Rawles: FBI datamined my site. Feds Tracking Survivalists/Preppers? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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humanguerrilla
03-20-2012, 20:46
redirected his site traffic, employed long living cookie, tracked 10% of visitors possibly in the course of or under guise of an investigation of one reader who was associated with or used megaupload.

http://survivalblog.com/2012/03/important-message-from-jwr-the-fbis-cookie-caper-and-the-vpn-imperative.html

racerford
03-20-2012, 22:00
I saw that. I am surprised that he or anyone else would be surprised by that action on the part of the FBI.

TangoFoxtrot
03-21-2012, 04:20
But yet the FBI could not find Bin Ladin for 10 years? Hmmmm. Sounds like wasted energy and assets to me.

kirgi08
03-21-2012, 08:55
:faint:

RED64CJ5
03-21-2012, 09:00
I'm not convinced that using VPN to mask your activity is any better than just using your regular ISP.

The same goes for cookies. You might disable cookies, but you will suffer dearly for it on many websites. It's hard to go without them. Try driving your car without tires.

lawman800
03-21-2012, 09:43
If Bin Laden was a prepper or blogger against Obama... they would have found him in an hour.

inzone
03-21-2012, 11:19
same bs way the BATF works.....they find small paperwork errors in the books of mom and pop gunshop owners and litigate and harass them out of business...it is much easier and safer than actually going out and seizing guns from drug gangs and narco-trafficking terrorists, and gangs like the Latin Kings ,etc... it justifies their bureaucratic budgets and they are home for early dinner...... and it makes all America ever so much safer ! (sarcasm)

UneasyRider
03-21-2012, 18:28
I'm not convinced that using VPN to mask your activity is any better than just using your regular ISP.

The same goes for cookies. You might disable cookies, but you will suffer dearly for it on many websites. It's hard to go without them. Try driving your car without tires.

You can't hide from the government if you log on from your own house. Sorry to tell you.

Akita
03-21-2012, 18:29
While I have nothing to hide (i have never even been to megaupload etc), I found one of those FBI.gov cookies in my file. I am very careful about what cookies I allow, and that was NOT one of them; therefore it was forced onto me somehow. I am not computersavvy enough to say anything more than that.

I erased it, of course, along with all the other cookies to start over with a clean cookie file. I will continue to visit Rawles and periodically look for that evil forced cookie.

*******s.

Bolster
03-21-2012, 21:00
I regularly delete cookies, too, but never did it because of big brothah and .gov before. That's very disconcerting. I wonder why this doesn't get press. Oh, right. The media can't stand the tracking of terrorists if Bush is president, but spying on citizens who may be right of center is always a good idea under a Demo prez. In fact, haven't we learned from .gov that right-leaning and libertarian inclinations are predictive of terrorism?

But it's not just .gov. I've been reading the "What They Know (http://online.wsj.com/public/page/what-they-know-digital-privacy.html)" series of articles from Wall Street Journal and just the commercial side of tracking was enough to freak me out. I also generally switch on "Private Browsing" for Safari.

>>> Watch for targeted ads. If you see pop-ups that are advertising you things you might actually be interested in, then someone's probably tracking you. <<<

However, I'm also aware that none of these things actually keep me safe or anonymous. So most of the time I watch my mouth, too. They haven't got my mind yet...

kirgi08
03-21-2012, 21:18
You can't hide from the government if you log on from your own house. Sorry to tell you.

Your wrong,one can ghost.'08.

Bolster
03-21-2012, 22:56
I just don't get it. Over at FEMA (http://www.fema.gov/prepared/) they are encouraging people to prep. Why would one branch of .gov encourage prepping, and another branch spy on the preppers?

That seems like entrapment.

Other than the obvious answer, which is that we're becoming like the soviet union in terms of the ruling class distrusting and "managing" the population.

What is the FBI looking for? What are they trying to find? What's making the gov't nervous about prepping? Do they really care what tarp or firestarter or type of rice I'm buying?

For crying out loud, they should send someone out to kiss my butt for not being yet one more mouth to feed when trouble comes, and for getting my CERT credentials to help the community during crisis.

Maybe that's why they're spying on us. They're planning a nice, big surprise party for us, to tell us thanks for being responsible citizens...yeah, that's the ticket.

Bolster
03-21-2012, 23:05
Oh, just for the record, if any spooks are monitoring this thread, I would like to take a moment to state that I looooove big brother and will be a good little sheep. :tongueout:

TangoFoxtrot
03-22-2012, 04:16
If Bin Laden was a prepper or blogger against Obama... they would have found him in an hour.
I don't know about that. He was Chenney's sub contactor in Iraq.

Deployment Solu
03-22-2012, 04:29
Wow!! Just wow!!

Bren
03-22-2012, 04:38
I am usually ignored when I point out the information contained on Glock Talk. Nobody ever seems to think it's strange to respond to thread after thread of: your picture - picture of your house - your tattoos - where do you work - where did you got to school - where did you go to basic training - picture of your guns - what countries have you travelled to - etc.

Even an anti-gunner, with time and no special skills, equipment or authority, could put together a lot of information about you from this site. I have often found out who people are on forums using google and a few minutes of my time. Law enforcement or anti-gun groups or wacky hippies could do a lot more with a little time.

inzone
03-22-2012, 06:54
feds can pay min wage to college interns to monitor computers and research, they can conjure up entire investigations and databases on the real cheap and it is also politically correct to find the right wing wingnuts(sadly we have more than our share!) on the fringe and get news stories about their ethnocentrism,racism,nativism and paranoia, etc. The left/Obama/democrats can then build whole little cottage industries around this.Look at the "Million Mom March" and Brady Campaign, and a dozen expensive task forces in Justice Dept, FBI, BATF,Homeland Security , etc.

How many sophisticated terrorists and operators really send unencrypted, uncoded messages on the internet and in public message forums. AT BEST, all this monitoring after millions of dollars may skim out a very small number of the "third string", mostly wannabe lone wolves who are dumb as a box of rocks and saw off gun barrels a couple inches too short or make pipe bombs, or like the Hutarree wingnuts, dress in camos, run around in the woods, then drink too much beer and full of false bravado talk about megalomaniacal plans to jump start a revolution from the backwoods. The Mohammad Attas of the islamic jihad are not that stupid.

arclight610
03-22-2012, 07:41
I am usually ignored when I point out the information contained on Glock Talk. Nobody ever seems to think it's strange to respond to thread after thread of: your picture - picture of your house - your tattoos - where do you work - where did you got to school - where did you go to basic training - picture of your guns - what countries have you travelled to - etc.

Even an anti-gunner, with time and no special skills, equipment or authority, could put together a lot of information about you from this site. I have often found out who people are on forums using google and a few minutes of my time. Law enforcement or anti-gun groups or wacky hippies could do a lot more with a little time.

I'm sort of leary about the B/S/T forums here. Oftentimes when I put a gun up for sale, I get responses from extremely low post count users like joined on Sept 2007 with 2 posts. The responses are usually similar like "Where do you live? I would like to do face to face tomorrow at anytime." I can't help but to think "ATF agent" every time I see one.

Bolster
03-22-2012, 09:43
...The Mohammad Attas of the islamic jihad are not that stupid.

Good post. However the lefties would much, much rather fight the dumb right-wing nuts than they would the Islamic Jihad. The left doesn't really recognize Jihadis as enemies; they mostly see conservatives as the only enemies and if only the conservatives were wiped out, the world would be a beautiful place: abundant in free love, free healthcare, and no need to go to work every day.

Fighting foreign (or local) Jihadis is real, and dangerous. Fighting fellow conservative citizens is safe, gets you elected to office, and gives you the keys to power.

To twist the phrase, "If conservatives did not exist, liberals would need to invent them to get elected."

bdcochran
03-22-2012, 10:07
I will answer Bolster's question about the FBI.

It was very good at finding draft dodgers and interstate stolen car rings. Agents were routinely required to file hour reports exaggerating the time spent on government business. This was done so that in the annual budget hearings, Mr. Hoover could point out the good investment. Many of those hours were spent watching movies in movie theaters.

Today, it excels in catching internet porn watchers (just make sure that your views are not of underage) and lonely men looking for young girls.

The FBI has never been good at finding spies, but has been spy infested. It never knew that there was a Mafia until after J. Edgar died.

Ok. I will plug my new book: The China Connection, available on Amazon.com

quake
03-22-2012, 11:01
…Nobody ever seems to think it's strange to respond to thread after thread of: your picture - picture of your house - your tattoos - where do you work - where did you got to school - where did you go to basic training - picture of your guns - what countries have you travelled to - etc.
Even an anti-gunner, with time and no special skills, equipment or authority, could put together a lot of information about you from this site. I have often found out who people are on forums using google and a few minutes of my time. Law enforcement or anti-gun groups or wacky hippies could do a lot more with a little time.
My take on it is simply as others have pointed out - there’s no hiding, at least not from .gov, and especially not if you access the web from a pc connected to “you”. Your home, your work, etc.

So as far as my house, place of work, school, military service, etc; the .gov already knows all those things. Some things prep-specific, yes. They could pick up a picture of my pantry (but I don’t think they care about my personal pantry), or a picture of one of my rifles, but any gun I’ve posted a pic of, there’s a paper-trail on, which means that “they” already have that info as well.

As far as tattoos, that’s on file as well actually – under “distinguishing marks” with the sheriff’s office. :embarassed:

Keeping some (many) things private from individuals on the net is not only smart, but just logical and prudent. But “hiding my web identity from the govt” is usually an unrealistic pipedream imo.

quake
03-22-2012, 11:04
My take on it is simply as others have pointed out - there’s no hiding, at least not from .gov, and especially not if you access the web from a pc connected to “you”. Your home, your work, etc.

So as far as my house, place of work, school, military service, etc; the .gov already knows all those things. Some things prep-specific, yes. They could pick up a picture of my pantry (but I don’t think they care about my personal pantry), or a picture of one of my rifles, but any gun I’ve posted a pic of, there’s a paper-trail on, which means that “they” already have that info as well.

As far as tattoos, that’s on file as well actually – under “distinguishing marks” with the sheriff’s office. :embarassed:

Keeping some (many) things private from individuals on the net is not only smart, but just logical and prudent. But “hiding my web identity from the govt” is usually an unrealistic pipedream imo.


{edit to add gratuitous tattoo pic :supergrin: :
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f360/quake316/Tattooarm-cropped2-1.jpg

bdcochran
03-22-2012, 11:15
I had a private investigator. His brother worked for the CIA. His brother had kept his assignments and locations secret. They bet $1000 that the private investigator could not find where he lived. 24 hours later, the private investigator provided a lot of information and won the bet. This was over 10 years ago. At that time, my investigator has over 120 data bases in which to tap.

In my area, well over 1/2 of the landwire phones are unlisted. However, for a fee, you can find out a person's landline.

Women are a bit harder to track because of changing married names. Do you want to find an address, for example, of a movie star, just look up political contributions at the federal level.

Have problems collecting a judgment. Just pay an investigator a few hundred dollars and you will have a full report, including social security number within 24 hours.

Some people watch too much television (CSI). Just having algorithms and 10,000 spy cameras (like downtown London) doesn't mean that crimes are solved or justice is done either.

ZombieKing
03-22-2012, 11:24
I just don't get it. Over at FEMA (http://www.fema.gov/prepared/) they are encouraging people to prep. Why would one branch of .gov encourage prepping, and another branch spy on the preppers?



Two levels of preppers in their world. One preps for a few days and is okay.

The second, the one they are watching, are the ones who in their view are suspicious for prepping for months or years of bad times.

Bolster
03-22-2012, 11:52
The second, the one they are watching, are the ones who in their view are suspicious for prepping for months or years of bad times.

OK, so from their perspective, why is that suspicious and worth watching? If the long-term preppers are wrong, they merely have to eat their own stored food. I still don't understand why the long-term prepping community is worth surveilling. They must have the entire Mormon church under tight surveillance.

Why not surveil boba fett collectors? Or people who buy pocketknives? Or people who are buying silver coins, or crowbars, or shovels? What's so interesting about people who stock water and rice and have a vegetable garden and a backup generator and a bug-out location?

I'm not seeing the angles here, help me out. Put me into the elitist, paranoid mindset of a .gov spook, or their handlers. Put me into Janet Napolitano's mindset, or Eric Holder's mindset.

kirgi08
03-22-2012, 11:57
.Gov understands where the current policies are moving us towards.So as a matter of self interest they want ta know where the food is at.They'd hate ta go hungry.'08.

quake
03-22-2012, 12:06
OK, so from their perspective, why is that suspicious and worth watching? If the long-term preppers are wrong, they merely have to eat their own stored food. I still don't understand why the long-term prepping community is worth surveilling. They must have the entire Mormon church under tight surveillance.

Why not surveil boba fett collectors? Or people who buy pocketknives? Or people who are buying silver coins? What's so interesting about people who stock water and rice and have a vegetable garden and a backup generator and a bug-out location?

I'm not seeing the angles here, help me out. Put me into the elitist, paranoid mindset of a .gov spook, or their handlers. Put me into Janet Napolitano's mindset, or Eric Holder's mindset.

Basically, a "guilt by association" or "where there's smoke" kind of thing in their mind. The McVeigh's and Kaczinski's of the USA are considered (and genuinely are) anti-govt and dangerous; and anyone right-of-center (even though Kaczinski was decidedly left of center) is associationally lumped in with them, with the Klan, etc, as dangerous to society and/or the govt.

I know a lot of white people who see the idiocracy of NOLA and get mad at black people. And by the same token, there are a lot of non-preppers who see dsarti1 as representative of 'preppers'. Stupid and irrational to make that inductive leap, but not all that complicated; and all too common. On both sides.

lawman800
03-22-2012, 12:43
Preppers who are self sufficient usually don't trust nor want government in their lives and the left thinks of that as a big threat to their order.

cyrsequipment
03-23-2012, 07:41
This isn't exactly surprising, is it?

Some of the comments that have been posted on this site (I'm not familiar with the other site) have been on the verge of advocating major crimes. When similar comments are posted on DU (and we all know they have a nasty habit of advocating crimes) I'm sure they are looked at as well.

You can't hide completely on the web, so you need to act properly online. Given the work that I have done and the incidental contacts I've had with the FBI throughout my career, I have absolutely no doubt that they have gathered some information on me, I accept that without an issue. It doesn't really matter, unless you do something to draw negative attention to yourself.

The "grey man" concept that is often drown out in this forum in favor of the Rambo wannabes is good advice to all times, not just when SHTF. Some of the idiots around here that have advocated killing law enforcement under "certain circumstances" are going to stand out and be scrutinized. If you are going to shoot your mouth off, you're gonna have to expect it.

Stop pretending to be Rambo in your preps and start worrying about food, water, shelter, and the other things needed for life and it won't matter what the FBI knows about you.

lawman800
03-23-2012, 07:45
File a FOIA request with the feds and see what you get. You just might be surprised at what the feds got on you.

UneasyRider
03-23-2012, 08:04
This isn't exactly surprising, is it?

Some of the comments that have been posted on this site (I'm not familiar with the other site) have been on the verge of advocating major crimes. When similar comments are posted on DU (and we all know they have a nasty habit of advocating crimes) I'm sure they are looked at as well.

You can't hide completely on the web, so you need to act properly online. Given the work that I have done and the incidental contacts I've had with the FBI throughout my career, I have absolutely no doubt that they have gathered some information on me, I accept that without an issue. It doesn't really matter, unless you do something to draw negative attention to yourself.

The "grey man" concept that is often drown out in this forum in favor of the Rambo wannabes is good advice to all times, not just when SHTF. Some of the idiots around here that have advocated killing law enforcement under "certain circumstances" are going to stand out and be scrutinized. If you are going to shoot your mouth off, you're gonna have to expect it.

Stop pretending to be Rambo in your preps and start worrying about food, water, shelter, and the other things needed for life and it won't matter what the FBI knows about you.

Great post!

cyrsequipment
03-23-2012, 11:34
File a FOIA request with the feds and see what you get. You just might be surprised at what the feds got on you.

Meh, I'm not too worried.

Akita
03-23-2012, 16:49
{edit to add gratuitous tattoo pic :supergrin: :
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f360/quake316/Tattooarm-cropped2-1.jpg

You are not foolin the F-bees- thats Larry the Cable Guy!

quake
03-23-2012, 17:11
Larry's what we called in the service an "LTD" - a little tubby dude. He's younger and near a half-foot shorter.

He's likely smarter, though...

TangoFoxtrot
03-25-2012, 07:21
I really don't care about the feds, they take their taxes out of my pay check and all their suppose to do is manage those taxes properly.( which they don't). Other than that they can kiss my I don't need them to help me in a crisis and never did. Besides there are bigger issues for them to track other than little ole me. I think a lot of this is paranoyia and not worth worrying about.

blueyedmule
03-26-2012, 06:52
The "grey man" concept that is often drown out in this forum in favor of the Rambo wannabes is good advice to all times, not just when SHTF.

:wavey: A big "grey man" wave to ya.

cyrsequipment
03-26-2012, 09:13
Shhhhhhh.......

Sent from the blackness