A new heavy 10mm cast bullet [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Yondering
05-09-2012, 22:52
As some of you here know, I shoot a lot of cast bullets through my 10mm. I thought I'd share this info, hopefully it will help inspire some of you bullet casters out there.

I recently ordered a mold from Mountain Molds for a heavy 10mm bullet, that has turned out pretty well. (You design your own bullet on the Mountain Molds website, then the mold is made to your specs.)

This one is a 220gr flat nose, designed specifically for maximum case capacity, and at .673" long, is shorter than a 200gr XTP bullet. I had designed it as a 215gr bullet, but they end up at 220 with lube, probably due to alloy variations. I also designed it to work with 40 S&W brass, loaded to 1.260", since I have about 10 gallons of it. Most cast bullets can't be loaded to 1.260" in 40 S&W brass without exposing the lube groove.

I'm still working on load development, but AA9 seems to be a really good candidate right now, pushing these over 1300 fps average from my compensated longslide. Penetration in dry cedar firewood is very impressive; I had to rebuild my backstop after firing a bunch of these.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c26/zthang43/Bang/molds/IMG_0763.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c26/zthang43/Bang/molds/IMG_0767.jpg

Edit: forgot to mention, the bullet on the left is a sized down .41 Mag bullet from a Mihec mold. It also weighs 220gr; you can see the difference in bullet length due to the design.

harley45
05-09-2012, 23:40
Posted to follow along I like this one!

alwaysshootin
05-10-2012, 05:37
This is very interesting, please keep us posted on results, groupings, and such, down the road please!:wavey:

countrygun
05-10-2012, 11:40
Oh, now THAT is what I'm talking about!

I would be most interested in that bullet @ 1,000-1,100 fps out of a stock length barrel in a g-20 (probably not stock barrel though)

Any Cal.
05-10-2012, 11:48
Oh, now THAT is what I'm talking about!

I would be most interested in that bullet @ 1,000-1,100 fps out of a stock length barrel in a g-20 (probably not stock barrel though)


I am getting 1150 out of the stock barrel, with a hairline smile on some of the cases. I agree though, it makes a nice round...

countrygun
05-10-2012, 11:58
I am getting 1150 out of the stock barrel, with a hairline smile on some of the cases. I agree though, it makes a nice round...


That is what I get with 220's in my .41 mags as a "general purpose" round

_The_Shadow
05-10-2012, 12:17
Yondering, very nicely done, I like the bullet very much! It appears you pressed a homemade Gas Check on one of them in the picture, one is just lubed, the other is straight out the mold.

Might I ask about the meplat? It appears to be about 0.300 or 0.320".

I bet those would be great as a Hollow Point too! They would be a little lighter, but awesome to say the least.

Congrats!

Yondering
05-10-2012, 14:27
Shadow, yes, one of the bullets pictured has a home-made gas check from soda can aluminum on the base. This adds about .010" to the bullet length.

The meplat is .290", or about 73%. Experienced cast bullet handgun hunters say a 70% meplat is ideal; I went with a little more to help make the bullet shorter.

Any Cal helped with this design too, and has some of the bullets for his evaluation.

I've thought about having one cavity of this mold converted to hollow point. There are a few people that offer this service.

I've recovered a few of these fired into wood; cast hard they barely deform, cast soft (10-12 BHN) the nose rivets a bit but they remain intact. I haven't set up any wet newspaper tests with this bullet yet. It's going to take a longer stack of paper than my normal test setup.

nickE10mm
05-10-2012, 14:37
VERY nice, sir! :popcorn:

gofastman
05-10-2012, 17:26
Very nice indeed! I was looking at the Ballisti-Cast #996 (http://www.ballisti-cast.com/Bullet%20Designs%20Page%205.htm), but this one looks better. I too have a bunch of .40 brass and it would be nice to have a versatile bullet design.
You shoot the long .40's in you 10mm barrel?

SDGlock23
05-10-2012, 20:34
Nice looking bullet, I wouldn't mind having some to try out. Congrats!

Taterhead
05-10-2012, 20:44
Dangit Yondering! Now you've done it again. Another thread that has me wanting to start getting into this casting stuff. That is pretty darned cool. I look forward to hearing how your bullets group. A 220 @ 1300 is pretty impressive stuff.

Thanks for another great thread.

Yondering
05-10-2012, 23:59
You shoot the long .40's in you 10mm barrel?

Yes. I have very carefully studied this, and am convinced there is no danger, in a Glock. I would not advise this in any other 10mm.

Taterhead, I haven't done a lot of shooting for groups, mostly just working up loads, but it's already obvious that these shoot really well. Accuracy seems better with this bullet in all loads, than with most of my other "good" loads.

One really nice shooting mild load I found was 9.0gr of 2400. It averaged 999 fps from my longslide, with a SD of 6. Very mild, and very accurate.

The one problem I've had with this bullet is a light leading towards the muzzle with the hotter loads. Not streaks of lead, just a light lead wash on the barrel, that doesn't seem to build up. I'm still experimenting with different hardness and lubes.

_The_Shadow
05-11-2012, 07:27
Yondering, my thoughts on the leading you are seeing, one thought is that as the bullet is pushed from the cartridge, the lube in the groove could be blasted outward because the 40S&W casing being shorter, as the bullet transitions to the bore.

Or a lack of lube on the long forward driving band from the start. You could try some Johnson's paste wax or alox on the nose, to see if it improves the situation.

Good luck sorting it out!

Ethereal Killer
05-11-2012, 07:29
Why hasnt anyone done a 125-130gr hardcast WFN? Running the design program and coming up with a workable design then running that thru QL for a baseline I am getting over 1700FPS with a 125gr bullet out of a 5.2" barrel and over 2100fps with a 16" carbine.

started new thread for discussion of this here: http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=18953447#post18953447

Yondering
05-11-2012, 11:31
Yondering, my thoughts on the leading you are seeing, one thought is that as the bullet is pushed from the cartridge, the lube in the groove could be blasted outward because the 40S&W casing being shorter, as the bullet transitions to the bore.

Or a lack of lube on the long forward driving band from the start. You could try some Johnson's paste wax or alox on the nose, to see if it improves the situation.

Good luck sorting it out!

It does it with 10mm brass also. I've been wondering about the long front bearing surface, but the Mihec 220gr bullet also shown above has an equally long bearing surface (split by the crimp groove) and does not cause the same leading. No lube in the crimp groove on that one either. I didn't cast those myself though, so the alloy may be different. I'm going to try some Carnuba Red, which is designed for higher velocity (although it's never worked well for me in the past) and will also try some LLA.

doublebuck
05-11-2012, 17:31
great job! got any for sale? I'm be first in line.

hubcap500
05-11-2012, 19:13
Tell me more about the gas chex. I do lots of casting and would be very interested.

Yondering
05-11-2012, 20:34
Tell me more about the gas chex. I do lots of casting and would be very interested.

See this thread about making gas checks for plain base bullets from soda cans or other thin aluminum. It should work with thin copper too.
http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1409223

WeeWilly
05-11-2012, 20:49
Dangit Yondering! Now you've done it again. Another thread that has me wanting to start getting into this casting stuff. That is pretty darned cool. I look forward to hearing how your bullets group. A 220 @ 1300 is pretty impressive stuff.

Thanks for another great thread.

My sentiments exactly, everyday in everyway I get closer and closer to buying a casting kit.

Great stuff Yonderling, I really appreciate your sharing.

_The_Shadow
05-11-2012, 21:05
When I bought the Lyman 175 gr TCBB and the 156 gr Devastator HP molds I was looking at several things, but the most important was the what if SHTF and no bullets were avalible. Both are very nice perfomers for what they are. :supergrin:

Casting sort of insures supply...I'm tempted to get an Big Bore air rifle for hunting or what if no componnets are to be had. :shocked:

Cast'em if you got'em! :cool:

Yondering
05-11-2012, 22:48
Casting sort of insures supply...I'm tempted to get an Big Bore air rifle for hunting or what if no componnets are to be had. :shocked:



That would be cool. I saw a design for a fully automatic air rifle once that fired .32 cal cast bullets and would shoot through a 5 gallon jug of water. That would be fun to play with.

hammeredbean
05-12-2012, 09:54
This is great! I am posting to follow along too. I don't have a 10mm but am giving strong consideration to getting one sometime. I would be interested in finding out how a 200 gr bullet at 1000-1100 fps would fare on wild hogs, deer, rabbits, mosquitos, and serpents. Ha! Your bullets look great.

countrygun
05-12-2012, 10:00
This is great! I am posting to follow along too. I don't have a 10mm but am giving strong consideration to getting one sometime. I would be interested in finding out how a 200 gr bullet at 1000-1100 fps would fare on wild hogs, deer, rabbits, mosquitos, and serpents. Ha! Your bullets look great.


I can tell you how a 220 gn .41 KSWC @ 1,100 does on game animals-----very well, thank you:supergrin:

countrygun
05-12-2012, 10:10
OK, so now I am curious to see if the company has your mold specs on file:whistling: And a few more details on about the mold would be nice:kilt:

Any Cal.
05-12-2012, 12:44
Like Yondering mentioned, I have been playing with these for a while as well. While the bullet is quite good, there are a couple changes I would like to make to suit a slightly different purpose. If anyone is interested in group funding bullets of a very similar design, but optimized for 10mm brass and possibly higher speed/pressure, PM me.

If there were at least 4-5 showing interest, I think we could also have a couple options as to heavy duty alloy types as well.

Yondering
05-12-2012, 14:35
OK, so now I am curious to see if the company has your mold specs on file:whistling: And a few more details on about the mold would be nice:kilt:
No, they don't save your specs. Every mold from Mountain Molds is custom designed by the person ordering it. There is a save function on there website, but it hasn't ever worked as far as I know.

I ordered the 2 cavity brass mold, because all of my best casting molds are brass. This one is no exception, almost every bullet dropped from the mold was a keeper. It's definitely a heavy mold, but well made and should last longer than I will.

You do need to have mold handles of course, they don't come with these molds. I use the Lee 6-cavity handles, they work great.

ctious
06-06-2012, 12:26
I am really Interested in making my own design. 205 gr. Very large flat tip with 2 lube groves with a 85% plate. Short overall for max case room. Maybe with a hollow point also. Shallow one.

Being we are talking handguns long range does not matter much to me as a hard hitting big hole blowing bullet.

Vic777
06-06-2012, 12:31
This is very interesting, please keep us posted on results, groupings, and such, down the road please!:wavey:Yes indeed, but what's the logic in designing a "heavy" bullet and then firing it thru a compensated barrel? I'm always looking for loads to fire thru my aftermarket 6 inch G20 barrel.

Any Cal.
06-06-2012, 13:39
The comp slows down the slide speed drastically, even without having lots of extra gas to work with. The first "comps" had no holes, they were just a barrel weight. The weight is helpful regardless of the loading you use.

Yondering
06-06-2012, 18:39
Yes indeed, but what's the logic in designing a "heavy" bullet and then firing it thru a compensated barrel? I'm always looking for loads to fire thru my aftermarket 6 inch G20 barrel.

I fail to see the relation between a heavy bullet and a compensator? I don't see any "logic" to argue one way or another, other than heavier bullets use less powder, but that's really a non-issue with all the powder choices available.

Edit: Any Cal is correct above.

Yondering
06-06-2012, 18:44
I am really Interested in making my own design. 205 gr. Very large flat tip with 2 lube groves with a 85% plate. Short overall for max case room. Maybe with a hollow point also. Shallow one.

Being we are talking handguns long range does not matter much to me as a hard hitting big hole blowing bullet.

85% meplat dia. is way too big. Two issues with it - #1, you have to reduce OAL to avoid jamming up in the magazine. 1.260" OAL, maybe even 1.250", will not work with a meplat that big in a G20 magazine. (The rounds are tilted, the edge of the wide meplat binds on the magazine front wall.)
#2, too big a meplat sacrifices stability in game. You want that bullet to penetrate straight and deep. 70% meplat diameter is commonly accepted as optimum for big bore revolver bullets; I don't see why the 10mm would be different.

2 lube grooves is probably a good idea.

You shouldn't need a hollow point, but they are fun to play with.

ONEo'clockGLOCK
07-04-2012, 03:59
thank you your post is very interesting and informative. Keep em coming we need more 10mm enthusiasts around!