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DarkShooter
06-25-2012, 22:24
Im finally gonna work up some full power 10mm handloads for my stock Gen3 20. Ive previously only done FBI loads and 40's for my KKM Precision barrel.
Id like to get 1300fps with 180gr Gold Dots and XTP, and 1200fps with 200gr XTP and FMJ. These are max or near max loads from Speer #12 and Hornady #4 manuals.
Would I be ok with the stock barrel / recoil spring assembly, or should I get an aftermarket barrel/rsa right from the start? Im concerned about the brass smiles and havin a strong enough spring to prevent battering.
Im asking because these are max loads from the manuals, but milder than some loads ive seen suggested. Thx for the help.

TDC20
06-25-2012, 23:40
Those are my loadings for 180gr and 200gr XTP's, and I have shot them out of my stock G20 barrel at those velocities (1300 and 1200fps respectively). I do use a 22lb Wolff recoil spring. I would add that I have only done this with Long Shot and 800-X, and I use standard CCI#300 primers for the loads. So it may not work or be safe with other powder/primer combinations.

If you don't have a chrono, you should stick with book loads and in any case, work up carefully (0.2gr increments) to your max. I strongly suggest weighing every charge at these velocities, as small errors in thrown charges can cause big problems. Especially 800-X, since it doesn't meter well, needs to be weighed every charge.

The brass does get worked a bit more in the stock barrel, but as long as it isn't glock smiled (and I haven't yet had a glock smile from the loads I mentioned here) you can get several reloads from your brass at these velocities with little worry.

One other thing, the consensus is that 180gr Gold Dots over expand at 1300fps. 180 XTP's are good to go at that speed, though.

WeeWilly
06-25-2012, 23:47
I think you can reach those goals with the stock barrel. I run a 22lb and lately a 24lb captive ISMI RSA (from Glockmeister) when shooting at this level, no smiles ever. The springs seem to help keeping the slide off the frame and help with policing the brass, at the expense of greater felt recoil. For whatever reason the 24lb ISMI RSA seems to really change the recoil personality, it gets fairly jarring. Not full house 44RM jarring, but not the dreamy recoil the stock and to a lesser degree the 22lb spring provides.

I have settled on a more sedate 1225fps with 180XTP's as my everyday load. It gives me everything I want and with the 22lb spring, I still get a reasonable follow up and the frame is spared any battering.

Breadman03
06-26-2012, 06:49
180 grain Rainier HP over 7.5 grains of Unique from my stock G29 clocked at 1074 average. Out of a G20, that would probably be in the ballpark of 1150fps.

That 7.5 was near the starting load. At max published load, I should be near 1150 from my barrel with the Unique. I'm going to try some 2400 next time I go out, since I have some and Speer rates it better than Unique for the 10mm. My next purchase is going to be Longshot due to the recommendations here and elsewhere.

DarkShooter
06-26-2012, 08:53
Thanks for all the info. Im gonna order a 22lb rsa tonight, and get a pound of 800x locally. This seems like a great powder for the big 10.

Im gonna weigh every charge, just like handloading for my deer rifles when using stick powder, and slowly work up to max in the manual.


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DarkShooter
06-26-2012, 08:57
I got some 2400 on hand as well. Seems like it has the right qualities to be a good 10mm powder, but seems like not many use it. It meters great thru a measure too.


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WeeWilly
06-26-2012, 09:12
I got some 2400 on hand as well. Seems like it has the right qualities to be a good 10mm powder, but seems like not many use it. It meters great thru a measure too.


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I tried 2400 for the same reason, had some left laying around from my .357 loading days. I liked it a lot, for what ever reason, I got some of the best accuarcy, no weird flyers like back in the Model 19 days. The negative is I think the upside velocity wise is limited. Not as weak as faster powders, but decidedly below what a powder like 800x, AA#9, Blue Dot, etc. might deliver.

It is a fun caliber to load for, enjot it.

Yondering
06-26-2012, 09:24
I got some 2400 on hand as well. Seems like it has the right qualities to be a good 10mm powder, but seems like not many use it. It meters great thru a measure too.


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Sure, it's a great powder, except it's too slow and bulky. Max loads are based on case volume, and will be several hundred fps slower than Blue Dot, Longshot, or AA9.

Personally I'd skip 800X and get a powder that's easier to work with.

Taterhead
06-26-2012, 19:32
Personally I'd skip 800X and get a powder that's easier to work with.

100% Agreed.

Taterhead
06-26-2012, 20:37
Im finally gonna work up some full power 10mm handloads for my stock Gen3 20. Ive previously only done FBI loads and 40's for my KKM Precision barrel.
Id like to get 1300fps with 180gr Gold Dots and XTP, and 1200fps with 200gr XTP and FMJ. These are max or near max loads from Speer #12 and Hornady #4 manuals.
Would I be ok with the stock barrel / recoil spring assembly, or should I get an aftermarket barrel/rsa right from the start? Im concerned about the brass smiles and havin a strong enough spring to prevent battering.
Im asking because these are max loads from the manuals, but milder than some loads ive seen suggested. Thx for the help.


As with any barrel or platform setup, you can't know what is safe without doing careful load workups. I reduce the charge weights and work up in 0.2 - 0.3 grain increments. I load at least 5, and usually 10 at each charge weight to check for groups, function, and indications of excessive pressure. I also look for deviations on velocity, but that is down the list of concerns for pistol rounds. My practice is to shoot one round, collect the brass, inspect. Repeat.

As Murphy would have it, the one time I did not follow my normal loading and inspection process, I overlooked smiles. I got a bit lax. My powder increments were also bigger (0.5 grains). The next string the smiles were huge and primers were FLAT. I had shot a couple like that before noticing. I have never repeated that mistake. This was a load way below book max. It was with 800-X and 180 XTPs. All hand weighed and verified with check weights.

Bottom line, there is really no way to know what is safe without doing the workups - but that is true with an aftermarket barrel too. Things run differently in different setups. If you see smiles, you've gone too far.

1200 fps is attainable in my stock G20 with a 200 gr XTP over 13.0 grains of Accurate no. 9 (WLP primer) by following Hornady book data. That charge weight is between the maxes of Accurate Powders (12.5) and Hornady(13.2) published data.

DarkShooter
06-27-2012, 05:50
Guys thanks for the great advice. Gonna get started this weekend.


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WeeWilly
06-27-2012, 08:23
As with any barrel or platform setup, you can't know what is safe without doing careful load workups. I reduce the charge weights and work up in 0.2 - 0.3 grain increments. I load at least 5, and usually 10 at each charge weight to check for groups, function, and indications of excessive pressure. I also look for deviations on velocity, but that is down the list of concerns for pistol rounds. My practice is to shoot one round, collect the brass, inspect. Repeat.

As Murphy would have it, the one time I did not follow my normal loading and inspection process, I overlooked smiles. I got a bit lax. My powder increments were also bigger (0.5 grains). The next string the smiles were huge and primers were FLAT. I had shot a couple like that before noticing. I have never repeated that mistake. This was a load way below book max. It was with 800-X and 180 XTPs. All hand weighed and verified with check weights.

Bottom line, there is really no way to know what is safe without doing the workups - but that is true with an aftermarket barrel too. Things run differently in different setups. If you see smiles, you've gone too far.

1200 fps is attainable in my stock G20 with a 200 gr XTP over 13.0 grains of Accurate no. 9 (WLP primer) by following Hornady book data. That charge weight is between the maxes of Accurate Powders (12.5) and Hornady(13.2) published data.

Really excellent advice.

GotFour
06-27-2012, 20:14
I've gotten rather used to all of my fingers and my blue eyes......you might get away with pushing the 10's limits on your not fully supported chamber, then again you might not. I shoot my reloads in a KKM barrel in which I have total confidence. $250 or so for an after market barrel will buy a lot more insurance than obamacare :supergrin:

SDGlock23
06-28-2012, 19:39
Book max load (9.5gr) of Longshot will get you close to if not over 1300 fps w/180gr. I'm not a fan of "full power" 10mm in a stock barrel, since even some load that aren't even considered warm begin to bulge the brass pretty good. The 9.5gr Longshot load does well and the case bulge is there for sure, but not horrendous.

CanyonMan
06-28-2012, 19:50
Book max load (9.5gr) of Longshot will get you close to if not over 1300 fps w/180gr. I'm not a fan of "full power" 10mm in a stock barrel, since even some load that aren't even considered warm begin to bulge the brass pretty good. The 9.5gr Longshot load does well and the case bulge is there for sure, but not horrendous.


Hey brother, I guess I am going to have to just jump in and finally try the LS powder with you other guys here. All I seem to read over here any more is LS LS LS, so Since I already have a pound I guess tomorrow I'll finally try it out.

(9.4/9.5) seems to be pretty standard from all I see here all the time, if I am wrong I can use some input from y'all on the LS powder with 180gr and 200gr XTP's and HC bullets as well.



I'll let y'all know how it goes. But what seems to be the favorite load with LS in the 180 gr and 200gr XTP's ?



Thanks
Stay safe amigo







CM

WeeWilly
06-28-2012, 20:02
I liked Longshot a lot, I have even taken to using it in other calibers like 9mm. I think it might be one of the most cost effective powders for 10mm.

I didn't get to 1300fps with max book LS loads (9,5gr) out of my stock barrel using 180gr Hornaday HAP's. I was running WLP primers, so maybe had I used dedicated magnum primers (like CCI 350), maybe I would have gotten there. IIRC my best averages were like 1260fps.

I could get to 1300fps but it was over the line some, no smiles or excess bulges out of the stock barrel.

Taterhead
06-28-2012, 20:41
Book max load (9.5gr) of Longshot will get you close to if not over 1300 fps w/180gr. I'm not a fan of "full power" 10mm in a stock barrel, since even some load that aren't even considered warm begin to bulge the brass pretty good. The 9.5gr Longshot load does well and the case bulge is there for sure, but not horrendous.

Interesting. In my testing, 9.5 gr Longshot under a 180 XTP only gets about 1190 fps in my G20. I was a bit surprised by that.

_The_Shadow
06-28-2012, 22:20
My test with the 9.4 grains of LongShot, Rem 2 1/2 LP over the 200XTP, from the S&W1006 22lb RSA, yielded 1240-1250 fps from the G-29 factory bbl 21lb Wolff RSA, yielded 1177-1190 fps.

CanyonMan
06-29-2012, 10:11
OK gentelman,

So any one put 9.4/9.5grs of LS under the 180gr XTP in a stock barrel G20/G29 and if you did what did you get ????

I am trying to pick some brains here as time is something I ain't got "right now," and save myself some bench time.. ;)


Mucho thanks ! ;)






CM

DarkShooter
06-29-2012, 10:21
Thanks everyone. So much great information and advice for a 10mm FNG!


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Cwlongshot
06-29-2012, 10:30
I have been loading Blie Dot and to a lesser extent 800X. Reciently I began shooting Longshot. The max powder charge from my gun is no issue.

From my 6" barrel I wanna see 1300+ from a 200g.

CW

_The_Shadow
06-29-2012, 12:19
OK gentelman,

So any one put 9.4/9.5grs of LS under the 180gr XTP in a stock barrel G20/G29 and if you did what did you get ????

I am trying to pick some brains here as time is something I ain't got "right now," and save myself some bench time.. ;)


Mucho thanks ! ;)
CM

Hello Canyon Man, I have loaded 9.4 grains under the Hornady 200 XTP's of LongShot using CCI300 in various brass to test the 1240 fps loadings of SwampFox ammo. if you look for the tribute I did to Mike Willard after he died I obtained some of his ammo and pulled it down to verify this load that we actually discussed right hee on GT.

The results were as follows...

Did a little test today (1/25/12) using the SwamFox 9.4 grain ofLongShot with 200 grain Hornady XTP's loading...

1) S&W 1006 22lbs RSA velocity 1260 - 1280 fps, itexpanded to 0.4295".

2) Glock-29 factory bbl 21lb Wolff RSA @ 1177 fps "used" Hornady casing expanded to 0.430".

I also tested the 9.4 grains of IMR800X with very simular results maybe even slightly better with the shorter bbl G29 :supergrin:

GotFour
06-29-2012, 13:19
I have been loading Blie Dot and to a lesser extent 800X. Reciently I began shooting Longshot. The max powder charge from my gun is no issue.

From my 6" barrel I wanna see 1300+ from a 200g.

CW

I was able to get 1320 out of my 6" KKM using 9.3 grns of 800X over a 200grn XTP before I had the barrel Mag-Na-Ported.......1290 after. This load didn't produce any adverse pressure signs in my G-20. Lots of folks don't like the way 800X meters but if you throw individual loads like I do its no big deal. ......proceed with caution

CanyonMan
06-29-2012, 14:28
Hello Canyon Man, I have loaded 9.4 grains under the Hornady 200 XTP's of LongShot using CCI300 in various brass to test the 1240 fps loadings of SwampFox ammo. if you look for the tribute I did to Mike Willard after he died I obtained some of his ammo and pulled it down to verify this load that we actually discussed right hee on GT.

The results were as follows...

Did a little test today (1/25/12) using the SwamFox 9.4 grain ofLongShot with 200 grain Hornady XTP's loading...

1) S&W 1006 22lbs RSA velocity 1260 - 1280 fps, itexpanded to 0.4295".

2) Glock-29 factory bbl 21lb Wolff RSA @ 1177 fps "used" Hornady casing expanded to 0.430".

I also tested the 9.4 grains of IMR800X with very simular results maybe even slightly better with the shorter bbl G29 :supergrin:



Hey Shadow, I was begining to get lonely over here ! haha.

Hope all is well with you amigo !

Thanks for the information man. It looks like the 9.4/9.5gr LS is about the most popular loading with both 180gr and 200gr XTP's so far.

I guess I will go ahead then with the 9.4/9.5grs in the G20 with 180gr XTP. I have a Steel rod and a ISMI 22# spring in there and stock spring in the G29.

I have been running 11.0grs BD in the G29 stock barrel/spring, with 180gr XTP with NO issues of any kind at all. I just thought i'd try the LS and see if It changed anything here, and would meet my needs better than the BD I like so much.

I appreciate it my friend, and I'll start there since it seems so many others are having nothing but good results.

I just didn't know if these 'good results" were out of stock or AM barrels..

Not being lazy, but just have NOT EVEN had time to look up old threads or research much. Wanted a quick jump start here on the LS from guys I trust, and whip out a few and have a looksee. I figured these loads with the LS even over the max book allowed loads would still be fine, just wanted to make sure in my "hurry hurry life" at "present" that I was reading all this correctly.

Again, I appreciate it Shadow, and anything else you ole boys want to toss in... I am all ears. ;)



Stay safe !


Thanks again....!








CM

DarkShooter
06-29-2012, 19:54
I like where this thread is going. Lots of great info from experienced 10mm/G20 shooters. What ive learned so far-

Im thinkin Longshot is the way to go, everyone seems to agree its a great powder for these velocities, and it was used to load Swampfox ammo. Sounds like a winner.

800X also does great, but each charge has to be weighed due to it being a poor shape for runnin thru a powder measure.

Blue Dot is the old standby, and Accurate #9 has some fans too.

Wow I got a lot of loads to work up!

_The_Shadow
06-29-2012, 21:51
I like where this thread is going. Lots of great info from experienced 10mm/G20 shooters. What ive learned so far-

Im thinkin Longshot is the way to go, everyone seems to agree its a great powder for these velocities, and it was used to load Swampfox ammo. Sounds like a winner.

800X also does great, but each charge has to be weighed due to it being a poor shape for runnin thru a powder measure.

Blue Dot is the old standby, and Accurate #9 has some fans too.

Wow I got a lot of loads to work up!

Have fun, most of us have for years, since early 1990 for me with 10mm! Still learning too! :supergrin: I started with Blue Dot before published loads were out for this cartridge and there was as much internet back then!

Taterhead
06-29-2012, 22:44
OK gentelman,

So any one put 9.4/9.5grs of LS under the 180gr XTP in a stock barrel G20/G29 and if you did what did you get ????

I am trying to pick some brains here as time is something I ain't got "right now," and save myself some bench time.. ;)


Mucho thanks ! ;)






CM

Hi CM,

Good to see you back roaming around GT again.

I have loaded up to 9.5 grains of Longshot under a 180 XTP. It only yields about 1190 fps from my G20. CCI 300 for that one. Hope that helps.

EDIT:

So far, I have not found any advantage with Longshot over Blue Dot with book data and XTPs - at leas in my setup. Sticking with Hornady load data for BD and 180 XTPs, they are running about 1215 fps at a couple tenths less than max. Nice clean burn and great groups too.

CanyonMan
06-30-2012, 08:44
Hi CM,

Good to see you back roaming around GT again.

I have loaded up to 9.5 grains of Longshot under a 180 XTP. It only yields about 1190 fps from my G20. CCI 300 for that one. Hope that helps.

EDIT:

So far, I have not found any advantage with Longshot over Blue Dot with book data and XTPs - at leas in my setup. Sticking with Hornady load data for BD and 180 XTPs, they are running about 1215 fps at a couple tenths less than max. Nice clean burn and great groups too.



Hey amigo, just now having a tad of room to breathe, we had a ruff afternoon/evening/night around here yesterday.

Well I have had some good advice on LS from you guys, and Shadow was helpful as well with some load data.

Reading your post here, and "now" this morning having the time to "hit the books" and my load data notes, and all, I think I will stick with my beloved BD on these 180/200gr bullets and especially cast where I am getting 1300fps, old faithful saddle bag stand by... I may pop a few LS's and see, but I believe your right from what I am seeing (on paper at least) this morning about the BD.

I use 11.0grs BD with the 180gr, and 10.5 grs with the 200gr (BD) A tad over Hornady Max, but have had VERY good results with these for a long time out of stock and AM barrels. Getting plenty good enough vels with a XTP, (which is just a "in town" bullet, and really sweet with HC bullet which are my "main staple out here" any way..

Yep, you helped a great deal, and my thanks amigo and to Shadow and others as well....

Good to have friends ! ;)



THANKS ALL !



Y'all stay safe.
Gotta run again! :faint:







CM

DarkShooter
07-02-2012, 17:19
No time to handload this weekend, due to bein called out to my second job. But, a few boxes of Underwood 200gr XTP ammo came in, and I was able to spend a short time at a nearby range.

Wow this stuff is impressive! I really don't think I need to explain it to you veterans! Very accurate too. I policed the brass, and took some measurements after I got home.

First of all, the OAL of loaded cartridges is very consistent.
There was only .002 difference in an entire box of 50.
All measured between 1.256 - 1.258

The web on the unfired cartridges (Starline brass) measured between .4213 - .4215.
Hornady 4th Edition manual lists .423 as nominal diameter.

The web on the fired cartridges measured between .4325 -.4330. No visible bulging or smiles.

Two rounds did smile, and they measured .4349 and .4350.

30 rounds were fired total.

Just to be safe, I am gonna get an aftermarket barrel, probally KKM because im happy with the quality of my .40 barrel from them. I already got a Wolf 22lb spring/guide rod on the way. Im very impressed by this cartridge, and the quality of Underwood ammo. I will be getting more. I know all this is a lil off topic, but wanted to share what I found out.

Cwlongshot
09-20-2012, 18:16
So far I have shot 9.0 of Longshot and a 200XTP at max OAL with zero pressure signs... Loaded 9.2 and 9.5 tonight to try next...

Also loaded 10.5 and 10.7 behind a 175g Silver tip again at max OAL.

6" KKM G20.

CW

nickE10mm
09-21-2012, 11:51
Personally I'd skip 800X and get a powder that's easier to work with.

Knowing what alternatives exist, I would do the same thing. Longshot, Blue Dot and AA9 are FAR better choices for heavy loads if you ask me.

nickE10mm
09-21-2012, 11:52
So far I have shot 9.0 of Longshot and a 200XTP at max OAL with zero pressure signs... Loaded 9.2 and 9.5 tonight to try next...

Also loaded 10.5 and 10.7 behind a 175g Silver tip again at max OAL.

6" KKM G20.

CW

CW, just so you know ... I get 1325fps AVERAGE from a 6" KKM or 6" Fusion .... CCI300, 200gr XTP, new starline, 1.26" using 9.4gr Longshot. Be careful with this workup, as you know.

For readers who don't realize this, this load is more than 2 grains OVER Hornady max.... Its on YOU if something happens ;)

I settled on 9.0gr LS as a safer alternative to wanting more power from a 200gr XTP.

Cwlongshot
09-21-2012, 18:45
CW, just so you know ... I get 1325fps AVERAGE from a 6" KKM or 6" Fusion .... CCI300, 200gr XTP, new starline, 1.26" using 9.4gr Longshot. Be careful with this workup, as you know.

For readers who don't realize this, this load is more than 2 grains OVER Hornady max.... Its on YOU if something happens ;)

I settled on 9.0gr LS as a safer alternative to wanting more power from a 200gr XTP.


ABSOLUTELY!! Its uncharted territory!

SO far ZERO pressure signs at 9.0g... BUT I am yet to chronograph these higher loadings. I was 1250 or so at 8.5 IIRC.
My "target" is 1300fps with good accuracy. For me that will be 2" at 50 yards. All loads so far are at least that good accuracy wise.

I also have a 5.5" ported LWD barrel. I'll back it down a grain or so and work back up in that one later if I dont get what I want here.

I also have #9, and 800X to try if needed. I'm hoping LongShot does what I expect it to...

Thanks for the tip!

CW

TDC20
09-21-2012, 23:26
So far I have shot 9.0 of Longshot and a 200XTP at max OAL with zero pressure signs... Loaded 9.2 and 9.5 tonight to try next...

Also loaded 10.5 and 10.7 behind a 175g Silver tip again at max OAL.

6" KKM G20.

CW
CW, what is your velocity goal for the 175gr Silvertips? 10.5 and 10.7gr of Longshot is very very potent. I use 9.7 gr. of Longshot with CCI#300 at 1.255" to get a 180XTP to 1400fps from my 6" LWD barrel and 1300fps from the stock G20 barrel. Measuring case head expansion from this load indicates that this is a safe but full power loading in my gun. That means I retire the brass to light-moderate range loadings after 2 loads at this level.

Based on my results with Longshot, I would advise you to seriously consider loading a few lighter rounds, starting no higher than 9.5 - 9.8 gr. range and work up from there if you need to. I wouldn't expect to get much more than 1400fps safely from a 5.5" barrel with the 175gr Silvertips. For the sake of safety, it's wise to begin with a reasonable velocity goal and work up to that in 0.2gr increments.

Good luck and be safe!

Cwlongshot
09-22-2012, 09:36
I did not set a goal on the Silvertips, it was kinda a afterthought. But I know 1400 is pretty easy to attain with the longer barrel.

The chrono numbers I have gotten so far have been slow, but as I said, accuracy is there power is "enough". ;)

CW

DarkShooter
09-23-2012, 16:07
This thread is full of great info for someone just starting out, like me.

Mods, maybe sticky material since so many noob questions have been answered with sound advice?

Ive been busy with work all summer, but finally found time to work up & test a couple loads.

Ive settled on 200gr XTP, Winchester brass and WLP with 9.0gr Blue Dot and 12.6gr AA#9. OAL 1.260. Both these loads are from the Hornady 8th edition.

Im getting an honest 1100 fps average with the stock rsa/barrel, and a bit higher with 22lb spring/kkm barrel. I know these are not remarkable loads, but they are accurate and 100% reliable, and more powerful than the FBI loads im used to.

I plan on working up to book max (9.4gr BD/13.2 AA#9) when I get more time, but I am pretty happy with what I got now.

arthury
11-15-2012, 15:20
The Glockmeister captive 22lb spring kit was mentioned on page 1 of this thread ...

Question:
Since there's a screw that is used in the assembly of the rod and the spring, did you guys have an encounters where the screw gets loosened after a certain number of discharges?

dm1906
11-15-2012, 23:17
The Glockmeister captive 22lb spring kit was mentioned on page 1 of this thread ...

Question:
Since there's a screw that is used in the assembly of the rod and the spring, did you guys have an encounters where the screw gets loosened after a certain number of discharges?

Blue Loc-Tite. 10K rounds, not loose.

ds7br
11-16-2012, 11:59
I've run 9.7 of Longshot with the 180XTP and Nosler HP 180 and 9.3 of Longshot with the 200 XTP.
Starline brass
CCI 300 primer
STORM LAKE barrel with tight chamber
Wolf rod and 22# spring.
These loads were worked up to SLOWLY and cases measured at the pressure ring for expansion. I wouldnt run them in my factory barrel just to be on the safe side.
The 10mm seems to be a very adaptable to load for as long as you use some restraint and dont go stupid.
Dennis

SDGlock23
11-20-2012, 10:13
When I loaded for the 10mm I would often use 9.5gr Longshot w/180gr bullets. I tried some at 9.7gr and it actually reduced velocity instead of increasing it. However, that could just be my batch of powder. I would get about 1260-1270 fps from the stock G20sf with the 9.5gr load using jacketed 180gr bullets.

As for the guy loading 10.5-10.7gr Longshot with the 175gr Silvertip....be very careful with that. The KKM barrel will give you the extra support you need, but in my option, the 175gr is essentially 180gr so if you increase powder, do so very slightly. 10.0gr sounds a little more safe, and that's still probably a little high pressure wise. Just exercise caution and work up starting at maybe 9.7gr. I've ran 9.7gr Longshot w/175gr Silvertip and I think it got me close to, if not over 1300 fps from the stock G20sf.

ModGlock17
11-27-2012, 18:38
...
I've ran 9.7gr Longshot w/175gr Silvertip and I think it got me close to, if not over 1300 fps from the stock G20sf.

I saw diminishing return with LS between 9.0 - 9.3gr for 180gr, using CCI 350. I'd target 9.0gr essentially reserving 0.3gr for error which is unlikely to be > 0.1 gr.




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nickE10mm
11-27-2012, 22:29
I saw diminishing return with LS between 9.0 - 9.3gr for 180gr, using CCI 350. I'd target 9.0gr essentially reserving 0.3gr for error which is unlikely to be > 0.1 gr.




Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire (http://www.outdoorhub.com/mobile/)

In my experience with LS, there is a point of diminishing returns at 9.2-9.5gr when working up 180gr bullets ... and at 8.2gr-8.6gr with 200gr workups... You can get over the "hump" but none of us have pressure equipment so make your own deductions. :)

arthury
11-29-2012, 18:22
One thing to bear in mind when exploring loads beyond the published max in manuals is to go back to the concept of the Pressure/Time curve; whereby the y-axis is the pressure and the x-axis is the time.

The curve of the powder with respect to a cartridge should be pretty similar under the same dimensions. Beyond the known peak pressure, things tend to be non-linear.

That's where things become hairy and unpredictable. So, be careful.

gator378
12-02-2012, 17:29
Im finally gonna work up some full power 10mm handloads for my stock Gen3 20. Ive previously only done FBI loads and 40's for my KKM Precision barrel.
Id like to get 1300fps with 180gr Gold Dots and XTP, and 1200fps with 200gr XTP and FMJ. These are max or near max loads from Speer #12 and Hornady #4 manuals.
Would I be ok with the stock barrel / recoil spring assembly, or should I get an aftermarket barrel/rsa right from the start? Im concerned about the brass smiles and havin a strong enough spring to prevent battering.
Im asking because these are max loads from the manuals, but milder than some loads ive seen suggested. Thx for the help.

For max loads get a good aftermarket barrel. I went through two glock barrels on my g 20. Finally got a Barstow and never had smiley since. Do not like Glock barrels or would use one. Better barrels out there

BenKeith
12-18-2012, 18:46
I load Blue Dot with standard CCI primers and 180 grain Golden Sabers for my PD load. With the Glock barrel, they average 1260 fps, with the 6" LW barrel they average 1350 fps. I will not say how much Blue Dot because there's not a book in the country that's going to show a load with as much as I'm using. I also use a 22 lb spring with them. I've shot approx 100 of these loads, spread out over different temps and weather conditions and feel pretty confident they are good for a full clip if needed but it's not a load I would pratice with. I only load these in new brass and not sure how much the gun could handle it over the long term. Primer's and brass still look good after firing but they do have a little recoil.

180 is as heavy as I've loaded, so can't say for

nickE10mm
12-18-2012, 20:16
I load Blue Dot with standard CCI primers and 180 grain Golden Sabers for my PD load. With the Glock barrel, they average 1260 fps, with the 6" LW barrel they average 1350 fps. I will not say how much Blue Dot because there's not a book in the country that's going to show a load with as much as I'm using. I also use a 22 lb spring with them. I've shot approx 100 of these loads, spread out over different temps and weather conditions and feel pretty confident they are good for a full clip if needed but it's not a load I would pratice with. I only load these in new brass and not sure how much the gun could handle it over the long term. Primer's and brass still look good after firing but they do have a little recoil.

180 is as heavy as I've loaded, so can't say for

I'd say 11.2-11.5gr would make your stated vels... nice load.

Taterhead
12-18-2012, 20:22
I load Blue Dot with standard CCI primers and 180 grain Golden Sabers for my PD load. With the Glock barrel, they average 1260 fps, with the 6" LW barrel they average 1350 fps. I will not say how much Blue Dot because there's not a book in the country that's going to show a load with as much as I'm using. I also use a 22 lb spring with them. I've shot approx 100 of these loads, spread out over different temps and weather conditions and feel pretty confident they are good for a full clip if needed but it's not a load I would pratice with. I only load these in new brass and not sure how much the gun could handle it over the long term. Primer's and brass still look good after firing but they do have a little recoil.

180 is as heavy as I've loaded, so can't say for

Just a guess, but I imagine that those loads burn pretty clean at those pressures. Blue Dot cleans up nicely the more you stoke the furnace. Pretty loud report too, I would bet!

I haven't quite worked up to your velocities, but I have fed my G20 quite a few 180 XTPs @ 1215 fps with Blue Dot. My loads were "on book" though. Nick is probably correct with his charge weight prognostication.

BenKeith
12-19-2012, 21:02
You're good, ll.4. Going by pressure signs, or lack of, I might could go a little more, but why push it and beat the crap out of the gun. It that load won't stop em, I need a lot bigger gun, not just a hotter load.

Yes, they burn extremely clean. When I first started loading for it, I was told Blue Dot was a very dirty powder. I was actually suprised how clean it burns after reading all the comments about BD.

nickE10mm
12-19-2012, 21:08
You're good, ll.4. Going by pressure signs, or lack of, I might could go a little more, but why push it and beat the crap out of the gun. It that load won't stop em, I need a lot bigger gun, not just a hotter load.

Yes, they burn extremely clean. When I first started loading for it, I was told Blue Dot was a very dirty powder. I was actually suprised how clean it burns after reading all the comments about BD.

Agreed, find a load in your power range preference then re-work up the load for ACCURACY .. :-)

storm2844
12-23-2012, 01:28
Hi i have a question i have a new gen3 g20 (completely stock) i went to the range the other day with some reloads
180g xtp's
9.2g longshot
Win brass
Wlp primers
They were moving at 1340fps through my crony 9.4g longshot gave about the same. 9.2 had no over pressure signs at all 9.4 had some scratches on the case and burr on the head were the extractor goes.
Does this velocity sound right to you guys? Overpressure?
I checked my chony with a known load and all was good.
Thanks

Taterhead
12-25-2012, 19:51
Hi i have a question i have a new gen3 g20 (completely stock) i went to the range the other day with some reloads
180g xtp's
9.2g longshot
Win brass
Wlp primers
They were moving at 1340fps through my crony 9.4g longshot gave about the same. 9.2 had no over pressure signs at all 9.4 had some scratches on the case and burr on the head were the extractor goes.
Does this velocity sound right to you guys? Overpressure?
I checked my chony with a known load and all was good.
Thanks

That load runs quite a bit slower in my G20 (1180 fps), but it is otherwise a decent load with no indications of excessive pressure.

I wonder if you mean where the ejector goes? Scratches, nicks and dings are normal. A warm load smacks into the ejector pretty hard. The case then can bang the corner of the slide on its way out. A photo or two, or at least a bit better desription of the burrs and scratches can let us know for sure.

TDC20
12-26-2012, 01:04
Hi i have a question i have a new gen3 g20 (completely stock) i went to the range the other day with some reloads
180g xtp's
9.2g longshot
Win brass
Wlp primers
They were moving at 1340fps through my crony 9.4g longshot gave about the same. 9.2 had no over pressure signs at all 9.4 had some scratches on the case and burr on the head were the extractor goes.
Does this velocity sound right to you guys? Overpressure?
I checked my chony with a known load and all was good.
ThanksI used 9.3gr with a CCI#300 primer and a 1.255" OAL and got around 1250fps with the stock barrel and a 22lb spring. So, you're definitely hotter with the WLP's and your lot of Longshot. You didn't mention your OAL, so that could have an effect on the velocity/pressure. The ejector burrs are normal when you've reached full power. I agree with what Taterhead said, I think it has more to do with slide velocity from hot loads than anything else.

Personally, I wouldn't go any higher with your lot of Longshot, since you are getting excellent performance where you are at. You may have to back off a little if you start seeing Glocksmiles.

I measure pressure using case head expansion. My somewhat arbitrary case head expansion limit standard had me stop at 1295fps from the stock G20 barrel, but with CCI#300 primers and my lot of Longshot. The powder charge was higher than yours.

storm2844
12-26-2012, 03:10
Cool thank you guys for all the info my col is 1.250 i actually downloaded it quite a bit to 8.8g and a col of 1.255 i gotta make it out to the range here to try them. I wanted to keep the velocity under 1300fps 1240-1260 is actually what i was shooting for. I want to keep the gun stock except i have a 20lb wolff recoil spring comming in. I want to be able to shoot everything reliably.

storm2844
12-26-2012, 03:36
Has anyone swapped out 180g xtp's for 180g gold dots using the same powder and charge etc... What were your findings? (I know i should always do work up.)

blastfact
12-26-2012, 21:10
I really need to get me some Long shot. I've pushed Blue Dot to it's max.

_The_Shadow
12-27-2012, 10:51
If you don't mind handweighing IMR800X is what Underwood is using in all of his performance 10mm cartridges.
You can read more about his loadings here; http://10mm-firearms.com/factory-10mm-ammo/underwood's-lineup-135155165180220/

gator378
01-19-2013, 17:11
Im finally gonna work up some full power 10mm handloads for my stock Gen3 20. Ive previously only done FBI loads and 40's for my KKM Precision barrel.
Id like to get 1300fps with 180gr Gold Dots and XTP, and 1200fps with 200gr XTP and FMJ. These are max or near max loads from Speer #12 and Hornady #4 manuals.
Would I be ok with the stock barrel / recoil spring assembly, or should I get an aftermarket barrel/rsa right from the start? Im concerned about the brass smiles and havin a strong enough spring to prevent battering.
Im asking because these are max loads from the manuals, but milder than some loads ive seen suggested. Thx for the help.
It is just my opinion, but max loads I would use a fully supported aftermarket barrel. 200 gr XTP and 13.0 grains of AA#9 would smile in a Glock barrel. I never use a Glock barrel in my G20. Had too many smileys even with some factory ammo