brass kick back from my 21SF [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Mia
02-18-2012, 20:41
I'm very new at this site so I hope I'm in the right place.
I have a .45 Glock 21SF and she has a nasty habit of hitting me in the face with hot brass.
I also have a .40 cal and have no trouble.
I don't fear the recoil at all. I know that's the first question I asked myself knowing it can affect so much in how the brass is expelled.
I'd just like an idea of how to fix the mistake I must be making to get brass in the face.
Last note, the ammo is Blazer Brass 45 auto 230gr FMJ.

Thannks for any help or advice,
Mia

castroj
02-19-2012, 01:55
If you are not letting the barrel rise too much, which if you were, you would be getting some smoke pipes. I would say try some different ammo. My Glock 30 was ejecting my cases back at me, but, that was because they were hot reloads. I backed off the powder charge and then the cases started going to the right. Enjoy finding the answer because that is the fun of truly tunning your gun for you. It becomes all the fun.

battlerageson53
02-19-2012, 07:52
I have the same issue my G21SF and Blazer. I will try different ammo here shortly once I run out of the Blazer. I don't have the same thing happen with my other two Glocks. Other than that I really love my G21SF.

Mia
02-19-2012, 16:31
Thank you for your advice. Now that I think of it I did use about 200 round of an off brand because I was so excited to shoot my new gun. I'll figure out what brand and load works best for us. I always heard guns have their own like & dislikes.
May I ask one more question? Am I supposed to use GAP or ACP?

ArmyDoc
02-19-2012, 21:28
Thank you for your advice. Now that I think of it I did use about 200 round of an off brand because I was so excited to shoot my new gun. I'll figure out what brand and load works best for us. I always heard guns have their own like & dislikes.
May I ask one more question? Am I supposed to use GAP or ACP?

ACP in the G21SF.

Don't know what to tell you about the rounds kicking staight back, except mine does the same. Haven't found anything that doesn't kick more to the back more than to the right. Love to hear it if anyone has found a solution...till then I wear glasses and a cap. I like the 45 too much to switch to 40.

texagun
02-20-2012, 07:03
Love to hear it if anyone has found a solution...till then I wear glasses and a cap. I like the 45 too much to switch to 40.

Try the Glock 21 Gen4 if you can find one for rent at the range. It has a different recoil system in it and the recoil characteristics are different. So far, I haven't read of anyone with a G-21 Gen4 that has had the problem. Also, different brands of ammo will eject the brass in different patterns. I can usually avoid this problem simply by changing the brand of ammo I am using.

vaquero aleman
02-20-2012, 12:53
Don't know how much this will help, but as I have been experiencing the same thing, I didn't realize how irritating it was until I read this thread. I first shot 230gn slowball to get used to my new to me 21, but soon recieved some DT 185gn in the mail. I also switched to a 22# wolff recoil assy. I have been switching between the factory barrel and an LWD 6.6" and I wasn't paying enough attn to remember which barrel I was shooting out of when the brass was kissing me. But I can say that I was using the DT 185gn Nosler and the 22# recoil spring. But I had other problems occupying my attn. I found that limp-wristing with the 22# spring caused FTFs and it was very irritating so I most likely didn't pay attn to the brass direction.

Broiler Monster
02-29-2012, 13:38
I am a Glock 21 fan and I had the same issue. I have had a 21 for a while. When the 21 SF came out I was excited to have the same gun with a slimmer grip. My 21 SF put 10 out of 13 rounds back on my face. I called Glock and they said it was my ammo and not the gun. I tried a number of different quality factory ammos and it was the gun. I took it to the Armorers at Glock and they said we don't know why it's doing this. They wanted to keep it and try to figure it out. they traded me out for another 21 SF. I said GREAT! The new 21 SF did the same thing. I eventually ended up with a 19 and a bunch of high cap mags and I was happy. Personally I think that Glock had a lot of 21 SF guns that ejected brass back in the shooters face. I had two in a row that did it and I have heard about this from a number of Glock Shooters. Recently I bought a Gen 4 G21 and I love it. It is an awesome gun. It functions 100% like my old Gen 3 21. And it has a great grip.

vaquero aleman
02-29-2012, 14:13
I was working on my 21 and had an orbital launch. Bye Bye spring loaded bearing. There was a brief trade on comments from another post about this and the thought was put forth that maybe if there wasn't a spring loaded bearing installed that it might change the path of the case. Maybe the extractor is gripping the case lip too tight?

I will know for sure this weekend when I get my Buffalo Bore 185 gn 45 Super. As I still do not have a spring loaded bearing installed, but I do have a 22# recoil spring and an LWD compensator on the 6.61" bbl.

vaquero aleman
03-07-2012, 09:46
I finally received the Buffalo Bore 185gr @ 1300fps 45 Super and took it to the outdoor range. I shot from a G21 w/LWD 6.61" barrel, LWD 45comp, Wolff 22# recoil spring/guide rod, Wilson Combat recoil buffer and no Spring Loaded Bearing because I had lost the SLB. All of the brass ejected into a three to four foot area about six feet to the right of where I was standing. I did not get a single piece of brass in my face. I won't say that any one single thing was the remedy, but I can say that the only thing out of place was the missing SLB. I did not have any failure to ejects either.

I will be getting two replacement SLBs soon and I plan on installing one and running a few rounds through my rig to see if there is a difference in the brass trajectory.

ArmyDoc
03-07-2012, 09:50
There is a lengthy thread dealing with brass being kicked back into your head, here: http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1402990

Based on it, I took out my extractor and pollished it as suggested. I don't think it will make much of a difference, as min extractor was not tight (as there's was). I also saw a video on "making your Glock Rock" where he suggested lightly filing your ejector pin... not sure I'm ready to try that yet, althought it's only like $8 to replace.

Let you know after the weekend how pollishing the extractor works for me.

vaquero aleman
03-07-2012, 10:12
Yeh, I really need to stop buying gun parts and pick up a dremel.

ArmyDoc
03-07-2012, 18:09
Yeh, I really need to stop buying gun parts and pick up a dremel.

Actually, I just used a very fine flat file. I got a set of jewlers files at Lowes for like $5.

The dremel does help with a felt polishing wheel and polishing compound for the feed ramp, but thats about it - I worry anything heavier and I will be removing more metal than I want.

vaquero aleman
03-07-2012, 18:19
I talked to a guy at KKM today and he told me that the fix for the extractor to use the 45 to 10mm barrel in the 21 is to remove the inner most "step" which allows the extractor to reach further into the slide to better grab the case. I mentioned that filing on the extractor step was mentioned in a ejection issue discussion, but he said he couldn't really elaborate on the ejection problem except where the 10mm was concerned.

ArmyDoc
03-08-2012, 11:26
I talked to a guy at KKM today and he told me that the fix for the extractor to use the 45 to 10mm barrel in the 21 is to remove the inner most "step" which allows the extractor to reach further into the slide to better grab the case. I mentioned that filing on the extractor step was mentioned in a ejection issue discussion, but he said he couldn't really elaborate on the ejection problem except where the 10mm was concerned.

Very good to know - especially since removing that step shouldn't interfere with .45 function.

I'm very interested in a .45 to 10mm conversion barrel... but don't want to be replacing the extractor. Basically I want to swap barrels, and magazines and go. Otherwise I'd just buy a new G20. (which I may want to do anyhow, when the G4 comes out...but that's a different story :cool:)

By the way, when were you with 1CD? I was there in '94-'96 when Gen Shinseki was the BG and Gen Casey was my CO back when he was a COL.

vaquero aleman
03-08-2012, 12:53
I was with the 82nd field artillery as a mechanic in 97/98 until my 8 was done then I caved in to the wife(big mistake )and ets'd.

I was there when they started implementing some sort of new army doctrine, force 21 or something like that. I think it was an army children's club designed to get rid of us old guys.

Arc Angel
03-31-2012, 17:02
Here! (I dislike having to write anything twice.) ;)

For all you guys who are having a problem with brass flying backwards into your face, take a look at this:

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1402990&page=12

I like the comments offered by Voyager4520. I'd like to say a little more about why Dave Nowlin's solution, also, works. (Which was how this entire, now rather long, thread began.)

Now, let's see, how can I explain this? OK, yes, the new molded extractor claws are slightly too large, and the new extractor claws do a really poor job of gripping the cartridge rim tightly. Consequently, when extraction starts to take place and without that slight angle to the claw, like the 40 caliber extractor has, the case is going to come out of the chamber along a lower horizontal axis.

Something else is going to happen to: Because the inside shoulder of the new molded extractors is slightly oversized, once the cartridge case is almost out of the chamber the new extractors are unable to move backwards into the slide with the same, 'snap' as the older extractors are able to do.

This means that a spent cartridge case is going to be, 'pushed' more out of the gun rather than, 'snapped' out; and THIS is what Nowlin's solution actually addresses. Consequently, there's more than just one performance characteristic wrong with Glock's new molded extractors. If I were to do a list, it would look like this:

1. The top and bottom, 'flats' are too thick and need to be polished down.

2. There is no reverse angle on the earliest extractor claws.

3. The claws on these molded extractors are too large and the fit is sloppy.

4. The inside, 'shoulder' is slightly oversized and inhibits inward extractor motion (or, 'snap') at the end of the slide's stroke.

5. I have a suspicion that the recoil characteristics of Glock's new dual-action guide rod design contribute to this situation.

The only thing I'll add to the above is anytime you have a mysterious FTF/FTE problem it's always a good idea to change the SLB, too.

vaquero aleman
05-04-2012, 05:41
Well, I finally got my G21 converted to .460 Rowland and managed to get to the shootin hole and pop off a few.

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q547/vaqueroaleman/460%20ROWLAND/DSCN0440-1.jpg

Prior to this I had, on a hunch, removed the extractor plunger/spring assy and snipped about one and a half curls off of the plunger spring(about the thickness of the bearing head). I reassembled the slide and continued on my journey of conversion.

So I begin to shoot the 460, I'm pretty anxious at that moment, I immediately notice that the comp has spun a little bit and I started having FTF's. All of this aggravation means that I didn't pay attention to the direction of the brass, but after firing 14 rounds(@ $1 per round), I stopped to collect my brass and realized that all but one piece of brass had landed in an area off to my right, not over my shoulder and behind me. The one stray piece of brass was still off to my right but a little bit behind where I was standing, so over all I would say that my simple fix of "removing a couple of curls from the plunger spring" has solved my "brass in the face" problems.:)