10mm ammo [Archive] - Glock Talk

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PLINKING.40
05-03-2012, 15:26
Hi Yall, I am looking to buy some 10mm bullets from underwood, and saw the Hot stuff at 1400-1600 fps,that I would use for maybe Zombies or Hoggs, but the lower 1250-1300fps for EDC, "Q".? is it going to be ok on the factory G20 barrel (little under supported) to shoot the high power stuff without getting a more supported barrel like KKM or such..would like to stay stock..was going to ge 50rd boxes for stock pile...:dunno:

Cwlongshot
05-03-2012, 15:57
Hello!

I don't really understand your question. But will make a few comments that may ast some light on your decisions.

Generally speaking when looking at pistol ammo the higher velocity equates to lower penetration. This is because pistol bullets are more fragile and lack sectional density to provide deep penetration.
SO such vel will only be attained with the lightest bullets. These bullets will likely profuse horrific shallow wounds on "Zombies". The will not penetrate a much tougher hog adaquity you may well kill them, but I doubt you will recover them.

Pick a good bullet a proven bullet. Then be sure it functions and shoots accurately. Then practice with it and carry it.

For hunting I recommend the Hornady XTP in 180 or 200 loaded to 1300+ and 1200 respectively.

If hunting I would look hard at a good art mkt barrel then hand load it for optimal performance.

CW

PLINKING.40
05-03-2012, 16:53
I thought that the hotter stuff in the 1600fps range was the harder hitting round, but mostly refering to the "smileys" bulge on the case end, don't want a KB out the back of the case and blow the mag and sides out. I was thinking the 135gr and the 185gr rounds..

post-apocalyptic
05-04-2012, 01:03
Let's cut to the chase here...

ALL Underwood Ammo, (and anything else on the market today), is just fine shot through a stock G-20 barrel!!!!!!!1!!!1!!!

I'm sick of this dis-information coming up again.. and again... and again... and again... :upeyes:

FACK an aftermarket barrel, except for the most discriminating of re-loaders.

Clear enough? :)

bac1023
05-06-2012, 20:26
The stock Glock barrel is fine.

Merrixs
05-07-2012, 05:09
The bulge you are talking about with the stock barrel and factory ammo is just a bulge from the stock barrels generous chamber, it is not a smiley. Smileys are caused by over pressure rounds, not from the stock eat anything even when it's abused barrel. A smiley is a distinct grove in the case.

The stock barrel will safely shoot any factory loaded ammo, unless said ammo specifically states "fully supported". I think Swampfox was the only one to do that anyway.

swinokur
05-07-2012, 05:18
Underwood has a caution on using his 1300 FPS ammo in Colt Delta Elites due to an unramped barrel. He has a 1200 FPS load for DE's. No such warning for other pistols.

flyingillini
05-07-2012, 06:35
A while ago I contacted Glock on this sort of issue. They stated very clearly that all factory ammo within 10mm spec is safe to shoot in all Glock 10mm pistols.

Angry Fist
05-07-2012, 06:40
Underwood has a caution on using his 1300 FPS ammo in Colt Delta Elites due to an unramped barrel. He has a 1200 FPS load for DE's. No such warning for other pistols.
Yeah there is. No 200 gr. XTP in a G29. Get a lighter load, IIRC.

purrrfect 10
05-07-2012, 06:47
A while ago I contacted Glock on this sort of issue. They stated very clearly that all factory ammo within 10mm spec is safe to shoot in all Glock 10mm pistols.

Is Underwood Ammo considered factory ammo?

tyr0981
05-07-2012, 10:41
Yeah there is. No 200 gr. XTP in a G29. Get a lighter load, IIRC.

:headscratch:

http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/1765/underwood.jpg
http://www.underwoodammo.com/10mmauto200grainxtpjacketedhollowpointboxof50.aspx
it's a serious and as heavy a load as i'd recommend for the smaller pistol, as long as you've got some strength in you why don't you like it? my girlfriend even says these rounds aren't too strong!

PLINKING.40
05-07-2012, 14:52
Thanks Gents, I guess I will save $165 clams on not getting a KKM barrel, I just wanted to be safe on the fact that if I went Hog hunting with the hot stuff, I didn't have to worry about a BlowOut, from the case not being fully supported at the bottom...Kool.:cool:
GaryK

post-apocalyptic
05-07-2012, 18:18
Thanks Gents, I guess I will save $165 clams on not getting a KKM barrel, I just wanted to be safe on the fact that if I went Hog hunting with the hot stuff, I didn't have to worry about a BlowOut, from the case not being fully supported at the bottom...Kool.:cool:
GaryK

No worries man, you, (and your Glock), will be fine. :)

Angry Fist
05-07-2012, 19:54
:headscratch:

http://www.underwoodammo.com/10mmauto200grainxtpjacketedhollowpointboxof50.aspx
it's a serious and as heavy a load as i'd recommend for the smaller pistol, as long as you've got some strength in you why don't you like it? my girlfriend even says these rounds aren't too strong!
I thought there was a disclaimer on one of the UA rounds that didn't recommend a G29. :dunno:

4949shooter
05-07-2012, 19:56
I thought there was a disclaimer on one of the UA rounds that didn't recommend a G29. :dunno:

I think that was Swampfox for the 29.

Underwood has a Delta Elite specific load.

tyr0981
05-07-2012, 21:14
I thought there was a disclaimer on one of the UA rounds that didn't recommend a G29. :dunno:

yeah just for the 'Colt Delta" pistol, something about not having a ramp :dunno: i'm going to switch on my next order to the 180 grains, it's just the 200's weren't nearly as hurtful to the hand as i though (they where on sale!) so i felt i should stick up for them! :supergrin:

LASTRESORT20
05-07-2012, 21:36
Let's cut to the chase here...

ALL Underwood Ammo, (and anything else on the market today), is just fine shot through a stock G-20 barrel!!!!!!!1!!!1!!!

I'm sick of this dis-information coming up again.. and again... and again... and again... :upeyes:

FACK an aftermarket barrel, except for the most discriminating of re-loaders.

Clear enough? :)



Thank you.....:cool:

Angry Fist
05-07-2012, 23:03
I think that was Swampfox for the 29.

Underwood has a Delta Elite specific load.

yeah just for the 'Colt Delta" pistol, something about not having a ramp :dunno: i'm going to switch on my next order to the 180 grains, it's just the 200's weren't nearly as hurtful to the hand as i though (they where on sale!) so i felt i should stick up for them! :supergrin:
Thanks, guys. :embarassed:

Angry Fist
05-07-2012, 23:05
I never got my Swampfox. I ordered at the worst possible time. :crying: :sadangel:

DG2
05-08-2012, 02:19
I think that was Swampfox for the 29.

Underwood has a Delta Elite specific load.

Kevin emailed me and said those DE loads are loaded to about 1240fps instead of 1200. Still safe and still powerfull.

Cwlongshot
05-08-2012, 04:09
There is another reason for the aft mkt barrel besides support... the extra length will get you some velocity and energy...

I have a KKM6" in route. Its going in my G20.

The Glock barrel MAY be fine and a safe, a better supported barrel WILL reduce wear and tear on brass simply because your not working it as much. Years ago I was shooting "race" guns in 38 stupid and you simply could not achieve "major" power factor with out a supported barrel. The simple fact that a barrel produced "smiles" shows its improperly supported. Unsafe, maybe maybe not. But a prudent loader will drop the powder, change the load or buy a better supported barrel.
I completely understand what post-apocalyptic, is saying. I also do not like misinformation. Or information thats mimicked because people continue to read other people posting about it. Yet have zero first hand experience with the topic. Its a bad situation and has led to some good products getting passed over.

Now will that barrel be as reliable? If shooting good loads I say yes.

People in general will always blame the equipment and them selves LAST. Even tho more times than not they have allot of "ownership" in those problems...

In my case, I wanted the longer barrel to get some extra performance first, better support in the chamber second.

If your just gonna buy factory offerings your really hamstringing the possible choices that are available to a hand loader...

Good luck,
CW

whitebread
05-08-2012, 06:44
Yeah there is. No 200 gr. XTP in a G29. Get a lighter load, IIRC.

Nonsense. I load 200 grain XTP's with 7.9gr of Power Pistol and carry them in a G29SF. Absolutely no problems. KKM barrel and 23# Wolf spring.

swinokur
05-08-2012, 11:06
The late Mike Wollard who owned Swampfox, did have a warning about using his 1400 FPS loads in a G29 IIRC. Underwood has no such warning for his ammo in a G29. He does have a specific DE load however.

PLINKING.40
05-16-2012, 10:59
I bought some 135g,165, & some 200gr speer & Nosler, ammo that are rated at 1300-1400 & 1600fps, is it still safe to stay with the stock factory spring, or bump up a lb. or so..

tyr0981
05-16-2012, 12:51
I bought some 135g,165, & some 200gr speer & Nosler, ammo that are rated at 1300-1400 & 1600fps, is it still safe to stay with the stock factory spring, or bump up a lb. or so..

the OEM spring works perfectly with 200 Grain Underwood ( don't recommend going heavier then that).

I bought a Wolf Spring (19 lb) and it ruined my day of shooting, failed to load, failed to eject, stove piped, DO NOT change the spring poundage! (just FYI, they let me return the spring without difficulty)

glock20fanboy
05-16-2012, 23:11
the OEM spring works perfectly with 200 Grain Underwood ( don't recommend going heavier then that).

I bought a Wolf Spring (19 lb) and it ruined my day of shooting, failed to load, failed to eject, stove piped, DO NOT change the spring poundage! (just FYI, they let me return the spring without difficulty)
I've got a 21# Brass Stacker spring setup in my 20SF, 100% reliable. I've got a Wolff setup in the 29SF, again a 21# combo, and it's 100% reliable. Both using 135 and 165 gr. Underwood Ammo.

PLINKING.40
05-17-2012, 13:06
I was reading somewhere that the lighter 17# stock spring was a little light for hot loads, and might put a little extra stress on the slide and frame being Slammed back to hard when being shot and to slow it it down a bit with a stiffer spring, and lessen that 50 yrd fling of brass, 1st Glock so be kind. just learning all I can for Tinker'n and possible Hints about a G20...Thx..any other input and Info would be deeply used..

Cwlongshot
05-17-2012, 15:22
the OEM spring works perfectly with 200 Grain Underwood ( don't recommend going heavier then that).

I bought a Wolf Spring (19 lb) and it ruined my day of shooting, failed to load, failed to eject, stove piped, DO NOT change the spring poundage! (just FYI, they let me return the spring without difficulty)


I don't doubt your word, But I will tell you its NOT NORMAL!

When I bought the extended barrels, I also bought a 18, 20, 22, 23 and 24# recoil spring.

I bought the heavier springs because I fully intended to load the 10 to its origional pressures and full potential. For use as a hunting round. I shot my heaviest 200g loadings with the 20#, the 23# and a the 24# spring. ALL ejected fine, ALL funtioned 100%. The heavier springs will help reduce the battering of the frame and also allow me to find my brass in the same zip code. ;)

In my Bullseye 1911 45, I use lighter recoil springs as my re-loads with Bullseye and 185G LSWC's are going SLOW... You can feel the complete cycling of the action, as if in slow motion. If I even tried a factory weight spring, it would not cycle...

Now if someone was thinking carry gun, I advise a Glock factory or Wolff aftermarket, factory weight spring. I would "play" with weights on a target or hunting gun not a personal carry piece. (Other than to upgrade to a quality spring set like Wolff)

CW

PLINKING.40
05-17-2012, 16:07
I got this G20, for a EDC/HD pistol, want to keep it stock, even with the heavy trigger, but wanted to see what little tweaks can be done to it for more of evenmore reliable Blaster that you gents have found with your gun that worked perfect and, If it aint broke dont fix it" is the mind set for me, but like to keep all of my guns MINT. cond. and flawless..

dm1906
05-17-2012, 16:17
I don't doubt your word, But I will tell you its NOT NORMAL!

When I bought the extended barrels, I also bought a 18, 20, 22, 23 and 24# recoil spring.

I bought the heavier springs because I fully intended to load the 10 to its origional pressures and full potential. For use as a hunting round. I shot my heaviest 200g loadings with the 20#, the 23# and a the 24# spring. ALL ejected fine, ALL funtioned 100%. The heavier springs will help reduce the battering of the frame and also allow me to find my brass in the same zip code. ;)

In my Bullseye 1911 45, I use lighter recoil springs as my re-loads with Bullseye and 185G LSWC's are going SLOW... You can feel the complete cycling of the action, as if in slow motion. If I even tried a factory weight spring, it would not cycle...

Now if someone was thinking carry gun, I advise a Glock factory or Wolff aftermarket, factory weight spring. I would "play" with weights on a target or hunting gun not a personal carry piece. (Other than to upgrade to a quality spring set like Wolff)

CW

I agree with this, mostly. What you decide to carry, and in what configuration (all legal, of course), doesn't require explanation. Don't carry more than you are competent and confident with, and don't leave behind what you might need (might, because we aren't looking for a fight...are we?). Aftermarket is aftermarket. Leave it all OEM, or discard the fears of aftermarket. 11 of 12 won't understand or care, and the 1 won't convince them of anything. A justified situation is just that. Justified. It doesn't matter if you use a rubber hose or a bazooka. I carry a G20, modified, with my loads. I also keep handy the OEM parts, which can be changed in a few seconds if I have any reservations, at any time (still waiting for that to happen). I was asked during a trial once, why I carried a "3 fitty seben magun and 30 boolits" (6 in the wheel and 4 speed loaders). My reply, "If I carried more, I'd have to leave my baton and chewing gum in the trunk or my pants would fall off my 30" waist. Chewing gum is important". After a few chuckles, it resumed, with no more stupid questions. We don't wear seatbelts, have airbags, bumpers, Onstar, speed limits and insurance because we are looking for a crash. How is a .44 Mag at factory level any more "acceptable" than a full power 10mm? It isn't, and a lot of people carry (and have used) .44 mag's. Use what will work reliably when you need it. Carry what you are comfortable with and is legal. Practice a LOT. Practice the same way you carry. The range table (where you pick up and load your weapon before shooting) won't be with you and your family at McDonald's when the BG's show up. When it's in the fan, you only bring your instincts and habits with you. Develop good habits, and denounce bad ones.

I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

PLINKING.40
05-17-2012, 16:54
:wow:AlrightyThen,...I will sit on that for a while..K?:faint:

PLINKING.40
05-17-2012, 17:05
OK. This might help, I will stay OEM (Glock mfg) only.... NOW.! what if i just got a stiffer spring made by Glock.?, or will the jury still out on that one.?

Cwlongshot
05-17-2012, 17:29
The "trouble" as I see it is some guys are seemingly hypnotized by the Glock "perfection" theology. Only one thing I know is perfect, yes the name begins with a letter G.. ::)

Then there are the guys who think a carry gun should be as stock as possible for personal protection.

BOTH have merits as Glock did do a very good job. Thats why we are here and why this site exists. But nearly all things man made can be improved. Glock is no different.

CW

dm1906
05-17-2012, 18:33
The "trouble" as I see it is some guys are seemingly hypnotized by the Glock "perfection" theology. Only one thing I know is perfect, yes the name begins with a letter G.. ::)

Then there are the guys who think a carry gun should be as stock as possible for personal protection.

BOTH have merits as Glock did do a very good job. Thats why we are here and why this site exists. But nearly all things man made can be improved. Glock is no different.

CW

That's all I'm saying, CW. I stated my opinion from my chair. What works for me won't work for everyone, or anyone for that matter. I've been doing this for a long time, but that doesn't make a rookie wrong (not directing that at anyone specific). Correct, in that almost nothing/one is perfect. A 34 beer on a summer evening is pretty close. My statement, after the .44 Mag part, is a golden rule. Take it to heart, or become a statistic. We speak casually here, but when the hammer drops, casual stops.

Taterhead
05-17-2012, 21:00
My stock Gen 3 G20 digests and cycles everything with the stock recoil spring assembly and barrel. I do have a Wolff steel guide rod and 22# spring assembly that I rarely use any more. I found that it 1) has sharper felt recoil, 2) my follow-up shots are slower, and 3) it would have the occasional stovepipe with hotter rounds. In less than ideal situations where grip angle is compromised, limpwristing is more likely with a heavier spring. I noticed that when doing some drills from an akward angle behind cover.

The stock spring is 100%. I make sure to replace it at 3000 rounds or less. They are only about $7.50 so no big deal. As far as "frame battering", just not seeing it. Plastic is flexy so somewhat forgiving.

As far as the barrel goes, I had complete intentions of getting a "fully supported" rig. I noticed that I was having absolutely no problems with any ammo (handloads or boutique factory hot stuff). No Glock smiles, etc. Also 9 average reloads with my brass is plenty for me. The Glock barrel is far more precise than it is given credit for.

So over time I just did not see what I was gaining from going with an aftermarket setup except for the possibility of diminished reliability. I will eventually get a threaded extended length barrel to compliment the stock setup. However, by not replacing the stock barrel, I plowed the money saved into another 1000 rounds of Starline brass and some bullets. No regrets. Money better spent.

My suggestion to those getting a new 10mm Glock is to go put a couple thousand rounds downrange. That will reveal if anything is lacking. There is no problem pulling a new Glock out of the box and running Buffalo Bore or Underwood Ammo through it completely stock. Man I love my Glock 10mm.

WeeWilly
05-17-2012, 23:34
...As far as the barrel goes, I had complete intentions of getting a "fully supported" rig. I noticed that I was having absolutely no problems with any ammo (handloads or boutique factory hot stuff). No Glock smiles, etc. Also 9 average reloads with my brass is plenty for me. The Glock barrel is far more precise than it is given credit for. .

I agree with this observation. I have ventured pretty far into the twilight zone with some of my 10mm loads and have yet to get a smiley with my stock barrel. I bought a couple of KKM barrels and they are terrific pieces, but the only difference I have found from all the important things is the KKM will not feed some of my lead loads while the stock Glock barrel has never choked. Kind of ironic that I switch to the Glock barrel for all my lead shooting.

I do have to say that my KKM .40S&W conversion barrel for my G20SF is pretty sweet. I was shooting today at a crowded indoor range using some Longshot and Blue Dot 10mm loads with 40 S&W brass. I was only getting back about half my brass (I swear there were guys standing back there with catcher's mitts), it didn't sting as much as I am paying about $.03 a case for once fired 40 versus $.14/case for new Starline 10mm brass.

tyr0981
05-18-2012, 02:19
I realize that their was some type of "exception" in my experience with the heavier spring and metal guide rod, the guy i spoke with was talking about "de-burring" and other issues that may occur, but after my brief experience with it, i doubt i'll ever alter the internals of any Glock ever again! they're made that way for a reason (beyond the cheapest components available)!

the only reason i put the 19lb spring on their was the 200Grains i was catapulting down range, but i think the heaviest i'm going to run is 180's now, perhaps even 165's.... haven't gone through all the pro's and con's yet....

:motorcycle:

WeeWilly
05-18-2012, 08:50
I left out that I am running a factory style 22lb flat recoil spring on a SS rod. I don't know if it helps with frame bashing or not as I have left it in since my first test. I have almost no frame bashing compared to what many have posted, regardless of how hot I go, although this is a pretty unscientific observation.

With the 22lb spring my gun cycles everything I have shot with this spring, including light 40 loads out of my .40S&W conversion barrel, which leads me to believe it may not actually be a full 22lbs. I got mine from Glockmeister.

PLINKING.40
05-18-2012, 12:04
My stock Gen 3 G20 digests and cycles everything with the stock recoil spring assembly and barrel. I do have a Wolff steel guide rod and 22# spring assembly that I rarely use any more. I found that it 1) has sharper felt recoil, 2) my follow-up shots are slower, and 3) it would have the occasional stovepipe with hotter rounds. In less than ideal situations where grip angle is compromised, limpwristing is more likely with a heavier spring. I noticed that when doing some drills from an akward angle behind cover.

The stock spring is 100%. I make sure to replace it at 3000 rounds or less. They are only about $7.50 so no big deal. As far as "frame battering", just not seeing it. Plastic is flexy so somewhat forgiving.

As far as the barrel goes, I had complete intentions of getting a "fully supported" rig. I noticed that I was having absolutely no problems with any ammo (handloads or boutique factory hot stuff). No Glock smiles, etc. Also 9 average reloads with my brass is plenty for me. The Glock barrel is far more precise than it is given credit for.

So over time I just did not see what I was gaining from going with an aftermarket setup except for the possibility of diminished reliability. I will eventually get a threaded extended length barrel to compliment the stock setup. However, by not replacing the stock barrel, I plowed the money saved into another 1000 rounds of Starline brass and some bullets. No regrets. Money better spent.

My suggestion to those getting a new 10mm Glock is to go put a couple thousand rounds downrange. That will reveal if anything is lacking. There is no problem pulling a new Glock out of the box and running Buffalo Bore or Underwood Ammo through it completely stock. Man I love my Glock 10mm.

Holy Mother Of Gun Oil Batman..THATS what I was looking for..YES. Thank You TaterHead..!! all qestions answerd.! Going to leave it stock Lock & Barrel....:wavey::tongueout:

chemboy
05-23-2012, 08:39
One (big) plus that I have found with the KKM(6") barrel in my G20SF is the accuracy-it has to be seen to be believed!
Now, I haven't tried any handloads with the KKM setup as of yet, but with factory stuff it is noticeably more accurate than the stock barrel.