DEBT and survival (MAXED OUT) [Archive] - Glock Talk

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AimZeroed
02-26-2012, 03:52
Has anyone seen this documentary MAXED OUT? Its a bit long but I wonder about peoples' thoughts about it and its relation to SHTF. Obviously it wouldn't matter much (I think) in the most extreme circumstances. But what about during the slide to chaos? It's a little prophetic with some of the people they interview like gietner. Your thoughts

Maxed Out: Hard Times, Easy Credit and the Era of Predatory Lend - YouTube

Syclone538
02-26-2012, 05:16
Without watching it yet (I will), just reading the title, I can't help but to think of Argentina. FerFal said that when they revalued the currency, everyone with savings was wiped out, and everyone with debt just paid it off with the new worthless currency. Not something to bet a life savings on, but something to think about.


edit

Ok, after watching some of it, it looks like propaganda against free markets and personal responsibility. Two things that I think are very important.


If two people agree on terms, they should be free to complete the transaction.

If someone wants to do something that doesn't hurt someone else, they should be free to do it.

With freedom comes responsibility.

R_W
02-26-2012, 08:14
I didn't watch it, but...

the powers that be have studied Argentina and have a piece in most large banks and almost all mortgages. They have already proven they will change the rules and terms to protect themselves. You think they will honor your terms? They won't make the same mistake and will start "readjusting" your debt to account for inflation.

Dexters
02-26-2012, 11:04
Has anyone seen this documentary MAXED OUT? Its a bit long but I wonder about peoples' thoughts about it and its relation to SHTF. Obviously it wouldn't matter much (I think) in the most extreme circumstances. But what about during the slide to chaos? It's a little prophetic with some of the people they interview like gietner. Your thoughts



What are your thoughts?

shotgunred
02-26-2012, 12:30
Her is one of the biggest secrets in the US. The government always has been and will always be about business not about people.
The revolutionary war was a merchant's war and things haven't done anything but gotten worst since then.

AimZeroed
02-26-2012, 12:35
My thoughts? Well about the film itself I think it is good in spite of itself. I strongly dislike the bias towards a certain political party as I am a "not a dimes worth of difference and a pox on both houses kind of guy." I think both parties say what they need to in order to get elected then act in the interest of those who give the donations. But this film, in light of the events that took place after (I think the film was about 2006 or 07) really drove home the point to me that the current system seems destined to crash. The lady at the end who I believe is now running for senate asked, (paraphrasing) What is the exit plan? And there isn't one. Look at that debt clock at 7 Trillion back then, seems small now eh. I think the current system will certainly go on longer than most people think but I give it 5 to 10 years before the bills come due. That means about 3 years minimum and 8 years maximum to get our stuff together. It's not the end of the world, but it is as we know it. So the stuff about personal finance, certainly get out of debt if you can for survivalist, but I am thinking of the larger picture of our relation to debt as a society and nation.

So what kind of economics would exist in a post debt collapse world once things got somewhat back together? Interesting on that NG preppers where I saw the guy buying alcohol to trade.

Dexters
02-26-2012, 15:00
My thoughts? Well about the film itself I think it is good in spite of itself. I strongly dislike the bias towards a certain political party as I am a "not a dimes worth of difference and a pox on both houses kind of guy." I think both parties say what they need to in order to get elected then act in the interest of those who give the donations. But this film, in light of the events that took place after (I think the film was about 2006 or 07) really drove home the point to me that the current system seems destined to crash. The lady at the end who I believe is now running for senate asked, (paraphrasing) What is the exit plan? And there isn't one. Look at that debt clock at 7 Trillion back then, seems small now eh. I think the current system will certainly go on longer than most people think but I give it 5 to 10 years before the bills come due. That means about 3 years minimum and 8 years maximum to get our stuff together. It's not the end of the world, but it is as we know it. So the stuff about personal finance, certainly get out of debt if you can for survivalist, but I am thinking of the larger picture of our relation to debt as a society and nation.

So what kind of economics would exist in a post debt collapse world once things got somewhat back together? Interesting on that NG preppers where I saw the guy buying alcohol to trade.

I don't think we go straight down.

Our future is Europe's.

In the early 80s they started VAT at 5% it is now 18 - 25% depending upon the product - that postponed their problems. We will do the same to postpone our debt problems.

We will do the same - partly because the international community will pressure the USA to do so.

So the time line is - dates are approximate:

Now until 2015 - recessionary - deflation

2016 - 2020 - economic upturn - slight inflation

2020 - high inflation

2021 - 5 - institute VAT in USA

2025 - 2035/40 - OK times

2035/40 - bad times returns like they have in Greece.

It looks good but 2 hours is a bit much.
http://www.maxedoutmovie.com/syn/index.html

Big Bird
02-29-2012, 07:19
Eh.... who knows.

Politicians give people what they want to hear. Believe crap like they can take stuff from other people and this will make your life better and vote for it and you will always be disappointed in the outcome.

We've had this same level of debt (as a percentage of GDP) before and worked out of it.

We haven't had the same ballooning entitlement problems before--medicare and SS.

10 years ago Japan had FAR greater debt and entitlement problems than the ones we are facing and limped along for a decade but the S didn't HTF.

20 years ago the Berlin wall came down and the entire polticial, social, and monetary systems of the old communist bloc literally fell apart in a few months time. Those folks all seem to be doing fine now and it didn't look like the S didn't HTF much there at the time.

We've been here before in many ways and this time its different--maybe--maybe not.

This nation's economy is a lot more resilient than most people give it credit for and it needs some love from the masters in Washington--not a constant threat of taxation and regulation. Somebody has to believe they can make some money sometime somehow before they go around passing out jobs like candy. Some serious growth will wipe most of this out and we'll be arguing over small things once again. But growth is tough to drive in a mature economy with the masters cracking the biggest tax and regulatory whip in the world. So some political change is necessary and possible and easier in the end than letting the SHTF.

Argentina Schmargentina....could that happen here? Sure. And if it does we'll get through it too...just like the Argentines. Will it suck? Sure. We can't keep "Drinking free bubble up and eating that rainbow stew" all the time...it would get boring and we'd get fat and lazy.