G20 Race Gun? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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uglyblackguns
06-20-2012, 14:26
Ok so like the title says would a G20 make a decent race gun? I have been upgrading my G20 with some tweak here and there and have looked into possibly making it a race gun. Haven't gone too crazy with it...yet. So do you think it would be crazy to do it with a G20 and just go and get a 17 or 34 and do it with those. Has anyone seen a 20 being used as a race gun and is the 10mm even a viable option to shoot in matches. I have recently got set up for reloading so I am not too worried about ammo. I have time on my side, I don't need to have this gun done anytime soon so I can work at my own pace and do most of the work myself. Any input would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

bac1023
06-21-2012, 02:45
Seems to me it would be a bit too slow to get back on target to compete well. :dunno:

Meathead9
06-21-2012, 11:16
Most guys that shoot Glocks in Open Class are running 9 Major Comp'd G17's. I'm sure you could build it up & still compete, you'll just have to do a TON of load development/spring calibration to get a comparably flat shooting 10mm round. Another member here, Boba Debt, built an open gun out of a G20LS.

uglyblackguns
06-21-2012, 13:54
Thanks for the info guys. I figured it would be a lot of work to go against 9mm and 40's but at least I have something good to spend my money on instead of just wasting it.:whistling:

EKUJustice
06-22-2012, 07:31
what division are you considering to be a "Race gun division"

uglyblackguns
06-22-2012, 08:48
I was thinking USPSA open division. There is a local club here that does all kinds of matches but that would be the end goal.

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VN350X10
06-29-2012, 19:58
An old member on here "Ditz" shot a 10MM open 20 for years, as the smaller guns just didn't fit his hands. We shot together until he moved, he is still a very high "B" shooter (sandbagger!) and on many occasions has beaten A, M & GM shooters. Like I said, sandbagger, like most guys in "B" in any division !
Load development & practice is the key. And if you decide to shoot s GSSF match, EVERYBODY pays attention when you're shooting a 10MM. It's like showing up at the local cruise night with a Ferrari or a real Cobra.


uncle albert

uglyblackguns
07-03-2012, 19:53
Thanks for feedback guys. Sounds like its going to be a challenge but I'm up for it. I think the load development will be fun.

Just picked up a Gen 2 G20 today so I think that will be my gun to build on. It feels a lot better without the finger groves. Like the Gen 2 20 was made for my hand.

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WeeWilly
07-03-2012, 22:11
...or a real Cobra.


uncle albert

I love that distiction, so true.

copo9560
07-05-2012, 21:04
Have you considered a 40 conversion barrel? With the heavy G20 slide, would seem recoil would pretty much disappear with leading to a very quick pistol. Please keep us posted of how this goes.

Flexmoney
07-13-2012, 07:13
A G20 makes a fantastic Limited division gun in USPSA (no optics or comps/ports).

VN350X10
07-13-2012, 15:42
Brian shot his G20 open gun quite well. Far better than most thought a Glock should shoot. No doubt about poppers going down !

Hey Kyle ! Hows it going ?

uncle albert

davsco
07-13-2012, 16:16
For fun, sure. To be competitive, probably not. Reduced magazine capacity and excessive recoil unless you load lite. Not to mention clocks are few and far between in open division.

VN350X10
07-13-2012, 18:21
No need to load lite. Solution is to practice with what you shoot !

Remember the equasion relates to Speed, Accuracy & Power !
When you shoot a serious calilber, the ENTIRE popper is your target zone, not just the calibration circle & above.....

uncle albert

agtman
07-14-2012, 05:53
Ok so like the title says would a G20 make a decent race gun? I have been upgrading my G20 with some tweak here and there and have looked into possibly making it a race gun. Haven't gone too crazy with it...yet. So do you think it would be crazy to do it with a G20 and just go and get a 17 or 34 and do it with those. Has anyone seen a 20 being used as a race gun and is the 10mm even a viable option to shoot in matches. I have recently got set up for reloading so I am not too worried about ammo. I have time on my side, I don't need to have this gun done anytime soon so I can work at my own pace and do most of the work myself. Any input would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Seems to me that a G20 long-slide, with a compensator, would pretty much get you there.

15+1 rds, long sight radius and highly controllable w/ hot loads ... Sounds like a 10mm race gun.

Meathead9
07-14-2012, 08:23
Seems to me that a G20 long-slide, with a compensator, would pretty much get you there.

15+1 rds, long sight radius and highly controllable w/ hot loads ... Sounds like a 10mm race gun.

A Race Gun, or USPSA Open Class gun, has a red dot sight so sight radius is a non issue. Most guys shooting race guns have 28ish round mags, so 15rds would put you at a distinct disadvantage. Also, the comp is what flattens the muzzle rise, so the extra slide mass doesn't really help either. Again, most guys that shoot open class are running lightened G17 slides, which helps speed up the cycling. More than likely you'd be running a 155gr bullet @ 1070-1100fps or a 135gr bullet @ 1225-1260 (only 165PF to make major) with something slow like W296/H110. I'm sure we all know that those bullets at those velocities are child's play in 10mm. I'm shooting a G20SF in limited Class, and like flex said, it's a great Limited gun. If you want to shoot a G20 in open class for fun it would probably work just fine, but it's a whole different story if you want to really compete.


.

agtman
07-14-2012, 19:05
A Race Gun, or USPSA Open Class gun, has a red dot sight so sight radius is a non issue. Most guys shooting race guns have 28ish round mags, so 15rds would put you at a distinct disadvantage. Also, the comp is what flattens the muzzle rise, so the extra slide mass doesn't really help either. ***

Yep, forgot about the RDS used in Open Class.

Plus, he could always attach those Arredondo +5 extentions on the G20 mags for 20+1.

:cool:

Meathead9
07-14-2012, 22:04
Yep, forgot about the RDS used in Open Class.

Plus, he could always attach those Arredondo +5 extentions on the G20 mags for 20+1.

:cool:

I'm running 20rd Arredondo's on my G20SF in Limited, which is on par with most Limited shooters. USPSA being a game, and the Open Class shooters being the ultimate gamers, being down 8+rds compared to the faster/flatter 9 Major & 38 Super would kind of defeat the purpose of shooting in Open. That's why Limited is such a good Class to shoot. I have the same capacity as guys running $4000 2011's, so it's a lot easier to stay competitive.

VN350X10
07-14-2012, 22:48
Even thou you might be down by several per mag, the reliability of a Glock & the usual incompetence of the reloading habits of the majority of Open shooters tends to level the field ! As soon as a .38 or 9 shooter has a malfunction & ejects 1-2 rounds correcting it, he's lost time & ammo capacity. Meanwhile, the Glock just keeps running.
I saw this in a match my son was shooting, using his G24 in open. 9Major wasn't legal yet, so he was the ONLY .40S&W cal gun in the match in Open. One stage stands out, 32 steel poppers, basicly a balls-out shooting stage. He finished 5th on that stage, behind 2 GM's, 1 M & 1 A shooter. Bad choice of where to make his mag change cost him 2 places. But his G24 never bobbled. He beat several GM's & M's, as well as everybody else. He was shooting UNCLASSIFIED at the time, not having enough matches scored to be classified (he's now a very high "B" shooter).
Bottom line....everybody behind him had ammo related gun malfunctions, due to sloppy reloading quality control. Most Open shooters get their "SUPERGUN" and think it's a cure all. So don't rule out a Glock as opposed to a 1911/2011 type pistol.
(I'm currently building him a 9Major based on a G34 type pistol, & have been experimenting with 9Major for almost 8 yrs. Use it in my Production G34 on heavy steel stages for R&D) Oh yeah, my "normal" 9mm production ammo runs a PF of about 148-150. We shoot real-world ammo, not gamer loads in anything. When I used to shoot my G20 in Production, I was using a load with a PF of 214 !

uncle albert

jp3975
07-14-2012, 23:03
Have you thought about 9x25dillon at all? Its a 10mm necked down to 9mm. Ive heard people say that with a proper comp, muzzle rise is virtually eliminated.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9%C3%9725mm_Dillon

VN350X10
07-14-2012, 23:27
And with the wrong comp, you might just shoot yourself in the foot with the 2nd round !

A great idea, back when .38 Stupid was the only game in town, but far over-powered for what was needed.
In a 10" Contender barrel, it would make an excellent hunting/varmint round.
Be a whole lot of fun in a 16 1/2" carbine barrel ! Easily powerful enough for coyote & small deer, given a proper bullet choice.

uncle albert

Fire_Medic
07-15-2012, 08:35
Even thou you might be down by several per mag, the reliability of a Glock & the usual incompetence of the reloading habits of the majority of Open shooters tends to level the field ! As soon as a .38 or 9 shooter has a malfunction & ejects 1-2 rounds correcting it, he's lost time & ammo capacity. Meanwhile, the Glock just keeps running.
I saw this in a match my son was shooting, using his G24 in open. 9Major wasn't legal yet, so he was the ONLY .40S&W cal gun in the match in Open. One stage stands out, 32 steel poppers, basicly a balls-out shooting stage. He finished 5th on that stage, behind 2 GM's, 1 M & 1 A shooter. Bad choice of where to make his mag change cost him 2 places. But his G24 never bobbled. He beat several GM's & M's, as well as everybody else. He was shooting UNCLASSIFIED at the time, not having enough matches scored to be classified (he's now a very high "B" shooter).
Bottom line....everybody behind him had ammo related gun malfunctions, due to sloppy reloading quality control. Most Open shooters get their "SUPERGUN" and think it's a cure all. So don't rule out a Glock as opposed to a 1911/2011 type pistol.
(I'm currently building him a 9Major based on a G34 type pistol, & have been experimenting with 9Major for almost 8 yrs. Use it in my Production G34 on heavy steel stages for R&D) Oh yeah, my "normal" 9mm production ammo runs a PF of about 148-150. We shoot real-world ammo, not gamer loads in anything. When I used to shoot my G20 in Production, I was using a load with a PF of 214 !

uncle albert

Don't overlook WSF for 9MM Major loads, thanks for the story it was very insightful.

Meathead9
07-15-2012, 08:49
Even thou you might be down by several per mag, the reliability of a Glock & the usual incompetence of the reloading habits of the majority of Open shooters tends to level the field ! As soon as a .38 or 9 shooter has a malfunction & ejects 1-2 rounds correcting it, he's lost time & ammo capacity. Meanwhile, the Glock just keeps running.
I saw this in a match my son was shooting, using his G24 in open. 9Major wasn't legal yet, so he was the ONLY .40S&W cal gun in the match in Open. One stage stands out, 32 steel poppers, basicly a balls-out shooting stage. He finished 5th on that stage, behind 2 GM's, 1 M & 1 A shooter. Bad choice of where to make his mag change cost him 2 places. But his G24 never bobbled. He beat several GM's & M's, as well as everybody else. He was shooting UNCLASSIFIED at the time, not having enough matches scored to be classified (he's now a very high "B" shooter).
Bottom line....everybody behind him had ammo related gun malfunctions, due to sloppy reloading quality control. Most Open shooters get their "SUPERGUN" and think it's a cure all. So don't rule out a Glock as opposed to a 1911/2011 type pistol.
(I'm currently building him a 9Major based on a G34 type pistol, & have been experimenting with 9Major for almost 8 yrs. Use it in my Production G34 on heavy steel stages for R&D) Oh yeah, my "normal" 9mm production ammo runs a PF of about 148-150. We shoot real-world ammo, not gamer loads in anything. When I used to shoot my G20 in Production, I was using a load with a PF of 214 !

uncle albert

I'm not saying to scrap Glocks period for Open Class, I'm just saying that the G17 makes for a more competitive gun. I have laid down stage scores in production that smoked M's & GM's in open & Limited, but do I consistently do that or place higher on the results page? Not so much. Everyone $h*ts the bed on a stage or two, or even a whole match every once in a while.

Either the M's & GM's you shot with were only M's & GM's of Classifiers, or trashed several stages in that particular match. If your son consistently beats M's & GM's (especially down 8rds), he should be Classified well above B class. That's pretty badass that you shoot 214PF Minor loads though.


.

agtman
07-15-2012, 16:50
Even thou you might be down by several per mag, the reliability of a Glock & the usual incompetence of the reloading habits of the majority of Open shooters tends to level the field ! As soon as a .38 or 9 shooter has a malfunction & ejects 1-2 rounds correcting it, he's lost time & ammo capacity. Meanwhile, the Glock just keeps running.
I saw this in a match my son was shooting, using his G24 in open. 9Major wasn't legal yet, so he was the ONLY .40S&W cal gun in the match in Open. One stage stands out, 32 steel poppers, basicly a balls-out shooting stage. He finished 5th on that stage, behind 2 GM's, 1 M & 1 A shooter. Bad choice of where to make his mag change cost him 2 places. But his G24 never bobbled. He beat several GM's & M's, as well as everybody else. He was shooting UNCLASSIFIED at the time, not having enough matches scored to be classified (he's now a very high "B" shooter).
Bottom line....everybody behind him had ammo related gun malfunctions, due to sloppy reloading quality control. Most Open shooters get their "SUPERGUN" and think it's a cure all. So don't rule out a Glock as opposed to a 1911/2011 type pistol.
(I'm currently building him a 9Major based on a G34 type pistol, & have been experimenting with 9Major for almost 8 yrs. Use it in my Production G34 on heavy steel stages for R&D) Oh yeah, my "normal" 9mm production ammo runs a PF of about 148-150. We shoot real-world ammo, not gamer loads in anything. When I used to shoot my G20 in Production, I was using a load with a PF of 214 !uncle albert

Love this part - a genuine 10mm-competitor all the way.

Not just gaming it with a ".40-level" load in a more expensive case ... :cool: