.224 Boz. [Archive] - Glock Talk

PDA

View Full Version : .224 Boz.


twisted1
12-02-2011, 00:05
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/.224_Boz
Reading on this 10mm necked down to a .223, and found it pretty amazing. I'm gonna shoot lonewolf an email seeing if we can possibly get a barrel made. All we would need is some reloading dies right?

twisted1
12-02-2011, 00:13
Pictures. http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu295/sld225/9bff7c6d.jpg
http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu295/sld225/cbd171b8.jpg

arushus
12-02-2011, 06:49
You may be ableto find a lil bit of info on the .224boz on bren-ten.com...its somewhere in there...

_The_Shadow
12-02-2011, 10:33
Hey Twisted1, The 224 BOZ was an interesting cartridge. The Glock and 1911 pistols had thier slides skeletonized because these neck down cartridges have a very short impulse duration. The 224BOZ pointed bullets were oiginally used to defeat soft body armor.

Why don't you try the 9x25Dillon, barrels, ammunition and dies are readily avalible, use .355"/.356" bullets driven as fast as the 224BOZ. I remeber you were considering getting into handloading and neither of these cartridges lend themselves to first time reloaders.

I have been playing with the 9x25Dillon for a while and still developing loads for it using various bullets. The most critical part of loading for thes will be proper head spacing as the casing is sized and neck tension to prevent bullet set back!

awdxtc
12-02-2011, 11:06
That is one strange looking round.

_The_Shadow
12-02-2011, 15:10
I had thought about the 224BOZ, but ended up with the 9x25Dillon for several reasons as mentioned above.

If memory serves me, the 224BOZ cartridge needs to be annealed and the neck shaped in stages...Whereas the 9x25Dillon can be shaped with the Dillon die in one pass or step. It has a larger case capacity also, which helps with powder charges.

http://i1086.photobucket.com/albums/j441/_The_Shadow/9X25Pic.jpg

VN350X10
12-07-2011, 20:43
The BOZ is a propriatary(sp) ctg. & nobody will make reamers, etc. for it. You would need to change the dimensions just a bit (couple of thou should do it) and give YOUR version a new name, then reamers & dies made from them become zero problem. Just DON'T mention the BOZ in any corespondence to a reamer mfgr.
The idea of a 15 round .221 Fireball semi-auto is kind of neat, but I'd go with a 6" bbl to get the max out of it.
Good of a reason as any for a custom long slide. Just be prepared to do a lot of R&D to get it to function 100%.

uncle albert

Kegs
12-08-2011, 06:34
cut down 7.62 AP bullet in a sabot @ 2000 fps. Pretty much accomplishes everything the boz would. Challenge is finding materials and putting it together legally.

Good luck.

VN350X10
12-08-2011, 16:55
Where can you find .40 to .30 sabots ? Or is this a fab as you go thing ?


uncle

Javelin
12-08-2011, 17:20
Seems like a solution looking for a problem.

If you are going to go to all that work stuffing a .223 bullet into something I would recommend the .50BMG personally

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_koyhDsKjI3g/SqAvv9PHELI/AAAAAAAAAm8/T7KFwb7pwj4/s400/overbore.jpg

Javelin
12-08-2011, 17:22
55gr@6500fps.... that's where things get real :whistling:

_The_Shadow
12-08-2011, 18:03
That sure does look like its photoshop'd...

_The_Shadow
12-08-2011, 18:23
Sabots...
http://www.eabco.com/reload02.html
http://www.mmpsabots.com/

VN350X10
12-08-2011, 21:11
the .223-50 can (and has) happened, but there are a couple of serious problems...

1) Barrell life is measured in dozens of rounds

2) Even with all that powder, the max velocity is going to be around 5300 fps, as nitrocelluose powders just can't burn fast enough to exceed this level. Ask the guys @ Sierra bullets who TRY to get projectiles to vaporize in flight, to make sure us varmint hunters don't have it happen.
Last time I talked to a tech, they were using a 22-.284 wildcat with 36" of barrel and topped out about 5250 fps. I called asking about bullet blowup with my .220 Swift. They said "Good Luck!"

uncle albert

21Carrier
12-09-2011, 02:01
In case you guys have never seen it, or forgotten about it, check out the sticky thread above, titled, "Hey Tazz, how's the .223XR coming?" That was a thread about duplicating the .224Boz. One of our old members (Tazz, owner of the Agrip company) was on a quest to make his own .224Boz clone. He was initially going to neck down the 10mm brass to accept a .223 bullet (like the Boz), but changed his idea to making a sabot. After much promising, stalling, and many excuses, it ended in nothing. I read the whole thread.

It's a cool idea, but it's not feasible unless you have lots of money to spend. You will either have to develop your own cartridge, or develop your own sabot. As far as I know, no sabot exists for such a conversion (.400" to .223"). Either option will be VERY expensive, and require some serious engineering.

The best option is the 9x25 Dillon. With it, you get as much velocity, more power, and 9mm diameter. It won't defeat body armor, but you don't need that. Besides, I doubt the .224Boz is particularly effective. .223 bullets are meant for much higher velocity, and are not very effective at lower velocity.

_The_Shadow
12-09-2011, 12:45
The thing with a sabot which needs to be fairly thick, takes up space on the base which reduces powder space in the casing. Likewise the reducing of neck of the cartridge also takes away the powder capacity to an extent.

The 224BOX has a much shorten casing in forming the neck to allow for the use of the pointed bullet, seated 1.291" this is too long for many gun magazines & actions (standard COL 1.250-1.260") that can still cycle up and thru the action of the weapon. This reduced the case capacity further.

If one were to do the 224BOZ, strickly as a project, these things need to be taken into account. Also the original guns had their slides skelotonized to lighten up the total mass to improve reliable ejection from the short duration impulse...

I was communicating with a fellow that had done his own 224BOZ project, but have lost touch with him.

I am not trying to sway or discourage anyone but merely share things about what goes into the process of such a project.

Having the barrel cut to fit the particular firearm and chambered to be of proper head spacing to match dies and cartridges. I my opinion Glock's may be better because so many aftermarket parts and items and barrel makers...1911 would be next choice but more expensive overall.

Having die set to form the cases, this may consist of several dies and requier certain steps to form the cases which might include annealing to keep the brass from cracking or spliting during the forming process. **Fire forming might be needed to have cases that truely fit the chamber correctly?

*Note - Dillon's dies for the 9X25 have carbide sections for both 10mm section and 9mm section, a definite plus to case forming process.

Loading of cartridges would require attention to maintain proper head spacing, neck tension and cartridge overall lengths for reliable feeding...
The lising above shows small rifle primers, so this would require cases with small primers like those of the Federal NT(non toxic primer) or other simular. These are not found every day but do exist.
Load data is scarace with only uses of suggested powders in the info above, pressure data NOT defined.

Therefore a balance of powders' burn rate to ejection cycle could cause ejection timing issues...This will take a lot of trial and effort testing.
Too fast of burn rate = poor performance or higher pressure than desired.
Too slow of burn rate = poor performance or pressures which remain too high, holding the casing swollen to the chamber walls for the cycle. Or too slow to burn in the shorter barrel length.

While it can be done, it will take time to work thru all of these facets involved!