Why Romney Needs to Lose [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Gundude
06-18-2012, 17:03
It's very simple:

Romney embodies the complete abdication by the Republican Party of its responsibility to provide any semblance of counterbalance to the Democrats.

He could easily run as a Democrat. There are plenty of Democrats who have become multi-millionaires and even billionaires founding and/or running successful businesses. That doesn't make him a Republican. What does?

Will the Republican "base" ever get tired of being taken for granted so completely? It's gotta feel pretty insulting.

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 17:10
So, you think America needs 4 more years of 0bama?

Gunnut 45/454
06-18-2012, 17:10
Gundude
You RPbot's just will not give up will you!! Is Mitt the perfect GOP canidate- nope. Is he better then Obumer- By a long shot!:faint:

JBnTX
06-18-2012, 17:30
It's very simple:

Romney embodies the complete abdication by the Republican Party of its responsibility to provide any semblance of counterbalance to the Democrats.

He could easily run as a Democrat. There are plenty of Democrats who have become multi-millionaires and even billionaires founding and/or running successful businesses. That doesn't make him a Republican. What does?

Will the Republican "base" ever get tired of being taken for granted so completely? It's gotta feel pretty insulting.


You do know that by default this thread makes you an Obama supporter.
You don't get it both ways.

How does it feel to be an Obama supporter?
What makes you think Obama will make a better president?

Do you agree with Obama's policies?
Did you vote for Obama the last time?

..

Gundude
06-18-2012, 17:34
So, you think America needs 4 more years of 0bama?More than it needs 4 or 8 of Romney, yes.

JBnTX
06-18-2012, 17:36
More than it needs 4 or 8 of Romney, yes.

How can someone with a username of Gundude be an Obama supporter?

He called you a bitter clinger, remember that?

Jerry
06-18-2012, 17:37
More than it needs 4 or 8 of Romney, yes.

:rofl: Oh that's just soooooo :therapy: I just can't put it into words without having to report myself for insulting you. :rofl:

Quigley
06-18-2012, 17:38
To the OP you are absolutely right. I can and will not vote for Romney. Not because he gives Republicans a bad name, I could care less, but because he gives conservatives a bad name. He is in no way a conservative, but somehow because being conservative has become synonymous with being a Republican. With either him or Obama in office the country is going to fall. It's just that I would rather see it fall under a liberal than a "conservative"


Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

JBnTX
06-18-2012, 17:46
... With either him or Obama in office the country is going to fall. It's just that I would rather see it fall under a liberal than a "conservative"...


Seriously, you would rather see your country fall under a liberal than a conservative?

...and you call yourself an American?

This country is NOT going to fall under either party.
Sorry to disappoint you.

You need to have a little faith in your country.

Neither Romney or Obama can cause this great country to fall.
Both are just bumps in the rocky road of history.

You Ron Paul/Barack Obama supporters need to get your priorities straight.

Gundude
06-18-2012, 17:48
You do know that by default this thread makes you an Obama supporter.
You don't get it both ways.

How does it feel to be an Obama supporter?Not great, but Romney makes it easier for me every day. I'm sure by election time I'll have no problem with it.

What makes you think Obama will make a better president?
Lack of political capital
Won't have congress on his side
Generally no good at getting stuff done


Do you agree with Obama's policies?Nope, do you agree with Romney's?
Did you vote for Obama the last time?Technically, no, but if you believe some people's theories about any action (or inaction) other than a vote for McCain having been a vote for Obama, then maybe.

So now that I've answered all your questions, will you return the favor? What makes Romney a Republican, and does he or does he not embody the complete abdication by the Republican Party of its responsibility to provide any semblance of counterbalance to the Democrats?

Gundude
06-18-2012, 17:49
How can someone with a username of Gundude be an Obama supporter?I can't be a Romney supporter with that name, can I? It's one or the other, right?

Gundude
06-18-2012, 17:51
Neither Romney or Obama can cause this great country to fall.On this one point I agree with you 100%. Without that fear, I see no reason to vote for Romney, for the reason I opened this thread with: We need to encourage opposition in our government, and a Romney victory will quash that.

JBnTX
06-18-2012, 17:54
....

So now that I've answered all your questions, will you return the favor? What makes Romney a Republican....


Romney doesn't have to be a republican, a conservative or anything else.

All he has to do is defeat Barack Obama.

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 17:56
On this one point I agree with you 100%. Without that fear, I see no reason to vote for Romney, for the reason I opened this thread with: We need to encourage opposition in our government, and a Romney victory will quash that.So, if there is no difference, why is the main stream media working so hard to get 0bama re-elected?

You really think Mittens is going to nominate a couple of Supremes that are going to be as radical as Kagan and Sotomayor?

Ronulan please.

JBnTX
06-18-2012, 17:57
Romney doesn't have to be a republican, a conservative or anything else.

All he has to do is defeat Barack Obama.

Ohhh!

I just found me a new signature line.
Damn, I'm good.

:rofl:

Gundude
06-18-2012, 18:01
Romney doesn't have to be a republican, a conservative or anything else.

All he has to do is defeat Barack Obama.We already know Barack Obama won't bring down this country, so why is his defeat so important? Why does it not matter who Romney is? If Romney kicked in your door, defecated on your couch and flipped you the bird on his way out, would you still vote for him?

Where's the line that Romney has to cross before you refuse to vote for him?

oldsoldier
06-18-2012, 18:02
None of them are worth a damn in my opinion. It's a sorry state of affairs when the best we can come up with is Romney or Obama. I will vote a straight Republican ticket though because I believe Romney is better than Obama.

Gundude
06-18-2012, 18:07
So, if there is no difference, why is the main stream media working so hard to get 0bama re-elected?

You really think Mittens is going to nominate a couple of Supremes that are going to be as radical as Kagan and Sotomayor?

Ronulan please.The main stream media is in the entertainment business and in that business you need a protagonist and an antagonist. It's just show business. It doesn't reflect reality.

427
06-18-2012, 18:08
Paulbot, Gundude, is on record as an Obama supporter to teach America, especially the GOP a lesson for not electing his man.

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=18802976&postcount=7

JBnTX
06-18-2012, 18:09
I believe Barack Obama is truly hell bent on destroying the American capitalist system, and turning us into a full blown socialist country.

He wants us to cease being a world superpower and get in line with all the other "one world order" countries.

He wants to destroy the American individualism and independence that made this country great.

For this reason, I'll vote for anyone who stands a chance of defeating Obama.

If that's Romney, then he's got my vote.

..

JBnTX
06-18-2012, 18:11
Paulbot, Gundude, is on record as an Obama supporter to teach America, especially the GOP a lesson for not electing his man.

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=18802976&postcount=7


Thanks for the memories.:rofl:

callihan_44
06-18-2012, 18:13
We already know Barack Obama won't bring down this country, so why is his defeat so important? Why does it not matter who Romney is? If Romney kicked in your door, defecated on your couch and flipped you the bird on his way out, would you still vote for him?

Where's the line that Romney has to cross before you refuse to vote for him?

how do you know obama wont bring the country down? What benefits will we reap with another 4 yrs of obama? Will the country be the same after that period of time? What happens if europe collapses with obama at the the helm here?

Gundude
06-18-2012, 18:13
None of them are worth a damn in my opinion. It's a sorry state of affairs when the best we can come up with is Romney or Obama. I will vote a straight Republican ticket though because I believe Romney is better than Obama.I will also be voting Republicans for congress. I still hold a glimmer of hope that they may one day finally stand up and say "stop!".

But with Romney at the helm, 2001-2006 will look like the golden years of fiscal conservatism, with either Republicans or Democrats in congress. If I had to wager, I'd say there's far more chance of Obama being forced to be more fiscally conservative in his second term than Romney ever would be.

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 18:13
The main stream media is in the entertainment business and in that business you need a protagonist and an antagonist. It's just show business. It doesn't reflect reality.So you're saying they only acted like they hated Bush 43 and are only acting like they love 0bama.

Seems your reality is different than reality.

pilsbury
06-18-2012, 18:15
Gundude
You RPbot's just will not give up will you!! Is Mitt the perfect GOP canidate- nope. Is he better then Obumer- By a long shot!:faint:

Thank you. I'd rather have Clinton again than the big O.

dstanley66
06-18-2012, 18:17
:2gun: I vote for Elmer Fude, at least he likes guns !!!

Gundude
06-18-2012, 18:18
I believe Barack Obama is truly hell bent on destroying the American capitalist system, and turning us into a full blown socialist country.

He wants us to cease being a world superpower and get in line with all the other "one world order" countries.

He wants to destroy the American individualism and independence that made this country great.

For this reason, I'll vote for anyone who stands a chance of defeating Obama.

If that's Romney, then he's got my vote.

..Would you vote for Chuck Shumer, if he put an R after his name? There has to be some baseline where you wouldn't vote for somebody, even against Obama. Where is that baseline?

aircarver
06-18-2012, 18:19
Over our dead bodies.

.

Acujeff
06-18-2012, 18:21
Just a few reasons why Romney needs to win:

Romney will end Obamacare. Obama won't.

Romney will cut spending sharply. Obama will increase it.

Romney will appoint conservative judges like Alito and Roberts. Obama will continue to name liberal anti-RKBA ones like Sotomayor and Kagan.

Romney will remove the U.S. as an active partner to the U.N. gun-ban treaty. Obama has vowed to implement it.

Romney will block grant Medicaid and food stamps and stop their growth. Obama won't.

Romney will cut income taxes. Obama will raise them.

Romney will stop EPA regulation of carbon dioxide. Obama will step it up.

Romney will stop the NLRB from forcing unionization. Obama will continue it.

Romney will do all he can to help Israel stop Iranian nukes. Obama won't.

Romney will crack down on Chinese currency manipulation. Obama is afraid to.

Romney will starve Chavez by curtailing purchase of his oil. Obama won't.

Romney will restore defense cuts. Obama will disarm us.

Romney will approve Keystone and off shore drilling. Obama won't.

Romney will not cut Medicare to finance Obamacare. Obama is.

Romney will reform Medicare by using competition. Obama won't.

Romney will stop debasing the dollar by printing more and more. Obama will continue to print money.

Romney will encourage photo id laws. Obama will veto them.

Romney will call Islamic terrorists, Islamic terrorists. Obama doesn't.

Romney will reduce the capital gains tax. Obama will increase it.

Romney has a better chance to turn America around. Obama hasn't, won't and can't.

Romney will be a better president than Obama.

Gundude
06-18-2012, 18:22
So you're saying they only acted like they hated Bush 43 and are only acting like they love 0bama.

Seems your reality is different than reality.No, the MSM story line is that Republicans are bad and Democrats are good. It doesn't matter how overly simplistic that story line is or whether or not it meshes with reality. It's easy and it sells, that's as far as the MSM cares about.

Gundude
06-18-2012, 18:23
Just a few reasons why Romney needs to win:

Romney will end Obamacare. Obama won't.

Romney will cut spending sharply. Obama will increase it.

Romney will appoint conservative judges like Alito and Roberts. Obama will continue to name liberal anti-RKBA ones like Sotomayor and Kagan.

Romney will remove the U.S. as an active partner to the U.N. gun-ban treaty. Obama has vowed to implement it.

Romney will block grant Medicaid and food stamps and stop their growth. Obama won't.

Romney will cut income taxes. Obama will raise them.

Romney will stop EPA regulation of carbon dioxide. Obama will step it up.

Romney will stop the NLRB from forcing unionization. Obama will continue it.

Romney will do all he can to help Israel stop Iranian nukes. Obama won't.

Romney will crack down on Chinese currency manipulation. Obama is afraid to.

Romney will starve Chavez by curtailing purchase of his oil. Obama won't.

Romney will restore defense cuts. Obama will disarm us.

Romney will approve Keystone and off shore drilling. Obama won't.

Romney will not cut Medicare to finance Obamacare. Obama is.

Romney will reform Medicare by using competition. Obama won't.

Romney will stop debasing the dollar by printing more and more. Obama will continue to print money.

Romney will encourage photo id laws. Obama will veto them.

Romney will call Islamic terrorists, Islamic terrorists. Obama doesn't.

Romney will reduce the capital gains tax. Obama will increase it.

Romney has a better chance to turn America around. Obama hasn't, won't and can't.

Romney will be a better president than Obama.We're talking about Mitt Romney here. Who is this mythical other Romney you're referring to?

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 18:24
Just a few reasons why Romney needs to win:How can this be? According to the Ronulans, they are exactly the same.:rofl:

countrygun
06-18-2012, 18:27
I just can't understand how my fellow conservatives could embarrass me so badly by 'dissin these folks who vote out of spite? why anyone one of us could have probably been accused of that in the days before our voices deepened and we grew facial hair. Now think back to your playground days and have a little compassion. It's just a phase.

Cavalry Doc
06-18-2012, 18:31
Guys, we all knew when the Paul guys showed up, that when Paul failed to get the nomination, and if he did not run third party, that about 1/3 of them would vote third party, about 1/3 of them would vote for the Republican Nominee, and about 1/3 of them would vote for Obama.

Now we know were gundude sits, that's all. He's gonna vote for Obama. No big surprise.

http://www.google.com/url?source=imglanding&ct=img&q=http://hudsonian.us/duh.jpg&sa=X&ei=QsjfT8_sLuHa2AWTwdnrCQ&ved=0CAkQ8wc&usg=AFQjCNH0wczRg_2ZFkZuWG_CyLN-Ra_8Gg

Gundude
06-18-2012, 18:33
I just can't understand how my fellow conservatives could embarrass me so badly by 'dissin these folks who vote out of spite? why anyone one of us could have probably been accused of that in the days before our voices deepened and we grew facial hair. Now think back to your playground days and have a little compassion. It's just a phase.Spite? How so? You don't think that consistently losing elections would cause a party to change their strategy? Isn't the point of us voting to effect the political change we desire? What does spite have to do with it?

Gundude
06-18-2012, 18:36
Guys, we all knew when the Paul guys showed up, that when Paul failed to get the nomination, and if he did not run third party, that about 1/3 of them would vote third party, about 1/3 of them would vote for the Republican Nominee, and about 1/3 of them would vote for Obama.

Now we know were gundude sits, that's all. He's gonna vote for Obama. No big surprise.

http://www.google.com/url?source=imglanding&ct=img&q=http://hudsonian.us/duh.jpg&sa=X&ei=QsjfT8_sLuHa2AWTwdnrCQ&ved=0CAkQ8wc&usg=AFQjCNH0wczRg_2ZFkZuWG_CyLN-Ra_8GgWhat would bring me, as a "Paul guy", to "show up" in 2003?

Ruble Noon
06-18-2012, 18:36
Seriously, you would rather see your country fall under a liberal than a conservative?

...and you call yourself an American?

This country is NOT going to fall under either party.
Sorry to disappoint you.

You need to have a little faith in your country.

Neither Romney or Obama can cause this great country to fall.
Both are just bumps in the rocky road of history.

You Ron Paul/Barack Obama supporters need to get your priorities straight.

Who's the conservative? This election is between a fascist and a liberal progressive.

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 18:39
Who's the conservative? This election is between a fascist and a liberal progressive.You should direct your question to Quigley. It was his statement.

Not sure what kind of answer you will get, as it seems he has a fantasy about America falling.

I'd guess 3%er or Oath Keeper.

Cavalry Doc
06-18-2012, 18:41
What would bring me, as a "Paul guy", to "show up" in 2003?

What would that change?

Ruble Noon
06-18-2012, 18:42
Paulbot, Gundude, is on record as an Obama supporter to teach America, especially the GOP a lesson for not electing his man.

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=18802976&postcount=7

What lesson are you teaching the GOP by continually voting for their favored candidates that are farther left each election?

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 18:48
What lesson are you teaching the GOP by continually voting for their favored candidates that are farther left each election?Why are declared non-members of the GOP trying to teach the GOP a lesson?

Cavalry Doc
06-18-2012, 18:49
What lesson are you teaching the GOP by continually voting for their favored candidates that are farther left each election?

Look what not electing McCain got us......


This fantasy that we send messages that are received by some mysterious smoke filled room that are going to pick the next republican nominee based on how many votes the last one got is really getting silly.

The RNC didn't pick Romney, the moderates from the little blue states that got to have their primaries first picked him.

bear62
06-18-2012, 18:52
I find Romney disgusting ...... I find Obama infinitely more disgusting than Romney ..... :faint:

Edited to say ........ I will vote for Romney ....

countrygun
06-18-2012, 18:55
Why are declared non-members of the GOP trying to teach the GOP a lesson?

For the same reason Dems vote for Obama. yup that teaches the GOP a lesson alright:crazy:

What they really don't seem to get is that, if RP HAD become the GOP candidate it would have meant a sure Obama victory


...or maybe they do get it.

beforeobamabans
06-18-2012, 18:56
:popcorn:

Interesting to watch you eat your own...

Ruble Noon
06-18-2012, 18:58
Look what not electing McCain got us......


This fantasy that we send messages that are received by some mysterious smoke filled room that are going to pick the next republican nominee based on how many votes the last one got is really getting silly.

The RNC didn't pick Romney, the moderates from the little blue states that got to have their primaries first picked him.

I don't know who picked him. I doubt it was the people though as Romney supporters are more scarce than a three peckered Dodo bird.

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 19:05
I don't know who picked him. I doubt it was the people though as Romney supporters are more scarce than a three peckered Dodo bird.But not as rare as a Ron Paul supporter that makes it to the polling place.

427
06-18-2012, 19:05
What lesson are you teaching the GOP by continually voting for their favored candidates that are farther left each election?

Remember this Ruble Noon? Or did you forget?

Shortsightedness!? Talk to your fellow paul supporters who want to vote for Obama.

Yes, I will admit that they are shortsighted in that aspect. They think that by electing obama to a second term people will soon wake up to the freedoms that they are losing. I disagree. The people that don't realize what is happening by now either cannot be awakened or they agree with what is happening and are therefore complicit in the destruction of our country.

The Machinist
06-18-2012, 19:09
The Romneybot tears in this thread are sweet. :rofl:

stopatrain
06-18-2012, 19:11
Anybody but Obama for me.

The Machinist
06-18-2012, 19:12
Just a few reasons why Romney needs to win:
Romney will end Obamacare. Obama won't.
Romney will cut spending sharply. Obama will increase it.
Romney will appoint conservative judges like Alito and Roberts. Obama will continue to name liberal anti-RKBA ones like Sotomayor and Kagan.
Romney will remove the U.S. as an active partner to the U.N. gun-ban treaty. Obama has vowed to implement it.
Romney will block grant Medicaid and food stamps and stop their growth. Obama won't.
Romney will cut income taxes. Obama will raise them.
Romney will stop EPA regulation of carbon dioxide. Obama will step it up.
Romney will stop the NLRB from forcing unionization. Obama will continue it.
Romney will do all he can to help Israel stop Iranian nukes. Obama won't.
Romney will crack down on Chinese currency manipulation. Obama is afraid to.
Romney will starve Chavez by curtailing purchase of his oil. Obama won't.
Romney will restore defense cuts. Obama will disarm us.
Romney will approve Keystone and off shore drilling. Obama won't.
Romney will not cut Medicare to finance Obamacare. Obama is.
Romney will reform Medicare by using competition. Obama won't.
Romney will stop debasing the dollar by printing more and more. Obama will continue to print money.
Romney will encourage photo id laws. Obama will veto them.
Romney will call Islamic terrorists, Islamic terrorists. Obama doesn't.
Romney will reduce the capital gains tax. Obama will increase it.
Romney has a better chance to turn America around. Obama hasn't, won't and can't.
Romney will be a better president than Obama.
Are you on drugs? You're just making up garbage with absolutely nothing in Romney's history to back up your delusions.

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 19:14
The Romneybot tears in this thread are sweet. :rofl:Anybody But Obama makes someone a romneybot in your world?

You must be using that new math in your calculations.

G29Reload
06-18-2012, 19:16
The reason why the premise is flawed is because Obama needs to LOSE.

This election isnt about electing Romney.

Its about "throw the bum out" and that Obama needs to be fired.

This is important most of all because failure to kick Boy Zero Wonder out of the WH only puts the imprimatur of approval on his actions. It's the American public saying, "yeah, we want MORE of this!"

At the moment Obama bounces, the message is clear in no uncertain terms to Romney: Get it right, or we do the same to you.

The OP's premise is, cut off your nose to spite your face. (And that he's an Obama supporter) Republicans = fail to do what I want = must do penance by being enslaved by Obama for another 4.

Ridiculous.

427
06-18-2012, 19:23
Is it me, or are the Paul supporters trying to publicly justify their Obama support?

Cavalry Doc
06-18-2012, 19:27
I don't know who picked him. I doubt it was the people though as Romney supporters are more scarce than a three peckered Dodo bird.

I've actually met a few. I never did meet anyone that would admit voting for McCain in the Primary.

If it was Dr. Evil, find his secret base and send in Austin Powers. If you don't think that will work, what do you have in mind.

Ruble Noon
06-18-2012, 19:29
Remember this Ruble Noon? Or did you forget?

Nope, didn't forget it and still stand by it.

Cavalry Doc
06-18-2012, 19:32
The Romneybot tears in this thread are sweet. :rofl:

The cultist projection is sweeter. I have not seen anyone singing his praises a 10th as much as the paul disciples have been singing his. He's still losing you know. Best bet, he causes a disruption at the convention, more likely, he endorses Romney. Where is your god now?

Oh well, we are where we are. It's a pretty crappy choice, a liberal or a socialist. Some of your guys, and maybe even you will be voting for Obama.

No big to me. I didn't like anyone in the race that much, and the guys that were the very bottom of the barrel ended up at the end of the race.

Now, it's just entertainment. I'll do fine regardless of who wins. I'm hoping that in 2016, there is a change in the primary process, and maybe a real conservative (and when I say that, I don't mean a libertarian) to vote for.

Till then, we shall live in interesting times.

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 19:32
Is it me, or are the Paul supporters trying to publicly justify their Obama support?Seems that way.

Also seems they are trying to relieve the pressure on their brains.

Must be awfully hard to come to grips with originally saying only electing Ron Paul can save the U.S. to now saying only electing 0bama can save the U.S.

countrygun
06-18-2012, 19:54
Seems that way.

Also seems they are trying to relieve the pressure on their brains.

Must be awfully hard to come to grips with originally saying only electing Ron Paul can save the U.S. to now saying only electing 0bama can save the U.S.


They go from "I really belive in what Ron Paul stands for"

To

"I'm going to vote for the man who has increased the National debt more than any other President, and wants to keep us dependent on foriegn oil and hasn't closed GITMO"


these folks could get lost on a staircase.

Cavalry Doc
06-18-2012, 20:06
Seems that way.

Also seems they are trying to relieve the pressure on their brains.

Must be awfully hard to come to grips with originally saying only electing Ron Paul can save the U.S. to now saying only electing 0bama can save the U.S.


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/42/Super-Patriot.jpg

Super Patriot - Loves America so much, and is so conservative that he MUST vote for the most liberal candidate in order to try to destroy it.

PawDog
06-18-2012, 20:09
They go from "I really belive in what Ron Paul stands for"

To

"I'm going to vote for the man who has increased the National debt more than any other President, and wants to keep us dependent on foriegn oil and hasn't closed GITMO"

these folks could get lost on a staircase.

It's actually sad to watch the Paulatarians melt down right now. (OK, not really sad, but it is expected. :supergrin:)

i expect by November 6, 2012, we'll see a "Jonestown" style suicide-pact with some of these cultist children. :rofl:

countrygun
06-18-2012, 20:29
It's actually sad to watch the Paulatarians melt down right now. (OK, not really sad, but it is expected. :supergrin:)

i expect by November 6, 2012, we'll see a "Jonestown" style suicide-pact with some of these cultist children. :rofl:


I was kinda figuring that they didn't care what they did to the Country because they were going to gather for the "Mothership" to pick them up the day after the election.

Kingarthurhk
06-18-2012, 21:14
More than it needs 4 or 8 of Romney, yes.

So, your sour grapes are so strong you would willingly endorse a president activist who just in your face violated the seperation of powers? That is some serious Ron Paul love. You didn't glue his head on, some "other pictures" did you?:supergrin:

Gundude
06-18-2012, 21:21
This is important most of all because failure to kick Boy Zero Wonder out of the WH only puts the imprimatur of approval on his actions. It's the American public saying, "yeah, we want MORE of this!"So, how would electing Romney not be saying to the Republican party, "yeah, we want MORE gun-grabbing, big spending, immigrant-loving candidates!"


At the moment Obama bounces, the message is clear in no uncertain terms to Romney: Get it right, or we do the same to you.If you elect Romney, nobody is ever going to believe you'd vote anything but Republican, ever. Your idle threats will be laughed at as liberal progressive after liberal progressive get shoved down your throats as Republican candidates..


The OP's premise is, cut off your nose to spite your face. (And that he's an Obama supporter) Republicans = fail to do what I want = must do penance by being enslaved by Obama for another 4. Nope, spite has nothing to do with it. When Republicans become worse than Democrats I don't vote for them because I don't want them in office. That's the whole point of voting. They are worse than Democrats because they offer all the bad things Democrats do, plus a few bad things of their own.

Gundude
06-18-2012, 21:24
Why are declared non-members of the GOP trying to teach the GOP a lesson?What's this obsession with "teaching a lesson"? Does it really never occur to you that people vote against somebody (or some party) simply because they don't like what that person (or party) is doing?

The Machinist
06-18-2012, 21:35
Doc, the only cult members are the GOP faithful, such as yourself. No matter how often they lie to you, and betray every tenet of conservatism, they own you, and they know it.

countrygun
06-18-2012, 21:48
Doc, the only cult members are the GOP faithful, such as yourself. No matter how often they lie to you, and betray every tenet of conservatism, they own you, and they know it.


Well, if you "Own" Ron Paul, how come he is giving orders to behave yourselves? If he backs Romney will that be at your orders?

427
06-18-2012, 21:55
What's this obsession with "teaching a lesson"? Does it really never occur to you that people vote against somebody (or some party) simply because they don't like what that person (or party) is doing?

I don't know, maybe it's posts from your fellow Paul supporters?
Like this:

Ok here you guys are going to trash at me for what I am about to say. Please understand that I love America and none of us are learning a lesson from 2004 and past and therefore I say:

If Ron Paul is out then I'll vote Obama to trash GOP. GOP needs to go under; I mean it.

Who got us Obama? McCain! Romney as our GOP will get us Obama fo sho! If you are in denial of that then you are sticking your head into the sand!

GOP will never win a President race in the future; that's way too obvious!!! GOP is wayyyy too divided.

I am going to vote Obama because this race is fixed for Obama. The America is screwed up because the majority of Americans aren't capable to understand the politic, economy, and the moral standard that's horrible. They just want to see more drama and to divide ourselves.

I don't think RP will win 2012 because many of us are idiots. I recommend you to take pictures of the America in hardcopy (those pictures will be the historical documents); look at Detroit for example. Enjoy the America while it lasts.

countrygun
06-18-2012, 22:10
Anybody But Obama makes someone a romneybot in your world?

You must be using that new math in your calculations.



A logical choice between the two viable candidates pales in the face of their quest for a Messiah.

Fed Five Oh
06-18-2012, 22:41
What's this obsession with "teaching a lesson"? Does it really never occur to you that people vote against somebody (or some party) simply because they don't like what that person (or party) is doing?As to your first question, you should ask Ruble Noon this question, as he is the one talking about teaching a lesson.

As to your second question, why do you think many of us are voting for Mittens? Seems your second question could be nominated for stupidest question of the month.

Snowman92D
06-18-2012, 22:59
I was kinda figuring that they didn't care what they did to the Country because they were going to gather for the "Mothership" to pick them up the day after the election.

True. Them RP supporters are indeed getting stranger and stranger as their World continues to fray apart. I think that several of the ones I know will indeed welcome the impending arrival of the "Mothership".

In fact, the last I heard, one of them was poking around under his kitchen sink trying to find the Comet. :ufo:

G29Reload
06-19-2012, 00:17
Nope, spite has nothing to do with it. When Republicans become worse than Democrats I don't vote for them because I don't want them in office.

Therein lies your false premise. Republicans are NOT worse than dems. For all romney's faults, he's a hundred times better than Zero.

And romney's getting his chance because we're firing zero for taking us down the socialist path. Everyone gets a first chance, you go against us, you'll be a one termer too.

NO AFFIRMATION FOR COMMIES1 and DONE!

Don H
06-19-2012, 00:34
More than it needs 4 or 8 of Romney, yes.

:crazy:

ricklee4570
06-19-2012, 01:56
If you are anti-military, vote Obama. If you care about our military, vote Romney. Romney wont gut our military in favor of more big government programs to enslave the ignorant.

After all, Obama is the food stamp king.

barbedwiresmile
06-19-2012, 04:08
Romney will cut spending sharply.

:rofl:

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 04:28
Doc, the only cult members are the GOP faithful, such as yourself. No matter how often they lie to you, and betray every tenet of conservatism, they own you, and they know it.

You made me laugh. I've visited a couple Paul sites, seen the bum rushing of countless Internet polls, watched the reaction to the slightest criticisms.

Yup, you keep telling yourself that if you want too. But we all know this is just frustration that the messiah has failed again. It can't be his fault, so you need another outlet for your anger.

It's funny in a sad kind of way.


There is no secret message being sent by voting for Obama. McCain losing to obama didn't give us a more conservative candidate. This line of thought is a liberal Jedi mind trick. Works just like it did in the movie too.

eracer
06-19-2012, 04:55
Now that he is the (holding my nose) our 'republican' candidate for president, I will vote for Obama Lite for one reason.

SCOTUS.

PocketProtector
06-19-2012, 05:14
I believe Barack Obama is truly hell bent on destroying the American capitalist system, and turning us into a full blown socialist country.

He wants us to cease being a world superpower and get in line with all the other "one world order" countries.

He wants to destroy the American individualism and independence that made this country great.

For this reason, I'll vote for anyone who stands a chance of defeating Obama.

If that's Romney, then he's got my vote.

..

This !!! If you think otherwise, then you have no clue what OMao has been doing for 3 1/2 years.

Bren
06-19-2012, 05:35
So, you think America needs 4 more years of 0bama?

That's what he said - joining the rest of the "stealth liberals" of Glock Talk. Now he can report the responses in a thread at Democratic Underground.

Either that, or he really can't understand the difference between 2 equally liberal presidents, when 1 is a second-yterm democrat and the other a first-term republican. If that is the case, he'd have no business voting or making any other important decision.

HexHead
06-19-2012, 05:48
I believe Barack Obama is truly hell bent on destroying the American capitalist system, and turning us into a full blown socialist country.

He wants us to cease being a world superpower and get in line with all the other "one world order" countries.

He wants to destroy the American individualism and independence that made this country great.


..

And for these reasons there's a slightly better chance that under 0bama we'll split into two countries and cast off the blue states.

beforeobamabans
06-19-2012, 05:55
They go from "I really belive in what Ron Paul stands for"

To

"I'm going to vote for the man who has increased the National debt more than any other President, and wants to keep us dependent on foriegn oil and hasn't closed GITMO"


these folks could get lost on a staircase.

You should try using singular pronouns instead of slandering the entire landscape with your political generalizations (fantasies?)

I, for one, am a lifelong republican voter who attempted to bring a whiff of sacrifice and responsibility to the primary process by supporting the ONLY candidate who published a written plan to fulfill the primary tenet of the Tea Party. In case you've forgotten what that is, it is singularly a significant reduction in the size and reach of the federal government.

It has been very interesting to watch all you Pawlenty, Bachmann, Cain, Gingrich, Huntsman, Perry, Trump (who'd I forget?) bandwagon jumpers move from one candidate to the next. I'll bet not one of you can produce a post from last year identifying your original support of Romney. In fact, I seem to recall all you supporters of the above candidates condemning Romney in the strongest terms possible equating him with the nearest thing to a GOP Obama-Lite with such labels as "Obamneycare".

Now that Romney is the GOP nominee, all you 11th hour converts are eager to practice a scorched earth campaign denigrating anyone who happened to support Ron Paul who factually put forth the most Tea Party consistent platform of any candidate. Interesting, to say the least.

Given my lifelong principles, I could never vote for Obama. He is anathema to everything I stand for (and hope for the GOP). However, Romney has a long way to go to earn my vote. Maybe he'll get there but where are his detailed policies? Has he published a budget identifying specific cuts in government (as Ron Paul bravely did)? Of course not, he wants to keep his options open. Has he actually produced a detailed plan on any major public policy? I'd like to read them if he has. Romney remains an enigma wrapped in an enigma. If elected, he may well surprise Republican voters as much as Obama has surprised most Democrats. Is it too much to ask that we have an opportunity to know what a politician plans to do in office before we vote for him?

So, after seeing my first choice eliminated in the primaries, this former Paul supporter is re-evaluating the political landscape. I desperately want real, tangible conservative reform in the GOP but it is obvious that I'm not going to see that this cycle. Unfortunately, the promise of the 2010 elections have evaporated into thin air. I know I will not vote for Obama. Can I reconcile my deeply held principles to hold my nose and vote for Romney? Maybe, but it will depend on what if anything he actually reveals about his plans for office. And, for those of you who insist that a non-vote is a vote for Obama, all I can say is, too bad OUR party nominated such a weak candidate that he cannot motivate the most conservative among us to be passionate about his candidacy.

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 06:16
And for these reasons there's a slightly better chance that under 0bama we'll split into two countries and cast off the blue states.

Another pipe dream. All Barry will do is take us deeper into the hole.

Quigley
06-19-2012, 06:42
Seriously, you would rather see your country fall under a liberal than a conservative?

...and you call yourself an American?

This country is NOT going to fall under either party.
Sorry to disappoint you.

You need to have a little faith in your country.

Neither Romney or Obama can cause this great country to fall.
Both are just bumps in the rocky road of history.

You Ron Paul/Barack Obama supporters need to get your priorities straight.

This has to be the biggest oxymoron that I have ever seen. It's like saying that because I don't like broccoli that makes me a cancer lover. You are saying that because I support the most conservative candidate that we've seen in the past 50 years that I am somehow also supporting the most liberal president that we have ever seen.


Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

The Machinist
06-19-2012, 06:44
Well, if you "Own" Ron Paul, how come he is giving orders to behave yourselves? If he backs Romney will that be at your orders?
As I said in another thread, Paul could renounce his every belief and worship at the altar of liberalism tomorrow, and my views on liberty still wouldn't change. Romney would still not get my vote.

Why do you Romney supporters always try to make every argument about Paul? He's out. He's not going to be the president.

The Machinist
06-19-2012, 06:47
You made me laugh. I've visited a couple Paul sites, seen the bum rushing of countless Internet polls, watched the reaction to the slightest criticisms.

Yup, you keep telling yourself that if you want too. But we all know this is just frustration that the messiah has failed again. It can't be his fault, so you need another outlet for your anger.

It's funny in a sad kind of way.


There is no secret message being sent by voting for Obama. McCain losing to obama didn't give us a more conservative candidate. This line of thought is a liberal Jedi mind trick. Works just like it did in the movie too.
Your memory is failing, and I don't believe you really pay attention to anybody's posts, unless they're agreeing with you and your support for Romney.

A) Ron Paul is not my messiah.

B) I'm not voting for the Kenyan squatter.

TheJ
06-19-2012, 07:07
To me this election is not about the next four years. It's about the next 20-40 years with the likely two supreme court justices whoever wins will appoint. We may not be 100% sure about the type of justices Romney will appoint but we certainly can be sure about what type of justices Obama will appoint.

Those who would help Obama get re-elected out of spite (by not participating) are absolutely no different then those who actually vote for him and work for his re-election.

JBnTX
06-19-2012, 07:22
A lot of posters are actively and openly supporting Barack Obama now that they no longer have Ron Paul to hide behind.

They've been Obama supporters all along.
Now, they're finally exposed for what they really are.

Quigley
06-19-2012, 07:42
A lot of posters are actively and openly supporting Barack Obama now that they no longer have Ron Paul to hide behind.

They've been Obama supporters all along.
Now, they're finally exposed for what they really are.

You're a real genius. I will vote for neither but I will vote. However, saying that anyone who is a RP supporter has actually been an Obama supporter all along is outrageous. The two are complete opposite ends of the spectrum. RP actually wants to decrease the size of the Fed drastically. It is however, actually rather difficult to tell the difference between a true Romney supporter and an Obama supporter. I mean neither candidate will actually be open about their stance on most issues and both are big Gov't


Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

whoflungdo
06-19-2012, 07:43
Now that he is the (holding my nose) our 'republican' candidate for president, I will vote for Obama Lite for one reason.

SCOTUS.


That's my biggest concern right now. Policy wise I don't see much difference between Obama and Romney. From my research Romney doesn't have a good track record with nominating conservative judges, but we KNOW what type of judge Obama will nominate. Can you imagine where we would be right now if Gore or Kerry had won and appointed 2 judges with the landmark cases they've decided on recently?

One of my fears is that the country will see someone like Romney can win and the Republican Party will continue to nominate candidates like McCain and Romney.

Bren
06-19-2012, 07:46
Now that Romney is the GOP nominee, all you 11th hour converts are eager to practice a scorched earth campaign denigrating anyone who happened to support Ron Paul who factually put forth the most Tea Party consistent platform of any candidate. Interesting, to say the least.

There is no way I would have chosen Romney from the original candidates - just as there is no way I'd support Obama by voting for anybody (3rd party) other than Romney in the election.

Your rant is ridiculous. Many people wanted a better Republican candidate from the beginning and aren't proud that they have to vote for Romney to avoid electing Obama again. So? That's how out system works. I'll be voting Romney, knowing I don't really want him, but he is the lesser of evils. The only part I'm proud of is having the common sense to understand the danger of voting thrid party "on principle" and helping Obamma win again.

aircarver
06-19-2012, 07:57
There is no way I would have chosen Romney from the original candidates - just as there is no way I'd support Obama by voting for anybody (3rd party) other than Romney in the election.

Your rant is ridiculous. Many people wanted a better Republican candidate from the beginning and aren't proud that they have to vote for Romney to avoid electing Obama again. So? That's how out system works. I'll be voting Romney, knowing I don't really want him, but he is the lesser of evils. The only part I'm proud of is having the common sense to understand the danger of voting thrid party "on principle" and helping Obamma win again.

:thumbsup:

.

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 07:58
Your memory is failing, and I don't believe you really pay attention to anybody's posts, unless they're agreeing with you and your support for Romney.

A) Ron Paul is not my messiah.

B) I'm not voting for the Kenyan squatter.

You have my support for voting any way you want.
Ron is about to prove to everyone he is human.

The main point is that voting against Barry, for the most likely guy to beat him, doesn't send a message to anyone that will have control of who is nominated next. That all depends in who wants to run, an who the republicans will vote for.

The best way to get more conservative nominees is to change the order of the primaries. That's been pretty successful in nominating the most liberal candidate for both parties so far.

whoflungdo
06-19-2012, 08:00
You have my support for voting any way you want.
Ron is about to prove to everyone he is human.

The main point is that voting against Barry, for the most likely guy to beat him, doesn't send a message to anyone that will have control of who is nominated next. That all depends in who wants to run, an who the republicans will vote for.

The best way to get more conservative nominees is to change the order of the primaries. That's been pretty successful in nominating the most liberal candidate for both parties so far.

Agreed.

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 08:01
You're a real genius. I will vote for neither but I will vote. However, saying that anyone who is a RP supporter has actually been an Obama supporter all along is outrageous. The two are complete opposite ends of the spectrum. RP actually wants to decrease the size of the Fed drastically. It is however, actually rather difficult to tell the difference between a true Romney supporter and an Obama supporter. I mean neither candidate will actually be open about their stance on most issues and both are big Gov't


Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine


Not all RP supporters are turning to Barry, but there are enough of them openly stating that to notice a trend. I think about a third will vote third party, a third will vote for Romney, and a third will vote for Barry. A few won't vote at all.

JFrame
06-19-2012, 08:04
Not all RP supporters are turning to Barry, but there are enough of them openly stating that to notice a trend. I think about a third will vote third party, a third will vote for Romney, and a third will vote for Barry. A few won't vote at all.


Statistically, that would make them a pretty inconsequential faction...


.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 09:11
A lot of posters are actively and openly supporting Barack Obama now that they no longer have Ron Paul to hide behind.

They've been Obama supporters all along.
Now, they're finally exposed for what they really are.You can refuse to believe all you want that there's a large chunk of the population who hold Romney in lower regard than Obama. You can indulge your fantasies that we were always going to vote for Obama anyways so it doesn't matter that we do.

None of it changes the fact that Romney is an awful candidate, a disgrace to Republicans, and will more than likely lose what should have been an easy election.

Whatever scenario you need to fabricate in your head to cope with how it turned out that way, have at it.

sbhaven
06-19-2012, 09:28
Is there anyone here who is saying that Romney doesn't have problems? That he doesn't need to be dragged to the right on many issues?

Voting "anyone but Obama" doesn't automatically mean that someone is 100% behind Romney. What it does mean is that one is 100% against Obama having a second term.
:dunno:

Shadyscott69
06-19-2012, 09:29
Right. We don't need 4 more minutes of the curent buffoon in the white house.
Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 09:43
Statistically, that would make them a pretty inconsequential faction...


.

If you are interested in the entertainment value, they are priceless.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 09:48
Is there anyone here who is saying that Romney doesn't have problems? That he doesn't need to be dragged to the right on many issues?

Voting "anyone but Obama" doesn't automatically mean that someone is 100% behind Romney. What it does mean is that one is 100% against Obama having a second term.
:dunno:It's weird, then, that me voting for "anybody but Romney" automatically means I'm 100% behind Obama to so many people in this thread.

I'm not, of course, but it's wasted time trying to convince them of that. The point I'm trying to make is that Romney won't be dragged to the right, because he won't have any motivation to. Once he knows he can still get your vote, even with his record, your desires for him to move right will mean absolutely nothing to him. Others, equally bad or worse than him, seeing the same thing, will then follow.

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 09:52
It's weird, then, that me voting for "anybody but Romney" automatically means I'm 100% behind Obama to so many people in this thread.

I'm not, of course, but it's wasted time trying to convince them of that. The point I'm trying to make is that Romney won't be dragged to the right, because he won't have any motivation to. Once he knows he can still get your vote, even with his record, your desires for him to move right will mean absolutely nothing to him. Others, equally bad or worse than him, seeing the same thing, will then follow.

Two words: Harriet Miers.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 09:53
Statistically, that would make them a pretty inconsequential faction...


.Depends on which state they live in.

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/may/27/news/la-pn-electoral-college-10-states-matter-20120525

Fortunately, my state is one of the gray ones. :wavey:

beforeobamabans
06-19-2012, 10:00
There is no way I would have chosen Romney from the original candidates - just as there is no way I'd support Obama by voting for anybody (3rd party) other than Romney in the election.

Your rant is ridiculous. Many people wanted a better Republican candidate from the beginning and aren't proud that they have to vote for Romney to avoid electing Obama again. So? That's how out system works. I'll be voting Romney, knowing I don't really want him, but he is the lesser of evils. The only part I'm proud of is having the common sense to understand the danger of voting thrid party "on principle" and helping Obamma win again.

My rant is ridiculous? :rofl: Look at what you just wrote.

I supported Ron Paul because I KNEW what he would do as POTUS. You have already decided to vote for someone who you openly state you don't want, which means you either disagree with his principles and policies or you simply don't know what they are. Perhaps you can help me make up my mind by supplying his policy positions on the following issues:

1. How much money will he approve for the US spending budget? What departments will he eliminate? How much less will this be than the current expenditures, how fast will he bring the budget into balance and how fast will he reduce the current $16 Trillion deficit?
2. How will he change our tax structure? Will he eliminate deductions I depend on and raise my rates?
3. How much will he spend on Defense and Foreign Aid? What national detense goals does he purport to accomplish with these expenditures?
4. What will he do to Social Security and Medicare? Will this effect my retirement?

I could go on but I don't want to overwhelm you. Please answer these for starters and then I can start to evaluate whether or not his positions are worthy of my support. Thank you in advance for helping me make up my mind.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 10:04
Two words: Harriet Miers.Oooh, yeah, you guys sure showed Bush a thing or two about who's boss. We got Patriot Act, No Child Left Behind, more Medicare, Department of Homeland except border Security, TSA, Iraq, TARP. But you sure stopped him from appointing Harriet Miers. I'm sure every potential Republican president is looking at that act of defiance with fear in their hearts.

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 10:06
My rant is ridiculous? :rofl: Look at what you just wrote.

I supported Ron Paul because I KNEW what he would do as POTUS. You have already decided to vote for someone who you openly state you don't want, which means you either disagree with his principles and policies or you simply don't know what they are. Perhaps you can help me make up my mind by supplying his policy positions on the following issues:

1. How much money will he approve for the US spending budget? What departments will he eliminate? How much less will this be than the current expenditures, how fast will he bring the budget into balance and how fast will he reduce the current $16 Trillion deficit?
2. How will he change our tax structure? Will he eliminate deductions I depend on and raise my rates?
3. How much will he spend on Defense and Foreign Aid? What national detense goals does he purport to accomplish with these expenditures?
4. What will he do to Social Security and Medicare? Will this effect my retirement?

I could go on but I don't want to overwhelm you. Please answer these for starters and then I can start to evaluate whether or not his positions are worthy of my support. Thank you in advance for helping me make up my mind.

Most of us don't know what Romney will do, all of us have a pretty good idea what Barry will do.

beforeobamabans
06-19-2012, 10:06
Two words: Harriet Miers.

With the financial calamity and other heavy issues facing this country, I find it ludicrous that some have to retreat all the way to unknown possible SCOTUS appointees to find a reason to support this candidate. This says a lot about both.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 10:07
Most of us don't know what Romney will do, all of us have a pretty good idea what Barry will do.Why don't we know what Romney will do? Didn't Barry do exactly what we expected him to? Why won't Romney?

beforeobamabans
06-19-2012, 10:11
Most of us don't know what Romney will do, all of us have a pretty good idea what Barry will do.

Since you're in medicine, I'll give you an analogy you'll understand: Your position is like having a sick patient and two drugs. You know one drug will kill him so you know you don't want to give him that one. You know nothing about the second one but go ahead and give it because it might help.

God help us.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 10:20
Since you're in medicine, I'll give you an analogy you'll understand: Your position is like having a sick patient and two drugs. You know one drug will kill him so you know you don't want to give him that one. You know nothing about the second one but go ahead and give it because it might help.

God help us.Another analogy:We have to pass the bill so you can find out what is in itSound familiar?

ted1
06-19-2012, 10:24
I would vote for a toilet brush before Obama so Romney gets my vote. As for ron Paul what a joke he should be in a nursing home not the white house.

Sent from my DROID RAZR

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 10:32
Oooh, yeah, you guys sure showed Bush a thing or two about who's boss. We got Patriot Act, No Child Left Behind, more Medicare, Department of Homeland except border Security, TSA, Iraq, TARP. But you sure stopped him from appointing Harriet Miers. I'm sure every potential Republican president is looking at that act of defiance with fear in their hearts.

And I guess you got all that and Kagan/Sotomayor.

Big win for you huh?

beforeobamabans
06-19-2012, 10:35
I would vote for a toilet brush before Obama so Romney gets my vote. As for ron Paul what a joke he should be in a nursing home not the white house.

Sent from my DROID RAZR

Exhibit A for the informed, deliberative American voter. :whistling:

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 10:36
Since you're in medicine, I'll give you an analogy you'll understand: Your position is like having a sick patient and two drugs. You know one drug will kill him so you know you don't want to give him that one. You know nothing about the second one but go ahead and give it because it might help.

God help us.

Better analogy, both drugs will make the patient sicker, not kill them, just make them worse. But one will make them sickerthan the other.

IRL, I'd give neither, but that's not one of the choices in the election.

JFrame
06-19-2012, 10:37
If you are interested in the entertainment value, they are priceless.


:rofl:


.

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 10:38
Exhibit A for the informed, deliberative American voter. :whistling:

Come on, a toilet brush, even old and used would be better than Barry. Think about it.

SCmasterblaster
06-19-2012, 10:39
So, you think America needs 4 more years of 0bama?

BHO has got to go, or else he'll push for more gun control in 2013-2017.

427
06-19-2012, 10:47
It's weird, then, that me voting for "anybody but Romney" automatically means I'm 100% behind Obama to so many people in this thread.

I'm not, of course, but it's wasted time trying to convince them of that. The point I'm trying to make is that Romney won't be dragged to the right, because he won't have any motivation to. Once he knows he can still get your vote, even with his record, your desires for him to move right will mean absolutely nothing to him. Others, equally bad or worse than him, seeing the same thing, will then follow.
You're not a Ron Paul supporter who turned to supporting Obama?
A good thing for the country. If the only realistic alternative to Democrats is a Republican party whose only real difference from Democrats is a more authoritarian stance on sex, drugs, and religion, that's not good for the country.

Not long ago, I didn't think I could ever possibly vote for someone like Obama, but after all this discussion, it occurs to me that maybe I do just have to hold my nose and vote for somebody repulsive in order to help achieve an end. I mean, I really want him to win in a blowout, so it's kind of a cop-out to let everybody else do the dirty work.

And I have GTPI to thank for bringing me around. I wonder how many other Obama voters this forum created?

:whistling:

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 10:48
BHO has got to go, or else he'll push for more gun control in 2013-2017.

And even if it's not gun control or more ber-liberal SCOTUS picks, it WILL be something. He's not done with his fundamental transformation by a long shot.

maxsnafu
06-19-2012, 11:03
.

The best way to get more conservative nominees is to change the order of the primaries. That's been pretty successful in nominating the most liberal candidate for both parties so far.

...and that's why there will be no change in the order of the primaries. GOP elites are very satisfied with the candidates they've gotten because they're NOT conservative.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 11:10
You're not a Ron Paul supporter who turned to supporting Obama?


:whistling:No, what was the date on that post? I'm pretty sure it was long before Ron Paul evaporated from the race. If I was a Ron Paul supporter, I would've been supporting Ron Paul at the time.
ETA: Oh yeah, there's a link there: 03-09-2012. So there you go.

I like most of RP's ideas. Most of his ideas that I like aren't even really his, but simply libertarian principles. At the time of that post, and now, I believe it's more important to prevent the Republican party from straying even further from any sort of small-government platform than to expend effort worrying about Ron Paul. Voting Republican with the "warning" that big-government behavior won't be tolerated is a laughable fantasy. Only one currency matters: votes. Idle threats do not matter. Therefore I do what I can: vote against them.

427
06-19-2012, 11:16
No, what was the date on that post? I'm pretty sure it was long before Ron Paul evaporated from the race. If I was a Ron Paul supporter, I would've been supporting Ron Paul at the time.

I like most of RP's ideas. Most of his ideas that I like aren't even really his, but simply libertarian principles. At the time of that post, and now, I believe it's more important to prevent the Republican party from straying even further from any sort of small-government platform than to expend effort worrying about Ron Paul. Voting Republican with the "warning" that big-government behavior won't be tolerated is a laughable fantasy. Only one currency matters: votes. Idle threats do not matter. Therefore I do what I can: vote against them.
:rofl:
Does it matter what date it was? Were you lying then about your support for Obama, or are you lying now? You've had a lot posts trying to justify it.

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1406756&page=7

How many times are you going flip-flop?

series1811
06-19-2012, 11:17
If these are the best arguments the Truth Sqadders can come up with to keep O-Nothing, he is in real trouble.

wjv
06-19-2012, 11:22
Classic Ron Paulites. . .

If we can't have our way, we'll throw a hissy fit and sink the entire country. And you're not a conservative unless we say you are. . .

The typical Ron Paulite is beginning to sound like a bunch of 5 years olds who just lost at T-ball.

Go read the "Death of the LP" thread. . . That is the future of the LP.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 11:27
:rofl:
Does it matter what date it was? Were you lying then about your support for Obama, or are you lying now? You've had a lot posts trying to justify it.

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1406756&page=7

How many times are you going flip-flop?What are you talking about? My message at that time and today are the same. The fact that Ron Paul was in the race back then and now he's not has changed nothing. The idea that my voting for Obama is some sort of revenge for the Republicans torpedoing RP, or whatever, is nonsense. It's a vote to effect change. That's the reason people vote. I don't want the Republican party to stray futher from principles of small government, so I vote against them when they run a candidate who strays further from the principles of small government. How complicated is that to understand?

countrygun
06-19-2012, 11:28
There is no way I would have chosen Romney from the original candidates - just as there is no way I'd support Obama by voting for anybody (3rd party) other than Romney in the election.

Your rant is ridiculous. Many people wanted a better Republican candidate from the beginning and aren't proud that they have to vote for Romney to avoid electing Obama again. So? That's how out system works. I'll be voting Romney, knowing I don't really want him, but he is the lesser of evils. The only part I'm proud of is having the common sense to understand the danger of voting thrid party "on principle" and helping Obamma win again.

That is it in nutshell. IMO we have a lot of underground Obama supporters confusing younger idealistic voters that it is "being true to the Country", or some other bilge, to do something to get Obama reelected, than to bite the bullet by using Romney to get Obama out. The young are easily swayed by arguments of "standing on principle, no matter what the result" It gives them a warm, fuzzy feeling, and the closet Obamaoists play on that. The rest of us are taking the long known path of the lesser of two evils, because we know Obama is BY FAR the worst of two evils and we put our Country ahead of of patting ourselves on the back for getting him reelected to make ourselves feel a 'Principled"

Gundude
06-19-2012, 11:33
That is it in nutshell. IMO we have a lot of underground Obama supporters confusing younger idealistic voters that it is "being true to the Country", or some other bilge, to do something to get Obama reelected, than to bite the bullet by using Romney to get Obama out. The young are easily swayed by arguments of "standing on principle, no matter what the result" It gives them a warm, fuzzy feeling, and the closet Obamaoists play on that. The rest of us are taking the long known path of the lesser of two evils, because we know Obama is BY FAR the worst of two evils and we put our Country ahead of of patting ourselves on the back for getting him reelected to make ourselves feel a 'Principled"The other side of that coin is that when somebody feels Romney is the worse of the two evils, so they bite the bullet and vote Obama, you gotta respect it, correct?

427
06-19-2012, 11:34
What are you talking about? My message at that time and today are the same. The fact that Ron Paul was in the race back then and now he's not has changed nothing. The idea that my voting for Obama is some sort of revenge for the Republicans torpedoing RP, or whatever, is nonsense. It's a vote to effect change. That's the reason people vote. I don't want the Republican party to stray futher from principles of small government, so I vote against them when they run a candidate who strays further from the principles of small government. How complicated is that to understand?

It's not my idea, you're on record making those statements. I posted quotes and links backing the facts up.

Were you lying then, or are you lying now? Either way your credibility is in the toilet.

PawDog
06-19-2012, 11:39
:rofl:
Does it matter what date it was? Were you lying then about your support for Obama, or are you lying now? You've had a lot posts trying to justify it.

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1406756&page=7

How many times are you going flip-flop?

The Paulatarian cult was heavily infiltrated prior to the 2008 election by Democrats who's only actual goal was to pull votes away from the Republicans. This election year, their numbers have only grown, as is evidenced by the posts many cultists post here.

Paul himself has been courting the Marxist and Socialist left openly for the past couple of years; he aligned himself with the anti-American group Code Pink, providing campaign financing for one of their members in 2008, he co-sponsored a bill with liberal Socialist Barney Frank, where the "research" was paid for by George Soros' group Moveon.org.

Last month, Paul aligned himself with one of the most vocal Socialist Democrats in congress, Sheila Jackson Lee, again voicing support for a bill she sponsored.

Paul also openly supported the Occupy losers, and many of his cult members actively participated in the OWS protests for the past year.

As the old saying goes;

"You are known by the company you keep."

Gundude
06-19-2012, 11:41
It's not my idea, you're on record making those statements. I posted quotes and links backing the facts up.No, you haven't. You quoted me saying what I'm saying now: I will vote Obama to effect change in the Republican party. The Republican party is heading in the opposite direction from where I want them to go, and voting is the currency they understand.

Were you lying then, or are you lying now? Either way your credibility is in the toilet.Show me an actual contradiction and I'll address it.

mtnglide
06-19-2012, 11:50
Ask yourself one simple question. How many Supreme Court Justices do you think will be appointed by the man who wins in November?

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 11:51
No, you haven't. You quoted me saying what I'm saying now: I will vote Obama to effect change in the Republican party. The Republican party is heading in the opposite direction from where I want them to go, and voting is the currency they understand.

Show me an actual contradiction and I'll address it.

Just checking, but is there any chance that voting for Barry will send the message that he's the kind of candidate you'd like to keep seeing from the Democrats?

Seems to me, when you broadcast a message, you should consider how it will be received by all recipients.

427
06-19-2012, 11:53
No, you haven't. You quoted me saying what I'm saying now: I will vote Obama to effect change in the Republican party. The Republican party is heading in the opposite direction from where I want them to go, and voting is the currency they understand.

Show me an actual contradiction and I'll address it.

Then, March 9, 2012

A good thing for the country. If the only realistic alternative to Democrats is a Republican party whose only real difference from Democrats is a more authoritarian stance on sex, drugs, and religion, that's not good for the country.

Not long ago, I didn't think I could ever possibly vote for someone like Obama, but after all this discussion, it occurs to me that maybe I do just have to hold my nose and vote for somebody repulsive in order to help achieve an end. I mean, I really want him to win in a blowout, so it's kind of a cop-out to let everybody else do the dirty work.

And I have GTPI to thank for bringing me around. I wonder how many other Obama voters this forum created?

Now, earlier today.

It's weird, then, that me voting for "anybody but Romney" automatically means I'm 100% behind Obama to so many people in this thread.

I'm not, of course, but it's wasted time trying to convince them of that. The point I'm trying to make is that Romney won't be dragged to the right, because he won't have any motivation to. Once he knows he can still get your vote, even with his record, your desires for him to move right will mean absolutely nothing to him. Others, equally bad or worse than him, seeing the same thing, will then follow.

Here's your "actual contradiction." Were you lying then, or are you lying now?

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 11:56
Ask yourself one simple question. How many Supreme Court Justices do you think will be appointed by the man who wins in November?

3 of them are 75 or older. Ginsberg is 79, and has already had a serious health issue.

JBnTX
06-19-2012, 11:56
... I will vote Obama to effect change in the Republican party...



Here's the effect of your one vote for Obama:

1. Helped Obama get re-elected 99%
2. Caused change in the republican party 1%


..

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 11:59
...and that's why there will be no change in the order of the primaries. GOP elites are very satisfied with the candidates they've gotten because they're NOT conservative.

Is that why, or is it because no one has seriously tried?

Gundude
06-19-2012, 12:01
Then, March 9, 2012



Now, earlier today.



Here's your "actual contradiction." Were you lying then, or are you lying now?Reading comprehension, my friend:

It's weird, then, that me voting for "anybody but Romney" automatically means I'm 100% behind Obama to so many people in this thread.

I'm not [100% behind Obama], of course,
My vote is a vote against Romney. The "two-party rule" says to vote against Romney, I need to vote for Obama. This is the exact same "two-party rule" that everybody else is citing in their intention to vote for Romney, even though they don't like him.

I'm not 100% behind Obama. I'm probably not even 5% behind him. I'm voting for him because I'm 0% behind Romney.

Any more smoking guns you got for me?

Gundude
06-19-2012, 12:04
Here's the effect of your one vote for Obama:

1. Helped Obama get re-elected 99%
2. Caused change in the republican party 1%


..Of course, they're inseperable. It's not a protest vote in some "safe state". It's a vote with the full intention of getting Obama re-elected. Losing this election will cause change in the republican party. It's going to be an embarrassment, losing to such a weak person. Introspection will need to be done.

427
06-19-2012, 12:06
Reading comprehension, my friend:

My vote is a vote against Romney. The "two-party rule" says to vote against Romney, I need to vote for Obama. This is the exact same "two-party rule" that everybody else is citing in their intention to vote for Romney, even though they don't like him.

I'm not 100% behind Obama. I'm probably not even 5% behind him. I'm voting for him because I'm 0% behind Romney.

Any more smoking guns you got for me?

Credibility, you has none. :rofl:

Gundude
06-19-2012, 12:07
Credibility, you has none. :rofl:Mm, well done. :upeyes:

JBnTX
06-19-2012, 12:08
My vote is a vote against Romney.


There's no such thing as voting against a candidate.
Show me that option on any ballot. It doesn't exist.

Do you think a vote for Obama takes a vote away from Romney? Wrong!

A vote for Obama is a vote for Obama, nothing more and nothing less.
It will not cause any change in the republican party.

Voting for Obama puts you 100% in support of Obama.

Anything else is just a fantasy.

427
06-19-2012, 12:12
Mm, well done. :upeyes:
I'm glad you like it.

You've been an admitted Obama supporter since March, when Paul was still in the race. And you've been trying justify your support ever since.

Lethaltxn
06-19-2012, 12:16
Reading comprehension, my friend:

My vote is a vote against Romney. The "two-party rule" says to vote against Romney, I need to vote for Obama. This is the exact same "two-party rule" that everybody else is citing in their intention to vote for Romney, even though they don't like him.

I'm not 100% behind Obama. I'm probably not even 5% behind him. I'm voting for him because I'm 0% behind Romney.

Any more smoking guns you got for me?
You should come up for air, you're drowning.

JBnTX
06-19-2012, 12:16
... Losing this election will cause change in the republican party...


NO it will not cause change in the republican party.
It will only get us four more years of Obama.

More effective change in the republican party only has a chance if they win in November.

Don't listen to that crap about rewarding the republican party,
that comes from the anarchists and Ron Paul supporters.

For a chance at positive change the republicans must win in November. This will put more TEA party members in power in congress.

The American people have already sent a message of change to the republicans, and that change can only be realized if the republicans win.

whoflungdo
06-19-2012, 12:20
Of course, they're inseperable. It's not a protest vote in some "safe state". It's a vote with the full intention of getting Obama re-elected. Losing this election will cause change in the republican party. It's going to be an embarrassment, losing to such a weak person. Introspection will need to be done.


I disagree. If that were the case, they should of learned the lesson from McCain. They did not and put up someone who is just as bad or worse as McCain. I held my nose and voted for McCain. Looks like I'm going to have hold my nose and vote again. At this point, I'm a single issue voter. The SCOTUS...

Quigley
06-19-2012, 12:23
Here's your "actual contradiction." Were you lying then, or are you lying now?


I don't see the contradiction here. All he is saying is that he will not vote for Romney bc The GOP keeps electing the same type of person over and over and he is tired of it. By voting for Romney he is supporting this trend in the GOP and he won't stand for it. He would rather see Obama win this time around and maybe send the GOP a message that they need to change back to conservative values. I will not vote for Romney for this same reason, however I will not vote for BO either. Open your mind and vote for what you believe is right not the lesser of two evils because at the end of the day they are both evil. Neither candidate will do good for this country so vote for someone that you believe will. It doesn't matter if they win or not. All that matters is that at the end of the day you know what you did was right.

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Shadyscott69
06-19-2012, 12:27
Of course, they're inseperable. It's not a protest vote in some "safe state". It's a vote with the full intention of getting Obama re-elected. Losing this election will cause change in the republican party. It's going to be an embarrassment, losing to such a weak person. Introspection will need to be done.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-lhfc_kQ-2rA/TevmymkfHpI/AAAAAAAAAAQ/AfdeDb6X7UM/s1600/dont-cut-off-your-nose-to-spite-your-face.jpg

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 12:30
I don't see the contradiction here. All he is saying is that he will not vote for Romney bc The GOP keeps electing the same type of person over and over and he is tired of it. By voting for Romney he is supporting this trend in the GOP and he won't stand for it. He would rather see Obama win this time around and maybe send the GOP a message that they need to change back to conservative values. I will not vote for Romney for this same reason, however I will not vote for BO either. Open your mind and vote for what you believe is right not the lesser of two evils because at the end of the day they are both evil. Neither candidate will do good for this country so vote for someone that you believe will. It doesn't matter if they win or not. All that matters is that at the end of the day you know what you did was right.

Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine



If such a message were to be possibly received, don't you think they would have gotten it with McCain losing?


This whole concept of sending a message is a delusion based on a false sense of self importance.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 12:31
I'm glad you like it.

You've been an admitted Obama supporter since March, when Paul was still in the race. And you've been trying justify your support ever since.Well thank you for dropping your flip-flop accusation and testifying to my consistency. You can also see now that it has nothing to do with bitterness about Ron Paul dropping out of the race.

If you want to treat the words "voter" and "supporter" as synonymous, then yes, your statement is correct. I've intended to vote for Obama ever since it became obvious who the Republican candidate would be. The reasons for my intent have been repeatedly and consistently explained.

You may not agree with them, but the purpose of publishing them is to encourage others with the same philosophy to do likewise. I did come to the realization that if I want somebody to lose, I should vote for the other person, as unpleasant a task as that is. To refuse to vote while still hoping for a certain outcome is wrong.

So to those who feel they're unable to bring themselves to vote for Obama, think again. If you really don't care who wins, then not voting is fine. But if you're rooting for one or the other, to either win or lose, consider that it is your duty to help make that outcome a reality.

427
06-19-2012, 12:32
I don't see the contradiction here. All he is saying is that he will not vote for Romney bc The GOP keeps electing the same type of person over and over and he is tired of it. By voting for Romney he is supporting this trend in the GOP and he won't stand for it. He would rather see Obama win this time around and maybe send the GOP a message that they need to change back to conservative values. I will not vote for Romney for this same reason, however I will not vote for BO either. Open your mind and vote for what you believe is right not the lesser of two evils because at the end of the day they are both evil. Neither candidate will do good for this country so vote for someone that you believe will. It doesn't matter if they win or not. All that matters is that at the end of the day you know what you did was right.

Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

I guess I wasn't clear.

The contradiction is that Obama is the very antithesis of everything Paul supporters say they believe, yet they are willing to vote for Obama, to teach a lesson, to effect change.

What is right is voting Obama out of office.

SCmasterblaster
06-19-2012, 12:33
G20 owner Ted Nugent has endorsed Romney after getting a no new gun control pledge out of him.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 12:35
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-lhfc_kQ-2rA/TevmymkfHpI/AAAAAAAAAAQ/AfdeDb6X7UM/s1600/dont-cut-off-your-nose-to-spite-your-face.jpg
Wrong again. It's the lesser of two evils. If you have a cartoon of a guy choosing to get stabbed in the arm over getting shot in the face, go ahead and put that one up. I think it'll apply to almost everybody on this forum.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 12:38
I guess I wasn't clear.

The contradiction is that Obama is the very antithesis of everything Paul supporters say they believe, yet they are willing to vote for Obama, to teach a lesson, to effect change.It's because the choice is between Obama and Romney. Romney's worse. If there was a better choice (that mattered), I'd vote it over either of these guys in a heartbeat.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 12:41
G20 owner Ted Nugent has endorsed Romney after getting a no new gun control pledge out of him.Sweet, that and $1.50 will get him a cup of coffee somewhere.

But Obama pledged not to raise my taxes, so I'm actually gonna go with him instead.

427
06-19-2012, 12:41
Well thank you for dropping your flip-flop accusation and testifying to my consistency. You can also see now that it has nothing to do with bitterness about Ron Paul dropping out of the race.

If you want to treat the words "voter" and "supporter" as synonymous, then yes, your statement is correct. I've intended to vote for Obama ever since it became obvious who the Republican candidate would be. The reasons for my intent have been repeatedly and consistently explained.

You may not agree with them, but the purpose of publishing them is to encourage others with the same philosophy to do likewise. I did come to the realization that if I want somebody to lose, I should vote for the other person, as unpleasant a task as that is. To refuse to vote while still hoping for a certain outcome is wrong.

So to those who feel they're unable to bring themselves to vote for Obama, think again. If you really don't care who wins, then not voting is fine. But if you're rooting for one or the other, to either win or lose, consider that it is your duty to help make that outcome a reality.


First you say you're Paul supporter, now you say are an Obama supporter, the very and antithesis of Paul,- that is not consistancy, that's flip flopping. Then after admitting you're and Obama and admitting your Obama vote is to affect change in the GOP, you can't figure out why people think you are an Obama supporter, and the obsession with teaching a lesson.

What are you going to say next? Are you going to do a John Kerry and say: I was actually against Obama before I was for him?

Quigley
06-19-2012, 12:42
I just came up with a great analogy.

Take for example these two large countries the Red country and the Blue country. They are both very large and both own a good majority of the world. However there is this one small country, the White country, that neither of them own. So they both decide to go to War with each other to take ownership over the White country. Now the White country doesn't want to be owned by either the Reds or the Blues. It wants to maintain its own freedom. The Whites could decide to join in this War and side with the lesser of Two evils but it would much rather be independent. It doesn't really matter to the Whites that they are smaller and they stand a very good chance of being crushed by either of the Two larger countries. Instead the Whites stand up and fight for what is right. Regardless of weather they win or not.

This actually kind of sounds like a War that happened not too long ago doesn't it?


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427
06-19-2012, 12:42
Sweet, that and $1.50 will get him a cup of coffee somewhere.

But Obama pledged not to raise my taxes, so I'm actually gonna go with him instead.

Just like these Obama pledges, right?

--I promise 100% transparency in my administration..
--I promise NO NEW TAXES on a family making less than $250K a year..
--I will allow 5 days of public comment before I sign any bills..
--I will remove earmarks from PORK projects before I sign any bill..
--I will end Income Tax for seniors making less than $50K a year..
--"I will bring ALL of our troops home within ONE year."
--Ill put the Health Care negotiations on CSPAN so everyone can see who is at the table!.
--Ill have no lobbyists in my administration."
--"I'll close Guantanamo."
--"I'll resign if I don't cut the deficit in half by the end of four years."
--"I'll unite the people of this great country."

aircarver
06-19-2012, 12:43
Sweet, that and $1.50 will get him a cup of coffee somewhere.

But Obama pledged not to raise my taxes, so I'm actually gonna go with him instead.

So will they remain zero ... or negative ? .....:upeyes:

.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 12:44
Just like these Obama pledges, right?

--I promise 100% transparency in my administration..
--I promise NO NEW TAXES on a family making less than $250K a year..
--I will allow 5 days of public comment before I sign any bills..
--I will remove earmarks from PORK projects before I sign any bill..
--I will end Income Tax for seniors making less than $50K a year..
--"I will bring ALL of our troops home within ONE year."
--Ill put the Health Care negotiations on CSPAN so everyone can see who is at the table!.
--Ill have no lobbyists in my administration."
--"I'll close Guantanamo."
--"I'll resign if I don't cut the deficit in half by the end of four years."
--"I'll unite the people of this great country."Hmmm, you're correct. Pledges are worthless.

Acujeff
06-19-2012, 12:44
Ask yourself one simple question. How many Supreme Court Justices do you think will be appointed by the man who wins in November?


The important irreversible issue for gunowners is the Supreme Court. Four US Supreme Court Justices (Scalia, Kennedy , Breyer, and Ginsburg) are now over the age of 70 and three of them will be over the age of 80 by the end of Obama's second term. He could likely appoint 3 more Justices if he is re-elected. An anti-gun Court would be free to re-define and dismantle Heller and the RKBA out of existence. The current anti-RKBA Justices have already stated their intention to do exactly that.

Anti-Second Amendment Justice Ginsberg has stated that the majority opinions in this case are “grievously mistaken”, that minority opinions would be used to rewrite legal history and create a purely “collective right connected to the militia” and she looks forward to the day a “future, wiser court“ overturns Heller. John Paul Stevens recently told Time magazine the one thing in particular he would change about the American judicial system “I would change the interpretation of the Second Amendment. The court got that quite wrong.”


Obama and the Democratic majority Senate appointed anti-Second Amendment Justices Sotomayor and Kagan. All they need is one more like minded Justice to get a majority of five anti’s and implement their stated agenda through the courts. If that happens we’ll never see a pro-RKBA victory again in our lifetime.

Obama also appointed 125 anti-RKBA liberals to federal judgeships, including 25 to appellate courts. At present, there are 86 vacancies on district and appellate courts, 39 of which already have pending nominees before the Senate.

GW Bush was often categorized as “not pro-gun enough”, for making the same statement about the AWB as Romney, but he appointed two pro-RKBA Justices to the Supreme Court giving us the majority to win Heller and McDonald. The AWB was allowed to expire and much of our pro-RKBA legislation progress was during his administration.

If we want to protect the Second Amendment, we need to get a Republican in the White House and a pro-RKBA Republican majority and leadership in the Senate. Romney’s stated position is to appoint conservative Justices like Alito and Roberts, to the Supreme Court.

ted1
06-19-2012, 12:51
Exhibit A for the informed, deliberative American voter. :whistling:

I am a very informed voter I just don't have time to sit and type a book I have a family to take care of. So @#$$off if you have something else to say pm me.

Sent from my DROID RAZR

RC-RAMIE
06-19-2012, 12:55
Statistically, that would make them a pretty inconsequential faction...


.

I guess it would if you go with numbers Doc just makes up off the top of his head.

JFrame
06-19-2012, 12:57
I guess it would if you go with numbers Doc just makes up off the top of his head.


...Just making an assessment based on that comment... :)

Anyone else is free to conjecture whatever numbers they'd like also. :cool:


.

sbhaven
06-19-2012, 13:03
It's weird, then, that me voting for "anybody but Romney" automatically means I'm 100% behind Obama to so many people in this thread.

I'm not, of course, but it's wasted time trying to convince them of that. The point I'm trying to make is that Romney won't be dragged to the right, because he won't have any motivation to. Once he knows he can still get your vote, even with his record, your desires for him to move right will mean absolutely nothing to him. Others, equally bad or worse than him, seeing the same thing, will then follow.
You may not like Obama, but you are either voting to keep him in office, or your not.

You appear to want to keep him in office to punish the GOP (and by extension this country). It appears you want Obama to have the chance to nominate more progressive far left SCOTUS justices, possibly tilting the court for the next 20 years (or more).
No, you haven't. You quoted me saying what I'm saying now: I will vote Obama to effect change in the Republican party. The Republican party is heading in the opposite direction from where I want them to go, and voting is the currency they understand.
Then why vote for Obama? If you think Romney cannot be dragged to the right, then why do you assume the rest of the GOP will be dragged in the direction you want them to go by voting for Obama in November?

Despite claims by some to the contrary there is a difference between Obama and Romney. Will Romney being socialists and communists with him to the White House? Would he bypass congress as Obama did this past week? Would he play 100 rounds of golf while the economy burns? Would he nominate far left progressives to SCOTUS? Would he burn the investors/shareholders and bailout a company in a way to benefit the company's employee union? Does he openly attack the rich while hobnobbing with and collecting donations from Hollywood celebrities?

At the end of the day there will only be a few choices in November; Obama, Romney, third party/write in, or don't vote. Some voters will have to choose if they want Obama and the Democrats to continue his/their current course of destruction in hopes that someone better than Romney will run (and can garner enough votes) in 2016. Will Romney be better than Obama? Only thing I am certain of, we will never know if Obama gets a second term.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 13:03
First you say you're Paul supporter, now you say are an Obama supporter, the very and antithesis of Paul,- that is not consistancy, that's flip flopping. Then after admitting you're and Obama and admitting your Obama vote is to affect change in the GOP, you can't figure out why people think you are an Obama supporter, and the obsession with teaching a lesson.

What are you going to say next? Are you going to do a John Kerry and say: I was actually against Obama before I was for him?Paul will not be on the ballot, so voting for Obama instead of Paul isn't flip-flopping. It just goes to show how wide the chasm is between what I'd like and what I'm offered. I would normally hope the Republican nominee would be halfway between Paul and the Democrat. In this case, the Republican nominee is just under the Democrat, so the Democrat is next in line for my vote.

Teaching a lesson, as in "You lost this election because you fronted a candidate who goes against all the principles you're supposed to represent, so learn from it and do better next time" - Yes.

Teaching a lesson, as in "You robbed Ron Paul of his rightful chance to be President, I hate you, I'm voting for Obama" - No

I'm not saying there are no people who take that second stance. I'm just saying I don't. I don't have enough interest in Ron Paul to get emotional about it.

RC-RAMIE
06-19-2012, 13:19
Well thank you for dropping your flip-flop accusation and testifying to my consistency. You can also see now that it has nothing to do with bitterness about Ron Paul dropping out of the race.

If you want to treat the words "voter" and "supporter" as synonymous, then yes, your statement is correct. I've intended to vote for Obama ever since it became obvious who the Republican candidate would be. The reasons for my intent have been repeatedly and consistently explained.

You may not agree with them, but the purpose of publishing them is to encourage others with the same philosophy to do likewise. I did come to the realization that if I want somebody to lose, I should vote for the other person, as unpleasant a task as that is. To refuse to vote while still hoping for a certain outcome is wrong.

So to those who feel they're unable to bring themselves to vote for Obama, think again. If you really don't care who wins, then not voting is fine. But if you're rooting for one or the other, to either win or lose, consider that it is your duty to help make that outcome a reality.

Third option there is a 3rd party on all 50 state ballots.

Gundude
06-19-2012, 13:20
You may not like Obama, but you are either voting to keep him in office, or your not.

You appear to want to keep him in office to punish the GOP (and by extension this country). It appears you want Obama to have the chance to nominate more progressive far left SCOTUS justices, possibly tilting the court for the next 20 years (or more).It's not a vote to punish the GOP. The bottom line is I'd never vote for Romney. If it were just a matter of one candidate against the other, in a vacuum, I wouldn't vote at all. I wouldn't care which one won. What pushes me to Obama is the possibility of Romney losing big. Not as a punishment, but simply as a clear message that he's not the kind of candidate we want again in the future. Ever. This is a message to future candidates, early primary voters, party powerbrokers, everybody. The possibility of that message being delivered, even if slim, is just enough to push me from not voting at all to voting for Obama. To be clear: I don't think the country will be any worse off with Obama for another 4 years than with Romney, so I'm not choosing the worse candidate just to send that message. I see two equally bad candidates, but the potential to send that message makes Obama a hair better than Romney.

Then why vote for Obama? If you think Romney cannot be dragged to the right, then why do you assume the rest of the GOP will be dragged in the direction you want them to go by voting for Obama in November?

Despite claims by some to the contrary there is a difference between Obama and Romney. Will Romney being socialists and communists with him to the White House? Would he bypass congress as Obama did this past week? Would he play 100 rounds of golf while the economy burns? Would he nominate far left progressives to SCOTUS? Would he burn the investors/shareholders and bailout a company in a way to benefit the company's employee union? Does he openly attack the rich while hobnobbing with and collecting donations from Hollywood celebrities?I have no reason to believe he wouldn't do all those things, with maybe some names changed as far as which rich people he attacks and which rich people he takes money from, and which organizations benefit from his burning of investor/shareholders.

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 13:34
Sweet, that and $1.50 will get him a cup of coffee somewhere.

But Obama pledged not to raise my taxes, so I'm actually gonna go with him instead.

See, now that makes more sense than anything you've said so far. If there are things you like about Barry, and you think it will be better for you personally if he is president, I can respect that.

But this whole message sending thing is illogical to me. It makes no sense at all that the mysterious men behind the curtain will suddenly take notice of 10% of people voting for their guy or against there guy, and so must drastically change their ways is preposterous. After the innauguration, no one really cares about the number of votes they won by. They all claim a mandate and set about doing what they planned to do.

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 13:37
I guess it would if you go with numbers Doc just makes up off the top of his head.

I'm guessing just based off of my observations here and on a couple Paul sites.

I'd be real interested if you know of a poll that has more accurate numbers.

Acujeff
06-19-2012, 13:40
Romney is way more conservative than Obama. Gundude is a hypocrite in not applying his standards the same to Obama.

His arguments are delusional and infantile. A Republican win is much more likely to encourage more conservative Republicans to run in the future.

Most GT'ers don't appreciate his distortions and attacks to get us to vote against our own interests and liberty.

wjv
06-19-2012, 13:41
To be clear: I don't think the country will be any worse off with Obama for another 4 years than with Romney, so I'm not choosing the worse candidate just to send that message.

Then you're a fool.

As has been pointed out 10-20 times already in this thread, the Supreme Court (and other federal court appointments) has a HUGE and LONG LASTING impact on the future direction of this country.

If you seriously think that Obama's nominees will be no worse than Romney's nominees, then you are clueless. . .

Shadyscott69
06-19-2012, 13:49
Double

Acujeff
06-19-2012, 13:59
Gundude irrational arguments convince more folks to vote against Obama.

https://beatobama.us/

Lethaltxn
06-19-2012, 14:06
So let's distill Gdude's statement.

He'll vote for someone he doesn't like,in fact is the antithesis of what he claims to stand for, because he doesn't like the other guy who he claims is the antithesis of what he stands for; instead of voting third party, or not at all.

Now take two seconds to really think about that.

Mrs. Tink
06-19-2012, 15:44
His arguments are delusional and infantile. A Republican win is much more likely to encourage more conservative Republicans to run in the future.


I disagree. Look what keeps happening to more conservative Republicans. And I'm not talking about quasi-conservative statists like Santorum. I'm talking about people who actually believe in freedom and liberty, at all levels of government. They get pushed out by people who want statist interference in (name your sector of American life, be it the economy, your bedroom, etc.) and we get the same old, same old. Smushy RINOs like Romney win, ensuring not that more conservative Republicans win, but that more smushy RINOs run and win. What incentive do they have to be more conservative?

I don't know if I would go the same route as Gundude. But he's not delusional, nor is he infantile.

Ruble Noon
06-19-2012, 15:52
Romney is way more conservative than Obama.

Lol! You can't make this **** up. If you really believe that you'd better brace yourself because you're gonna' be fukked.

Cavalry Doc
06-19-2012, 16:52
Lol! You can't make this **** up. If you really believe that you'd better brace yourself because you're gonna' be **********

Tsk Tsk :shame:

wjv
06-19-2012, 16:53
Lol! You can't make this **** up. If you really believe that you'd better brace yourself because you're gonna' be fukked.

He did not say Romney is a conservative.

He said that Romney is more conservative than Obama, which is a true statement.

If you can't see that, then you're the one who is f'd. . . . . .