Is your department a weapons hog? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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JuneyBooney
12-21-2011, 09:02
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/12/20/local-cops-ready-for-war-with-homeland-security-funded-military-weapons.html

I was curious if your department is a "weapons hog" since 9-11?:cool: Interesting article about even small departments having rather cool weapons with no crime.

Back in the late 80's cops had normal hair and even in the academy the hair was normal bank type style with a mustache allowed and goatee for undercover and long hair. After 9-11 short military hair seems normal for most non undercover work. Semi militarization also seems to have taken place over these years too. I don't know if it is good or not but it has happened. Some of the older officers I know still have normal haircuts. Do you guys think it is the money that changed things or the war on terror etc?

K-9 Unit

The Fargo Police Department has three dogs assigned to its K-9 unit.
The use of police canines helps keep officers out of danger and can even reduce the chance of serious injury to suspects in certain situations. Sometimes offenders try to hide from officers in places where a dog is much more efficient in finding them. Some of these offenders are very dangerous and may be armed. The use of the dogs helps reduce the danger for officers during apprehension efforts. The dogs may also allow officers to avoid using higher levels of force, including deadly force, to take offenders into custody.
http://www.cityoffargo.com/attachments/72c9d01d-c844-4922-81cd-0dc96c9d962a/K9BlueAngel.jpg

Now that would be cool..a fighter plane and a k9 unit.

DaBigBR
12-21-2011, 09:15
No slant in that article at all.

vanilla_gorilla
12-21-2011, 09:25
I only get to use the weapons I supply, and I have shaved my head for nearly ten years, though I completed the academy two years ago. [shrug]

Of course it's all that money that's behind it. That is why Fargo's K9 unit pictured is a truck that's about 10 years old, and probably near falling apart. :upeyes:

Morris
12-21-2011, 09:36
No slant in that article at all.

Nooooooooooooo, not at all.

The comments were humorous to read though. Alex Jones has some serious fans/tin foil investors.

JuneyBooney
12-21-2011, 09:36
I only get to use the weapons I supply, and I have shaved my head for nearly ten years, though I completed the academy two years ago. [shrug]

Of course it's all that money that's behind it. That is why Fargo's K9 unit pictured is a truck that's about 10 years old, and probably near falling apart. :upeyes:

You are probably right about the truck. I see that in a number of cities. You see that in businesses too since the recession. I don't think the article really grasps the entire economic picture.

CJStudent
12-21-2011, 10:18
http://katie73.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/dont-feed-the-troll.jpg

Cochese
12-21-2011, 10:40
Should we have hair like this tool?

http://www.hairstylesdesign.com/articles/photos/86.jpg

Cochese
12-21-2011, 10:41
Since that seems to be what everyone I arrest for drugs/DUI/ dating DV, etc all have.

:upeyes:

JuneyBooney
12-21-2011, 10:49
Should we have hair like this tool?

http://www.hairstylesdesign.com/articles/photos/86.jpg

That is how cops used to look..but their hair was combed. :cool:

wprebeck
12-21-2011, 10:58
That is how cops used to look..but their hair was combed. :cool:

Why don't we ask some old timers? SAR, ateamer, Dragoon, Trigger finger, et al

They actually did the job, instead of reading about it on a real life version of The X-Files "Lone Gunman" website.

GioaJack
12-21-2011, 11:18
Our hair standards were almost exactly the same as the military; could not fall over the ears, lay across the collar or extend below the eyebrows.

Abiding by the regulations but yet fitting in with the social norm of the non-military look was a rather simple matter.

You let your hair grow out until you had tested the seriousness of verbal warnings from your Sgt., LT and possibly even your station commander then just before you were written up you made an appointment to have your hair permed.

Rather than walking around 'high and tight' the perm allowed for a thick, long looking haircut but yet did not violate the ear, collar or eyebrow guidelines.

Getting a perm was a bit uncomfortable since this was a time of either women's beauty salons or men's barber shops and one did not usually defile another's domain. It seems a bit incongruent to wear a 1911 in a shoulder holster under a lavender smock whilst sitting under a hot air dryer with pink curlers in your hair but it was worth the embarrassment since the ladies seemed to appreciate the end result.

Mustaches were also governed by military standards but were not enforced as diligently and unless you tried to get away with a full blown Fu Manchu you were pretty much good to go.


Jack

mrsurfboard
12-21-2011, 11:19
Hair styles have adjusted with the times. Mustaches are out, because they are no longer in style. Only those living in a "TJ Hooker" time warp still have them.

longhaulcop
12-21-2011, 11:23
Ours are pretty close to Military style could not fall over the ears, lay across the collar or extend below the eyebrows. Our policy manual even has pictures. Most of the new officers now seem to like the bald head look, while I'm still sporting a crew cut.

ateamer
12-21-2011, 11:49
Um, who wears a mustache anymore? And departments are too military in structure? Really? So you're saying that calling sergeants by first name, not having formal standing-in-formation roll call every day and not wearing hats except for ball caps and beanies is "becoming more military-like"? Being asked for your side of the story instead of automatically being disciplined and getting to choose your shift and days off is too much like the military? Wearing easy-care hairstyles that also happen to be extremely popular among the general population means that we are militarized? Newsflash, pal, short hair parted to one side with short sideburns has been out of date for 20 years. No one combs their hair like an insurance salesman from 1961 anymore.

ateamer
12-21-2011, 11:55
Oh, and those Class A uniforms that people like the OP like so much? They're based on military dress uniforms. Cargo pants and sewn-on cloth badges are actually practical and far more useful than tailored wool and hats that are more properly suited for drill instructor.

TBO
12-21-2011, 11:58
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v90/TheeBadOne/TBO/ThePolice.jpg

Dukeboy01
12-21-2011, 13:21
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v90/TheeBadOne/TBO/ThePolice.jpg

Heh. I support the militarization of The Police.

Dukeboy01
12-21-2011, 13:31
Newsflash, pal, short hair parted to one side with short sideburns has been out of date for 20 years. No one combs their hair like an insurance salesman from 1961 anymore.

HEY! At least I still have hair to part! And you should consider getting more life insurance. It's not just for piece of mind, it's an investment.

In all seriousness, I think that male pattern baldness dictates police hairstyles more than the regs do, at least at my agency. The guys with thinning hair lean into it nowadays and go for the full cueball instead of toupees and combovers. Guys who are blessed with luxuriant flowing locks like me have haircuts like... extras on "Mad Men" according to some people.

That, and everybody wants to emulate Vic Mackey from "The Shield," a character who was 180 degrees from the paramilitary discipline model that's freaking the civil libertardians like Alex Jones out.

SAR
12-21-2011, 13:36
Why don't we ask some old timers? SAR, ateamer, Dragoon, Trigger finger, et al

They actually did the job, instead of reading about it on a real life version of The X-Files "Lone Gunman" website.

Actually, through the 70's a lot of guys had bushy mustaches and sideburns like Vic Morrow in "Police Story." Even though times were strict and many guys were just coming back from Vietnam, hair was just longer. Somewhere I have pictures. This all changed in the 80's when Miami Vice came along. Then we went through a decade of shoulder holsters and Panama Jackets. Honestly, even back then, guys were slaves to fashion... :rofl:

series1811
12-21-2011, 14:51
We had always looked like hoodlums in my last agency. My wife laughs now at some of my old pictures with long hair (and I do mean long) and sometimes a beard. I am amazed we didn't get shot more often in cases of mistaken identity back then, (mistaken for pirates). :supergrin:

Now, the younger guys look like you could put them in uniform, and not even have to send them to the barber. Just not the same. :crying:

BLACK Z
12-21-2011, 15:00
I know we have now have weapons that Years ago we never thought we would have, From full auto's to launchers and Armored vehicles. We have more weapons then guys to use them.

series1811
12-21-2011, 15:08
I know we have now have weapons that Years ago we never thought we would have, From full auto's to launchers and Armored vehicles. We have more weapons then guys to use them.

Since my old agency works foreign, too, we have got an Indiana Jones style warehouse with more military type stuff than you can shake a stick at: M249s, M240s, HK21's, M203's, M79s, C4 and, the best, Claymores!

If only you could check them out for use in housing projects. :supergrin:

Patchman
12-21-2011, 16:16
In the 1980s I tried to grow a rat tail. But hard as I tried I couldn't get it right. Then in 1990 or 1991 I started on my jogging/fitness phase. One really hot summer I had my hair cut short (not quite military short) and it was an eye opener. My hair was sooooooo easy to maintain.

Kept the short hair through the academy and since then. If today I can grow a rat tail, I would. With a hairnet, I could meet our uniform requirements.

Oh yeah, short hair also hides my grays (hair, not eyes).

Patchman
12-21-2011, 16:24
As for upping firepower, in a few previous threads I've mentioned our jurisdiction has a fixed communications satellite and a "Death Star" type satellite overhead.

I am officially retracting any Death Star posts I may have previously made. And no, absolutely we are NOT getting any surplused military Predator drones in 2012.

rookie1
12-21-2011, 16:45
A large number of folks at my place have shaved or bald heads. I in no way shape of form could pull that off. I wont get into my hair style too complicated. We have at least one guy who has a total 1990 look to him. With the stache and keeps his duty belt attached to his pants so he just needs to pull it up and tuck in his shirt. Looks the same as he did 10-15 years ago He also gets dressed in the mirror for several minutes and is a total tool. Every year we have mustache week with a traveling trophy.

blueberry1177
12-21-2011, 20:38
Wait I missed the memo...Mustache Clubs aren't "in" anymore?!?!

ateamer
12-21-2011, 21:32
I have been shaving my head since 1997, before it was fashionable. My hair started receding in the early 90s when I was in my early 20s and it's only gotten worse. I am not obese, really old, don't breathe oxygen from a portable tank and don't listen to polka music, so a combover was out of the question. Even if I could grow my hair back, it would look like hell because it grows straight out until it's least four inches long. That's why when I had hair, I wore a flat top ever since high school.

I couldn't care less if a shaved head offends someone. If it bothers the tinfoil hat crowd, it's all the more incentive to keep up with it.

boby
12-21-2011, 23:19
Not a cop.

My small town police force has upgraded quite a bit. Every car has an AR-15 and an 870. K-9 on EACH shift. Everyone is Taser equipped, everyone gets a weapon light. Seems pretty well equipped for a 30 man department. Seems like it would be a good place to work.

I fully support it. With possibilities of terrorist attacks and active shooters the police should be gunning up to deal with such things. I absolutely love my local police, response times are always great, and they always seem to be extremely proactive. I'm a bit of a scanner nut and I always hear them running constant traffic stops and getting out to do foot patrols through the park and such.

Stay safe guys.

Tiro Fijo
12-21-2011, 23:31
Ironically, Jeff Cooper wrote about this years ago saying most Depts. would be better served by a 30-30 rifle and people that knew how to use them. Yes, the police have become more militarized. Perhaps that is better philosophically than fiscally however. Granted, the taxpayers could be better served today but few would accept some Sheriff strolling into a house and drilling everything that moved la Melvin Purvis style with a couple 1911's or a Model 12 riot gun. :supergrin:

They said years ago that hardened criminals whom were barricaded up surrendered at the mere mention that "Jelly Bryce is comin' in" as they knew he would gun 'em down like dogs and did if they didn't toss in the sponge!! Ah, the good ol' days. :whistling:

JBaird22
12-22-2011, 02:08
I decided to end my head shaving last month and started growing it out. I have a ton of gray (for a guy that is a spry 33 years old, its devastating) and my hair grows straight. I decided to embrace the gray and straightness and let it go. Back from my high school days are some KA sideburns. But those too have gray.

I would give my right arm for a practical uniform. I think bloused pants look silly and don't belong and same with BDU pants. Cargo pockets? Yes please! Nylon duty gear? Count me in! AR's are or any actual rifle caliber patrol rifle is a much better option in today's world. Being able to provide long cover has a distinct advantage over walking up to the front door with a 38.

The world has changed. People hate cops. Why should we give a crap if someone wets themselves if I have a patrol rifle and level 4 plates? I don't know about them, but I am going home and if that means lugging around 14 pounds of armor and a 7lb gun, then I'm all in.

ateamer
12-22-2011, 04:34
And when Beslan happens here in America, it will happen in a small town with poorly-equipped and untrained police. The same ones who will take the brunt of criticism from the same idiots who didn't want them to advance beyond the 1950s.

And if you, whoever you are, think that Beslan won't happen here, you are an ostrich. It will, it's just a matter of when and where. God help the department that doesn't train and equip for it.

Patchman
12-22-2011, 04:54
^^^ Yep.

Terrorists will choose the softest target. They will test a number of LE jurisdictions to see initial response time, professionalism and what initial equipment is available. If your town or jurisdiction is the weakest, all the more reason why it's important to hug your children or loved ones every morning when they leave.

series1811
12-22-2011, 06:57
I have been shaving my head since 1997, before it was fashionable. My hair started receding in the early 90s when I was in my early 20s and it's only gotten worse. I am not obese, really old, don't breathe oxygen from a portable tank and don't listen to polka music, so a combover was out of the question. Even if I could grow my hair back, it would look like hell because it grows straight out until it's least four inches long. That's why when I had hair, I wore a flat top ever since high school.

I couldn't care less if a shaved head offends someone. If it bothers the tinfoil hat crowd, it's all the more incentive to keep up with it.

I hope I never get to that because I shaved my down really close one time and found I have a really funny shaped head. :supergrin:

CJStudent
12-22-2011, 07:10
I hope I never get to that because I shaved my down really close one time and found I have a really funny shaped head. :supergrin:

:rofl:

That's what I found out in Basic, too, lol. I prefer to keep just a wee bit on top now......

Hedo1
12-22-2011, 07:47
That's the style out of the police force too. Go to most gyms or places where 22-45 yr. old guys work or hang out and a large portion of them have shave heads or closely cropped hair. That's what's in.

BLACK Z
12-22-2011, 15:09
Had My Hair 1 level above bald since 1992, I tried to grow it out in 1997 and it grew straight out and never laided down. Kept it short ever since.

bccop
12-22-2011, 17:04
I don't think we are militarized enough yet. I am waiting for the day I can call in an air strike or artillery....

RocPO
12-22-2011, 17:43
That is how cops used to look..but their hair was combed. :cool:

Too much effort. It's easier just to leave it on a barbershop floor every 2-3 weeks.

Hair like that is only for pretty boys who are afraid to get their hands dirty.

And SWAT guys. :tongueout:

Spiffums
12-22-2011, 18:33
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v90/TheeBadOne/TBO/ThePolice.jpg

I had my hair cut like Sting back in HS and College..... back when I had hair to spike up.

fpgeek
12-25-2011, 17:19
We have been so cash strapped for so long, that the only weapons we had (until recently) were those the officers provided. Over the past couple of years I've exploited every assistance program I knew, so we were at least at par with other agencies in the county.

What disturbs me about pseudo-information like this is that certain bureaucrats use this as a rationale to eliminate government assistance to local police agencies, as one particular cabinet member is trying to do now. If it wasn't for those programs, our agency and many others (large and small) would be out of business. Besides guns and armor, they also provide office chairs, copiers, cameras, computers, monitors, printers, and other, less media-attractive but equally necessary items.

txleapd
12-25-2011, 17:31
I feel no need to defend my hair style, or the weapons I carry to an internet troll....

Carry on.

Newcop761
12-25-2011, 18:13
Ladies, Gentlemen, and trolls, we have a winner:

I feel no need to defend my hair style, or the weapons I carry to an internet troll....

Carry on.

ray9898
12-27-2011, 16:53
I feel no need to defend my hair style, or the weapons I carry to an internet troll....

Carry on.

Exactly.