IF there's time for a store run...top 6 items... [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Bolster
04-07-2012, 11:14
IF there's time for a run to one store (grocery store? big box store?) before an event (and often there is), what would you put on your list? I would like to have a list stashed so I'm not blundering through the store just grabbing random stuff.

Try to keep your list to the top 6 things you'd buy at the last minute. Obviously this is determined by what you already stock. My last-minute list would be for the grocery store. (Mostly duplicates many preps I already stock, but would want these as fresh as possible.) So far it would include:

Water (Can never have enough) or possibly CokeZero (my fave)
AA Batteries (to get the freshest possible)
Bleach (would want the freshest bottle possible)
Bread
Ice (to turn powerless fridge into icebox)
Peanut Butter (fresher is better)

...but I'm suspicious I'm overlooking more important items, here. Obviously my preps are such that no last-minute shopping is necessary, but neither does one want to pass up the last opportunity.

If your one stop would NOT be a grocery store, please explain. Given the nature of this list, I'll assume everyone's already stocked up on ammo. "Even if I had the opportunity, I would not go to a store" is also a valid answer. If that's your answer, please explain.

cowboy1964
04-07-2012, 11:19
Fresh Bleach?

If your preps are in good shape you really don't NEED to hit the grocery store. Ice maybe.

Bolster
04-07-2012, 11:22
Right, I agree. Assume you are already prepped, but the opportunity offers itself and you can make one last visit to a store, what additional stock would you pick up? Maybe just duplicates, or fresh items with a short shelf life.

Think of this exercise like Christmas shopping. No matter how well you prepare for it, there's always something you need to get the day before. What would your list be?

It's good to think this stuff through, BEFORE the event occurs.

Stevekozak
04-07-2012, 11:27
Does bleach go bad?

Commander_Zero
04-07-2012, 11:28
Depends on which store. Grocery store? WalMart? Cenex? Cabela's?

Bolster
04-07-2012, 11:29
Yes, bleach has a reasonably short shelf life (often given at 3-12 mo if it didn't get hot or cold), and if you'd need to be treating water with it, you'd want a fresh bottle.

Bolster
04-07-2012, 11:29
Depends on which store. Grocery store? WalMart? Cenex? Cabela's?

You decide. You get to go to one store. This is part of the exercise. Where would you go? What would you get? Six items. Hurry, the storm/aliens/zombies/radiation/drought is coming.

JimIsland
04-07-2012, 11:43
Water, Corona, Gentleman Jack, Vodka, Zing Zang, Coke.........sorry I couldn't be more helpful. I've got MORE than enough of everything else.

Stevekozak
04-07-2012, 12:22
Yes, bleach has a reasonably short shelf life (often given at 9-12 mo if it didn't get hot or cold), and if you'd need to be treating water with it, you'd want a fresh bottle.
I did not know that. What happens to it. Does breakdown, lose potency or what?

Bolster
04-07-2012, 12:34
I did not know that. What happens to it. Does breakdown, lose potency or what?

Yes, breaks down into salt and water. Potency is lost over a curve, not all at once of course, but some sources say "full potency" starts to degrade at only 3 months.

That's why bleach treatment of water always includes the sniff test. If it doesn't smell like chlorine after you treated it...your bleach may be old and you'd need to use more.

So .......................................... 46 views so far, and only one list submitted of "buy mostly alcohol"? If you disagree with my list, submit one of your own!

Vincine
04-07-2012, 13:12
A selection of greeting cards for all occasions, pineapple corer, turkey baster, make up remover, and dental floss.

Carry16
04-07-2012, 15:20
Didn't specify how bad/long an event I'm anticipating, but in general I would think:
1) throw away batteries
2) gasoline - top off cans/vehicle
3) bread products
4) milk
5) fresh veggies
6) ??

DaveG
04-07-2012, 16:22
I'd top off the vehicles and gas cans with gas for sure.

RED64CJ5
04-07-2012, 16:31
Batteries
Chocolate
Soft drinks
T-P (even though we have a lifetime supply)

Paul53
04-07-2012, 17:40
Hot sauce and toilet paper. Never one without the other.

Bolster
04-07-2012, 18:38
Good replies, gasoline and chocolate, definitely!

It's actually looking like a 7-eleven or circle K or Kangaroo or AM PM or whatever might be one of the better "last stops" to make because they'd have the gasoline, ice, chocolate, bread, batteries, milk, and water all in one spot. Maybe even bleach? You'd pay top price but in an emergency who cares.

What's the deal with last minute stocking of TP? It wasn't even commercially available until the 1850s. The Romans used a sponge on a stick, and then placed it into a bucket of seawater. Good enough for me.

Lone Kimono
04-07-2012, 19:49
I was at a K-Mart in the Keys before Andrew came through. Buy anything you can without getting into a fist fight for it.

1. Water
2. Food
3. Ammo
4. Salt
5. TP
6. Any Camping stuff left

If there were a 7 it would be batteries.

thesurefire
04-07-2012, 20:39
Good topic.

For those that said bleach, look into pool shock, its stores forever, is cheap, and can make literally hundreds of gallons of bleach from bag.

It really depends on the event. For example power loss in the summer, Ice is number 1, in winter, its not even on the top 100 list since I can just put stuff outside. In general:

1. Gas
2. Batteries
3. Toilet paper/baby wipes/disinfectant wipes
4. Chocolate
5. Coffee
6. Hard liquor

Spices also wouldn't be a bad idea. It'd be pretty hard to grow the ones that are imported from around the world.

kirgi08
04-07-2012, 20:59
By them whole and grind as needed.'08.

ChuteTheMall
04-07-2012, 21:06
Well, if you are already stocked up properly on the staples, then the last minute store run would be for your last fresh food for awhile. Bugging out or in matters regarding portability.

Here are some fresh items you might want to grab just before the stores close and the grid shuts down and etc:

Milk
Bread
Meat
Veggies
Fruit
Cheese
Yogurt
Bucket of fried chicken
Ice if you can't produce it fast enough.
Fresh anchovies
:fishing:

random southpaw
04-07-2012, 21:21
Does bleach go bad?

Yep! Liquid bleach can and does go bad.

That is why a lot of preppers prefer "pool shock," which comes in solid form. It stores and lasts way better. Then, you have a reliable means of making suspect water safe to drink.

Just be sure you know how much to use for a given quantity of water.

M1A Shooter
04-07-2012, 21:31
id go for AA batteries, gas, propane tanks, assorted little debbie snacks, cigarettes and beer.

ive got most everything else. even have most of my list but just not as much as i'd like.

for those stocking bleach, look into powdered Calcium Hypochlorite. can be found as Pool Shock, but stay away from those with anything extra in it. if stored airtight and dry, will last almost indefinitely and can easily be made into liquid bleach and used as normal as needed.

random southpaw
04-07-2012, 21:31
My family already has a stash to get through most weather type event situations. And, if bad times persisted for a while ( remember, it took about 3 weeks for help to reach New Orleans), we can handle that as well.

As for what we would get--simply because we are prepared--we might get some comfort food type items, make sure we have enough good books to last for a while, and batten down the hatches.

Ready.gov has been telling everybody that we all need to have at least 3 days of food, water, etc. to handle any kind of emergency--and that should always be on hand--like right now.

Personally, after observing the less than stellar performance of our disaster response when something happens in the USA, I think that the 3 day suggested stash of supplies should be multiplied by a factor of at least ten. Do not stop prepping, until your family has a solid 30 day supply of essentials for every member of your family. Oh, and don't forget to plan for more due to the irresponsible friends and family who will come looking for you because they know you plan for these things--and they do not. Nice reward isn't it?

Bolster
04-07-2012, 21:42
(removed...I was off topic -- had questions about calcium hypochlorite -- found answers here (http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1361002&highlight=calcium+hypochlorite) with a search.)

bdcochran
04-07-2012, 21:45
Would go to costco:
1. gasoline
2. batteries
3. filled propane tanks
4. jerky
5. fresh fruit/vegetables
6. canned soup

TalkToTheGlock
04-07-2012, 21:49
1. Digorno supreme pizza with stuffed crust

2. Doritos

3. Iced Tea

4. Party Mix

5. Reeses Peanut Butter Cups

6. Nature Valley Fruit and Nut bar


iPhone 4

Warp
04-07-2012, 22:49
Local Kroger:

1. Canned foods (we don't do the eat what store/store what eat thing well)

2. Dog food (even though it wouldn't be their usual)

3. Gas: Fill up red plastic gas cans at with fuel reward points, also top off vehicle.

Whatever else sounds like a good idea. Maybe toilet paper/paper towels, maybe garbage bags, maybe fruit, maybe milk, depends on the event, what we expect, and what we have.

kirgi08
04-07-2012, 23:08
Well, if you are already stocked up properly on the staples, then the last minute store run would be for your last fresh food for awhile. Bugging out or in matters regarding portability.

Here are some fresh items you might want to grab just before the stores close and the grid shuts down and etc:

Milk
We have a farm fresh source.

Bread

We bake our own,we ain't bought from a store in years.
Meat

Covered,and then some.
Veggies

Garden going in after the last threat of a frost goes by
Fruit

We have fruit trees.
Cheese

Same as milk,be for around for a long time.
Yogurt
Not our thing,not prep wise anyway.

Bucket of fried chicken
Couldn't resist,could ya.:supergrin:

Ice if you can't produce it fast enough.
We can,just ta fill freezers as needed.

Fresh anchovies
:puking:

:fishing:

:tempted:

ChuteTheMall
04-08-2012, 10:05
Hookers and blow?

Glock30Eric
04-08-2012, 12:44
Lowes

1) Several of 5 gallon gas tanks (it is a barter item if I could fill it with diesel to get weapons n ammo or high-end valuable items)
2) Veggie seeds (to trade for some valuable things I need)
3) 1 set of wrenches and hand tools (to make several modifications out of things for a trade. I also could do a repair for a trade)
4) Wood spiltter ax 7 lbs (keep ourselves warm and to sell woods)
5) Two long crowbar (to break things down)
6) Heavy duty ropes (multi-purpose ropes)

I will need those things to thrive in SHTF. I don't want to be a dependent in the SHTF.



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Warp
04-08-2012, 12:49
Lowes

1) Several of 5 gallon gas tanks (it is a barter item if I could fill it with diesel to get weapons n ammo or high-end valuable items)
2) Veggie seeds (to trade for some valuable things I need)
3) 1 set of wrenches and hand tools (to make several modifications out of things for a trade. I also could do a repair for a trade)
4) Wood spiltter ax 7 lbs (keep ourselves warm and to sell woods)
5) Two long crowbar (to break things down)
6) Heavy duty ropes (multi-purpose ropes)

I will need those things to thrive in SHTF. I don't want to be a dependent in the SHTF.



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I guess the question is...why don't you have them now?

I think most items on a list like this are perishable, otherwise they would already have been acquired.

Bolster
04-08-2012, 13:11
I guess the question is...why don't you have them now? I think most items on a list like this are perishable, otherwise they would already have been acquired.

My question also. I would think your last-minute run would concentrate on the perishables.

Thanks to this exercise I'm totally reorganizing my original list. Now:

1 Gasoline
2 Ice
3 Soda - CokeZero
4 Bread
5 Peanut Butter
6 Batteries, maybe, if time permits. Have lots of Eneloops.

Water left the list because there’s 120 gallons at home, and I don’t want to be schlepping heavy water around at the last minute. Cola instead. Bleach is gone, going to use Calcium Hypochlorite instead.

Bolster
04-08-2012, 13:19
TALLY so far, by number of mentions:

1. Gasoline - 7 mentions
2. Batteries - 6 mentions
3. Vegetables - 4 mentions
4. Toilet paper - 4 mentions

All the following got 3 mentions so far:

Water
Bread
Ice
Alcohol
Soda

--------

I was surprised at toilet paper & alcohol making top mentions -- these can both be stocked. But if they're not, that indicates they'd make excellent barter items. Batteries is borderline, if people were meaning AA and AAA, since LSD NiMH rechargeables (Eneloops, etc.) can be stocked.

Chindo18Z
04-08-2012, 14:33
My first actual shopping actions (if time & situation allow) are the following:

1. GASOLINE
2. CASH x MAX ATM WITHDRAWAL
3. AMMUNITION (edited to caveat:ADDITIONAL)

Once I've accomplished the above, and if the opportunity to shop a grocery store exists:

My priority FOOD items are soon-to-be-scarce things (mostly high calorie fat or protein) that keep without electricity:

1. COOKING OIL
2. SPAM
3. EGGS
4. BUTTER
5. CRISCO
6. SUMMER SAUSAGE
7. VELVEETA PROCESSED CHEESE
8. PEPPERONI
9. TUNA
10. CANNED CORNED BEEF
11. SALTINE CRACKERS
12. PEANUT BUTTER
13. CHOCOLATE
14. HONEY
15. HARD BLOCK/WHEEL CHEESE
16. WASA CRISP CRACKERS
17. DRIED PASTA MIXES (BAG/BOX MEALS)
18. ROASTED NUTS (ANY)
19. DAK CANNED HAM
20. NUTELLA HAZELNUT CHOCOLATE SPREAD (VERY HIGH CALORIE)
21. CANNED ROAST BEEF
22. CANNED CHICKEN
23. CANNED SOUP
24. CANNED STEW
25. CORN NUTS (VERY HIGH CALORIE)

Sorry...I can't keep a list to just six items unless it's a 6-pack of beer. :winkie:

Bolster
04-08-2012, 15:04
My first actual shopping actions (if time & situation allow) are the following...

Good list, but is this your last-second list? By way of feedback, this would mean you'd need to go to four stores to get your first four items...unless they're now selling ammo at Arco stations or banks.

Why not stock cash and ammo now? Ditto some of the long-shelf items on your list, such as #17 pasta and #14 Honey, which is perhaps the longest shelf-life food known to mankind, having been found in ancient Egyptian tombs and still being edible.

Otherwise, a thoughtful, ordered list...strong work.

Out of curiosity, how long do eggs last w/o refrigeration?

Warp
04-08-2012, 15:09
I think an S/Per listing ammunition at the top of a "last second" list is doing something wrong.

ChuteTheMall
04-08-2012, 15:10
Out of curiosity, how long do eggs last w/o refrigeration?

Why not bring live chickens?

:rofl:

Glock30Eric
04-08-2012, 17:12
I guess the question is...why don't you have them now?

I think most items on a list like this are perishable, otherwise they would already have been acquired.

I live in an apartment and I am married. Sometime you don't get what you need right now because you aren't the only one making decision.


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DoctaGlockta
04-08-2012, 17:29
IF there's time for a run to one store (grocery store? big box store?) before an event (and often there is),

Water (Can never have enough) or possibly CokeZero (my fave)
AA Batteries (to get the freshest possible)
Bleach (would want the freshest bottle possible)
Bread
Ice (to turn powerless fridge into icebox)
Peanut Butter (fresher is better)

...

I thought you were trying to survive? :dunno:

michael e
04-08-2012, 17:34
Last hurrican that hit was a few years ago. I was the only one in the store buying beer, pizza, smokes, red bull, jager. I keep everything else stocked up anyway.

G29Reload
04-08-2012, 17:39
As much green produce as I could eat before it spoils. (1 months?)
Couple extra sacks of rice…5, 10 lb bags
Hefty bags
Bleach
TP
Extra bottled water
case of black beans
Fillup the vehicle and jerry jugs.

See if there's a time to grab a couple of fresh baked pizza at the dominoes. might not have any of that for awhile...

Aceman
04-08-2012, 18:11
If I KNEW "it" was coming:

#1 Gas
#2 Fresh bleach, apparently...
#3 Batteries
#4 Canned food - unusual stuff NOT usually on my shelves (i.e.; NOT more ravioli)
#5 Seasonal meds (allergy meds, sunscreen, etc...)
#6 More of appropriate gear for the specific SHTF (no electric - Propane, Rain - plastic sheets, etc...)

purrrfect 10
04-08-2012, 18:21
Hot sauce and toilet paper. Never one without the other.
:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Warp
04-08-2012, 18:22
I live in an apartment and I am married. Sometime you don't get what you need right now because you aren't the only one making decision.


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Yup .

Lone Kimono
04-08-2012, 18:39
Bolster, you might want to watch episode 2 or 3 of Doomsday preppers. The lady used mineral oil on the outside or eggs and they kept for 8 or 9 months. She didn't explain the entire process though, so there may be more to it.

Chindo18Z
04-08-2012, 19:02
Good list, but is this your last-second list?

Honestly...Like you, I don't actually NEED anything at the last minute.

However...

Like many folks, I can't safely store as much extra gasoline as I'd like due to fire hazard and insurance requirements. Given last minute warning of impending events and assuming safe conditions, I will fill stockpiled empty containers with fuel. My only actual priority.

I think an S/Per listing ammunition at the top of a "last second" list is doing something wrong.

I can exercise the option to pickup additional when I get fuel and cash. All my points of purchase are co-located and nearby. So...Why not? Too much ain't enough.

The OP's question was designed to come up with suggestions he hadn't already thought of. It's a good mental exercise. If I choose to wade into a grocery store a few steps ahead of the panicked herd...I'm damn sure not limited to 6 types of items.

In point of fact, I already maintain a one page, prioritized Speed Shopping List of about 50 items. I keep printed copies at home and in my vehicles. Whomever can safely make it to a store first...starts hitting that list (or the priority section of it). It's a drill.

There is nothing on that list that I don't already have (except for the spare fuel). It's just a checklist to top off on pre-planned items.

I'm not going to fight my way into the super-store (ala Adrian's Undead Diary) if things have already descended into anarchy. But if I can beat the rush...

This ain't my first Prepper rodeo... :whistling:

M1A Shooter
04-08-2012, 19:44
seems like the OP had a goal of making you think about what you were short on, at least thats how i took it.

as far as eggs go, iirc the oil, vaseline or butter coatings only work on fresh eggs that havent been cooled already. you can also break them, scramble them and freeze them into ice cube trays and then bagged after frozen. or seperate the whites and yolks but the yolks need to be salted to let them freeze and not gel. another option is to scramble and cook them, then dehydrate and powder them. store like any other powdered eggs.

Bolster
04-08-2012, 20:06
Sometime you don't get what you need right now because you aren't the only one making decision.

I HEARD THAT! Same story here, and the better half is not convinced that society will come to a stand-still.

I thought you were trying to survive?

The Coke Zero? Well, I am trying to kill myself with that. You caught me.

seems like the OP had a goal of making you think about what you were short on, at least thats how i took it.

That's the altruistic view. The OP (me) was hoping to assemble a better "last minute list" with the help of the S/P intelligencia. Good suggestions and I'm very pleased with the thread. Made me think differently about last minute preps, and is making me stock up on a few items I hadn't thought to earlier.

One "aha" moment was realizing the mini-marts at the gas stations actually do serve a purpose. Normally I avoid them, but they'd be the shizzle for a last-minute run if you got there before the hoards descended. They stock most the stuff at the top of the list (in small quantities, admittedly) minus the vegetables. Costco/Wal-Mart/Sam'sClub might actually be places to avoid, last minute?

Any you guys have stories of what Costco/Wal-Mart/Sam'sClub/HomeDepot is like, last minute? Pretty nasty I imagine?

powder86
04-08-2012, 20:59
gasoline, water, canned goods, full propane tanks, ply wood (for windows and doors, and to create choke points), medicinal supplies.

i've already got good food storage, but one last trip to top everything off sure wouldn't hurt.

lawman800
04-09-2012, 01:16
Gasoline. Lots of gasoline.

Candles and other long duration, limited maintenance lighting source. Maybe more cyalume sticks if they have it.

Spam. Lots of canned meats with long shelf lives. Canned soups. Canned fruits. Just canned fruits in general. (Good thing I already have a can opener so I don't take up a space for that item)

Water. Never get enough water.

Cigarettes. Helps sooth the soul like alcohol without the debilitating effects.

Propane. For cooking.

TangoFoxtrot
04-09-2012, 04:26
1. Batteries
2. Gasoline
3. Propane
4. Beer
5. Water
6. Bleach

Glock30Eric
04-09-2012, 05:00
I don't think batteries won't run out that quick. Maybe a week after SHTF because not many people realized that they relies on the batteries to support their electronic addictions.

Candle is very good. I brought 50 lbs of soy wax at candle.com I think. It's perfect.

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ancient_serpent
04-09-2012, 05:22
We're fairly well set here for the scenario. If I had an opportunity to stock up on six items before SHTF I would buy many of the same thigns everyone else here picked:

In no particular order:

1- Instant Coffee. Nothing helps keep people motivated to work and stay alert like it. Hot coffee is a great morale boost when working long hours in recovery operations.

2- Bottled water. We have a whole bunch, but it never hurts to have a little extra.

3- Dog/cat food. Our pets would greatly appreciate it and if we don't know how long it will be till more arrives...

4- Ice. Will help keep perishables good for longer.

5- Gas for our vehicles.

6- Paper plates. Have a stock of them already, but little things like this can help preserve water for other uses.

jason10mm
04-09-2012, 08:47
Seems like there are two different philosophies appearing here. One are the folks who are just adding to what they should already have stocked, the other are the folks buying "luxury" items designed to make riding out the event as comfortable as possible.

I know what group I'd want to be in!

My list would be:
A) Fuel: Can't drive without it, can't cook without it, and in winter, can't heat without it. Definitely the most precious resource for me.
B) Fresh Food: If I'm bugging in then I know I'll be eating it. Steaks from a good butcher don't need refridgeration, veggies and fruit can last for a week or more. Some fresh foods can be prepared more easily and with less fuel than frozen items. Ground meat and chicken are to be avoided, they can not tolerate being warm (because the bacteria inside them will start to thrive).
C) Batteries: Power is like fuel. Hard to ever have enough. Can you recharge faster than you use?
D) Water: While it can be stored or gathered, it is nice to have good tasting bottled stuff to drink and reserve the rest for cooking.
E) Pet food. Hard (for me) to remember to keep much of a stockpile.

Bolster
04-09-2012, 09:42
Seems like there are two different philosophies appearing here. One are the folks who are just adding to what they should already have stocked, the other are the folks buying "luxury" items designed to make riding out the event as comfortable as possible.

I think your two categories miss the largest segment: Folks (such as yourself) who are getting perishable items at the last moment...which are neither easy to stock, nor luxury items. Perishables (including gas) appear to be far and away the items at the top of the list for a last minute run, which stands to reason.

If people would switch to hard liquor for disasters, then beer could be eliminated as a last minute prep item. Beer is best fresh; hard alcohol doesn't care and is way more compact to store and transport.

I noticed nobody mentioned medications as a last-minute stop. Perhaps that's because we're all such hairy-chested manly men in peak condition. (Not.)

powder86
04-09-2012, 10:58
I noticed nobody mentioned medications as a last-minute stop. Perhaps that's because we're all such hairy-chested manly men in peak condition. (Not.)

I did. Post 49.

Chindo18Z
04-09-2012, 10:59
I think we all come at this from different perspectives. Everyone envisions a slightly different type or duration of situation when considering their top picks.

Some are thinking about riding out a short term localized event (blizzard, tropical storm, ice storm, downtown riot, flood, etc.).

Some are considering a longer term and more widespread situation (regional/national natural disaster, power grid failure, monetary collapse, civil unrest, nuclear event, pandemic, etc.).

From my perspective, the most likely event I need to weather is a cascading failure of the electronic banking & monetary system...leading to interruption of public utilities, emergency services, and just-in-time logistic deliveries... leading to violent civil unrest. I feel that requires being able to self-sustain for several weeks to several months.

I prepare accordingly.

Twinkies.

Although I truly admire the post about Anchovies. :winkie:

sebecman
04-09-2012, 11:34
What's the deal with last minute stocking of TP? It wasn't even commercially available until the 1850s. The Romans used a sponge on a stick, and then placed it into a bucket of seawater. Good enough for me.

Because TP is better than a sponge?

The afghans use 3 stones...or their left hand.

We used to use newspaper or old magazines in our woods camp when I was a kid...

like anything there is lesser quality alternatives in a pinch, but prepping is about not having to go there...

quake
04-09-2012, 13:21
Gasoline. Lots of gasoline.

Candles and other long duration, limited maintenance lighting source. Maybe more cyalume sticks if they have it.

Spam. Lots of canned meats with long shelf lives. Canned soups. Canned fruits. Just canned fruits in general. (Good thing I already have a can opener so I don't take up a space for that item)

Water. Never get enough water.

Cigarettes. Helps sooth the soul like alcohol without the debilitating effects.

Propane. For cooking.
+1

Only change I'd make is from 'candles' to 'batteries for LED lights' for lighting; as they're more economical and also safer than open flames in the house. Even a little paklite unit on 'low' will put out substantially more light than a candle, and do it for 500-600 hours from a single $1.50 battery.

Bolster
04-09-2012, 14:20
Because TP is better than a sponge?

Is it REALLY, sebecman...is it REALLY? If all you know is TP, you are probably running around dirty. Live a little...try a sponge! Or better yet get one of those high-ticket TP-less Japanese thrones. They are so fine (http://files.myopera.com/sukekomashi-gaijin/blog/hightechtoilet.jpg), you will never want to leave the loo...

Glock30Eric
04-09-2012, 14:55
I'll wash my rear with water in my hands. It doesn't cost me anything. I have no problem with that.

I'll buy few TP so I could sell it at a crazy price during SHTF because I do foresee a high demand in it.

MoneyMaker
04-09-2012, 15:08
Fruit loops
Fudge bars
Tea
Milk
Bread
this way i can have milk with my cereal,make a egg sandwich and have a glass of tea while reading the forums,then have a fudge bar as my treat for the day

DoctaGlockta
04-09-2012, 19:01
Fuel

Hygiene products such as:

Soap
Ladies bandages

2 Stoke oil or motor oil

Food

Water

Shotgun shells

inzone
04-09-2012, 19:31
COSTCO:(sorry, I went over six!)(but this is survival so we dont play fair and we dont follow the rules!!) We take all four family vehicles: note, we have some of all the above,(already have beaucoup ammo) but the 0P said last minute.why not? (your credit cards may well be useless in a matter of hours)...so here goes:(lots) salt,honey,those 50 lb bags of white rice,(lots) hard cheeses, canned meets (lots), canned fruits, VITAMINS (lots), pasta, flour, crisco, olive oil(lots of oil) (especially in the large cans), canned tomato sauce/tomato paste, soy sauce, sardines (lots), beef jerky, sugar, dried salami, macaroni and cheese(boxes) LOTS!, teabags,coffee, dog food (lots), liquor, powdered milk, rubbing alcohol, big canisters of spices, koolaid mix, powderd bleach, corn meal,beans,.....till all four vehicles are filled up! oh and a package of twinkies!!:rofl:

Warp
04-09-2012, 20:18
I guess the elephant in the room is...What is the imminent scenario?

If hurricane Katrina II is about to hit...does that really warrant maxing out all of your credit cards for toilet paper and food? Even if your in LA?

lawman800
04-09-2012, 20:59
+1

Only change I'd make is from 'candles' to 'batteries for LED lights' for lighting; as they're more economical and also safer than open flames in the house. Even a little paklite unit on 'low' will put out substantially more light than a candle, and do it for 500-600 hours from a single $1.50 battery.

Good point, I have a few of those LED pop lights and they run for hundreds of hours on 3 AAA batteries. But I was thinking about that and I have a ton of LED flashlights which have a low mode which can also do the same so that is not so much of a need.

The candles would also provide for a source of fire, carefully monitored of course, but it comes in handy when you are short on lighters or matches and you don't want to be using your fire starter magnesium striker everytime you want a fire.

Bolster
04-10-2012, 00:14
I guess the elephant in the room is...What is the imminent scenario?

What was in room 101, in Orwell's book 1984?

Bolster
04-10-2012, 00:17
COSTCO:(sorry, I went over six!)

Oh, only slightly. I counted 35. That's not "last minute" that's "last week." Still, interesting list. Thanks for playing (you big cheat).

sebecman
04-10-2012, 07:49
Is it REALLY, sebecman...is it REALLY? If all you know is TP, you are probably running around dirty. Live a little...try a sponge! Or better yet get one of those high-ticket TP-less Japanese thrones. They are so fine (http://files.myopera.com/sukekomashi-gaijin/blog/hightechtoilet.jpg), you will never want to leave the loo...

ya okay...:supergrin:

If the paper products industry is any indicator sponge users are the minority. :whistling:

Babynine
04-10-2012, 09:13
First I'm goin' to Foot Locker to grab me some Fresh Air Jordans with red laces so I can rep my hood while I car jack some fool outside the grocery store. Then I'm taking that sucka's car to WalMart to steal that 50" Samsung LCD I had my eye on last week while I was cashing my baby moma's wellfare check...This #hit is gonna be ill son...

I am hoping to avoid those with the above mindset. I live just a little too close to them for comfort. I keep thinking of those WalMart security videos during the chaos from Hurricane Katrina. I will do my best to avoid people in general.

Bolster
04-10-2012, 09:37
I keep thinking of those WalMart security videos during the chaos from Hurricane Katrina.

I had not seen these! I searched Youtube and found this, it is HILARIOUS...especially the looting cops who say: "I'm doin' my job"...?!? So this is what last-minute shopping will be like? EVERYTHING's FREE!! Provided you can steal it before the cops do.

Katrina Looters - YouTube

glockguerilla
04-10-2012, 11:56
I'd give thought to CALCIUM HYPOCHLORITE in your preps:

http://www.tacticalintelligence.net/blog/how-to-make-chlorine.htm

lawman800
04-10-2012, 20:07
First I'm goin' to Foot Locker to grab me some Fresh Air Jordans with red laces so I can rep my hood while I car jack some fool outside the grocery store. Then I'm taking that sucka's car to WalMart to steal that 50" Samsung LCD I had my eye on last week while I was cashing my baby moma's wellfare check...This #hit is gonna be ill son...

They can get all those consumer goods and after they starve and get subjugated under my rule when I declare myself warlord of all that I survey, then I will just take those luxury items for my makeshift palace.:whistling:

MoneyMaker
04-10-2012, 21:07
Skittles

Warp
04-10-2012, 21:16
Skittles

These are the best

http://sweets.seriouseats.com/images/2011/10/20111021-candy-a-day-skittles-sour.jpg

bdcochran
04-10-2012, 23:02
Most of the people on this forum are already preped.

The problem is that some items cannot be stored for a long period of time or may be too dangerous to store in bulk:

1. perishable food;
2. fuel
3. batteries

I will give you a response to the toilet paper people.
You use a dedicated wet rag. Just have a couple of zip lock bags handy if needed.

If you ever consult a proctologist, you will be told not to use toilet paper, but to use a clean wet wash cloth for each wiping. Toilet paper usually contains abrasives and other chemicals.

Also make sure you take a dump how nature intended you to do and you will be cleaner than people who insist on using a conventional toilet.

Warp
04-10-2012, 23:16
Most of the people on this forum are already preped.

The problem is that some items cannot be stored for a long period of time or may be too dangerous to store in bulk:

1. perishable food;
2. fuel
3. batteries

I will give you a response to the toilet paper people.
You use a dedicated wet rag. Just have a couple of zip lock bags handy if needed.

If you ever consult a proctologist, you will be told not to use toilet paper, but to use a clean wet wash cloth for each wiping. Toilet paper usually contains abrasives and other chemicals.

Also make sure you take a dump how nature intended you to do and you will be cleaner than people who insist on using a conventional toilet.


One of these days I'm having a non-western style squat toilet installed in my house. Probably have to wait till we have a basement or my wife will have a conniption, as she says

SFCSMITH(RET)
04-11-2012, 06:17
1) Eagle Rare
2) Eagle Rare
3) Eagle Rare
4) Eagle Rare
5) Eagle Rare
6) Maker's Mark (for barter)

lawman800
04-11-2012, 08:35
Taste the rainbow!

bdcochran
04-11-2012, 08:44
Can you be more specific?

Currently, two basic varieties of Eagle Rare are produced. The first is aged for ten years in charred oak barrels, and bottled at 90-proof. It is a single barrel bourbon. The whiskey from each aging barrel is bottled individually, none of it is blended. This creates a unique flavor for each barrel.

The second variety is aged seventeen years in charred oak barrels as part of its "Antique Collection".[5] It is also 90-proof, but aged for seventeen years, much longer than most bourbons

Donn57
04-11-2012, 11:45
If you ever consult a proctologist, you will be told not to use toilet paper, but to use a clean wet wash cloth for each wiping. Toilet paper usually contains abrasives and other chemicals.

Also make sure you take a dump how nature intended you to do and you will be cleaner than people who insist on using a conventional toilet.

The key word here is "clean". In a SHTF situation where water is likely to be at a premium, I don't think I want to waste it washing wash cloths. Additionally, to actually get the cloth clean, it will require some sort of disinfectant.

Thank you, but I'll stick to toilet paper. It has been working fine for me for decades.

DrSticky
04-11-2012, 12:57
1. Chocolate (Hide it to use as pick me ups for wife and kids)
2. Johnny Walker Black or better
3. Beer
4. Coffee
5. Propane
6. Books

So this list is based on the assumption I feel like I have enough preps. I don't, so these would be the last minute items I would get assuming I felt like I have what I need.

And to weigh in on the toilet paper debate, I am partial to baby wipes.

DoctaGlockta
04-11-2012, 13:25
One of these days I'm having a non-western style squat toilet installed in my house. Probably have to wait till we have a basement or my wife will have a conniption, as she says

Your wife may like this

http://squattypotty.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Squattying-Guy.png
www.squattypotty.com

Bolster
04-11-2012, 14:16
The key word here is "clean". In a SHTF situation where water is likely to be at a premium, I don't think I want to waste it washing wash cloths. Additionally, to actually get the cloth clean, it will require some sort of disinfectant.

That's why the Romans used a bucket of seawater. (Which we have in abundance here.) Wasn't valuable drinking water, and the salt concentration would do a good job of killing the bacteria.

However...it could be cold...so maybe the Roman method would be a good coffee substitute, too...get you awake.

Donn57
04-11-2012, 17:01
That's why the Romans used a bucket of seawater. (Which we have in abundance here.) Wasn't valuable drinking water, and the salt concentration would do a good job of killing the bacteria.

However...it could be cold...so maybe the Roman method would be a good coffee substitute, too...get you awake.

Well, we don't have an abundance of sea water here and I don't know that I would trust sea water as a disinfectant anyway.

I suspect that the primary reason the Romans and everyone else throughout history didn't use toilet paper is simply because they didn't have any.

lawman800
04-11-2012, 21:23
The seawater around the Santa Monica beach where I am close to would be way more germ laden than anything you can imagine laying around the house.

Heck, the germs from the seawater would probably kill off all the germs from washing your rear end... and then kill you.

Bolster
04-11-2012, 22:33
I suspect that the primary reason the Romans and everyone else throughout history didn't use toilet paper is simply because they didn't have any.

First use of TP that I'm aware of was around 500s AD, in China. Some modern cultures (Asia, India) consider TP "dirty" and use running water instead. Would the Romans have used TP if they'd had it? Dunno- it's a mystery for the ages, and probably one of the more important historical mysteries at that.

@ Lawman: LOL the dirty California beach water!! I've been drinking the stuff...but have run it through my solar still first...!

lawman800
04-11-2012, 22:40
One time after a rain storm, I was driving up the coast by Santa Monica and came around the outlet for the sewer pipes... the raw sewage and crap running out of there was beyond disgusting and it wasn't that far from the beach where people swim... after every major rain storm here, the beaches get declared unsafe to swim from the contamination.

Yeah, I am supposed to think it's instantly safer after a few days even though the sewage still runs from there daily.

Bolster
04-11-2012, 22:43
You think it was raw sewage going into the ocean, not surface runoff? If so, somebody paid a hefty fine for that, I'll bet. I'd also guess the news would have been all over that story. The enviros would hang someone for that.

If it makes you feel any better, think of all the non-human poop that's in the ocean already...them sealife ain't holding it in...

...how the heck did I get on this topic? Giving self an OT penalty. Apologies.

"Bottom" line: TP is probably a good prep to stock.

Hour13
04-11-2012, 22:48
Top six...

1) Prilosec
2) Coffee
3) Jager
4) Toothpaste
5) Baby wipes
6) Gasoline

lawman800
04-11-2012, 22:48
I remember even seeing the stuff coming out of the pipe into the ocean and the big floating mass of **** with all sorts of pretty colors reflecting off the sun light. Looked like a big anus blowing out huge chunks of brown water and crap straight into the ocean.

RedHaze
04-11-2012, 23:06
Gotta love the sewage!

What are we gonna do with all this stuff? Pump it into the ocean. Brilliant!
http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m064bq1plq1rpql66o1_500.jpg

Nice little sewage plume...
http://www.theinertia.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/sewageplume.jpg

SFCSMITH(RET)
04-12-2012, 11:35
Can you be more specific?

Currently, two basic varieties of Eagle Rare are produced. The first is aged for ten years in charred oak barrels, and bottled at 90-proof. It is a single barrel bourbon. The whiskey from each aging barrel is bottled individually, none of it is blended. This creates a unique flavor for each barrel.

The second variety is aged seventeen years in charred oak barrels as part of its "Antique Collection".[5] It is also 90-proof, but aged for seventeen years, much longer than most bourbons


Eagle Rare 17 cannot be found in an emergency. In fact some years it cannot be found at all.

So, since it is the end of the world and all, the 4 bottles I found this year will be all for me..

The "regular" will be for "medicinal" purposes.. lol

sebecman
04-12-2012, 18:49
Eagle Rare 17 cannot be found in an emergency. In fact some years it cannot be found at all.

So, since it is the end of the world and all, the 4 bottles I found this year will be all for me..

The "regular" will be for "medicinal" purposes.. lol

Any Eagle rare would be for personal consumption, lets be serious here. :supergrin:

rotjovi
04-13-2012, 07:06
Seems like there are two different philosophies appearing here. One are the folks who are just adding to what they should already have stocked, the other are the folks buying "luxury" items designed to make riding out the event as comfortable as possible.

I know what group I'd want to be in!

My list would be:
A) Fuel: Can't drive without it, can't cook without it, and in winter, can't heat without it. Definitely the most precious resource for me.
B) Fresh Food: If I'm bugging in then I know I'll be eating it. Steaks from a good butcher don't need refridgeration, veggies and fruit can last for a week or more. Some fresh foods can be prepared more easily and with less fuel than frozen items. Ground meat and chicken are to be avoided, they can not tolerate being warm (because the bacteria inside them will start to thrive).
C) Batteries: Power is like fuel. Hard to ever have enough. Can you recharge faster than you use?
D) Water: While it can be stored or gathered, it is nice to have good tasting bottled stuff to drink and reserve the rest for cooking.
E) Pet food. Hard (for me) to remember to keep much of a stockpile.


Steaks from a good butcher don't need refrigeration. Please elaborate........


"Look the bull in the ass and laugh!"

Booker
04-18-2012, 16:10
Store: Wallyworld
Items:

1: Bread Yeast
2: Baking Powder
3: Salt
4: Flour
5: Powdered or UHP Milk
6: Lard

FireForged
04-18-2012, 16:56
1. water
2. canned tuna/salmon
3. peanutbutter
4. 123 batteries
5. ammo
6. bic lighters

Bolster
04-18-2012, 18:20
Is it time for me to do another item count and ranking?

Or does anybody care? If not, I won't bother.

(PS: Yeast was a good one. Not seen that earlier.)

UneasyRider
04-19-2012, 21:40
I would go to Sams and get more of some items that I already have a lot of:

1 - TP
2 - Dinty Moore
3 - Canned Hams
4 - Flour
5 - Batteries
6 - Flashlights

If I knew that it was TEOTWAIKI I would go to the gun shop and buy 3 thermal scopes and 3 pairs of night vision if they could be had.

SMUDGE07
04-19-2012, 23:17
1.)Water
2.)Corned Beef Hash
3.)Water Purification Tablets
4.)Liquor
5.)Shoes
6.)CONDOMS- Cause me and the misses are going to need something to do with the TV out.

G29Reload
04-20-2012, 11:46
5) Eagle Rare
6) Maker's Mark (for barter)

My butt!

Makers is awesome.
So is 46.

And Eagle 17
And William Larue Weller
And George T Stagg
And Pappy van Winkle 20
and Blantons
and pappy 12 SR

and and and don't forget the MacAllan 18!

Barter Hell! Don't forget tequilla in case a nice lady wants to barter…:supergrin:

G29Reload
04-20-2012, 11:49
http://www.thepowerhour.com/news/items_disappearfirst.htm

Stevekozak
04-21-2012, 12:07
+1

Only change I'd make is from 'candles' to 'batteries for LED lights' for lighting; as they're more economical and also safer than open flames in the house. Even a little paklite unit on 'low' will put out substantially more light than a candle, and do it for 500-600 hours from a single $1.50 battery.

I had to laugh again, at you Quake. I have been reading your posts for awhile now, and I most often agree with you and always read what you have to say with interest. You really do have a hangup on the candle thing though. Fire is natural. You just have to respect and understand it like anything else. Don't be candle hating!! :) :wavey:

kirgi08
04-21-2012, 13:19
I agree with Quake,candles need a lot more attention and I'm found of stuff happens avoidance.'08.

Bolster
04-21-2012, 14:01
I'm with Quake on this one. I don't see any reason to have a flame for light when my GoalZero will (almost) infinitely recharge AAs for flashlights, some of which will put out hundreds of hours of candle-level light.

The GoalZero Powerpack has a built in LED that will give you brighter than several candles, for 100 hours per 2 hr solar recharge. Or light up the room with the Luna Light for 10 hours...that's 3 evenings of bright light. Recharge in the sun the next day for 2 hours and you're good to go for another 3 evenings...

Stevekozak
04-21-2012, 14:45
I agree with Quake,candles need a lot more attention and I'm found of stuff happens avoidance.'08.
They do need a bit more attention, but i am fond of stuff that creates both light and heat. :wavey:

I am not hating on Quake. I know he has good reasons for his phobia about candles. Arkies are going to be hard to beat come SHTF!! :2gun:

quake
04-21-2012, 16:34
I had to laugh again, at you Quake.
Nothing unique there; I've been laughed at by lots of folks, many of whom I respect immensely.

(Me & Shrek are gonna overcome this bigotry someday... :lv: )

:supergrin:

I have been reading your posts for awhile now, and I most often agree with you and always read what you have to say with interest. You really do have a hangup on the candle thing though. Fire is natural. You just have to respect and understand it like anything else. Don't be candle hating!! :) :wavey:
Not hating, really; just going with what I genuinely believe to be a huge winner in the "cost/benefit" and "risk/reward" comparisons of candles vs. LED (or other) emergency lighting.

On the candle's side, it has the advantage of literally unlimited shelf life if stored decently; no way around that one and I concede it right up front. Any other advantages, I'm not aware of, but am willing to listen to if someone wants to share them. The heat thing can be an advantage in some situations, but it's not universally advantageous by any means. There's a whole lot of times I want light that I don't want increased heat.

On the LED side of the equation, they absolutely have the advantage of cost per lumen/hour. A pak-lite with a $7 four-pack of 9volt alkalines will put out approximately one candlepower (15 lumens or so; 12.5 lumens is one candlepower iirc) for over 3000 hours. Stated differently, that's 10 hours per night for almsot ten months. Total cost? Something like $30-$35 total, including the light & batteries both; for nearly a year of off-grid nightlight use. Compare that to tea-candle cost? That would be approximately 800-1000 tea-light candles' worth of burn time; so even if bought in bulk at 10-15 cents apiece, that's still $80 to $150 to accomplish the same number of hours.

Pak-lite on low, with standard alkaline battery, run-test. Went for two months. I wouldn't call it "the ultimate survival light" as this guy does, but it's impressive on an overall cost/size/weight/runtime basis:
http://www.brightestflashlightever.com/04/08/led-flashlight-manufacturer/


But as the infommercial guy says, 'Wait; there's more." :cool: With the candles (with any open-flame source), you not only need to be conscious of fire and carbon monoxide issues, you not only have to light a new one every 3 or 4 hours, you also need to keep on hand some lighters (or a thousand matches) to use them; another expense, and another link in the logistics chain to keep up with.

So, advantages of LED's include lower total cost, less pieces of inventory, less dangerous operation {and yes, open flames are inherently dangerous, regardless of how much we may like them}, and less interaction to keep them functional. They're also safe to leave with any kids and/or otherwise 'challenged' folks (elderlies, mentally handicapped, etc) to use at their whim if we so desire. I'll leave an LED flashlight in the hands of a small child; not so much a box of matches & candles.

Seems a no-brainer to me personally; but to each his own.

Again, any additional objective advantages to candles, I'm not opposed at all to learning about. :wavey:


{Added thought on the "fire is natural" thing. It absolutely is, but not sure what that's supposed to signify. My neighbor's dog took a dump in my yard earlier today - that pile is as natural as fire, or a dead fish, or molten lava. Not sure how being "natural" makes any of them inherently more beneficial, desirable or applicable. Not trying to be sarcastic; completely serious. My truck, my pocket knife, nor my pistol are "natural", but I don't see that as being inherently bad or negative.}

Stevekozak
04-22-2012, 07:52
Nothing unique there; I've been laughed at by lots of folks, many of whom I respect immensely.

(Me & Shrek are gonna overcome this bigotry someday... :lv: )




Not hating, really; just going with what I genuinely believe to be a huge winner in the "cost/benefit" and "risk/reward" comparisons of candles vs. LED (or other) emergency lighting.

On the candle's side, it has the advantage of literally unlimited shelf life if stored decently; no way around that one and I concede it right up front. Any other advantages, I'm not aware of, but am willing to listen to if someone wants to share them. The heat thing can be an advantage in some situations, but it's not universally advantageous by any means. There's a whole lot of times I want light that I don't want increased heat.

On the LED side of the equation, they absolutely have the advantage of cost per lumen/hour. A pak-lite with a $7 four-pack of 9volt alkalines will put out approximately one candlepower (15 lumens or so; 12.5 lumens is one candlepower iirc) for over 3000 hours. Stated differently, that's 10 hours per night for almsot ten months. Total cost? Something like $30-$35 total, including the light & batteries both; for nearly a year of off-grid nightlight use. Compare that to tea-candle cost? That would be approximately 800-1000 tea-light candles' worth of burn time; so even if bought in bulk at 10-15 cents apiece, that's still $80 to $150 to accomplish the same number of hours.

Pak-lite on low, with standard alkaline battery, run-test. Went for two months. I wouldn't call it "the ultimate survival light" as this guy does, but it's impressive on an overall cost/size/weight/runtime basis:
http://www.brightestflashlightever.com/04/08/led-flashlight-manufacturer/


But as the infommercial guy says, 'Wait; there's more." :cool: With the candles (with any open-flame source), you not only need to be conscious of fire and carbon monoxide issues, you not only have to light a new one every 3 or 4 hours, you also need to keep on hand some lighters (or a thousand matches) to use them; another expense, and another link in the logistics chain to keep up with.

So, advantages of LED's include lower total cost, less pieces of inventory, less dangerous operation {and yes, open flames are inherently dangerous, regardless of how much we may like them}, and less interaction to keep them functional. They're also safe to leave with any kids and/or otherwise 'challenged' folks (elderlies, mentally handicapped, etc) to use at their whim if we so desire. I'll leave an LED flashlight in the hands of a small child; not so much a box of matches & candles.

Seems a no-brainer to me personally; but to each his own.

Again, any additional objective advantages to candles, I'm not opposed at all to learning about. :wavey:


{Added thought on the "fire is natural" thing. It absolutely is, but not sure what that's supposed to signify. My neighbor's dog took a dump in my yard earlier today - that pile is as natural as fire, or a dead fish, or molten lava. Not sure how being "natural" makes any of them inherently more beneficial, desirable or applicable. Not trying to be sarcastic; completely serious. My truck, my pocket knife, nor my pistol are "natural", but I don't see that as being inherently bad or negative.}
Well, apparently you, me, and Shrek have something in common! :wavey:

I am not asserting that candles are a superior light source (honestly I was just messing with you for your aversion to them). I probably have more LED lights than candles in my home at present. I do think that candles can serve a purpose. As you state, their storablity is unparelled. The heat that they can provide could provide some cooking ability (and no, no one is likely to whip up a 4 course meal atop some tea candles :) ) They do leave a byproduct that is reusable (melted wax)

In regards to my "fire is natural" comment, I was just, again, kind of poking fun at your perceived aversion to flames in the form of candles. My point being that fire, like other potentially destructive items or forces, just needs to be respected for what it is, and not be discounted out of fear of the negative possibilites.

P.S. I bet you could find a use for that dog poop!! :)

lawman800
04-22-2012, 08:53
Candle light is more romantic... boom chika bow mow...:whistling:

kirgi08
04-22-2012, 10:52
:psycho:

ChuteTheMall
04-22-2012, 16:41
I try to stay pretty well stocked up on the non-perishables, from ammo to toilet paper to candles to canned goods and frozen food, so if I had one chance to run to the store for my top six items before the SHTF & TEOTWAWKI, they would be the freshest available:

(1)vegetables
(2)fruit
(3)bread
(4)fish, meat & poultry
(5)hookers and
(6)blow.

:tongueout:

lawman800
04-22-2012, 18:32
Don't forget hats and shoes if you are going to be worried about hookers and blow.

Babynine
04-22-2012, 19:30
They do need a bit more attention, but i am fond of stuff that creates both light and heat. :wavey:

I am not hating on Quake. I know he has good reasons for his phobia about candles. Arkies are going to be hard to beat come SHTF!! :2gun:
Candles also burn no matter how cold it is. When guys go and quote the package of thier new led light and start telling you it will run for this many thousands of hours, those advertised run times are measured at favorable tempatures.

Take that same light and try to run it on alkaline batteries at 45F degrees, and your lucky to get 50% the run time. At 30F degrees, your likely to only get 10-20% run time on alkalines.

I'm not an LED hater, in fact I own a couple Fenix LD series lights, a Surefire E1L Outdoorsman, a Black Diamond Apollo lantern, the Goal Zero solar charger, and a bunch of lower quality LED gear. But I also have well over 1200 candles, and UCO Mini candle lanterns(Highly recommended) to minimize risk of fire.

By the way, 1000 Canadian-made food grade tealight candles was under $34, and these burn 3x as bright as the Chinese-made tealights in a side by side test (using only my eyes to measure).

Just backin' up my backup lighting.

lawman800
04-22-2012, 19:34
Why not have both? Candles and LED lights can exist side by side, no?

Bolster
04-22-2012, 20:04
the freshest available:
(5)hookers...

I'd guess that the end of the world would provide tons of fresh new hookers, willing to trade for your preps. So don't worry about #5.

Babynine
04-22-2012, 20:10
Why not have both? Candles and LED lights can exist side by side, no?
That was the point of my last post:wavey:

Again, just backin' up my backup lighting

lawman800
04-22-2012, 20:34
I'd guess that the end of the world would provide tons of fresh new hookers, willing to trade for your preps. So don't worry about #5.

Yeah, but will they be good conversationalists?:whistling:

SFCSMITH(RET)
04-23-2012, 05:53
I'd guess that the end of the world would provide tons of fresh new hookers, willing to trade for your preps. So don't worry about #5.

Yeah, but will they be good conversationalists?:whistling:

Thankfully, no TV, so you only have to check their teeth..

lawman800
04-23-2012, 08:58
That would also mean I would have to stock up on mouthwash, toothbrushes and toothpaste... in the end of the world, people's breaths are going to stink!

kirgi08
04-23-2012, 09:43
Youse bored.'08. :dunno:

G29Reload
04-23-2012, 11:52
f
(5)hookers and
(6)blow.



Who let the Secret Service in?

Bolster
04-23-2012, 12:08
Who let the Secret Service in?

:rofl: Excellent.

lawman800
04-23-2012, 13:12
Ouch....

quake
04-23-2012, 15:54
Candles also burn no matter how cold it is.
True. Other side of the coin being that LED's actually burn brighter in the cold than they do in heat due to their internal function. They burn anytime, anywhere, cold, hot, windy, whatever. Batteries are a genuine concern in majorly cold climates, but not anywhere near a major concern in my part of the world. Antarctica or Alaska, definitely a problem to be dealt with (and easily dealt with by using lithiums instead of alkalines, at least to -20F or so); but in Arkansas, it's not really a major thing.

...When guys go and quote the package of thier new led light and start telling you it will run for this many thousands of hours, those advertised run times are measured at favorable tempatures.
Good point. That's why we all test our gear, correct? Lights, candles, guns, faraday cages, whatever. Usually a bad idea to take someone's word for something if you don't have to; and almost always a bad idea to just assume the guy's competent in the subject he's talking about.

"Testing stuff" is as important a step as "stocking up on stuff"; since without testing, we don't know for sure what or how much we should be stocking up on.


Take that same light and try to run it on alkaline batteries at 45F degrees, and your lucky to get 50% the run time. At 30F degrees, your likely to only get 10-20% run time on alkalines.
Probably right, or pretty close to it. Easy fix is lithiums, since they're often actually cheaper on a watt/hour cost basis than the 'cheaper' alkalines. In extremely cold climates, they'd be substantially cheaper on a watt/hour cost basis, since alkalines suffer so much there.

...By the way, 1000 Canadian-made food grade tealight candles was under $34, and these burn 3x as bright as the Chinese-made tealights in a side by side test (using only my eyes to measure).
Still available at that price? We use them occasionally for potpourri & such.

I personally don't see "unnecessary open flames" as a positive in an emergency situation, but love a good campfire. It's not a phobia about fire, it's simply an intentional avoidance of unnecessary open fires in my home, at least in almost all cases. We do the tealight-potpourri/scent thing occasionally, mostly around christmas, so I can't say we never have "unnecessary open flames" in the house. But no way I'd use them for night-light use; in a kid's room, bathroom, wherever. I guess the best way I can illustrate my thought on it is this: say you're out of town and it's just your wife & kids alone at home and the power goes out - even for just a day or two - and they have both options available to them; tealight candles with matches, and pak-lites with batteries. You can't get there, but maybe you can reach her on the phone. Of those two options (candles or pak-lites), which would you recommend to her to use as night-lights for the kids while they're stuck there without you? I'd say pak-lites (or other LED); maybe not everyone would. Candles can be fairly safe if treated carefully. But no matter how we try, there's just no way to make them anywhere near as non-dangerous as LED's; there's just not, and that's all I'm getting at.

That's a key thing with me - while candles can be used fairly safely, it's just about impossible to use LED lights unsafely. That being what it is, and the typical cost benefit being what it is, seems like a simple choice.


Fwiw, and not to beat a dead horse, but there are some really good flashlight forums out there ( candlepowerforums.com is my personal favorite), and they have a LOT of battery-performance info to be found there.

This climbers.org page is one I've saved for looking at comparisons of battery types & performances: http://www.climber.org/gear/batteries.html

There's a lot of info out there to be had. Info that should be used to prompt our own testing; not to be accepted as gospel.

No offense and sorry for the soapbox, but unless someone shows me a fault in this logic, I can't help but think it's a pretty simple concept; the concept of "reduced risk, when easily achieved, is usually the better approach".

Ok, I'll get off my soapbox now... :embarassed:

NecoDude
04-24-2012, 11:02
1. Gas
2. Beans (for more gas)
3. Baby Wipes (for the above gas)
4. Water - as stated more is better
5. Batteries
6. More Jack

Good thread Bolster, entertaining yet informative.

Glock30Eric
04-24-2012, 11:55
1. Gas
2. Beans (for more gas)
3. Baby Wipes (for the above gas)
4. Water - as stated more is better
5. Batteries
6. More Jack

Good thread Bolster, entertaining yet informative.

You'll might need matches for the gases. ;)

doktarZues
04-30-2012, 23:34
Very interesting thread reading through this..I've never actually made a list but I'm very aware of the things that I NEED that I don't keep a comfortable stock of assuming "the big one" went down tomorrow:

In order of priority:
1. Gasoline
2. Cooking fuel (white gas/coleman fuel, propane)
3. Dog food
4. Toilet Paper
5. Batteries (I have a lot of batteries, way more than I can use/rotate so I'm hesitant to buy more, but if you knew the balloon was going up I honestly don't think you could have enough)

I would literally load the shopping cart(s) to the tipping point with those items. If I could find a few open nook or crannies, I suppose I'd throw a few bottles of jack daniels in there for #6.

Babynine
05-01-2012, 10:58
True. Other side of the coin being that LED's actually burn brighter in the cold than they do in heat due to their internal function. They burn anytime, anywhere, cold, hot, windy, whatever. Batteries are a genuine concern in majorly cold climates, but not anywhere near a major concern in my part of the world. Antarctica or Alaska, definitely a problem to be dealt with (and easily dealt with by using lithiums instead of alkalines, at least to -20F or so); but in Arkansas, it's not really a major thing.


Good point. That's why we all test our gear, correct? Lights, candles, guns, faraday cages, whatever. Usually a bad idea to take someone's word for something if you don't have to; and almost always a bad idea to just assume the guy's competent in the subject he's talking about.

"Testing stuff" is as important a step as "stocking up on stuff"; since without testing, we don't know for sure what or how much we should be stocking up on.



Probably right, or pretty close to it. Easy fix is lithiums, since they're often actually cheaper on a watt/hour cost basis than the 'cheaper' alkalines. In extremely cold climates, they'd be substantially cheaper on a watt/hour cost basis, since alkalines suffer so much there.


Still available at that price? We use them occasionally for potpourri & such.

I personally don't see "unnecessary open flames" as a positive in an emergency situation, but love a good campfire. It's not a phobia about fire, it's simply an intentional avoidance of unnecessary open fires in my home, at least in almost all cases. We do the tealight-potpourri/scent thing occasionally, mostly around christmas, so I can't say we never have "unnecessary open flames" in the house. But no way I'd use them for night-light use; in a kid's room, bathroom, wherever. I guess the best way I can illustrate my thought on it is this: say you're out of town and it's just your wife & kids alone at home and the power goes out - even for just a day or two - and they have both options available to them; tealight candles with matches, and pak-lites with batteries. You can't get there, but maybe you can reach her on the phone. Of those two options (candles or pak-lites), which would you recommend to her to use as night-lights for the kids while they're stuck there without you? I'd say pak-lites (or other LED); maybe not everyone would. Candles can be fairly safe if treated carefully. But no matter how we try, there's just no way to make them anywhere near as non-dangerous as LED's; there's just not, and that's all I'm getting at.

That's a key thing with me - while candles can be used fairly safely, it's just about impossible to use LED lights unsafely. That being what it is, and the typical cost benefit being what it is, seems like a simple choice.


Fwiw, and not to beat a dead horse, but there are some really good flashlight forums out there ( candlepowerforums.com is my personal favorite), and they have a LOT of battery-performance info to be found there.

This climbers.org page is one I've saved for looking at comparisons of battery types & performances: http://www.climber.org/gear/batteries.html

There's a lot of info out there to be had. Info that should be used to prompt our own testing; not to be accepted as gospel.

No offense and sorry for the soapbox, but unless someone shows me a fault in this logic, I can't help but think it's a pretty simple concept; the concept of "reduced risk, when easily achieved, is usually the better approach".

Ok, I'll get off my soapbox now... :embarassed:

Hadnt been here in a minute, and had not seen I had been quoted on my thoughts on LED lights and candles.

As I said, I am not an LED hater, matter of fact I have been carrying them longer than many, and I did write that own a couple Fenix lights, a Surefire E1L that I carried everyday for over 5 years, a Black Diamond Apollo lantern, and a ton more average quality LED stuff. I also own over 50 Eneloops, with a bunch more on the way, and a bunch of LSD NiMH Duracells as backups...I even keep over a hundred of the hated alkalines around.

So I am not a LED hater, in fact I love my LED lights! But I also dont like having all my eggs in one basket, hence the well over a thousand candles, that I paid less than the cost of 20 Lithium batteries for :whistling:

And I also DO test my LED gear, I have already camped three seperate times this year(2012) alone, including some mid-January cold weather winter camping here in Wisconsin....Alkalines in my Shortwave reciever suffered badly in the cold, while my Eneloops in my Fenix LD10+LD20 did quite well in the same temps. The candles also burned great in those conditions.

As I also wrote, I have also purchaced 6 UCO Mini Candle Lanterns, and I can set a piece of paper directly on top of them while a candle is burning, without the paper catching on fire...not saying I would burn candles unattended, just sayin' I have another inexpensive backup lighting option, and I have taken some minor safty precautions. I will also be buying a German-made Feurhand oil lamp soon as another backup, but that is far less safe than candles.

UCO Mini Candle lanterns were on sale last month for $8.79ea at Campsaver.com, and the Canadian-made tealights were bought at a locally-owned hardware chain named Menards, they were on sale for $3.36/100, but now I think they are back up to $4 or $4.50 per 100. And yes these Canadian-made food grade tealights burn 3x as bright as the MORE expensive Chinese-made tealights from WalMart. They also burn cleaner.

Some of you guys remind me of my father, who is afraid to even have candles in his home. If you dont light them, they cant cause a problem! Just because you have them, does not mean you have to burn them in your childs bedroom, while he sleeps.

You keep firearms in your home no? Do you leave them unlocked and loaded in your young childs bedroom while he/she sleeps?

I thought preparing was about backup options, in case of unforeseen circumstances? $40 for for a thousand candles, that will likely never be burned (except while camping), is not a bad price in my opinion for another backup lighting option.

By the way, how much does a winter or two supply of lithium batteries go for? I quit carrying my trusty 6 year old Surefire over a year ago, out of disgust at the cost of those damn lithium batteries.

My LED lights will always be my primary backup lighting, but not my only backup lighting.

racerford
05-01-2012, 13:01
.........
UCO Mini Candle lanterns were on sale last month for $8.79ea at Campsaver.com, and the Canadian-made tealights were bought at a locally-owned hardware chain named Menards, they were on sale for $3.36/100, but now I think they are back up to $4 or $4.50 per 100. And yes these Canadian-made food grade tealights burn 3x as bright as the MORE expensive Chinese-made tealights from WalMart. They also burn cleaner.

Some of you guys remind me of my father, who is afraid to even have candles in his home. If you dont light them, they cant cause a problem! Just because you have them, does not mean you have to burn them in your childs bedroom, while he sleeps.

You keep firearms in your home no? Do you leave them unlocked and loaded in your young childs bedroom while he/she sleeps?

............

How does one candle burn brighter than another, especially 3x as bright? Is it a different wax or what. I don't understand the driver of the difference. Also anything that is visually 3 times as bright is liley on the order of like 20
or more times the lumens IIRC.


Candles can spontaneoously combust so they may be a danger if not lit.:whistling:

Is there problem leaving loaded, unlocked firearms in the room with sleeping children? Now when they are awake, that may be a different story, if they are not properly trained and behaved (the children, not the firearms).

On the positive, candles are rarely affected by EMP, so they do not need to be stored in a Faraday cage. Also they do not eat much.

Life is full of trade offs.

I do have some candles and other dangerous things in storage. I sleep well.

Candles left burning on a non-flammable plate that will hold all the wax and aware from rlamambles (like curtains) and in a room with adequate ventilation are not particularly dangeropus. People lived many thousdands of years with the risk. Just act wisely.

quake
05-01-2012, 13:15
:wavey: Fwiw, no 'hating' here either; just individual preference based on personal evaluation. Openly agree that candles win in the "infinite-shelf-life" comparison. But beyond that, where are they objectively better?



...By the way, how much does a winter or two supply of lithium batteries go for? I quit carrying my trusty 6 year old Surefire over a year ago, out of disgust at the cost of those damn lithium batteries.

My LED lights will always be my primary backup lighting, but not my only backup lighting.

A winter or two of lithium batteries will mean different things to different people & in different situations, but from an hours-per-lumen perspective, cost is typically less than with candles.

Where can those $40/1,000 candles be had? Best I've found is around $120 per thousand.

Serious question, not trying to pick a fight; genuinely curious. Other than shelf life, in what category (cost, benefit, risk, reward, convenience, etc) do candles fare better than LED's?

quake
05-01-2012, 13:17
How does one candle burn brighter than another, especially 3x as bright? Is it a different wax or what. I don't understand the driver of the difference. Also anything that is visually 3 times as bright is liley on the order of like 20 or more times the lumens IIRC.

I've seen exactly as Babynine says; some brands do burn substantially brighter than others. May be differences in quality of the wax or wicks, but he's right on that; there is a real variance in quality between makers.

Lt Scott 14
05-08-2012, 15:43
My wife likes the smaller scented candles, usually after dinner, and sometimes during the power outs. We have the led, lcds, and halogens light dept covered.
I have asked her to stay vigilant with our nosy kitty, watches the flicker of flames. As long as the room doesn't become a Shao Lin Monastery, no biggie.
After 24-36hr outage you will scramble to use whatever you have, or can get.

Items needed from store if not already prepped:
1. Meat, veggies, bread, TP, paper plates, roll towels, bottled water
2. Spare batteries, try to stay w/ AAs, or AAAs for hand used lights-leds
3. Basic meds/first aid- peroxide, cotton balls, vaseline, pain meds, personal requirements(hearing aid batts for me)
4. Ammo: 9mm, 38 spec, 12ga, 22 cal.
5. Basic overnight bug out stuff: Sleeping bagw/pad, tent(lightweight),back pack or two, fire start material, cooler smaller size to be fit in trunk(or couple smaller ones to carry)
6. Personal groom stuff: Unscented soap, small towel/wash cloth, tooth brushes, paste, denture supplies, spare glasses(even reader style would help most people)

porschedog
05-08-2012, 15:46
#1 Starbucks frappucinos. Hey, even if SHTF, and especially if SHTF, I will need my coffee fix.

Redheadhunter21
05-14-2012, 22:20
First off going to Walmart what they dont have I dont need.

1. Gas- truck and all red cans even the boat gets filled, 150 extra gallons might be needed
2. Ammo- clear shelves of any caliber I can use
3. Pool shock
4. Duct tape
5. Corrugated pipe- snorkel for the truck
6. Plenty of beer

kirgi08
05-15-2012, 09:09
Buy serpa cans,plastic sucks for long term fuel storage.Diesel and Kero can store well in red cans.Gas,not so much.I store diesel/Kero for long term,it's KISS compared ta gas.We do store it,it's just the fact that the more processed the fuel the shorter the shelf life.'08.