same thing...

msu_grad_121
11-30-2011, 11:32
Hmmm, I always carry speedloaders or strips in the STRONG side pocket since I switch the gun to my left hand, holding it by the open cylinder and frame, and use the right (strong) to reload it.

I kinda thought that was the way. No?

I agree, but I have seen a revolver reload put forth wherein the gun never leaves your right hand, and in fact, you never lose your firing grip on it. It looked a little convoluted to me, but he guy made it wrk, and pretty stinkin quick, too.

Ship A'Hoy
11-30-2011, 12:06
I don't use anything but the Desantis Nemesis pocket holster in the summer for my S&W 442.

I'm also right handed and keep my speed loaders/strips on my support side. The gun never leaves my right hand for reloading. It's fast and less chance to drop the gun.

CallMeIshmael
11-30-2011, 12:26
For those who choose to carry a j-frame as an off duty weapon what setups are you using? I pocket carry my 642 off duty, especially during the hot South Florida summers. I've tried belt carry, but I've always thought that if I'm going to put on a owb holster, I'll carry "more" gun.

Any input as to how you carry your j-frame would be appreciated, just curious what setups others have tried and what you decided was best for you when you carry a j-frame.
I also carry a M-642 S&W J-Frame. I use a Kramer pocket holster most of the time although I replaced the little boot grip with a larger PachmayrŪ SJ-C grip #03252. This grip is slightly larger than the "boot" grip the gun came with but it makes shooting it a lot easier. This grip though makes front pocket carry concealed impossible so I carry the gun in my back pocket covered (usually) by a Hawaiian shirt (I live in South Florida). Other times I use a DeSantis Cozy Partner. This is my second Cozy Partner, the first one not having the reinforcing band that the second one has. Both are very comfortable, the first being more comfortable but without the reinforcing band I have to virtually take my pants off to reholster the gun. The second Cozy Partner is not quite as comfortable but it has the reinforcing band making reholstering easy. I prefer the second for that reason.

I also have two ankle holsters, a Top-Line (padded nylon with a mid-calf support strap and an Alessi which I almost never wear. The Alessi is leather and very bulky with no mid-calf support which is why it stays in the shoe box. The Top-Line is almost 20 years old and was originally purchased for a M-60 S&W J-Frame which I used to own. I had the velcro retention strap relocated on it by a shoe repair shop to retain the internal hammer 642. This holster is very comfortable so much so I sometimes forget I'm wearing it.

I hope this helps.

3Speedyfish3
11-30-2011, 13:27
I carry an M&P 340 w/ Crimson Trace in the front shock plate pocket of my ballistic vest. Tuff strip with 5 GDHPs rides in dominant side front pants pocket. I wrote an article here: http://www.bluesheepdog.com/2011/05/26/reload-revolver/

Randall

Ajon412
11-30-2011, 13:54
I carry an M&P 340 w/ Crimson Trace in the front shock plate pocket of my ballistic vest. Tuff strip with 5 GDHPs rides in dominant side front pants pocket. I wrote an article here: http://www.bluesheepdog.com/2011/05/26/reload-revolver/

Randall

:thumbsup:...Randall, good article and I've read it before on your site...Covers both methods of reloading. Use whichever works for you and as you've mentioned, carry at least 1 reload, if not more..Just my .02.....:wavey:

CallMeIshmael
11-30-2011, 13:57
For those who choose to carry a j-frame as an off duty weapon what setups are you using? I pocket carry my 642 off duty, especially during the hot South Florida summers. I've tried belt carry, but I've always thought that if I'm going to put on a owb holster, I'll carry "more" gun.

Any input as to how you carry your j-frame would be appreciated, just curious what setups others have tried and what you decided was best for you when you carry a j-frame.

I also carry a M-642 S&W J-Frame. I use a Kramer pocket holster most of the time although I replaced the little "boot" grip with a larger PachmayrŪ SJ-C grip #03252. This grip is slightly larger than the "boot" grip the gun came with but it makes shooting it a lot easier. This grip though makes front pocket concealed carry impossible so I carry the gun in my back pocket covered (usually) by a Hawaiian shirt (I live in South Florida). Other times I use a DeSantis Cozy PartnerŪ. This is my second Cozy PartnerŪ, the first one not having the reinforcing band that the second one has. Both are very comfortable but without the reinforcing band on the first Cozy PartnerŪ reholstering requires me to virtually take my pants off. With the reinforcing band on the second Cozy PartnerŪ this is not necessary and that holster is still very comfortable.

I also have two ankle holsters, a padded nylon Top-Line with a top of the calf velcro support strap and a leather Alessi which I never wear. The Alessi is bulky and has no top of the calf support strap so it stays in the shoe box until the day I can get somebody to buy it. The Top-Line was originally purchased to hold a S&W M-60 (which has an external hammer) so I had the retention strap moved by a shoe repair shop to hold the internal hammer M-642. This holster is so comfortable that I often forget I'm wearing it.
I hope this helps.

fastbolt
11-30-2011, 14:51
I'm with you, LT642.

While I've previously used belt holsters, and still own a handful of them for J-frames, I typically tend to use a pocket holster. If I feel like using a belt holster, I'll generally choose from among my larger guns. I think the gun ought to weigh more than the holster. :rofl:

Back when I was teaching at conferences or attending out-of-town meetings I'd sometimes slip an Airweight into a pocket holster and carry in the front pocket of my suit slacks. Handier that way. I could remove my suit or sport coat and remain unobtrusively armed.

I look at ankle carry as being something more of a special circumstance carry method, meaning it's pretty practical and easy when seated in a vehicle. Otherwise, I have no interest in ankle carry.

I actually have one of those slick little Ken Null plastic pull-through shoulder rigs I bought many years ago (for a SP101). I can't remember the last time I used it, though. I came across it the other day and idly thought that maybe I should try to put it back into use sometime.

MeefZah
11-30-2011, 15:38
I also carry a M-642 S&W J-Frame. I use a Kramer pocket holster most of the time

Thoughts on the Kramer?

I use and love the MSP Paddle for my Glocks, and I want to pull the trigger on a Kramer pocket holster... but $100... talk me into it.

DaBigBR
11-30-2011, 17:37
I have a Kramer for my 642, but prefer the nemesis. The Kramer came with the gun (bought it used). It's a nice holster, but not as "grippy" in the pocket.

Goldstar225
11-30-2011, 18:53
When I carry my 642 I use the Mika pocket holster with a Bianchi speedstrip for a reload.

AngryBassets
11-30-2011, 18:57
All summer, if I'm not working, my 642 sits A-IWB in an ancient Bianchi IWB holster that's probably older than me (got it for $2 out of a used holster bin soon after I got my first j-frame, a year after I started in 1994). If I'm working, or slumming around in sweats or my fancyman AF wind pants, it's likely on my ankle in a renegade.

If I'm carrying on my IWB belt and it's not hot out, I carry my duty gun in a CTAC.

I have a 27, and need to order a new Ankle Glove. I gave my newer one away and my old one isn't serviceable anymore.

collim1
11-30-2011, 19:00
On-duty as a BUG I carry my 442 on my ankle.

I pocket carry in an Uncle Mike's pocket holster when I need a discreet carry for dress clothes off-duty.

Occasionally (rarely) mostly in summer I'll carry it OWB in a leather Don Hume thumsnap holster with a speed loader in a belt pouch up front.

MeefZah
11-30-2011, 20:57
I have a Kramer for my 642, but prefer the nemesis. The Kramer came with the gun (bought it used). It's a nice holster, but not as "grippy" in the pocket.

I'd gladly take it off your hands... name your price iffen you want.

fla2760
12-01-2011, 01:20
I use either a MIKA round cut or a DeSantis Nemisis for pocket carry of my 642.

EMTCOP
12-01-2011, 02:01
I carry my 642 in a Gary Brommeland IWB holster. The leather is very thin, but stiff, and the metal clip is very sturdy. I have had it for 10 plus years, and it is still as good as new.

I carry two Bianchi Speed Strips in a pocket on the opposite side of
the gun.

LT642
12-01-2011, 05:18
It seems like those of us who carry j-frames are using similar carry methods. Thanks to all who took the time to respond.

Stay safe!!

SCSU74
12-01-2011, 07:49
on duty i use an uncle mikes vest holster. off duty i throw it in my cargo pocket, i dont even own a belt holster for it

freeride88
12-02-2011, 02:13
I have a simple tuckable leather holster for my airweight that I use occasionally with church wear. Otherwise, it rides in a pocket holster or on the vest.

IGotIt
12-02-2011, 06:08
I use a hip grip. Real comfortable and you can wear a shirt tucked in if you choose.

federali
12-02-2011, 07:26
I own a Model 37 but rarely carry it anymore. They're wonderful guns but you must respect their limitations. It's a personal defense gun, not a gun you'd want to use to intervene in a robbery in progress or against multiple assailants.
Please see the following:
http://articles.nydailynews.com/1998-01-08/news/18073200_1_police-sergeant-robbery-marvin-brown

freeride88
12-02-2011, 12:32
I use a hip grip. Real comfortable and you can wear a shirt tucked in if you choose.

I can't see how you can tuck a shirt around that.

fastbolt
12-02-2011, 15:42
I own a Model 37 but rarely carry it anymore. They're wonderful guns but you must respect their limitations. It's a personal defense gun, not a gun you'd want to use to intervene in a robbery in progress or against multiple assailants.


Indeed, for reason of them being smaller and harder to shoot effectively for most people, they wouldn't be my first choice for an off-duty weapon which I'd use if I felt it necessary & appropriate to invoke peace officer status and intervene in a robbery, especially one involving more than a couple of armed suspects.

However, while I can think of situations where a cop was killed when a 5-shot revolver was involved, I can also remember a couple reported instances when a 5-shot revolver was 'enough gun' to use against at least a couple of armed suspects.

Gotta consider the owner/user factor, too, right?

I can also remember when I used to take my issued 6-shot service revolver to calls which involved shots-fired, burglaries & robberies-in-progress. Sure, I had a shotgun in the car, but my only handgun was a 6-shot revolver. The heavier weight made them generally easier to shoot controllably, the longer barrels made for better potential practical accuracy and they held 1 more round.

I look at the J-frames (and similar 5-shot snubs) as a weapon which has to be considered within situational context, meaning it can (and should) be mastered by the owner/user, and the very attributes which can often make it harder and more difficult to use can also make it easier to carry, and therefore more likely to be carried.

I've listened to a couple of seminars where it was offered that statistics indicate that at most maybe 20% of active cops carry off-duty. (I'd be surprised if the number was that large for retired cops.) I've had opportunity to speak to a fair number of folks who had CCW licenses, and very few of them ever claimed to carry much of the time, let alone all of the time.

This is probably why the diminutive 'pocket pistol calibers' are so popular, although that involves a different sort of compromise once you start talking about something less than a traditional LE service caliber for the last 50-75 years. Different subject.

The modern J-frame offers a range of options in weight, barrel length, sight configurations and caliber nowadays. While I tend to lean more toward the +P for my needs (except in a SP101DAO, which I usually consider to be more of a belt gun, for me), some folks find standard pressure .38 Spl or .357 Magnum to suit their needs (or perhaps the new .327 Magnum, I suppose).

So, while I do tend to agree that a J-frame owner/user ought to understand and respect their inherent limitations, I also tend to think that it's the knowledge, skillset & experience of the owner/user which is even more critical than the actual weapon/caliber/ammunition.

I feel much the same way, it seems, as I'll sometimes choose a pistol with greater (6-10 rd) capacity for some situations where I feel I'd rather not just have a 5-shot J.

Lots to think about ... and your comments were succinct and to the point. :wavey:

fla2760
12-02-2011, 18:12
Indeed, for reason of them being smaller and harder to shoot effectively for most people, they wouldn't be my first choice for an off-duty weapon which I'd use if I felt it necessary & appropriate to invoke peace officer status and intervene in a robbery, especially one involving more than a couple of armed suspects.

However, while I can think of situations where a cop was killed when a 5-shot revolver was involved, I can also remember a couple reported instances when a 5-shot revolver was 'enough gun' to use against at least a couple of armed suspects.

Gotta consider the owner/user factor, too, right?

I can also remember when I used to take my issued 6-shot service revolver to calls which involved shots-fired, burglaries & robberies-in-progress. Sure, I had a shotgun in the car, but my only handgun was a 6-shot revolver. The heavier weight made them generally easier to shoot controllably, the longer barrels made for better potential practical accuracy and they held 1 more round.

I look at the J-frames (and similar 5-shot snubs) as a weapon which has to be considered within situational context, meaning it can (and should) be mastered by the owner/user, and the very attributes which can often make it harder and more difficult to use can also make it easier to carry, and therefore more likely to be carried.

I've listened to a couple of seminars where it was offered that statistics indicate that at most maybe 20% of active cops carry off-duty. (I'd be surprised if the number was that large for retired cops.) I've had opportunity to speak to a fair number of folks who had CCW licenses, and very few of them ever claimed to carry much of the time, let alone all of the time.

This is probably why the diminutive 'pocket pistol calibers' are so popular, although that involves a different sort of compromise once you start talking about something less than a traditional LE service caliber for the last 50-75 years. Different subject.

The modern J-frame offers a range of options in weight, barrel length, sight configurations and caliber nowadays. While I tend to lean more toward the +P for my needs (except in a SP101DAO, which I usually consider to be more of a belt gun, for me), some folks find standard pressure .38 Spl or .357 Magnum to suit their needs (or perhaps the new .327 Magnum, I suppose).

So, while I do tend to agree that a J-frame owner/user ought to understand and respect their inherent limitations, I also tend to think that it's the knowledge, skillset & experience of the owner/user which is even more critical than the actual weapon/caliber/ammunition.

I feel much the same way, it seems, as I'll sometimes choose a pistol with greater (6-10 rd) capacity for some situations where I feel I'd rather not just have a 5-shot J.

Lots to think about ... and your comments were succinct and to the point. :wavey:

I agree re the snubs inherent limitations. Here is a link to some good articles on the snub as well as other guns.

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/Making%20J%20Frame%20Work.htm

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/OtherHandguns.htm

Arvinator
12-02-2011, 18:36
I own four different S&W J frame .38 snubbies. I have my 642 in a nylon pocket holster as I type this in my left front pocket (Jeans) and when in dockers/slacks I use a Desantis Nemesis holster, same carry.
On duty, the 642 rides in a Uncle Mikes body armor holster as my deep conceal backup. My Model 38 rides in my left rear pocket in a Uncle Mike's pocket holster.
For years, when wearing open top boots to work, my Model 60 was in a Bianchi Model 12 ankle holster, right ankle, butt forward. My well worn/used Model 37 with the hammer partially bobbed wearing oversize pachmayr grips stays home one of my "Out of sight,in my mind guns" for home defense. When we leave the house, they all go in the gun safe.
Each snub is loaded with Federal's "Nyclad" standard pressure hollowpoint. I have tested them in a water tank at a crime lab, and they performed well, and I killed a deer with 3 broke legs but no torso/head injuries in a freak accident. Speed strip rides in my right front pocket with 6 spare rounds.
Knowing that my snubbie saved my backside in 1992 when I was scuffling/arresting a drunk a man snick up behind and snatched my S&W 9mm (On safe) that was in my holster. Lucky for me the guy was fumbling with my Model 659 and I dealt with the problem quick and my then Taurus Model 85 snubbie was there for me.
I will say I am very fond and partial to 38 snubs for backup carry...

DaBigBR
12-03-2011, 03:34
I agree re the snubs inherent limitations. Here is a link to some good articles on the snub as well as other guns.

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/Making%20J%20Frame%20Work.htm

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/OtherHandguns.htm

If you like Mr. Camp's articles, I suggest you save them. He passed away last Spring at 59. I've always enjoyed his work.

thinkfast
12-04-2011, 12:25
Mitch Rosen Pocket Softy, got a left hand model for weak side front pocket carry. It's my only 'big name' holster--and it's awesome. After 7-8 yrs of almost daily wear it's molded itself to the snub and my leg--can hardly tell it is there anymore.

It was a little pricey but I can probably get 15-20 yrs out of it. Or more.

fla2760
12-04-2011, 20:51
If you like Mr. Camp's articles, I suggest you save them. He passed away last Spring at 59. I've always enjoyed his work.

I was not aware of that may Mr Camp RIP.

DaBigBR
12-05-2011, 09:36
I was not aware of that may Mr Camp RIP.

Yep. Really pretty sad. He was an excellent resource and always a gentleman.

Snafu
12-06-2011, 06:28
I don't believe anyone has mentioned using appendix IWB carry for these snubbies. I often carry my 442 or 642 this way when hiking if I don't bring my G23. I also have carried this way in the summer with shorts and an untucked tee shirt if I don't feel the need for a large gun. I can carry my S&W 64 2" the same way with no trouble at all.

I will use a cheap nylon holster and have not had any problems with retention.

The added bonus is the draw is very quick with a little practice.

jwhite75
12-06-2011, 06:46
Hmmm, I always carry speedloaders or strips in the STRONG side pocket since I switch the gun to my left hand, holding it by the open cylinder and frame, and use the right (strong) to reload it.

I kinda thought that was the way. No?

I will say I have had no formal training with a revolver. I have carried autos on duty since I started my career, and am not authorized a BUG, so this is strictly off duty use.

I release the cylinder with my strongside thumb, point the gun up ejector skyward, while drawing my reload, then hit the ejector allowing gravity to assist since primers are pointed down. Then rotate the gun barrel down and insert reload. The barrel pointing down also gets gravity to assist on the reload. Just how I do it.

I am smart enough to know if I were to get some formal training with a revolver I would probably learn a better way to do it. LOL

I am not sure if it has any bearing but I am left eye dominant and ambidextrous.

fla2760
12-06-2011, 12:32
I don't believe anyone has mentioned using appendix IWB carry for these snubbies. I often carry my 442 or 642 this way when hiking if I don't bring my G23. I also have carried this way in the summer with shorts and an untucked tee shirt if I don't feel the need for a large gun. I can carry my S&W 64 2" the same way with no trouble at all.

I will use a cheap nylon holster and have not had any problems with retention.

The added bonus is the draw is very quick with a little practice.
This is my preferred position for iwb carry but I use a decent leather holster.

2-8 Marine
12-06-2011, 13:43
I'm completely satisfied with my High Noon, Mr. Softy. Light, comfortable, reliable and inexpensive.

fla2760
12-06-2011, 14:50
I'm completely satisfied with my High Noon, Mr. Softy. Light, comfortable, reliable and inexpensive.

I like the High Noon Mr Softy holsters too.

Snafu
12-06-2011, 15:28
I use the High Noon Mr. Softy for my G23 carried in the appendix IWB position and love it. Their similar holster for the J frame just carries too high for my tastes. I have a kydex version from another maker and truly don't see a great advantage for my needs.

I will say that I feel it's important to carry a gun in a holster for most cases. The Hip Grip works if you don't envision running or fighting. Since my J frame is usually carried in the woods, I haven not had to do either and really can't picture needing to do so.

kayl
12-07-2011, 20:21
I pocket carry in a Mika for OD, no BUGs allowed :)

I highly recommend the Apex Tactical J-Frame kit! :)