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GVFlyer
12-23-2011, 07:01
I still haven't added a Nighthawk Custom to my 1911 collection, in part because they took a weird turn about a year ago and presently don't have anything that interests me. The other part is that I'm concerned about them maintaining value. There seems to be little interest in the line right now among the 1911 literati and even the gun magazines.

I know it's anecdotal, but as quasi-proof I submit that over at-the-other place, if I go to the 1911 manufacturers forums, right now there are 62 on the Colt forum, 25 on Dan Wesson, 20 on Ed Brown, 41 on Kimber, 32 on Les Baer, 27 on Wilson Combat, 18 on Sig Sauer, 52 on Springfield Armory, 4 on Remington and only 2 people on the Nighthawk forum.

What say you?

mstennes
12-23-2011, 07:03
I still haven't added a Nighthawk Custom to my 1911 collection, in part because they took a weird turn about a year ago and presently don't have anything that interests me. The other part is that I'm concerned about them maintaining value. There seems to be little interest in the line right now among the 1911 literati and even the gun magazines.

I know it's anecdotal, but as quasi-proof I submit that over at-the-other place, if I go to the 1911 manufacturers forums, right now there are 62 on the Colt forum, 25 on Dan Wesson, 20 on Ed Brown, 41 on Kimber, 32 on Les Baer, 27 on Wilson Combat, 18 on Sig Sauer, 52 on Springfield Armory, 4 on Remington and only 2 people on the Nighthawk forum.

What say you?

The only one that interests me is the T3, I do have a Vickers though, but its a few years old, and to be honest, when it gets its service it will hopefully be Wilson doing it.

SpringerTGO
12-23-2011, 07:07
The worst service I have received, on any PRODUCT I own, was from Nighthawk. My T3 was unreliable as delivered and the ambi safety was not as described. The owner of the company treated me like dirt, and implied that I was a liar.
Seriously, if you are going to spend that kind of money on a 1911, there are better companies to deal with.

awpk03s
12-23-2011, 07:42
I have 2 Nighthawk pistols and love them.

There are a lot of great guns being made by some seriously skilled people these days.... Wilson, Nighthawk, Guncrafter, Ed Brown, Baer, Infinity, STI, Dan Wesson, etc. My point is there are a ton of good options.

I don't buy in to all of the drama-mongering about some of the makers... If you want a NH, go for it. They are great guns in my experience.

glockarmor
12-23-2011, 08:22
I have 2 Nighthawks and a Wilson.. Both of my Nighthawks are below 10,000 Ser# and run flawlessly. The Wilson also runs flawlessly, is first class equipment and their quality control appears to be a cut about Nighthawk. Just MHO

38 Super Fan
12-23-2011, 08:29
I had planned to add a hard chrome Enforcer, but given the current price and issues I've read about, I've really lost interest. It dosen't make sense for me to spend well clear of $3000 on an Enforcer, when I can pick up a GunCrafter for hundreds less and almost certainly have a better built gun.

glock2740
12-23-2011, 10:28
The T3 interested me at first, until I started reading and hearing from first hand owners, that they were having alot of trouble with them. The T3 has really given NH a blackeye IMO, and the customer service reports have been less than stellar to say the least. I have a less than 800 serial numbered Predator II, that runs like a champ, that I picked up from DRC Firearms awhile back and am glad I have an older model. The Enforcer that BAC has, I would like to have an exact copy of, as well as a Lady Hawk and even the Falcon, but for the price raises in the recent past and knowing firsthand that 6 of NH's best builders recently left to go to Wilson, I'll stick to Guncrafter and Wilson, if I'm gonna be buying any guns that are made in the "1911 Capitol of the World". :cool:

Rinspeed
12-23-2011, 10:38
I wouldn't own a Nighthawk.

jwhite75
12-23-2011, 11:07
I agree witht he weird turn, and when Vickers pulled hi name off them something smelled funny too me. Too many great builders out there to take a chance on them as a relatively unproven company compared to the others.

I would buy a Wilson, Baer, Ed Brwon etc. first

SpringerTGO
12-23-2011, 13:22
When I received my Nighthawk it had a defective slide stop. It was dropping closed on an empty magazine.
When I ordered it, I specifically asked about the ambi safety, because I had problems with them coming loose and knew that Wilson makes a "Bullet Proof" one that stays put.

At the same time my slide stop wasn't working the safety got loose. I called to send it in, and was transferred to the owner. After a very heated discussion, the owner told me I was lying about speaking with his representative (Tim) about the safety, but would fix the slide stop. So they fixed that and sent it back to me with the same safety.

After about 700 rounds it is now locking open even with rounds in the magazine. I replaced the recoil spring, but haven't had time to test it.

In another forum, the representative of Nighthawk (Larry Lyles) goes on to say, that if not for my bad attitude, Nighthawk would have replaced the safety. And that I should just sell the T3.

Nice, huh?

glock2740
12-23-2011, 15:48
When I received my Nighthawk it had a defective slide stop. It was dropping closed on an empty magazine.
When I ordered it, I specifically asked about the ambi safety, because I had problems with them coming loose and knew that Wilson makes a "Bullet Proof" one that stays put.

At the same time my slide stop wasn't working the safety got loose. I called to send it in, and was transferred to the owner. After a very heated discussion, the owner told me I was lying about speaking with his representative (Tim) about the safety, but would fix the slide stop. So they fixed that and sent it back to me with the same safety.

After about 700 rounds it is now locking open even with rounds in the magazine. I replaced the recoil spring, but haven't had time to test it.

In another forum, the representative of Nighthawk (Larry Lyles) goes on to say, that if not for my bad attitude, Nighthawk would have replaced the safety. And that I should just sell the T3.

Nice, huh?
Chalk up another defective T3, along with bad CS.

SpringerTGO
12-23-2011, 16:18
Chalk up another defective T3, along with bad CS.

You've really got to love it when a manufacturer sells you a defective product, and then tells you to sell it if you aren't happy with it.
I produced emails on the other forum (which I am banned from now) showing that I had conversations with their rep prior to them building the T3.

It's also pretty funny that the manufacturer accused me of lying about a relatively inexpensive part, on a $3000+ handgun. I even bought a Nighthawk holster.
Let's see..... I can buy the T3 and holster cash, but I am desperate enough to have to lie about a safety, in order to pull something over on them. Yup, that sure makes sense.

I would sell it, but I'm keeping it as a reminder as to why I should stick with quality firearms from companies with great reputations. I pretty much gag every time I look at it.

faawrenchbndr
12-23-2011, 16:26
I'd buy a Wilson or a used Rock River before a NH

glock2740
12-23-2011, 16:51
You've really got to love it when a manufacturer sells you a defective product, and then tells you to sell it if you aren't happy with it.
I produced emails on the other forum (which I am banned from now) showing that I had conversations with their rep prior to them building the T3.

It's also pretty funny that the manufacturer accused me of lying about a relatively inexpensive part, on a $3000+ handgun. I even bought a Nighthawk holster.
Let's see..... I can buy the T3 and holster cash, but I am desperate enough to have to lie about a safety, in order to pull something over on them. Yup, that sure makes sense.

I would sell it, but I'm keeping it as a reminder as to why I should stick with quality firearms from companies with great reputations. I pretty much gag every time I look at it.
If it's working, and has been deemed as "fixed" by Nighthawk, then I'd sell it toot sweet. Tax time is just around the corner. If I were you, I'd sell it then. Even it was fixed, I'd still have a bad taste in mouth about it just on pure principal alone. I had a Weatherby SUB-MOA that had to go back to Weatherby 2 times before it would actually group under an inch. (And that was with good customer service.) I sold it for a pretty good loss, out of pure unadulterated spite and just because I couldn't even look at it without getting pissed off and wanting to throw in into the garbage can.

SpringerTGO
12-23-2011, 17:21
It was deemed fixed, but then acted up after around 700 rounds or less. I just replaced the recoil spring, but I don't even feel like tested it. It's much more fun to shoot my TGO1.
With Larry Lyles telling me to unload it if I don't like it, I don't think that's the way to go. I'm not desperate for the money, and I would rather take it to the range, show people how the casings hit the slide in front of the ejection port (great for the finish), and let them know about how Nighthawk treated me.

Basically I have a $3k gun that I don't like, but I'll bet that Nighthawk would have been better off fixing it in the first place and not accusing me of lying.

The posts in the other forum got pretty funny, when Larry produced an email I sent, that proved my point. Then I produced another one.
And then Larry telling me to sell it.:rofl:
I have to wonder how many potential customers read that thread.

bac1023
12-23-2011, 20:08
Both my Nighthawks have been terrific. However, I bought them years ago.

SpringerTGO
12-23-2011, 20:16
Both my Nighthawks have been terrific. However, I bought them years ago.

No doubt Nighthawk can build a 1911 that works. Lots of companies do, and it's not rocket science.

But I've never been treated so poorly by a manufacturer. And judging by a lot of the posts I have read, there really isn't a good reason to buy a Nighthawk. At best it will work, but quite often buyers will end up like me. Sooner or later a buyer stands a good chance of having to deal with service.

Why not learn from others mistakes and just go to a first class company like Wilson?

Rinspeed
12-23-2011, 20:20
Why not learn from others mistakes and just go to a first class company like Wilson?




Because they are over priced as well. :dunno: :rofl:

GVFlyer
12-23-2011, 22:01
Dunno, I think that my 1911s from Wilson, Brown, Baer and Dan Wesson have all represented good value, I'm just not so sure about Nighthawk going forward.

glock2740
12-23-2011, 22:20
Dunno, I think that my 1911s from Wilson, Brown, Baer and Dan Wesson have all represented good value, I'm just not so sure about Nighthawk going forward.
I gotta agree.

Glock_en_speil
12-23-2011, 22:44
The only one that interests me is the T3, I do have a Vickers though, but its a few years old, and to be honest, when it gets its service it will hopefully be Wilson doing it.

You might as well be asking Ferrari to service your Lamborghini. Nighthawk was created by several Wilson 'smiths who quit and decided to try and their own thing. That left a bad taste in Bill Wilson's mouth that has never gone away to this day.

Feel free to check this on your own and see if anything has changed, don't take my word for it but it's pretty well known that Wilson will not work on Nighthawk guns.

Of course you could always sell your Nighthawk on gunbroker and buy a Wilson. :supergrin:

38 Super Fan
12-23-2011, 22:59
Because they are over priced as well. :dunno: :rofl:
My interest in Wilson has waned too.

Glock Holliday
12-23-2011, 23:11
I've got three NHC's (the newest about three years old) and they have been very good pistols. About a year ago, NHC raised their prices again and money is getting kinda tight, so...

rahrah12
12-23-2011, 23:17
I feel like they are at a price point where there are a few better valued guns.

I would get a Guncrafter first or even a Wilson before Nighthawk.

Tiro Fijo
12-23-2011, 23:46
...Nighthawk was created by several Wilson 'smiths who quit and decided to try and their own thing. That left a bad taste in Bill Wilson's mouth that has never gone away to this day...


Well, Bill Wilson must have used some Listerine because he hired several of them back including Ron Phillips & his boy. :supergrin:

I imagine they came back on bended knee & ol' Bill just sopped that up like so much gravy and after a trip to the woodshed and ring kissing he took them back into the fold like prodigal sons to never leave the fold again. :whistling:

bac1023
12-24-2011, 04:52
Wilson is priced just as high, if not higher, than Nighthawk.

People don't seem to realize that for some reason.

faawrenchbndr
12-24-2011, 04:59
Wilson is priced just as high, if not higher, than Nighthawk.

People don't seem to realize that for some reason.


Yes,....they are. However, their quality seems to be a notch or two higher
than current production Night Hawks!

glock2740
12-24-2011, 08:39
Yes,....they are. However, their quality seems to be a notch or two higher
than current production Night Hawks!
And Wilson's CS is better as well.

glock2740
12-24-2011, 08:49
Well, Bill Wilson must have used some Listerine because he hired several of them back including Ron Phillips & his boy. :supergrin:

I imagine they came back on bended knee & ol' Bill just sopped that up like so much gravy and after a trip to the woodshed and ring kissing he took them back into the fold like prodigal sons to never leave the fold again. :whistling:
On bended knee? Woodshed and ring kissing? :upeyes: Money talks.

SpringerTGO
12-24-2011, 08:55
I called Wilson about having them install their safety on my T3. They were very nice about it, and would be glad to do it.
It's just a matter of time. They are pretty backed up, and putting more money and effort into the T3 is not a big priority to me.

For me, part of the high price for a 1911 is customer service. So what if Wilson's price is the same as Nighthawk. At least they give you what you are paying for. How often do you read complaints about Wilson quality or service?

R0CKETMAN
12-24-2011, 09:31
I'd buy a Wilson or a used Rock River before a NH

True, but OP has a Wilson. Finding a used RRA will be a monumental task.


My interest in Wilson has waned too.

Wilson is priced just as high, if not higher, than Nighthawk.

People don't seem to realize that for some reason.

I agree that Wilson now falls in the over priced category. Price increase after price increase. I'd venture to say their 1911 sales reflect such in this economic environment.

As for Nighthawk, the Enforcer has always interested me, but I've heard more than one comment on their poor CS. If you dig the gun and aren't planning on selling it, then go for it.

I'd lean toward custom Colt

Rinspeed
12-24-2011, 10:37
Wilson is priced just as high, if not higher, than Nighthawk.

People don't seem to realize that for some reason.





Wilson has spent a ton of money and time to be able to make top notch parts. Nighthawk doesn't make any parts as far as I know. :dunno:

cdunn
12-24-2011, 13:49
that too bad about having issues with NHC.I've had nothing but good experience with NHC and Larry has been nothing but helpful.

mstennes
12-24-2011, 14:32
I called Wilson about having them install their safety on my T3. They were very nice about it, and would be glad to do it.
It's just a matter of time. They are pretty backed up, and putting more money and effort into the T3 is not a big priority to me.

For me, part of the high price for a 1911 is customer service. So what if Wilson's price is the same as Nighthawk. At least they give you what you are paying for. How often do you read complaints about Wilson quality or service?

Thats what I'm hoping for is to have Wilson deNighthawkafy as much as possible with their Bullet Proof parts, or at a minimum a BP safety. On the plus side I did buy it used, and it is unfired. After reading this though, I'm done with Nighthawk.:wavey:

Glock_en_speil
12-24-2011, 17:27
Well, Bill Wilson must have used some Listerine because he hired several of them back including Ron Phillips & his boy. :supergrin:

Tiro Fijo,

By hiring back these 'smiths Bill knows he's hurting Nighthawk and helping his own business at the same time. It's a win/win situation for Wilson. Bill Wilson is not only a world class pistolsmith, he's also an extremely good businessman.

This still doesn't change the fact that the Wilson shop won't work on Nighthawk guns. You can however purchase Wilson Bullet Proof parts straight from their website and have a local 'smith install them for you.

SpringerTGO
12-24-2011, 17:46
Tiro Fijo,

This still doesn't change the fact that the Wilson shop won't work on Nighthawk guns. You can however purchase Wilson Bullet Proof parts straight from their website and have a local 'smith install them for you.

Like I said in an earlier post, they said they would work on mine.

Also, to those people saying Wilson is overpriced, I don't think you are taking a LOT into consideration.
No doubt you can buy as good (if not an even better) a 1911 for less money. But part of what you are paying for, is a company that has spent years establishing a top reputation not only for their products, but for standing behind them as well. A less expensive gunsmith might very well stand behind his work, but then again he might not. And for that matter, what happens if your 1 man shop owner gets hit by a bus?

Seriously, having been burned already on a "high end 1911" I've learned my lesson.

glock2740
12-24-2011, 17:47
Since when will Wilson not do work on a Nighthawk?

bac1023
12-24-2011, 19:31
Yes,....they are. However, their quality seems to be a notch or two higher
than current production Night Hawks!

Seems that way. I have no experience with the newer Nighthawks.

bac1023
12-24-2011, 19:32
Wilson has spent a ton of money and time to be able to make top notch parts. Nighthawk doesn't make any parts as far as I know. :dunno:

Wilson is certainly the better of the two companies, no doubt about it.

Tiro Fijo
12-24-2011, 21:33
I was always under the impression that a group of Wilson gunsmiths, Phillips, et al., jumped ship and formed Nighthawk. Later on there was dissent & Ron Phillips went on his own and then had some serious health issues. For anyone that has had serious health issues and is paying their own health insurance you know what a burden that is. The end story I heard is that many then defected from Nighthawk & went back to Wilson.

Yes, Wilson seeems to be a good businessman. However, I can assure you that he probably did not ask them to come back as they quit him and went into competition with him. I would wager money that these former employees asked him for their jobs back as let's face it, a hick town in Boondocks, USA is not exactly a mecca for good paying jobs.

Either way, Bill Wilson wins as he now has quality employees back & the competition is basically neutered. Sometimes you don't know how good you have it until it's gone.

bac1023
12-25-2011, 06:14
As for Nighthawk, the Enforcer has always interested me, but I've heard more than one comment on their poor CS. If you dig the gun and aren't planning on selling it, then go for it.


The Enforcer is my favorite Nighthawk by far. :supergrin:


http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu81/ollituc/047.jpg

http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu81/ollituc/050-1.jpg

Rinspeed
12-25-2011, 06:27
The Enforcer is my favorite Nighthawk by far. :supergrin:





That Enforcer puts your other NHC to shame in the looks department. :thumbsup:

bac1023
12-25-2011, 07:59
That Enforcer puts your other NHC to shame in the looks department. :thumbsup:

I agree Jeff.

Merry Christmas to you. :tree:

R0CKETMAN
12-25-2011, 09:19
That Enforcer puts your other NHC to shame in the looks department. :thumbsup:

This one and the Morris always lure me to the possibility of the HC "brite side"

glock2740
12-25-2011, 09:40
The Enforcer is my favorite Nighthawk by far. :supergrin:


http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu81/ollituc/047.jpg

http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu81/ollituc/050-1.jpg
Best looking Nighthawk out there. :thumbsup:I LOVE that one.:hearts: That gun is pretty much the root of my love for hardchrome. :cool:

JK-linux
12-25-2011, 09:57
I've never been tempted to own a Nighthawk. I have some Christmas money and am considering a pricier 1911. Nighthawk isn't on my list as they just don't really appeal to me at their price level. To each their own. Some people really like them.

Rinspeed
12-25-2011, 10:55
I agree Jeff.

Merry Christmas to you. :tree:




Thanks Brian and same to you.

kkramer673
12-27-2011, 04:57
I bought a couple of 1911s about 10 years ago -mostly Kimbers- and really liked the platform. Like a lot of people, I then "invested" in custom makers' guns. First I got a Wilson CQB about 5 years ago. It's great and Wilson is a pleasure to deal with on the phone. Then I bought an Ed Brown Kobra Carry. It's also excellent, and on the rare occasion I've called Ed Brown, they've been fine. Then I bought a Nighthawk T3 about a year ago. It's been every bit as well-made, reliable and accurate as the CQB and Kobra Carry and I find the Nighthawk people very professional and responsive to deal with on the phone. As far as interest waning in Nighthawk, place an order for one and see what the waiting time is. In spite of how bad the economy has been for several years, most custom shops like Wilson, Les Baer, Ed Brown and Nighthawk are businer than at any time in memory.

bac1023
12-27-2011, 05:03
Best looking Nighthawk out there. :thumbsup:I LOVE that one.:hearts: That gun is pretty much the root of my love for hardchrome. :cool:

Cool :cool:

Glad to hear that, Joe. :)

HexHead
12-27-2011, 05:28
I got mine about 3 1/2 years ago. Other than some issues with their then new stainless mags (they got a bad batch of springs), it's been flawless. As far as their CS, they were great, kept sending me new sets of mags until I finally said to just refund me the value of the two mags that came with it, I shipped them back all the mags they sent me and got two Wilson 47Ds in black with low profile baseplates. I considered getting a Wilson at the time, but they didn't offer something I wanted. I have no complaints.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/scat999999/misc/DSC_0022-2.jpg

Rinspeed
12-27-2011, 06:37
That is very sharp HexHead. :thumbsup:

glockarmor
12-27-2011, 07:18
Yes, Wilson seeems to be a good businessman. However, I can assure you that he probably did not ask them to come back as they quit him and went into competition with him. I would wager money that these former employees asked him for their jobs back as let's face it, a hick town in Boondocks, USA is not exactly a mecca for good paying jobs.

I don't know what these guys are getting paid but I've been to Nighthawk and there wasn't any Dodge Vipers sitting in the parking lot.. It is a small town and although the owners are making money I doubt that the guys building the pistols are getting rich or anything close to it. Just my .02

ca survivor
12-27-2011, 07:22
When I received my Nighthawk it had a defective slide stop. It was dropping closed on an empty magazine.
When I ordered it, I specifically asked about the ambi safety, because I had problems with them coming loose and knew that Wilson makes a "Bullet Proof" one that stays put.

At the same time my slide stop wasn't working the safety got loose. I called to send it in, and was transferred to the owner. After a very heated discussion, the owner told me I was lying about speaking with his representative (Tim) about the safety, but would fix the slide stop. So they fixed that and sent it back to me with the same safety.

After about 700 rounds it is now locking open even with rounds in the magazine. I replaced the recoil spring, but haven't had time to test it.

In another forum, the representative of Nighthawk (Larry Lyles) goes on to say, that if not for my bad attitude, Nighthawk would have replaced the safety. And that I should just sell the T3.

Nice, huh?
Thanks,you just save me a lot of $$$$$$

Shipwreck-The-Sequel
12-28-2011, 07:54
I really prefer Ed Browns or Springfield Custom Shop guns over Nighthawks...

SpringerTGO
12-28-2011, 08:37
I really prefer Ed Browns or Springfield Custom Shop guns over Nighthawks...

Springfield told me about the Wilson Bullet Proof safety, paid shipping both ways, installed the safety, and had my TGO1 back to me within about 5 days. They had me speak with their gunsmith directly.
The TGO1 has been 100% reliable (other than that) and is so accurate I don't have any excuses at the range.

When I go shooting, it's kind of hard to grab the Nighthawk when I have a Springfield Custom that I know will be 100%. Not only that, I don't have to worry about the Springfield breaking, because I know they will fix it.

The Nighthawk on the other hand..............

Glock_en_speil
12-28-2011, 18:37
One of the reasons I decided to go with Wilson was because some of their competitors use their parts as OEM. For instance, Colt uses the Wilson Combat Bullet Proof Ambi Safety on their Special Combat Government models and Smith & Wesson uses Wilson Combat's rear site on their performance center 1911's. In addition when I started to research Kimber one of the common fixes for the premature lock back issues they are having is to use a Wilson Combat Bullet Proof Slide Stop.

I said to myself if Wilson Combat's parts are so good and are even used in OEM manufacturing by their competitors then I need not look any further as to who's 1911 to go with so I coughed up my deposit and ordered a Wilson. :supergrin:

glock2740
12-28-2011, 19:33
I really prefer Ed Browns or Springfield Custom Shop guns over Nighthawks...
And you prefer Beretta 92's over all 1911's. :tongueout: You know you'll end up with another 1911. :cool:

awpk03s
12-28-2011, 23:24
Just food for thought... 3 pages of posts, and only one poster with a decided negative opinion of Nighthawk (which is re-posted, again and again and again).

Others are very easy to claim up their disapproval and portion off their future funds for pistols other than Nighthawk - based on the Internet opinion of one or maybe several that they read... despite many positive experiences and great pistols listed by posters here in this thread and others.

I know I'll get branded as a NH fanboy here, and I frankly don't care what people think. I own two, and they are fantastic pistols. I know that and am happy with them and don't much care what other(s) think about that. But I do feel that Nighthawk is one of those brands that takes a lot of flak from internet-drama-ramas, perhaps unfairly. Springer's pistol had issues and he has a reason to feel however he does - not going to argue about that. But a lot of people will chime in or chalk up that they've read too many issues with "recent Nighthawks" and won't spend their money there.

What are the issues with "recent Nighthawks"? Some of the smiths left the company and went back to Wilson. However, I don't recall all the doomsday rumors about Wilson when these guys left to form Nighthawk in the first place? My only point is, that the issues of Nighthawk in recent months I feel have been extremely overly dramatized for no good reason. Anybody keep this close track of people working at Brown or Baer? Or Springfield? Doubt it. I think NH makes a good pistol, because I have two. I've also read accounts of problems, not unlike Brown, Baer, Springfield, etc. The guys answering the phones and taking orders and interacting with customers at Nighthawk could use some improvement - this much I have direct knowledge of, and was most displeased about in my build process.

Not going to pick a favorite among all the current makers. As mentioned, I have two NH pistols, and I love them. I considered a Brown, and a Wilson, but ended up going NH on my build because they offered options that I wanted. No drama, no big deal. I still think Guncrafter is the best deal going in the semi-custom market - hands down.

But all the NH drama-bashing is getting old.

Just my opinion. Appreciate it or don't. I don't care.

GVFlyer
12-29-2011, 00:27
awpk03s you and I are pals, but my OP was concerning not the quality of the Nighthawk, but perceived interest in the brand by the 1911 shooting public. I noted the paucity of print journalism articles on the maker as well as subjective observations such as my going to the 1911 manufacturers forums on another enthusiast website to see how many people are on each manufacturer's forum. My concern is retained value. If nobody is interested in the brand I'll have a hard time selling the gun for what it's worth.

If I go to that same website now I see just 4 people on the Nighthawk forum, 9 on the Caspian, 50 on the Colt, 19 on the Dan Wesson, 17 on Ed Brown, 45 on Kimber, 20 on Les Baer, 14 on Sig Sauer, 59 on Springfield Armory, and 21 on Wilson Combat.

glock2740
12-29-2011, 04:06
Just food for thought... 3 pages of posts, and only one poster with a decided negative opinion of Nighthawk (which is re-posted, again and again and again).

Others are very easy to claim up their disapproval and portion off their future funds for pistols other than Nighthawk - based on the Internet opinion of one or maybe several that they read... despite many positive experiences and great pistols listed by posters here in this thread and others.

I know I'll get branded as a NH fanboy here, and I frankly don't care what people think. I own two, and they are fantastic pistols. I know that and am happy with them and don't much care what other(s) think about that. But I do feel that Nighthawk is one of those brands that takes a lot of flak from internet-drama-ramas, perhaps unfairly. Springer's pistol had issues and he has a reason to feel however he does - not going to argue about that. But a lot of people will chime in or chalk up that they've read too many issues with "recent Nighthawks" and won't spend their money there.

What are the issues with "recent Nighthawks"? Some of the smiths left the company and went back to Wilson. However, I don't recall all the doomsday rumors about Wilson when these guys left to form Nighthawk in the first place? My only point is, that the issues of Nighthawk in recent months I feel have been extremely overly dramatized for no good reason. Anybody keep this close track of people working at Brown or Baer? Or Springfield? Doubt it. I think NH makes a good pistol, because I have two. I've also read accounts of problems, not unlike Brown, Baer, Springfield, etc. The guys answering the phones and taking orders and interacting with customers at Nighthawk could use some improvement - this much I have direct knowledge of, and was most displeased about in my build process.

Not going to pick a favorite among all the current makers. As mentioned, I have two NH pistols, and I love them. I considered a Brown, and a Wilson, but ended up going NH on my build because they offered options that I wanted. No drama, no big deal. I still think Guncrafter is the best deal going in the semi-custom market - hands down.

But all the NH drama-bashing is getting old.

Just my opinion. Appreciate it or don't. I don't care.
There hasn't been too many remarks on this thread about the T3, but that model has had MANY issues with many people on this and other forums. Most NH's I know of have been very solid guns and I like Nighthawk alot myself. But their quality has dropped a little, while their prices have risen. I would say that the T3 has been their only black eye in the past couple of years. And frankly, it's a good gun. There's just been more than normal issues with that model. Also, I agree 110% with you about Guncrafter. Hands down the best highend 1911 for the money out there. :cool:

awpk03s
12-29-2011, 07:49
awpk03s you and I are pals, but my OP was concerning not the quality of the Nighthawk, but perceived interest in the brand by the 1911 shooting public. I noted the paucity of print journalism articles on the maker as well as subjective observations such as my going to the 1911 manufacturers forums on another enthusiast website to see how many people are on each manufacturer's forum. My concern is retained value. If nobody is interested in the brand I'll have a hard time selling the gun for what it's worth.

If I go to that same website now I see just 4 people on the Nighthawk forum, 9 on the Caspian, 50 on the Colt, 19 on the Dan Wesson, 17 on Ed Brown, 45 on Kimber, 20 on Les Baer, 14 on Sig Sauer, 59 on Springfield Armory, and 21 on Wilson Combat.

:thumbsup: I gotcha. :)

SpringerTGO
12-29-2011, 09:40
Just food for thought... 3 pages of posts, and only one poster with a decided negative opinion of Nighthawk (which is re-posted, again and again and again).

I know I'll get branded as a NH fanboy here, and I frankly don't care what people think. I own two, and they are fantastic pistols. I know that and am happy with them and don't much care what other(s) think about that. But I do feel that Nighthawk is one of those brands that takes a lot of flak from internet-drama-ramas, perhaps unfairly. Springer's pistol had issues and he has a reason to feel however he does - not going to argue about that. But a lot of people will chime in or chalk up that they've read too many issues with "recent Nighthawks" and won't spend their money there.

I think NH makes a good pistol, because I have two. I've also read accounts of problems, not unlike Brown, Baer, Springfield, etc. The guys answering the phones and taking orders and interacting with customers at Nighthawk could use some improvement - this much I have direct knowledge of, and was most displeased about in my build process.

But all the NH drama-bashing is getting old.

Just my opinion. Appreciate it or don't. I don't care.

I think you are being reasonable in regards to me.
But this is a thread about interest in Nighthawk waning, and there are plenty of posts in other 1911 forums not only about lack of consistent quality, but the way Nighthawk treats their customers.

And you say it yourself. You didn't like their customer interaction, and didn't like the way they treated you during the build.

My main point is that a 1911 is not such a complex piece of machinery that it takes a rocket scientist to build it. We are fortunate in that we have lots of good options. If I were buy another semi custom 1911, in the same price range as Nighthawk, I would want to deal with a company that has a track record of building quality products, and treating their customers with respect as well.

Shipwreck-The-Sequel
12-30-2011, 05:52
And you prefer Beretta 92's over all 1911's. :tongueout: You know you'll end up with another 1911. :cool:

I may well own another 1911 one day. I still always stop and look at them at my local gun store as I make my way down to the Beretta section :)

glock2740
12-30-2011, 18:48
I may well own another 1911 one day. I still always stop and look at them at my local gun store animate my way down to the Beretta section :)
:rofl:

midliferally
12-30-2011, 18:53
How do you animate the Beretta section??:tongueout:

glock2740
12-30-2011, 19:20
How do you animate the Beretta section??:tongueout:
http://i914.photobucket.com/albums/ac341/OU1911/M9.gif

:dunno:

NeverMore1701
12-30-2011, 20:57
How do you animate the Beretta section??:tongueout:

Probably start with something like this:


http://lk.gamers-desire.de/92fsview.jpg

Shipwreck-The-Sequel
12-30-2011, 21:17
How do you animate the Beretta section??:tongueout:

Man, I hate autocorrect on my iPad.. That's not what I typed...

glock2740
12-30-2011, 21:35
Damn robot phones! :steamed:

:rofl:

GVFlyer
12-30-2011, 22:57
Returning briefly to the thread topic - I need to add an Officer's model to my 1911 collection, that's why I was considering a Nighthawk. Bud's has a Colt for $1064 which would save me mucho bucks. What other Officer's model does the collective brain trust here think I should consider? I like The Dan Wesson CCO, but when CZ increased all Wesson prices by >40% they eliminated me as a buyer. $1430 is zu viel ("too much" in Munich) for the gun. What else?

Gdirty5
12-31-2011, 00:11
I was really eyeing the AAC nighthawk 1911.... I have a few suppressors from AAC, and also a few from silencerco, and wanted to suppress a 1911. But eventually I gave up on the idea, and just use my HK USP tactical, compact tactical, hk45c, USP SD's, and FNP tactical as suppressor hosts. BUT MAYBE one day I'll slap a suppressor on a 1911, I just hear they aren't the most reliable suppressor hosts. But If i do, for some reason either the AAC, or maybe a enforcer with threaded barrel and blind marked will be my choice....

bac1023
12-31-2011, 04:51
Damn robot phones! :steamed:

:rofl:

:rofl:

SpringerTGO
01-04-2012, 15:06
I took my T3 to the range today. It almost made it through 120 rounds without a problem.
But on the last magazine, it had to lock open with 3 rounds left in the magazine.

Not a bad day for my T3. it is almost as reliable as my Keltec.:rofl:

kkramer673
01-05-2012, 17:52
"Not a bad day for my T3. it is almost as reliable as my Keltec"

Why don't you sell it?

Carrots
01-05-2012, 18:21
Because he prefers *****ing about it all over the internet.

HexHead
01-05-2012, 18:37
That is very sharp HexHead. :thumbsup:

Thank you.

Rally Vincent
01-05-2012, 20:36
Don't know why, but the thought of paying 3500 dollars for a pistol just kind of makes me question my sanity.

willis68
01-06-2012, 09:44
I paid $2723.00 shipped for my custom built GRP Commander Bobtail it was built by Ron Phillips back when they built some of the Best 1911's on the planet. I recently called them and got a quote for an exact built gun the price would be $3972.00 shipped to my FFL. I feel that I got one hell of a deal and will never sell it. It is a shame they do not make them the way they use to

SpringerTGO
01-06-2012, 11:58
Because he prefers *****ing about it all over the internet.

Funny how so many Nighthawk owners don't want others to know when Nighthawk builds a bad product, or sh**s on their customers.
Even on another forum (that I was banned from) I was getting messages from Nighthawk owners who were also screwed over, but afraid to post.

Are you afraid the value of your Nighthawk will decrease if people hear the truth? Seriously, what is wrong with letting everyone on the planet know about how Nighthawk treated me, and how they built my T3?

GJ1981
01-06-2012, 12:45
Nothing wrong with letting people know about issues...I did the same thing with the garbage Springfield's Custom Shop did for me on three separate occasions. The difference with some people is selling the POS (POS's in case) and moving on is more important them "passing a message" everywhere OVER AND OVER and leaving the sand in their ***** for life.

The last time I checked, a single post tells enough for people to make an informed decision...but keep going on, it's amusing.

Carrots
01-06-2012, 13:21
Sorry bud, but I don't own a Nighthawk. I'm just sick of reading the same old whine over and over again.

ajgranda
01-06-2012, 15:25
Nothing wrong with letting people know about issues...I did the same thing with the garbage Springfield's Custom Shop did for me on three separate occasions. The difference with some people is selling the POS (POS's in case) and moving on is more important them "passing a message" everywhere OVER AND OVER and leaving the sand in their ***** for life.

The last time I checked, a single post tells enough for people to make an informed decision...but keep going on, it's amusing.

:yawn: I agree, it's getting a little played out already. :yawn:

Singlestack Wonder
01-06-2012, 16:39
Funny how so many Nighthawk owners don't want others to know when Nighthawk builds a bad product, or sh**s on their customers.
Even on another forum (that I was banned from) I was getting messages from Nighthawk owners who were also screwed over, but afraid to post.

Are you afraid the value of your Nighthawk will decrease if people hear the truth? Seriously, what is wrong with letting everyone on the planet know about how Nighthawk treated me, and how they built my T3?

I got banned too. Purchased a Vickers Tactical with several issues. With a lack of response and willingness to make it right from Nighthawk, I posted the issue with pictures on a forum (probably the same one) and was banned.

SpringerTGO
01-06-2012, 16:58
Sorry bud, but I don't own a Nighthawk. I'm just sick of reading the same old whine over and over again.

Sorry to you too, bud.
You don't even own a Nighthawk, but read the Nighthawk posts, and get sick of hearing "the same old whine". Maybe if you have a clue, it might just save you a few thousand $'s. I am aware of a few people who changed their minds and went with different makers, because of "the same old whine", so I feel like i did them a favor.

The title of the thread was about interest in Nighthawk waning, and people posting "the same old whine" might be part of the cause. But I'm really sorry if my "same old whine" (in a related Nighthawk thread) is offensive to you.

And GJ1981.... how many times have we heard about your Springfield?
I have no issues with you posting repeatedly about it.

GJ1981
01-06-2012, 17:09
And GJ1981.... how many times have we heard about your Springfield?
I have no issues with you posting repeatedly about it.

Springfield's, plural.

I overdid it with my *****ing, sure, but each time it was something NEW they screwed up or failed to acknowledge from multiple pistols, not just one. I understand your frustrations, I've been there, I'm just looking back on how I handled it and think there is a point where enough has been said and any more is just *****ing.

As I said, I got over it and moved on. You can only say so much before it runs its course.

SpringerTGO
01-06-2012, 22:55
Springfield's, plural.

As I said, I got over it and moved on. You can only say so much before it runs its course.

You didn't move on. You've brought it up even as recently as this thread. And even in this last post, you have to let us know you had "Springfields, plural.

Isn't that a bit of a double standard? And again, I don't blame you one bit for posting.

bac1023
01-07-2012, 05:27
I'm glad I've had nothing but great experiences with both Springfield and Nighthawk.

GJ1981
01-07-2012, 06:35
You didn't move on. You've brought it up even as recently as this thread. And even in this last post, you have to let us know you had "Springfields, plural.

Isn't that a bit of a double standard? And again, I don't blame you one bit for posting.

I have moved on, I sold them all and never felt better. I only mentioned SA in my post to say that bringing up issues with a company is understandable, so if agreeing with you in that sense is a double standard then have at it. I used plural to reference the continuing issues I was finding from their work at the time, but it had no point here, fine.

I guess my underlying point here is that since you had your issue with NH and I had mine with SA, it doesn't mean their products are all crap. All it means is there have been unsatisfied customers...like any company will have. If people want to base a decision off either case, go for it, but how much more can be said that hasn't been already?

.50 cal
01-09-2012, 05:44
I think it is interesting that Knighthawk is not representing their company at Shot Show this year

Quack
01-09-2012, 08:09
Wilson isn't going to be at SHOT either.

Officer's Match
01-09-2012, 08:20
My interest in Nighthawk hasn't waned in the slightest. I never had any to begin with, neither the 1911 with the big logo nor the Honda motorcycle.

20South
01-09-2012, 08:22
Wilson isn't going to be at SHOT either.

They must stink.

Quack
01-09-2012, 08:25
They must stink.

when i asked if they were going...

No, we don't do SHOT (or NRA) and haven't for several years.

I guess we could go to sell more guns that we are already incredibly backordered on thereby increasing the wait times even more?

:dope:

20South
01-09-2012, 08:30
when i asked if they were going...

It doesn't surprise me and I don't blame them at all. Its probably an unnecessary expense that isn't going to generate much if any more sales for them than they would have by just doing what they are doing. I used to do a big financial services show on the vendor side, and by the time you paid for the booth, signage, sponsorship, trinkets, meals, travel, room, power/network connectivity etc. etc. we would be in it for close to 100k. We never saw any roi from those things.

.50 cal
01-09-2012, 08:31
Wilson isn't going to be at SHOT either.

Who is Wilson?


:rofl:

Quack
01-09-2012, 08:58
Who is Wilson?


:rofl:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_A4YdwQlF8XU/Snyx9GfHnWI/AAAAAAAAA1M/25kB2w_SKxA/s400/wilson.jpg

lsbbigdog
01-09-2012, 09:03
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_A4YdwQlF8XU/Snyx9GfHnWI/AAAAAAAAA1M/25kB2w_SKxA/s400/wilson.jpg

:rofl:

20South
01-09-2012, 09:23
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_A4YdwQlF8XU/Snyx9GfHnWI/AAAAAAAAA1M/25kB2w_SKxA/s400/wilson.jpg

One of the best posts ever. Well played Don.

SpringerTGO
01-10-2012, 09:39
I got mine about 3 1/2 years ago. Other than some issues with their then new stainless mags (they got a bad batch of springs), it's been flawless. As far as their CS, they were great, kept sending me new sets of mags until I finally said to just refund me the value of the two mags that came with it, I shipped them back all the mags they sent me and got two Wilson 47Ds in black with low profile baseplates. I considered getting a Wilson at the time, but they didn't offer something I wanted. I have no complaints.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/scat999999/misc/DSC_0022-2.jpg

If they had a bunch of defective magazines, why would they keep shipping you the same model?

If you were already having problems, and they still wanted to unload bad product, maybe they could have run some rounds through the magazines before shipping them? They do test fire their 1911's anyways, don't they?

How is shipping you bad product (and having you sort it out) good service?

And in the end, you ended up with a Wilson solution to your Nighthawk problem, just like me.